GMA update
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GMA update
it gets better......COS 08 improvements will only be granted if the flight crew acceptance of SLS is good enough. makes me feel happier about cos 99 now!
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Holy ****....
Unfu****believable.
Are they smoking crack up there? Do they -seriously- expect anyone to sign over to a CoS which may or may not include those improvements that would cause you to sign across in the first place?
Do we, as a group, really come across to management as this stupid?
Are they smoking crack up there? Do they -seriously- expect anyone to sign over to a CoS which may or may not include those improvements that would cause you to sign across in the first place?
Do we, as a group, really come across to management as this stupid?
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still makes me wonder whether there is some loop-hole in the BPP on COS 99 that escapes us. ie keep the less senior guys on 09, expecting BPP....and then remove lube, insert baseball bat!
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GMA Update 15MAY09
With only a few days to go before the close of the SLS/COS 08 election I am pleased to hear that the HKAOA membership has successfully ratified the improvements to COS 08. The improvements have been discussed at length in both company and HKAOA communications. The agreed changes to COS 08 are attached for perusal and are fully expected to form part of COS 08. I use the word expected only because the improvements have always been subject to the HKAOA’s success in promoting widespread support for SLS within their membership. Over the past few weeks the company and HKAOA representatives have enjoyed a progressively better understanding and a more positive working relationship, nevertheless the fact remains that when the DFO first agreed to enter into negotiations on the broad principles established more than a month ago, it was on the strict understanding that the HKAOA would promote widespread support for the corporate scheme. With current sign up levels significantly behind those of other employee groups, that goal is yet to be achieved. I remain hopeful that it will be achieved in the remaining days. As a reminder, the deadline for the SLS election is 18th May at 12:00 midday.
I wish to reiterate that those who have already elected for SLS and COS 08 will receive exactly what has been promulgated through the election process. There will be no grab back of contracts or advertised retained benefits. The ratified improvements to COS 08 will however, as has been made abundantly clear in previous communications, only be fully implemented if the support of the HKAOA membership is forthcoming. I understand why there may be some angst about electing for a contract with improvements that may not be fully implemented. Equally there is some angst on the Company’s part, regarding the delivery of a level of support which, for the moment, appears at best elusive. With other staff groups posting SLS acceptance rates of almost 100%, I certainly hope that we, as pilots, can show that we are prepared to strongly support our Company through these difficulties. It would be wrong to leave that role to others to perform on our behalf.
Captain Richard Hall
General Manager Aircrew
With only a few days to go before the close of the SLS/COS 08 election I am pleased to hear that the HKAOA membership has successfully ratified the improvements to COS 08. The improvements have been discussed at length in both company and HKAOA communications. The agreed changes to COS 08 are attached for perusal and are fully expected to form part of COS 08. I use the word expected only because the improvements have always been subject to the HKAOA’s success in promoting widespread support for SLS within their membership. Over the past few weeks the company and HKAOA representatives have enjoyed a progressively better understanding and a more positive working relationship, nevertheless the fact remains that when the DFO first agreed to enter into negotiations on the broad principles established more than a month ago, it was on the strict understanding that the HKAOA would promote widespread support for the corporate scheme. With current sign up levels significantly behind those of other employee groups, that goal is yet to be achieved. I remain hopeful that it will be achieved in the remaining days. As a reminder, the deadline for the SLS election is 18th May at 12:00 midday.
I wish to reiterate that those who have already elected for SLS and COS 08 will receive exactly what has been promulgated through the election process. There will be no grab back of contracts or advertised retained benefits. The ratified improvements to COS 08 will however, as has been made abundantly clear in previous communications, only be fully implemented if the support of the HKAOA membership is forthcoming. I understand why there may be some angst about electing for a contract with improvements that may not be fully implemented. Equally there is some angst on the Company’s part, regarding the delivery of a level of support which, for the moment, appears at best elusive. With other staff groups posting SLS acceptance rates of almost 100%, I certainly hope that we, as pilots, can show that we are prepared to strongly support our Company through these difficulties. It would be wrong to leave that role to others to perform on our behalf.
Captain Richard Hall
General Manager Aircrew
What a
circus!!!
Last edited by AD POSSE AD ESSE; 15th May 2009 at 07:33.
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okay so heres what we do let the 18th come and go nobody click anything, then we shall watch as the revolt starts to bit them in the arse.
