People Thinking Of Going CX
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
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An ego maniac and a very sad reflection on the pilot body. But remember he joined via ASL so never did the complete CX recruitment thing. In by the back door for good reason.
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
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Except the market is not driven by its size, its driven by supply and demand.
During an age when you actually needed to be a pilot to hold a cockpit job, skills were rewarded. Modern aircraft have never been safer and the Accountants have realized that they essentially fly themselves. Widebody international flying was once limited to experienced, skilled aviators. Now it's full of newbie, low time kids willing to work for peanuts - essentially what they're worth. Only after events like AF or German Wings, does the public question who is actually in the seat. At the end of the day, until they're afraid for their own well being, the driving force is the price of a ticket. So far, none of the long list of 'errors' has cost CX a serious accident. If/when it does, maybe then things will change.
During an age when you actually needed to be a pilot to hold a cockpit job, skills were rewarded. Modern aircraft have never been safer and the Accountants have realized that they essentially fly themselves. Widebody international flying was once limited to experienced, skilled aviators. Now it's full of newbie, low time kids willing to work for peanuts - essentially what they're worth. Only after events like AF or German Wings, does the public question who is actually in the seat. At the end of the day, until they're afraid for their own well being, the driving force is the price of a ticket. So far, none of the long list of 'errors' has cost CX a serious accident. If/when it does, maybe then things will change.
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Australia
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Bet the vote is done and dusted before the 13th month announcement and early in the new year a order for more aircraft or some other change where pilots will have been outplayed again.
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Nippi
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So how much fight is there for a 30 years of service senior captain with a wife and 2 kids?
While stuck in Hong Hong in deteriorating conditions he will still be on a high salary (minus the 13th I hear) and have pretty good accommodation and education I believe and the best pick of the roster.
Now after 30 years where can this guy go?
Even a direct entry captain will have lower pay (yes overall) but the loss of seniority and the shyty shifts you are given takes the life out of your twilight years of employment, that quality family time at the good holiday periods is gone. Forget holidays for kids summer vacations or any school holidays.
Every 30 year senior would have been against the B scale introduction and a negative look at the pilots that took the B scale jobs with reduced pay and conditions, but the trend on job scales continues.
So we have A scale that can not really go any place unless they want to try a new venture or retire.
We have B scale that are happy if A scale leave or assist them for a better package for them. But they are starting to get some senior benefits and not happy the new C scale are making it hard for the B's to get a better package.
Then we have the C scale that many will happily flow thru the system for a few years to get "paid training" on the jets.
By the time the A's have retired many of the B's will be in the current A's position.
Dropknee - I am not a pilot but do work in the industry. I am currently a member of 2 unions and actively trying to "maintain" and then increase our pay and conditions, our employer is hell bent on reducing our conditions by lots and in return a increase far less than inflationary pay increase. The work we have done in informing the staff of what is happening to them is massive, but they are starting to get united in rejecting the offer given to us.
While stuck in Hong Hong in deteriorating conditions he will still be on a high salary (minus the 13th I hear) and have pretty good accommodation and education I believe and the best pick of the roster.
Now after 30 years where can this guy go?
Even a direct entry captain will have lower pay (yes overall) but the loss of seniority and the shyty shifts you are given takes the life out of your twilight years of employment, that quality family time at the good holiday periods is gone. Forget holidays for kids summer vacations or any school holidays.
Every 30 year senior would have been against the B scale introduction and a negative look at the pilots that took the B scale jobs with reduced pay and conditions, but the trend on job scales continues.
So we have A scale that can not really go any place unless they want to try a new venture or retire.
We have B scale that are happy if A scale leave or assist them for a better package for them. But they are starting to get some senior benefits and not happy the new C scale are making it hard for the B's to get a better package.
Then we have the C scale that many will happily flow thru the system for a few years to get "paid training" on the jets.
By the time the A's have retired many of the B's will be in the current A's position.
Dropknee - I am not a pilot but do work in the industry. I am currently a member of 2 unions and actively trying to "maintain" and then increase our pay and conditions, our employer is hell bent on reducing our conditions by lots and in return a increase far less than inflationary pay increase. The work we have done in informing the staff of what is happening to them is massive, but they are starting to get united in rejecting the offer given to us.
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: here
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I couldn't agree more.
Obvoiusly our union believe the "pilot shortage" (which they continually spruik on social media) will be solved by giving us a better package.
