13th Month
You are having problems following me.
Where is that great airlines, Dragonair and Dragonair Cargo?
Yes, the CX 'chequebook' trick worked, CC campaign and resignations or not.
Smoke and mirrors and it was all gone!
Master magician Harry Houdini could not have done it better.
And where will you be shortly, on what contract and with whom?
13th month?
The CX management got everything they wanted, without you even realized what happened!
Where is that great airlines, Dragonair and Dragonair Cargo?
Yes, the CX 'chequebook' trick worked, CC campaign and resignations or not.
Smoke and mirrors and it was all gone!
Master magician Harry Houdini could not have done it better.
And where will you be shortly, on what contract and with whom?
13th month?
The CX management got everything they wanted, without you even realized what happened!
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Less than 10 years ago KA pilots and their DPA had two great independent airlines, Dragonair and Dragonair Cargo.
CC, sickness and resignations. CX managers went across, smoke and mirrors, it was all gone!
Master magician Harry Houdini could not have done it better.
Today? An AOC, "Best viewed as a contract job, still a useful job search allowance".
13th month tomorrow?
CC, sickness and resignations. CX managers went across, smoke and mirrors, it was all gone!
Master magician Harry Houdini could not have done it better.
Today? An AOC, "Best viewed as a contract job, still a useful job search allowance".
13th month tomorrow?
Last edited by tsimbeit; 21st Nov 2017 at 12:31.
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A quick reminder to the AOA "Negotiating Committee". While you are down there on your hands and knees , grovelling to pick up the tiny crumbs that CX deign to sweep from the corporate table, don't forget to say "thank you".
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What an epic indictment of a failed KA pilot strategy: sickness, CC and resignations.
They lost two great airlines, Dragonair and Dragonair Cargo.
CX managers went across and got what they wanted.
KA still have an AOC, "Best viewed as a contract job, still a useful job search allowance".
They lost two great airlines, Dragonair and Dragonair Cargo.
CX managers went across and got what they wanted.
KA still have an AOC, "Best viewed as a contract job, still a useful job search allowance".
Last edited by tsimbeit; 21st Nov 2017 at 16:54.
I forgot. It was a long time ago. What was your alternative strategy?
A company is bought and broken up . Do the employee associations have any sway?
Your assertion of wildcat sickouts during that period is a little mischevious. There was no directive to do so in my recollection. That leaving pilots laid scorched earth in cases is a different matter
A company is bought and broken up . Do the employee associations have any sway?
Your assertion of wildcat sickouts during that period is a little mischevious. There was no directive to do so in my recollection. That leaving pilots laid scorched earth in cases is a different matter
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Because
#1 It’s an Association not a Union
Because
#2 You’re actually in Hong Kong
Because
#3 You can’t strike
Because
#4 Others who went before you and lost (sacrificed?) their jobs and took the company to court and won and lost under appeal and got a mere 150k for all they went through
Because
#5
In days past when entire fleets have been grounded for tech issues it’s taken a bunch of phone calls and a day to get replacements wet leased
Because
#6
The pilot body is so fragmented these days everyone else would just take up the slack anyway so #5 probably wouldn’t even be necessary
Because
#7
Sorry did you want the reality of it?
#1 It’s an Association not a Union
Because
#2 You’re actually in Hong Kong
Because
#3 You can’t strike
Because
#4 Others who went before you and lost (sacrificed?) their jobs and took the company to court and won and lost under appeal and got a mere 150k for all they went through
Because
#5
In days past when entire fleets have been grounded for tech issues it’s taken a bunch of phone calls and a day to get replacements wet leased
Because
#6
The pilot body is so fragmented these days everyone else would just take up the slack anyway so #5 probably wouldn’t even be necessary
Because
#7
Sorry did you want the reality of it?
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Because
#7 We have soulless and cowardly management like Morningcoffee to deal with
Because
#8 We began as a proud and successful airline, and have been reduced to a worldwide joke (because of #7 above)
Because
#9 We have reached a point where most of us don't care, and are planning on leaving
Because
#10 We will be interested in seeing just how passengers will react to the aircraft behaving like paperweights
Sorry, do you really want to see the reality and eventual outcome of you and your managements incompetence ?
#7 We have soulless and cowardly management like Morningcoffee to deal with
Because
#8 We began as a proud and successful airline, and have been reduced to a worldwide joke (because of #7 above)
Because
#9 We have reached a point where most of us don't care, and are planning on leaving
Because
#10 We will be interested in seeing just how passengers will react to the aircraft behaving like paperweights
Sorry, do you really want to see the reality and eventual outcome of you and your managements incompetence ?