So at a time like this when the need planes to be flying lets see how they fair when there is no crew lets take our own leave without pay in the form of a strike.
F#$K IT!
So at a time like this when the need planes to be flying lets see how they fair when there is no crew lets take our own leave without pay in the form of a strike.
F#$K IT!
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It is obvious they do not intend to implement any of the improvements to COS 08. The control the numbers and they could easily say that they wanted 100% and that 99% was not goo enough.
The vote is now clear more than before NO & NO
The vote is now clear more than before NO & NO
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This seems like a very strange update. Is he really trying to achieve higher numbers of SLS uptake or would he prefer us not to take it so he doesn't make the improvements to CoS 08? My plan was to wait until the 18th then plump for CoS 99 and give them SLS but I tend to react badly to threats and intimidation, so I'll think on it for a couple more days.
Here in Europe I don't think it's legal to act in this way with regards to employment contracts... this merits further investigation!
Here in Europe I don't think it's legal to act in this way with regards to employment contracts... this merits further investigation!
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Predictable "spin"
It is obvious that there is going to be a poor result for Management on the 18th. My guess is a 45-50% sign-up.
The GMA's message has 2 purposes.
1. To scare a handful of the "fence-sitters" into clicking an option.
2. To commence the Management "spin" on who is to blame for their b@lls-up. I thought they were just going to blame us selfish-overpaid pilots, but it seems the finger will be pointed at the HKAOA again "for failing to promote widespread support for SLS within the membership".
The next stage will be to demand that the HKAOA demonstrate "good faith" before they will talk about anything again. Seen this before... yawn.
Nothing to do with Management trying to pull a fast one by linking a lousy deal with SLS then??
The GMA's message has 2 purposes.
1. To scare a handful of the "fence-sitters" into clicking an option.
2. To commence the Management "spin" on who is to blame for their b@lls-up. I thought they were just going to blame us selfish-overpaid pilots, but it seems the finger will be pointed at the HKAOA again "for failing to promote widespread support for SLS within the membership".
The next stage will be to demand that the HKAOA demonstrate "good faith" before they will talk about anything again. Seen this before... yawn.
Nothing to do with Management trying to pull a fast one by linking a lousy deal with SLS then??
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what i love about this is that they fail to see that the aircrew body as a whole were most likely to put their bids in at about 1155 on monday.
i wanted to see the vote for improvements, the inclusion in COS 08 and then i would have done as before...compare the two and see what works.
all they have done now is swing my cos 08/cos 99 meter as far into the cos99 camp as it gets.....and generate a big SLS F*** you......as i was probably going to take it.
this is such a shambles of huge proportions. i am not an AOA member.....but give the guys a break; there are some working there balls of to try and get this right. you cannot lose sight of the fact that when it comes to employer/employee relations....the employer will always dictate the end game.
there are some trying to make this work that are making a big sacrifice in time and in their personal life to at least try and make this work.
(and don't give me the old crap that they should have my support through AOA membership......we all have our reasons for being in our out, or once in and then out)
i wanted to see the vote for improvements, the inclusion in COS 08 and then i would have done as before...compare the two and see what works.
all they have done now is swing my cos 08/cos 99 meter as far into the cos99 camp as it gets.....and generate a big SLS F*** you......as i was probably going to take it.
this is such a shambles of huge proportions. i am not an AOA member.....but give the guys a break; there are some working there balls of to try and get this right. you cannot lose sight of the fact that when it comes to employer/employee relations....the employer will always dictate the end game.
there are some trying to make this work that are making a big sacrifice in time and in their personal life to at least try and make this work.
(and don't give me the old crap that they should have my support through AOA membership......we all have our reasons for being in our out, or once in and then out)
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If you joined then maybe the AoA would have more funds for.
Court cases, employing professional neg some competition for JF.
Other News:
Please note: CrewDirect will be unavailable on 17 May (Sun) 09:30-10:30 and 14:30-15:30 HK LT. Please do not attempt to submit any training report during that period.
Funny that was just when I plan on loging on. I'll give up and sent a letter instead.
No & No !
I need advice:
I walked into a bar with my boss. He buys me a drink while he chats about him needing my support for this huge lie he is about to pull to all third parties. He said if I play the game with him there will be something in it for me.