Worth a try I guess, but they are burying their head in the sand....
Obvoiusly our union believe the "pilot shortage" (which they continually spruik on social media) will be solved by giving us a better package.
Worth a try I guess, but they are burying their head in the sand....
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Somewhere Smelly
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I really feel for you on this "I know I'd be going in and taking people's jobs which is why I'm hesitant to apply" but frankly this just isn't your responsibility.
You can't possibly be in any way responsible for the welfare of a team or community that you aren't even a member of.
If you apply and succeed, all you did is follow their rules which you had no input into.
Apply. Join. When you get there, be a good team player.
Even if that means the irony of not hiring yourself tomorrow.
You can't possibly be in any way responsible for the welfare of a team or community that you aren't even a member of.
If you apply and succeed, all you did is follow their rules which you had no input into.
Apply. Join. When you get there, be a good team player.
Even if that means the irony of not hiring yourself tomorrow.
But, if you added all the vertebrae at CX/KA, you couldn't build a single spine.
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: HKG
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Recruitment is now the domain of the 'People' department. They just want to fill seats. Flying ability and experience no longer required. Preference given to locals as they are less likely to leave.
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Earth
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According to Ray Dalio, we're in the 7th inning of this super cycle. It's sort of unprecedented that this business cycle has lasted this long, the Fed is obviously trying to play catch up with rate hikes which only worsens debt servicing. Airlines/Travel industry are usually the worst hit when there's an economic downturn, bad timing I guess.
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/09/11/bill...mic-cycle.html
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/09/11/bill...mic-cycle.html
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Hong Kong
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There are other options out there. For starts HK Express is an option and most SOs would meet the requirements and HK Express would love to have them. Contracts are very transparent and you will already earn more than an SO salary plus you get an upgrade to FO and you ACTUALLY FLY THE AIRCRAFT.
You tell me how that is not a better option???!!!
So please stop spreading your CX BS here.
When I bump into a CX S/O who joined as a cadet with 500 hrs jet I’ll let you know.
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
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HKE are targeting a much better experience level than CX. RHS positions being offered not backseat radio operators as in CX.
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: N/A
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I was an SO with only a few thousand turboprop and a few hundred P2X (Which probably counted as NOTHING). I got in, no type rating on 320. Full type rating course was done.
I am sure there are many SOs that had my similar experience plus more! HK Express is also starting their Second Officer program for pilots with less than their First Officer Requirements (1500 TT), the difference is these Second Officers will actually fly! Much better option for cadets who need to gain that experience.
Honest question as I am interested to have an insight at what life with them could be like.
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
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I was an SO with only a few thousand turboprop and a few hundred P2X (Which probably counted as NOTHING). I got in, no type rating on 320. Full type rating course was done.
I am sure there are many SOs that had my similar experience plus more! HK Express is also starting their Second Officer program for pilots with less than their First Officer Requirements (1500 TT), the difference is these Second Officers will actually fly! Much better option for cadets who need to gain that experience.
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Hong Kong
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Starting pay is around $50K at HKE, about the same as the S/O package at CX so the new S/O job at HKE is going to pay way less. And you’re all bitching that you can’t survive in HKG on what CX pay but HKE (and HKA for that matter) enable you to live a great life in HKG, on less money.
The hypocrisy is a joke, have you seen the schooling allowance for HKE?
Anything to get in a new shiny jet. NTR at HKE are bonded I assume.
The hypocrisy is a joke, have you seen the schooling allowance for HKE?
Anything to get in a new shiny jet. NTR at HKE are bonded I assume.
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Polar Route
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Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: HK-CRoC
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Thinking of Joining ??
If you're considering moving to the most expensive city on the planet for a #FakeAirline that's currently in the process of slashing wages and benefits, read the attachment then go shopping..
Shop around, shop wisely, enjoy life.
Shop around, shop wisely, enjoy life.
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Hong Kong
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Wow $110k a month base pay for an F/O is great money, skippers must be on $150k a month base pay at least. Sounds like HKE is the place to be, that’s at least 30% better than what CX pay. In fact a new joiner F/O at HKE is doing better than a skipper at CX.
Always good when someone presents the facts. And everyone is happy and they love the place, and they treat everyone so well.
Always good when someone presents the facts. And everyone is happy and they love the place, and they treat everyone so well.
