Jobs in the region (Merged ad nauseam)
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As you said, maybe it's time to face the reality Dimiair, but flying is a career path . . . a job . . . and people expect an honest day's pay for an honest day's work.
World economics-- ah, yes, the race to the bottom! Come over to Nicaragua and try to live with a family on $600 a month-- that's standard FO pay-- bring about $1200 if you fancy yourself a Captain and tell me how you like it and if you feel that you can undercut that salary-- living only to put food on the table is not a sustainable model, but after you're fed up (excuse the pun) and highball back to Europe, there will be another guy willing to replace you.
Those of us who have struggled to succeed in our career goals find it repugnant that extremely short-sighted individuals are all to eager to errode it away because they just want to fly (a-la wow, and you mean I even get paid for this)??? Reading the newspapers, believe this is a reason why Western Europeans are so concerned about the enlargement of the Euro-Zone and immigration.
Captain Stable, you are actually wrong to call this type of activity "prostitution." Prostitutes try to get the most money the possibly can for their services and sometimes show more unity in maintaining a minimum price with their peers-- overall, relatively honorable in a profession that is generally frowned upon by the public. On the hand, girls who "give it away" are referred to as "tramps."
So, Dimiair, you don't want to share a cockpit with me??? Sounds fine by me, you haven't hurt my feelings one bit.
World economics-- ah, yes, the race to the bottom! Come over to Nicaragua and try to live with a family on $600 a month-- that's standard FO pay-- bring about $1200 if you fancy yourself a Captain and tell me how you like it and if you feel that you can undercut that salary-- living only to put food on the table is not a sustainable model, but after you're fed up (excuse the pun) and highball back to Europe, there will be another guy willing to replace you.
Those of us who have struggled to succeed in our career goals find it repugnant that extremely short-sighted individuals are all to eager to errode it away because they just want to fly (a-la wow, and you mean I even get paid for this)??? Reading the newspapers, believe this is a reason why Western Europeans are so concerned about the enlargement of the Euro-Zone and immigration.
Captain Stable, you are actually wrong to call this type of activity "prostitution." Prostitutes try to get the most money the possibly can for their services and sometimes show more unity in maintaining a minimum price with their peers-- overall, relatively honorable in a profession that is generally frowned upon by the public. On the hand, girls who "give it away" are referred to as "tramps."
So, Dimiair, you don't want to share a cockpit with me??? Sounds fine by me, you haven't hurt my feelings one bit.
Last edited by Panama Jack; 9th Jun 2005 at 05:09.
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tramp
Well PJ. I'm contented to experience that I do agree with most of what you wrote. Maybe you're not as shallow like my first impression about you.
Nicaragua, as you know, is one of the hemisphere's poorest countries, faces low per capita income, massive unemployment, and huge external debt. Distribution of income is one of the most unequal on the globe and with 600 dlr a month your income is far above the average income of 133 dlr. Any idea what a lawyer or a doctor makes in Nicaragua? A friend of mine works as a pilot in PNG. He doesn't make any money at all! His church in Holland support his whole family. He's been doing this for 6 years now. I would like to do same, but the organisation he works for requires a solid connection with a christian church (apparently you can't help people in need without the message from god..)
Another friend of my works for a dutch flag carrier flying MD11. Straight from ab initio to the right seat. He has spend twice the money for his flight school then I've spend so far though. It usualy takes 7 years after graduation when you start to make big bucks.
Maybe we have to see ourselfs as a (mass)product. To sell your product you have to invest more then just the cost for manufacturing. Marketing, promotion and last but not least: a good network. The one who finds the best balans between all of this, will sell most of his products (or in our case 'gain the most hours')
Regarding the prostitue / tramp issue: I found a nice explanation of the word 'tramp' (google
)
"A tramp is a vessel that does not operate along a definite route on a fixed schedule, but calls at any port where cargo is available"
Give me wings for the vessel and I think I've found myself a job!
I think PJ that we could have lots of nice discussions and maybe one day we do share the same flight deck
Nicaragua, as you know, is one of the hemisphere's poorest countries, faces low per capita income, massive unemployment, and huge external debt. Distribution of income is one of the most unequal on the globe and with 600 dlr a month your income is far above the average income of 133 dlr. Any idea what a lawyer or a doctor makes in Nicaragua? A friend of mine works as a pilot in PNG. He doesn't make any money at all! His church in Holland support his whole family. He's been doing this for 6 years now. I would like to do same, but the organisation he works for requires a solid connection with a christian church (apparently you can't help people in need without the message from god..)
