Vote for Rod
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Vote for Rod
Vote for Rod.
Agreed, we are still far from where we would like to be. But without him and his leadership, we would be even further.
Remember, he managed to get the company to offer a well deserved inflation adjustment, after they had offered nothing for 2 years.
He got the company to finally sit and talk to us after they had imposed RPs last year.
Show our DFO that if the TA failed, it's not because of him, rather it is because it simply wasn't good enough.
With our limited leverage, his strategy to take the company to court on every little topic seems the most appropriate thing to do.
Rod, you've got my vote.
But whatever you guys do, please don't vote for the guy who says that expats benefits are gone forever, and who relays other pro-management bullsh** propaganda.
Now is not the time to give up. Stay the course.
Let's achieve what we wanted when we first started with Rod 2 years ago.
Agreed, we are still far from where we would like to be. But without him and his leadership, we would be even further.
Remember, he managed to get the company to offer a well deserved inflation adjustment, after they had offered nothing for 2 years.
He got the company to finally sit and talk to us after they had imposed RPs last year.
Show our DFO that if the TA failed, it's not because of him, rather it is because it simply wasn't good enough.
With our limited leverage, his strategy to take the company to court on every little topic seems the most appropriate thing to do.
Rod, you've got my vote.
But whatever you guys do, please don't vote for the guy who says that expats benefits are gone forever, and who relays other pro-management bullsh** propaganda.
Now is not the time to give up. Stay the course.
Let's achieve what we wanted when we first started with Rod 2 years ago.
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"You last visited: 25th Jul 2011 at 05:27
Private Messages: Unread 0, Total 6."
For the record: thanks for your support.
Now: you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem!
You now know who I am, so let's find out who you are.
"Put your money where your mouth is is" too and show your public support of Rod.
The problem with our membership is: I have received many messages of approval and encouragement via private messages and many PUBLIC messages of dissent and discouragement.
If you guys could only stop being afraid of poking the bear.....that would be great.
Step up and be counted you gutless fools.
But on that note: congrats, you finally got me out of hiding and back onto prune after 5 years.(Didn't even remember my password and it took me 30 minutes to retrieve it).
And also congrats to Numero Crunchero. Your identity will no longer be the worst kept secret on the prune.
And finally also for the record: no I'm not the Flying Clog or Curtain Rod.
Need any more hints?
Step up or reap what you sow, which is a retirement bagging groceries at Walmart! At least you get to enjoy your business class tickets to Bangkok and back, while complaining about my abundant housing allowance.
Private Messages: Unread 0, Total 6."
For the record: thanks for your support.
Now: you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem!
You now know who I am, so let's find out who you are.
"Put your money where your mouth is is" too and show your public support of Rod.
The problem with our membership is: I have received many messages of approval and encouragement via private messages and many PUBLIC messages of dissent and discouragement.
If you guys could only stop being afraid of poking the bear.....that would be great.
Step up and be counted you gutless fools.
But on that note: congrats, you finally got me out of hiding and back onto prune after 5 years.(Didn't even remember my password and it took me 30 minutes to retrieve it).
And also congrats to Numero Crunchero. Your identity will no longer be the worst kept secret on the prune.
And finally also for the record: no I'm not the Flying Clog or Curtain Rod.
Need any more hints?
Step up or reap what you sow, which is a retirement bagging groceries at Walmart! At least you get to enjoy your business class tickets to Bangkok and back, while complaining about my abundant housing allowance.
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The problem for Rod, as I see it, is that communications may be his downfall.
The vast majority of the membership don't keep close tabs on here, or the AOA forums.
People have already remarked to me that there is nigh-on nothing to show from his chair, and have been kept under a rock, so they have limited knowledge as to why he and his team haven't delivered.
Those a little more involved know more, and that he has a brick wall in front of him. But, from a results-based perspective (read 'layperson/laymember"), there is nothing to show from him, and no information to explain.
The vast majority of the membership don't keep close tabs on here, or the AOA forums.
People have already remarked to me that there is nigh-on nothing to show from his chair, and have been kept under a rock, so they have limited knowledge as to why he and his team haven't delivered.
Those a little more involved know more, and that he has a brick wall in front of him. But, from a results-based perspective (read 'layperson/laymember"), there is nothing to show from him, and no information to explain.
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Flaender:-
I'm sorry but I have no understanding of your post, which is a shame as you are clearly trying to be very forthright about something. I'm probably not the only one, upto you if you want to clarify. Genuine comment.