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morningcoffee
You're so misinformed, uneducated, and plain dumb!
You CAN strike in Hong Kong. If you had said too many spineless, self serving members within the association I would have a hard time arguing with you, but the fact is a strike would bring this management to its knees very quickly.
Replacement wet leased aircraft in a day? Bwaaahaha, I would like to see that! Are you aware of the acute shortage of aircraft and crew in the industry?
You're so misinformed, uneducated, and plain dumb!
You CAN strike in Hong Kong. If you had said too many spineless, self serving members within the association I would have a hard time arguing with you, but the fact is a strike would bring this management to its knees very quickly.
Replacement wet leased aircraft in a day? Bwaaahaha, I would like to see that! Are you aware of the acute shortage of aircraft and crew in the industry?
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No Dragon. He's not aware. None of them have any self-awareness as to the type of people they are. That's typically the case with the sort of mindless paper-pushers that tyrannies employ. You only have to go back to the 1930's in Germany to understand what I mean. Faceless, cowardly and ultimately doomed. Our current management may think they have the upper hand, but what they have done is removed the very foundation of the airline, which was the loyal and dedicated support of the most professional aircrew complement in the industry. Now, they have managed to turn nearly 3000+ individuals against them, and most of us are actively working to see them fall. What a legacy. Morning coffee....?...I would think more like 'morning whiskey' after the realisation of what they have done sinks in.
(...and you are correct, the comment about replacement aircraft in a 'day'...bwahahaha. Shows you what planet these people inhabit. No aircrew, no aircraft. And even if they could, can you imagine the sheer chaos and pr disaster that would prove to be. Please MC, you go ahead and wave your little magic wand and make a 'fleet' appear in a day. Fool)
(...and you are correct, the comment about replacement aircraft in a 'day'...bwahahaha. Shows you what planet these people inhabit. No aircrew, no aircraft. And even if they could, can you imagine the sheer chaos and pr disaster that would prove to be. Please MC, you go ahead and wave your little magic wand and make a 'fleet' appear in a day. Fool)
Last edited by Trafalgar; 21st Nov 2017 at 23:57.
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Trafalgar, why don’t you actually ask, (not preach to) the newbie SO’s or DE FOs, you meet, and see if they are enjoying their time in CX ? Ask them if they want to return to their previous careers consigned to regional TP flying , for a pittance. You will find the answer unanimously is that the newbies are here for their careers . And wether you like it or not , the newbies are the future, not you mate. Move on and for better or worse, let the next gen have their experience. Retire. Take your millions.
FYI, least we've all forgotten Career : an occupation undertaken for a significant period of a person's life and with opportunities for progress.
Long haul , career airline. Not many left you can just walk into . Unless you know better?
FYI, least we've all forgotten Career : an occupation undertaken for a significant period of a person's life and with opportunities for progress.
Long haul , career airline. Not many left you can just walk into . Unless you know better?
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Gnadenburg: " Do the employee associations have any sway"?
What happened to the two great airlines, Dragonair and Dragonair Cargo?
DPA and the Dragonair Cargo 747-400 basing, contracts, manning and the IFALPA blacklisting fiasco was the beginning of the end.
Do the employee associations have any sway?
What happened to the two great airlines, Dragonair and Dragonair Cargo?
DPA and the Dragonair Cargo 747-400 basing, contracts, manning and the IFALPA blacklisting fiasco was the beginning of the end.
Do the employee associations have any sway?
Last edited by tsimbeit; 22nd Nov 2017 at 07:05.
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The DPA have already gone into COS meetings on the back foot .
The DPA negotiators have indicated that they are asking for nothing. That theres nothing to talk about . Nothing to give .
However, they are already conceeding that the current RPA will be cancelled by the company. Joker G day requests will be cancelled, along with 4 day block requests will be cancelled.
Its too inconvenient say KA rostering. Pilots have too much flexibility. We cannot let this continue.
In return, the DPA are hoping these concessions on RPA will be enough to appease heir Anna and her destructive juggernaut. Giving into a bully is a road to submission.
Only Time will tell.
The DPA negotiators have indicated that they are asking for nothing. That theres nothing to talk about . Nothing to give .
However, they are already conceeding that the current RPA will be cancelled by the company. Joker G day requests will be cancelled, along with 4 day block requests will be cancelled.
Its too inconvenient say KA rostering. Pilots have too much flexibility. We cannot let this continue.
In return, the DPA are hoping these concessions on RPA will be enough to appease heir Anna and her destructive juggernaut. Giving into a bully is a road to submission.
Only Time will tell.
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They can't cap the 13th month. It is "defined" as one month basic pay.
They can and have capped the profit share which is very different.
