Unified Ra65 For All In Cx

[Dragon69]

Most of the 'senior' pilots in this airline have already had their prov funds weaseled away from them, 25%+ pay cuts in 99

You're quick to remind everyone about the 25% pay cut in 99, but you conveniently left out the share options received at $7.47 which you could have exercised when the share price was at $23+.

[Alpor]

Apparently in about year 2000 (so I believe) ASL were given a one off opportunity to join CPA. The only reason that everyone did not take it, I believe, was that joining CPA meant accepting RA 55 whereas ASL had (and apparently had always had) RA 60. There was obviously no inclination then for CPA to go for RA 60 then which could have helped to unify the work force. An associate of mine tells me that adopting RA 65 for the whole of CPA will disadvantage a lot of junior crew who joined in good faith expecting career progression based on the contract in force. From my knowledge of the company can pilots reaching age 55 not rejoin on the new conditions of service which apparently give the RA 65 - obviously on the bottom of your seniority? list but still in employment..

[raven11]

OK Dragon69.

It doesn't matter how many times someone mentions the deep cuts to the contracts of the senior crew over the years, their delayed commands, the losses they actually incurred are nothing to you. You're so filled with hatred of your fellow colleagues that you twist all events to rationalize your psychosis. The word schadenfreude comes to mind.

I have a question for you Dragon: What cuts to your contract have you endured? Before you jump onto your keyboard to spew your usual venom, I challenge you to answer the question: how many cuts have you endured to your contract?

However, be that as it may, in your last post (your typical cheap shot smear post) you've unwittingly given us the answer to our dilemma.
All junior crew that are bypassed by extendees can have compensation in the form of Cathay Options.

Well done! Now onto your keyboard Dragon and tell me how you can't wait until I'm flipping burgers in my retirement.

[Dragon69]

Listen Raven if you are too emotional and sensitive to handle some "Hard Talk" on an anonymous forum, well may I suggest that you leave and join a world peace forum.

Exactly who is acting as if the world owes them something???

As I've said before what makes you think that it is your god given right to extend past 55. You and your mates post here with disinformation (akin to TTs weekly update) to paint this picture of how badly you've suffered over the years. What was the joke in '99 "poor Nigel won't be able to fly his hunter anymore" Very sad but there was a lot of truth to it. I am sorry if my last post smeared that picture, but you really do live in a delusional world without any due regard or consideration to anyone else. You are not here to debate the issue or listen to the concerns of others. You are here to force your views upon us by chastising anyone that offers a balanced view or opinion.

We've all suffered pay cuts, pay freezes, etc etc etc etc!! What is your point and who is to blame for it???? Guess what, we never lead by example, never stood up to do anything about it when times were good, simply because we were ALL looking after our own self serving interest, and now you hypocritically criticize the younger crew for looking after their own self serving interest.

[boxjockey]

Dragon,

Bravo, good man, and spot on!! I will happily stay on RA55 and BPP. You can sign on to COS 08 and work until you are 65. I do not feel sorry for you. I do not feel sorry for myself.

box

[CYRILJGROOVE]

And What If

Ok Box, what would you do if a contract lobs in your box....offering an "improvement" to work until 65 or.........you are going to be fired, no option of staying on your present contract. Not much choice really eh. and CX have done it before and will do it again, I still have the DFO's letter that I "happily signed". Beat your chest as much as you like however BPP is in it's death roll and will not see in 2010.

[parabellum]

As a complete outsider with no axe to grind in any direction please may I ask a couple or three of questions?

1. Does anyone in CX seriously expect to get bypass pay from SFO to captain without having passed a command course?

2. Can those that are most put out by an extension of retirement age from 55 to 65 and claim that, "they signed a contract to 55 and that should be it" put their hands on their hearts and say that there have never been any other contractual changes, good or bad, that they have let slip by without protest?

3. On the up side the extra ten years in company employment will, in part, make up for the lack of pay rises and bonuses, won't it?

Had I had the chance with my company to extend to 65 I would probably have gone to around 63, others would have been gone the day after their 60th birthday so, realistically, how many on the 55 contract will actually go much beyond 60?
Working out exactly how much an individual has really been delayed from getting their command won't be so simple but aren't they getting, (possibly), another five years on SFO pay with increasing increments now and a further five at the top end of the captains incremental scale?
(or even ten) as they will have the opportunity to extend beyond 55 too?

[broadband circuit]

Written by Nick himself

parabellum,

Many here will immediately finger you for being a management stooge, possibly even the DFO himself, or someone under his direct control.

However, I am generous enough to consider the possibility that you genuinely don't understand the situation, hence:

1. Does anyone in CX seriously expect to get bypass pay from SFO to captain without having passed a command course?

Does anyone in CX seriously expect to NOT get bypass pay from SFO to captain without having the opportunity to even attempt a command course because extenders have filled their spot?

2. Can those that are most put out by an extension of retirement age from 55 to 65 and claim that, "they signed a contract to 55 and that should be it" put their hands on their hearts and say that there have never been any other contractual changes, good or bad, that they have let slip by without protest?

In my time at CX, we've never let contractual changes slip by without protest, sometimes we've been forced to accept them under duress, and sometimes they've been unilaterally enforced on us (note the current crop of court cases against CX by both pilots & the FAU).

And what the hell are you talking about "good" or bad??? Everything has been a one way street - ie management's way!

3. On the up side the extra ten years in company employment will, in part, make up for the lack of pay rises and bonuses, won't it?

I won't even dignify your point number 3 with an answer, other than to say it is the prime reason that everyone will accuse you of being the DFO.




To summarise, if you're not a management stooge, then please look again at the situation have another think about it

If you are a management stooge, then FOXTROT OSCAR!

[parabellum]

Thanks Broadband, definitely not a management stooge!! Never made it beyond line captain but I was an expat for most of my career, retired aged 60, bummer! Always interested in how things pan out in other companies, having been royally screwed contractually at least once!
Cheers, and the best of luck to you in getting the best deal you can.