I'm sorry but I have no understanding of your post, which is a shame as you are clearly trying to be very forthright about something. I'm probably not the only one, upto you if you want to clarify. Genuine comment.
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Flaender:-
I'm sorry but I have no understanding of your post, which is a shame as you are clearly trying to be very forthright about something. I'm probably not the only one, upto you if you want to clarify. Genuine comment.
I'm sorry but I have no understanding of your post, which is a shame as you are clearly trying to be very forthright about something. I'm probably not the only one, upto you if you want to clarify. Genuine comment.
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I value leadership.
I also value Rod's explanations and insights on the forums.
I have not received an answer as to why he allowed the GC to propose a TA to its members even though he voted against it due to Clause 7.
Perhaps 48% of the membership who voted NO would have been a lot smaller with his insights and opinions on Clause 7.
I also value Rod's explanations and insights on the forums.
I have not received an answer as to why he allowed the GC to propose a TA to its members even though he voted against it due to Clause 7.
Perhaps 48% of the membership who voted NO would have been a lot smaller with his insights and opinions on Clause 7.
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White None,
Apologies.
All I was trying to achieve was for all the silent supporters to get from behind their anonymous bulletproof screens and be counted.
There are many people who agree with the current direction, but can't be bothered showing a PUBLIC demonstration of support of Rod and his direction. (Don't get me wrong, some do).
I get a bit tired getting talked to about the silent majority who disagree with the current situation, but from all the PM's I receive I come to the opposite conclusion: there is a silent majority IN FAVOR of the current direction.
When I ask these silent lurkers/readers why they don't post that publicly, I get answers to the extent of: "I don't want to poke the bear", or words to that extent.
I'm tired of sticking my neck out for the silent majority.
As to why Rod "allowed" the GC to vote this way: feel free to post this question under your name on the forum.
I am not at liberty, nor am I inclined to post this on an anonymous public forum where non-members and the company can get the benefit of our paying members' inside information.
Thanks for getting me out into the "fresh" air of the prune.
Now, if you don't mind, I'll go back into my non-anonymous box.
I don't like this format and am indeed all for openness and that includes that you and I know who we address.
Flaender out.
Apologies.
All I was trying to achieve was for all the silent supporters to get from behind their anonymous bulletproof screens and be counted.
There are many people who agree with the current direction, but can't be bothered showing a PUBLIC demonstration of support of Rod and his direction. (Don't get me wrong, some do).
I get a bit tired getting talked to about the silent majority who disagree with the current situation, but from all the PM's I receive I come to the opposite conclusion: there is a silent majority IN FAVOR of the current direction.
When I ask these silent lurkers/readers why they don't post that publicly, I get answers to the extent of: "I don't want to poke the bear", or words to that extent.
I'm tired of sticking my neck out for the silent majority.
As to why Rod "allowed" the GC to vote this way: feel free to post this question under your name on the forum.
I am not at liberty, nor am I inclined to post this on an anonymous public forum where non-members and the company can get the benefit of our paying members' inside information.
Thanks for getting me out into the "fresh" air of the prune.
Now, if you don't mind, I'll go back into my non-anonymous box.
I don't like this format and am indeed all for openness and that includes that you and I know who we address.
Flaender out.
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One thing we all know for sure is that CX refuses to ever lose face, especially when it comes to labour. They will fight Rod forever plus one day and be willing to spend whatever it takes to "win", even if that is actually a huge loss. Logically, wouldn't it make sense to put a new face in there that can be seen to be more compromising? Someone who can make a deal. DS might be that person.
USAOA got some big wins by seemingly doing little more than being polite and civil. They didn't leverage CX directly, although it seems most US pilots were doing their own CC and adhering to the TB. Maybe CX is using USAOA (and the other AOAs) to put pressure on HK? Or maybe they are just showing HK that the best possible deal is obtained in a different fashion? It will be interesting to see how Europe is dealt with as they seem to be in lockstep with HK from a tactical perspective.
Want more of the same? Vote for Rod. Want change? Go with another.
USAOA got some big wins by seemingly doing little more than being polite and civil. They didn't leverage CX directly, although it seems most US pilots were doing their own CC and adhering to the TB. Maybe CX is using USAOA (and the other AOAs) to put pressure on HK? Or maybe they are just showing HK that the best possible deal is obtained in a different fashion? It will be interesting to see how Europe is dealt with as they seem to be in lockstep with HK from a tactical perspective.
Want more of the same? Vote for Rod. Want change? Go with another.