Another friend of my works for a dutch flag carrier flying MD11. Straight from ab initio to the right seat. He has spend twice the money for his flight school then I've spend so far though. It usualy takes 7 years after graduation when you start to make big bucks.
Maybe we have to see ourselfs as a (mass)product. To sell your product you have to invest more then just the cost for manufacturing. Marketing, promotion and last but not least: a good network. The one who finds the best balans between all of this, will sell most of his products (or in our case 'gain the most hours')
Regarding the prostitue / tramp issue: I found a nice explanation of the word 'tramp' (google
)"A tramp is a vessel that does not operate along a definite route on a fixed schedule, but calls at any port where cargo is available"
Give me wings for the vessel and I think I've found myself a job!
I think PJ that we could have lots of nice discussions and maybe one day we do share the same flight deck
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Dimiair,
Sadly, you are right about the state of affairs in countries like Nicaragua. Of course, I count myself amongst the more fortunate, given that I have many friends who make do on only a few hundred dollars a month-- I sometimes don't know how they do it-- Nicaragua may be less expensive than Europe or some aspects of North America, but it isn't "cheap" either. In many countries of the region where there is a "low cost of living," there is practically no "living." One good friend has a Bachelor Degree, is a relatively high ranking officer (Inspector) of the National Police here, and earns less than $300 per month. He considers himself fortunate that he didn't get a job at the local maquilladora, where people lined up and competition was fierce for the $95 per month jobs, and studies on weekends to get his law degree.
I also have a number of friends who are missionaries. With all due respect, these people are "different" from most of us. They see that they have instructions from a higher being, and are willing to go through a fair amount of self-sacrifice to bring the Word to those who will be receptive. Some of them may fly airplanes, and they may like flying, but flying is secondary to what they do (missionary first, pilot second). One friend, who I flew with years ago, is now in Afghanistan, with his pregnant wife and two young children, "bringing the Bible" to them.
I don't even think I would be willing to accept a paying job to go there.
I hope you'll visit us occasionally on this Forum, as there are a number of interesting regional topics discussed from time to time (when people actually come and post-- this is often the quiet backwater of PPRuNe
). One of the emerging problems is that flight training is rising (cost of a Cessna 152 these days in Nicaragua is $130/dual, $110/solo) while wages and opportunities remain low. Seeing as we discuss economics, the laws of economics should mean that wages should go up-- well, at least something's got to give. In the case of Nicaragua, most of the pilots are in their 40's or older. This points towards an upcoming shortage-- and hopefully more realistic wages to attract people into the profession (there is hardly a Nicaraguan military anymore). As one pilot friend said years ago "We don't want jobs, we want careers." Check out this thread
So I'm glad we've had this discussion Dimiair, and I hope that you might be able to get your dream job, not because of anything you said earlier which I surely misunderstood, but because of your qualifications (however low they may be, you've worked hard for them, invested heavily in that, and should be appropriately rewarded-- you are a professional) and desire to succeed, your track record in the Caribbean as a police officer and your enthusiasm for the region and for aviation in general. Oh, and as you said-- Networking . . . networking . . . networking . . .
Who knows, small industry, maybe we will share the flight deck together one day.
Sadly, you are right about the state of affairs in countries like Nicaragua. Of course, I count myself amongst the more fortunate, given that I have many friends who make do on only a few hundred dollars a month-- I sometimes don't know how they do it-- Nicaragua may be less expensive than Europe or some aspects of North America, but it isn't "cheap" either. In many countries of the region where there is a "low cost of living," there is practically no "living." One good friend has a Bachelor Degree, is a relatively high ranking officer (Inspector) of the National Police here, and earns less than $300 per month. He considers himself fortunate that he didn't get a job at the local maquilladora, where people lined up and competition was fierce for the $95 per month jobs, and studies on weekends to get his law degree.
I also have a number of friends who are missionaries. With all due respect, these people are "different" from most of us. They see that they have instructions from a higher being, and are willing to go through a fair amount of self-sacrifice to bring the Word to those who will be receptive. Some of them may fly airplanes, and they may like flying, but flying is secondary to what they do (missionary first, pilot second). One friend, who I flew with years ago, is now in Afghanistan, with his pregnant wife and two young children, "bringing the Bible" to them.