Being a team member & putting my trust in him I agree & buy the next round for further details:
He then tells me I have to sign a new & lessor contract because of the lie above. If I don't I'll won't get a pay rise ever again etc..
I'm confused is this guy on drugs or plain mad!
How should I react to this? Any suggestions:
Maybe I should make public all the lies this guy as pulled all his life. Hopefully this will result in getting his butt kicked & hopefully have him replaced with someone with integrity!
To all the others that get the same treatment and had their goal posts moved yet again & again & again. (is'nt there a song like that)
Who keeps moving the cheese?
Court cases, employing professional neg some competition for JF.
Other News:
Please note: CrewDirect will be unavailable on 17 May (Sun) 09:30-10:30 and 14:30-15:30 HK LT. Please do not attempt to submit any training report during that period.
Funny that was just when I plan on loging on. I'll give up and sent a letter instead.
No & No !
I need advice:
I walked into a bar with my boss. He buys me a drink while he chats about him needing my support for this huge lie he is about to pull to all third parties. He said if I play the game with him there will be something in it for me.
Being a team member & putting my trust in him I agree & buy the next round for further details:
He then tells me I have to sign a new & lessor contract because of the lie above. If I don't I'll won't get a pay rise ever again etc..
I'm confused is this guy on drugs or plain mad!
How should I react to this? Any suggestions:
Maybe I should make public all the lies this guy as pulled all his life. Hopefully this will result in getting his butt kicked & hopefully have him replaced with someone with integrity!
To all the others that get the same treatment and had their goal posts moved yet again & again & again. (is'nt there a song like that)
Who keeps moving the cheese?
Last edited by crewsunite; 16th May 2009 at 02:21.
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WTF?
As someone who logged on today to click Yes and Yes (personal reasons
), I thought I would check the GMA missive to see if I could find a reason to click No and No.
And there was the gift I was seeking. In all the stuff I had read on SLS/COS08 I had failed to spot the improvements were conditional on some fertive and undefined criteria regarding SLS uptake.
I am so glad there is no intimidation involved in the SLS decision-making process.
Ready-fire-aim.
), I thought I would check the GMA missive to see if I could find a reason to click No and No. And there was the gift I was seeking. In all the stuff I had read on SLS/COS08 I had failed to spot the improvements were conditional on some fertive and undefined criteria regarding SLS uptake.
I am so glad there is no intimidation involved in the SLS decision-making process.
Ready-fire-aim.
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I bet the reason the update came out is that a fire has been lit underneath them. Tony has probably asked them why the pilots are not signing or they have been told that if the SLS fails they will be held accountable...let see who blinks first
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The reason there is no response from the AOA is that the music is coming to a stop and they have been left without a chair.
They jumped on board recommending this SLS and COS08 bull-****t, and now the rules have been changed halfway through... again. They should have listened to their membership and stuck to their principles.
The AOA's next move will be the make-or-break type. Many people, myself included, are planning on leaving the AOA based on their recent gut-less display, and this is their chance to change that or make it even worse.
After the surrender we've seen on SLS and COS08, my money is on them bending over even more.
I really hope that I am wrong.
They jumped on board recommending this SLS and COS08 bull-****t, and now the rules have been changed halfway through... again. They should have listened to their membership and stuck to their principles.
The AOA's next move will be the make-or-break type. Many people, myself included, are planning on leaving the AOA based on their recent gut-less display, and this is their chance to change that or make it even worse.
After the surrender we've seen on SLS and COS08, my money is on them bending over even more.
I really hope that I am wrong.
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Oops!
Just went to show someone the GMA update on CX and its been edited to the first paragraph only!
There's a new one from NR in a much more please trust us tone but its the band aid over the cleaver wound after RH's tirade.
Thank goodness the complete version was posted before it was pulled otherwise we wouldn't quite be sure as to the managements thinking. Wonder how the phone call to RH went when they saw the secret plan had been leaked.
Still awaiting that offer of voluntary redundency but apparently that would cost them money rather than getting it from you.
There's a new one from NR in a much more please trust us tone but its the band aid over the cleaver wound after RH's tirade.
Thank goodness the complete version was posted before it was pulled otherwise we wouldn't quite be sure as to the managements thinking. Wonder how the phone call to RH went when they saw the secret plan had been leaked.
Still awaiting that offer of voluntary redundency but apparently that would cost them money rather than getting it from you.