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cxorcist,
i dont see any major gains in the US deal that weren't required by US law.
Whatever meagre pieces of silver they did receive I hope it was worth selling us all out with the two month average EFP. if any of the 3 candidates see that concession as a good tactic, they wont be getting my vote.
i dont see any major gains in the US deal that weren't required by US law.
Whatever meagre pieces of silver they did receive I hope it was worth selling us all out with the two month average EFP. if any of the 3 candidates see that concession as a good tactic, they wont be getting my vote.
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Very few of USAOA's gains have anything to do with first world labour laws. The only one I can think of off the top of my head is the D&G procedure, called a system board of adjustment in the US.
Items not required for CX to agree by US law...
- RP07 which is light years better than any RP policy
- Medical in the contract and grandfathered as is for current officers
- 2 or 3 annual pay raises, especially significant for CoS08 FOs which ends with all FOs on the same payscale, yet none take a paycut by my understanding.
- PD credit from home residence for commuters
- First class seating on flights over three hours on AA, AS, and DL; in exchange for freighter PX which many want to do anyways to get home sooner
- "Agency shop" requiring non-members to pay the Union for its services; no freeloading
- Online learning credit, how much do we get?
- Proper A day which facilitates a commute longer than Kelowna to Vancouver
- Proper tax sheltered retirement plan
You think all that is worthless? You think all that is required by US law? Better get your facts straight. You think USAOA voted 98% in favor because it's a bad deal? When is the last time HKAOA ever showed that level of unity?
On the JFK basing, I don't see it as a EFP sellout. I see it as a lifestyle pilot's wet dream. Five trips every two months? I'd do that for no EFP too. Sure, you might do 96 one month, half of it in the bunk; but the next month you are only flying two trips, and there are protections in that LOU which prevent work stacking and excessive regional flying. I see the whole arrangement as smart. JFK flying is logistically different than LAX or SFO, and all those regional sectors that could make it like YYZ get soaked up by HK crews doing training.
Items not required for CX to agree by US law...
- RP07 which is light years better than any RP policy
- Medical in the contract and grandfathered as is for current officers
- 2 or 3 annual pay raises, especially significant for CoS08 FOs which ends with all FOs on the same payscale, yet none take a paycut by my understanding.
- PD credit from home residence for commuters
- First class seating on flights over three hours on AA, AS, and DL; in exchange for freighter PX which many want to do anyways to get home sooner
- "Agency shop" requiring non-members to pay the Union for its services; no freeloading
- Online learning credit, how much do we get?
- Proper A day which facilitates a commute longer than Kelowna to Vancouver
- Proper tax sheltered retirement plan
You think all that is worthless? You think all that is required by US law? Better get your facts straight. You think USAOA voted 98% in favor because it's a bad deal? When is the last time HKAOA ever showed that level of unity?
On the JFK basing, I don't see it as a EFP sellout. I see it as a lifestyle pilot's wet dream. Five trips every two months? I'd do that for no EFP too. Sure, you might do 96 one month, half of it in the bunk; but the next month you are only flying two trips, and there are protections in that LOU which prevent work stacking and excessive regional flying. I see the whole arrangement as smart. JFK flying is logistically different than LAX or SFO, and all those regional sectors that could make it like YYZ get soaked up by HK crews doing training.
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When RP07 was cancelled by CX, AT put her new RP to a vote which was voted down by 98%
The last TA was not unity as it was designed to divide.
C-scalers looking for a bit of fast cash. I bet if it was just RP's voted on you would see HKAOA unity.
I don't smoke sorry
The last TA was not unity as it was designed to divide.
C-scalers looking for a bit of fast cash. I bet if it was just RP's voted on you would see HKAOA unity.
I don't smoke sorry
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BN,
Sorry, I don't recall voting on RPs apart from the failed TA. RPs were cancelled and an RP policy replaced it. The vote to which you refer was to remain in CC over RPs or to come out of CC because pay had been resolved. Pretty much a no brainer when the Company takes our work rules and shreds them into tiny pieces while we watch.
Sorry, I don't recall voting on RPs apart from the failed TA. RPs were cancelled and an RP policy replaced it. The vote to which you refer was to remain in CC over RPs or to come out of CC because pay had been resolved. Pretty much a no brainer when the Company takes our work rules and shreds them into tiny pieces while we watch.
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Flaender - thanks for take 2. I think you're throwing down the gauntlet to the more vociferous Pruners to go public about their views on the official forums. Fair enough.