In certain jurisdictions like France and Spain the 13th month is payable to ground staff no matter what the operating profit or loss but Swire's keep that little gem quiet.
They can and have capped the profit share which is very different.
In certain jurisdictions like France and Spain the 13th month is payable to ground staff no matter what the operating profit or loss but Swire's keep that little gem quiet.
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Because
All I’m doing is telling you the facts. If you think I’m talking BS about how easily CX wetleased aircraft google it.
Because
If you think that by striking under hkg law you’ll force the company back to the table rather than sack you, google it
Because
If you actually think the 49ers had a holiday for a few years rather than the hell they went through, google it
Because
If you don’t think the AOA members, many like those on here who talk the talk, eventually got tired of supporting the members who had been fired, google it.
The only fundamental change between then and now is we have even less unity.
But hey I’m management, financially supported the 49ers to the bitter end, unlike plenty who didn’t. Sadly as before, the AOA and the livelihoods of its members will become a vehicle for those in the union GC with personal axe to grind against the company.
All I’m doing is telling you the facts. If you think I’m talking BS about how easily CX wetleased aircraft google it.
Because
If you think that by striking under hkg law you’ll force the company back to the table rather than sack you, google it
Because
If you actually think the 49ers had a holiday for a few years rather than the hell they went through, google it
Because
If you don’t think the AOA members, many like those on here who talk the talk, eventually got tired of supporting the members who had been fired, google it.
The only fundamental change between then and now is we have even less unity.
But hey I’m management, financially supported the 49ers to the bitter end, unlike plenty who didn’t. Sadly as before, the AOA and the livelihoods of its members will become a vehicle for those in the union GC with personal axe to grind against the company.
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Morning Coffee.
Please forgive me if I find it difficult to believe that someone claiming to have financially supported the 49ers to the bitter end can also feel it is the AOA that is behaving
**sadly, like before** like it has a personal axe to grind against the Company....
Please, square that circle for me....
More likely, the AOA motion has rattled your cage.
Please forgive me if I find it difficult to believe that someone claiming to have financially supported the 49ers to the bitter end can also feel it is the AOA that is behaving
**sadly, like before** like it has a personal axe to grind against the Company....
Please, square that circle for me....
More likely, the AOA motion has rattled your cage.
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Sounds like someone’s spilling their coffee.....
And times change.
Maybe 20 years ago there wasn’t a looming and occurring pilot shortage. Now there is.
Maybe 20 years ago CX enjoyed a reputation as being the grab the brass ring job. Now it doesn’t and isn’t really competitive with long term careers in most majors.
Maybe 20 years ago folks really loved and cared about their jobs. Now it’s at best meh for most and at best just pays the bills.
Maybe 20 years ago information traveled much slower and social media was just beginning to be introduced. Now it’s pretty much instantaneous.
Maybe 20 years ago folks hadn’t seen a widespread breach of trust. Now it’s become an inherent part of the goings on.
Maybe 20 years ago folks could allow themselves to be made fearful. Now it’s at best meh....I’ll find another job. At least this gets me off my rear end and looking.
So circumstances are a wee bit different. Might want to cut back on the coffee—think it may be making someone jittery.
And times change.
Maybe 20 years ago there wasn’t a looming and occurring pilot shortage. Now there is.
Maybe 20 years ago CX enjoyed a reputation as being the grab the brass ring job. Now it doesn’t and isn’t really competitive with long term careers in most majors.
Maybe 20 years ago folks really loved and cared about their jobs. Now it’s at best meh for most and at best just pays the bills.
Maybe 20 years ago information traveled much slower and social media was just beginning to be introduced. Now it’s pretty much instantaneous.
Maybe 20 years ago folks hadn’t seen a widespread breach of trust. Now it’s become an inherent part of the goings on.
Maybe 20 years ago folks could allow themselves to be made fearful. Now it’s at best meh....I’ll find another job. At least this gets me off my rear end and looking.
So circumstances are a wee bit different. Might want to cut back on the coffee—think it may be making someone jittery.
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13 Month - Maybe ???
Maybe 20 years ago CX had great catering, now... A new "Leadership Appointment "Head of Culinary Excellence" is hired; too late, that ship sailed from here a long time ago..
Perhaps our new "Leader" could start by reinstating salt and pepper which, like everything else, disappeared at the justification of a spreadsheet geek who rationalised it to Directors at a savings of 10 cents / pax..
Death by spreadsheet geeks..............
Perhaps our new "Leader" could start by reinstating salt and pepper which, like everything else, disappeared at the justification of a spreadsheet geek who rationalised it to Directors at a savings of 10 cents / pax..
Death by spreadsheet geeks..............