I don't even think I would be willing to accept a paying job to go there. I hope you'll visit us occasionally on this Forum, as there are a number of interesting regional topics discussed from time to time (when people actually come and post-- this is often the quiet backwater of PPRuNe
). One of the emerging problems is that flight training is rising (cost of a Cessna 152 these days in Nicaragua is $130/dual, $110/solo) while wages and opportunities remain low. Seeing as we discuss economics, the laws of economics should mean that wages should go up-- well, at least something's got to give. In the case of Nicaragua, most of the pilots are in their 40's or older. This points towards an upcoming shortage-- and hopefully more realistic wages to attract people into the profession (there is hardly a Nicaraguan military anymore). As one pilot friend said years ago "We don't want jobs, we want careers." Check out this threadSo I'm glad we've had this discussion Dimiair, and I hope that you might be able to get your dream job, not because of anything you said earlier which I surely misunderstood, but because of your qualifications (however low they may be, you've worked hard for them, invested heavily in that, and should be appropriately rewarded-- you are a professional) and desire to succeed, your track record in the Caribbean as a police officer and your enthusiasm for the region and for aviation in general. Oh, and as you said-- Networking . . . networking . . . networking . . .
Who knows, small industry, maybe we will share the flight deck together one day.
Last edited by Panama Jack; 10th Jun 2005 at 06:44.
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Prostitution - defined
PJ, you almost got it right. It's not prostitute, (oldest profession), slut or skank (close). Actually, the correct indentification for this species is CRACK WHORE.
See, it goes like this: Volunerable young inexperienced person pays thru the nose and becomes high on the drug (flying). Likes it so much that he/she becomes addicted. Runs out of money and turns to selling his/her body for 15 small just to get a fix (the job). The pusher realizes this and pretty soon they are doing it for free. Just bend over and grab your ankles (the industry pay issue).
Like the young lad who went to Nassau and was easily talked into going to Gulfstream for 15 large (company commission?) and get a type (? more like SIC letter) in an aircraft that he cannot even qualify as PIC in. All because he was intoxicated during the interview (not a job offer in writing).
To be competitive in the island market, you need to have 1200-2000 hours TT 500 MEL (most have more). Plus, you need to have someone who will walk your CV in the door of the CP. I do not know you. You get no consideration from me. Remember boys and girls. It's not what you know (and 600 TT ain't nothing) it's who you know.
Here's a concept. Take your flying ability to your local military recruiter. Best free education you can get plus they pay you to fly!!
See, it goes like this: Volunerable young inexperienced person pays thru the nose and becomes high on the drug (flying). Likes it so much that he/she becomes addicted. Runs out of money and turns to selling his/her body for 15 small just to get a fix (the job). The pusher realizes this and pretty soon they are doing it for free. Just bend over and grab your ankles (the industry pay issue).
Like the young lad who went to Nassau and was easily talked into going to Gulfstream for 15 large (company commission?) and get a type (? more like SIC letter) in an aircraft that he cannot even qualify as PIC in. All because he was intoxicated during the interview (not a job offer in writing).
To be competitive in the island market, you need to have 1200-2000 hours TT 500 MEL (most have more). Plus, you need to have someone who will walk your CV in the door of the CP. I do not know you. You get no consideration from me. Remember boys and girls. It's not what you know (and 600 TT ain't nothing) it's who you know.
Here's a concept. Take your flying ability to your local military recruiter. Best free education you can get plus they pay you to fly!!
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Work in the Caribbeans
I am 33 and have over 5000 on B737s. I would work in Jamaica or anywhere in the Caribbeans because of lifestyle more than anything else, money including. Anyone with ideas?
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Just so you all know, I have given up merging other threads with this one. Any future threads started anew asking for information about jobs in the region will simply be deleted, as I can't be bothered to to all the work of merging.
In case of complaint, I refer you to a model that used to sit on the desk of a senior pilot of a company for whom I used to work. The plaque stated "In case of complaint, please take a number". Above it was a tag with a number printed on it, which was attached to the pin of a hand grenade.
In case of complaint, I refer you to a model that used to sit on the desk of a senior pilot of a company for whom I used to work. The plaque stated "In case of complaint, please take a number". Above it was a tag with a number printed on it, which was attached to the pin of a hand grenade.
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Suriname
hey all!!
I am very interested in flying in Suriname.