I also think you're under the belief we all know who you are, and that because of who you are we should take note? I for one have no clue but find myself aggressively ambivalent.
I also think you're under the belief we all know who you are, and that because of who you are we should take note? I for one have no clue but find myself aggressively ambivalent.
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I'll cook it down for you...
Rod's problem is that he has two mouths and only one ear. This is not something you would know unless you have worked with him. He is very much a demagogue, in love with his own ideas and the sound of his own voice. He thinks he is the smartest person in every room. This may or may not be the case, but it keeps him from truly hearing what others have to say. He picks and chooses the bits and pieces that fit his predetermined narrative and ignores the rest. His office staff, including CB, worship at the alter. They know who butters their bread. So you can't count on a challenge from them despite decades of experience. The other TUs, not AOAC or USAOA, are completely betrothened to HK as most of their money and all their office support are controlled by Rod. So those balancing groups are neutered as well. Who's left? A GC that Rod ignores until it's time to vote.
How many current or past GC members are endorsing him? JL... might want to consider the source. Anyone else?
Rod's problem is that he has two mouths and only one ear. This is not something you would know unless you have worked with him. He is very much a demagogue, in love with his own ideas and the sound of his own voice. He thinks he is the smartest person in every room. This may or may not be the case, but it keeps him from truly hearing what others have to say. He picks and chooses the bits and pieces that fit his predetermined narrative and ignores the rest. His office staff, including CB, worship at the alter. They know who butters their bread. So you can't count on a challenge from them despite decades of experience. The other TUs, not AOAC or USAOA, are completely betrothened to HK as most of their money and all their office support are controlled by Rod. So those balancing groups are neutered as well. Who's left? A GC that Rod ignores until it's time to vote.
How many current or past GC members are endorsing him? JL... might want to consider the source. Anyone else?
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cxorcist,
If you're as wrong about Rod as you are about everything else you write, Rod's got my vote.
We (perhaps not you as I suspect you're management) did vote on AT's version of Rostering practices. You ask when is the last time the HKAOA showed a level of unity to vote as unanimously as USAOA? When the HKAOA voted 98 percent against AT's version of RP's.
As for CX never losing face when it comes to labour, that's truly humorous. CX have a history of more backflips than a drugged up Russian gymnast. As you're management and know more about restocking a drink vending machine than you do of CX industrial history, I'll give just some examples.
Sign or be fired when no one got fired.
No 49er will ever be rehired.
No more money in the kitty just prior to offering an improved package in 2014.
No negotiated agreement with the Adelaide instructors just prior to offering them millions.
Unfortunately CX bully's only respect a fighter. I'm not sure we get that with DS or his spokesman PH.
If you're as wrong about Rod as you are about everything else you write, Rod's got my vote.
We (perhaps not you as I suspect you're management) did vote on AT's version of Rostering practices. You ask when is the last time the HKAOA showed a level of unity to vote as unanimously as USAOA? When the HKAOA voted 98 percent against AT's version of RP's.
As for CX never losing face when it comes to labour, that's truly humorous. CX have a history of more backflips than a drugged up Russian gymnast. As you're management and know more about restocking a drink vending machine than you do of CX industrial history, I'll give just some examples.
Sign or be fired when no one got fired.
No 49er will ever be rehired.
No more money in the kitty just prior to offering an improved package in 2014.
No negotiated agreement with the Adelaide instructors just prior to offering them millions.
Unfortunately CX bully's only respect a fighter. I'm not sure we get that with DS or his spokesman PH.
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Well PW,
Go ahead and vote for Rod. If he's reelected, we will have a chat in two years time and see if anything has changed. I don't subscribe to the keep doing the same things and expect different results school of thought, but I hope I'm wrong and that you're right.
If you haven't worked with Rod personally, you don't really know. Do you? Relations with the other TUs will not improve with Rod in the room. That's a fact. Don't believe me? Ask others who would know from said TUs or even the HK GC. I fail to see why it would be any different in relations with the Company. Again, I hope I'm wrong...
Go ahead and vote for Rod. If he's reelected, we will have a chat in two years time and see if anything has changed. I don't subscribe to the keep doing the same things and expect different results school of thought, but I hope I'm wrong and that you're right.
If you haven't worked with Rod personally, you don't really know. Do you? Relations with the other TUs will not improve with Rod in the room. That's a fact. Don't believe me? Ask others who would know from said TUs or even the HK GC. I fail to see why it would be any different in relations with the Company. Again, I hope I'm wrong...