Is there anyone who has experience with flying in Suriname?
All help, tips, advise or info...would be very much appreciated!
Many Thanks
I am very interested in flying in Suriname.
Is there anyone who has experience with flying in Suriname?
All help, tips, advise or info...would be very much appreciated!
Many Thanks
Last edited by gekko; 5th Dec 2005 at 20:53.
Seems like it's harder to get a job in the Caribbean then it is to get one in OZ. Where do all these pilots come from with 600hrs TT, 400 turbine?? Why would anyone give a turbine to somone with only that many hrs??
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Hi,
I think even if people continue to post threads to ask about jobs in Latin Amerika it has become clear by now that for Europeans the chances are near to zero.
Guy´s like Panama Jack state it how it is.
I often fly out of Europe to Mexico,Cuba, Jamaica,.... My wife is Mexican and most of my family is but the chances to get a job there are really low even to say impossible.
With Mexico for instance,...I looked for all the options,...there are none officially... and on top of that,....
I sympathise with the Mexican Pilots,... they have been overrun by foreign pilots in the past giving them almost no chance at all...
When I see how Mexican nationals are treated in the US, for sure I say they are right to give them a same piece of the pie..
I spoke a lot to Mexican pilots,...the terms and conditions are really uncomparable to what we have in Europe.
They too share the dreams to fly in Europe and benefit our social system with good organised health care and good salaries.
I came to terms with it that If I want to continue with the type of flying I am doing now, I will have to stay were I am now... Sad but true
All the best for the Aerocalifornia pilots who are out of a job now....
Muchos saludos.
I think even if people continue to post threads to ask about jobs in Latin Amerika it has become clear by now that for Europeans the chances are near to zero.
Guy´s like Panama Jack state it how it is.
I often fly out of Europe to Mexico,Cuba, Jamaica,.... My wife is Mexican and most of my family is but the chances to get a job there are really low even to say impossible.
With Mexico for instance,...I looked for all the options,...there are none officially... and on top of that,....
I sympathise with the Mexican Pilots,... they have been overrun by foreign pilots in the past giving them almost no chance at all...
When I see how Mexican nationals are treated in the US, for sure I say they are right to give them a same piece of the pie..
I spoke a lot to Mexican pilots,...the terms and conditions are really uncomparable to what we have in Europe.
They too share the dreams to fly in Europe and benefit our social system with good organised health care and good salaries.
I came to terms with it that If I want to continue with the type of flying I am doing now, I will have to stay were I am now... Sad but true
All the best for the Aerocalifornia pilots who are out of a job now....
Muchos saludos.
Last edited by el caballero rojo; 8th May 2006 at 14:29.
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Dash 8 Jobs
Gday im an australian trying to reach into the caribbean. Im a licensed DHC-8 avionics engineer and ive been told i need contacts in the region to have any hope. Is this true? and does anyone know any companies hiring in the region?
Cheers
Cheers
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737 rated FO's and Cap's needed by Lan
That's it dudes.. last saturday in the main chilean Newspaper showed a classified asking for it.. there you go with some info...
Los interesados enviar CV con fotocopia de Licencia Comercial por ambos lados y certificado DGAC que acredite horas de vuelo a:
Pilotos 10241, Casilla 13-D, Santiago
O al correo:
[email protected]
Habilitado en Material 737
in English:
Applicants send CV with copy of CPL both sides and Flight hours certificate to (the address showhed up there in bold and/or the email)
737 Type Rated
A few facts: Lan owns a reducing 737-200 Advanced fleet, but seems to have some problems with the A320 fleet and its bringing bakc to service some 737's, probably some Flight crews will be moving from Sky Airline and Aerolineas del Sur to fill this needing since those two carriers have only 732A, so i you dont find anything in Lan, go to those two carries after.
Los interesados enviar CV con fotocopia de Licencia Comercial por ambos lados y certificado DGAC que acredite horas de vuelo a:
Pilotos 10241, Casilla 13-D, Santiago
O al correo:
[email protected]
Habilitado en Material 737
in English:
Applicants send CV with copy of CPL both sides and Flight hours certificate to (the address showhed up there in bold and/or the email)
737 Type Rated
A few facts: Lan owns a reducing 737-200 Advanced fleet, but seems to have some problems with the A320 fleet and its bringing bakc to service some 737's, probably some Flight crews will be moving from Sky Airline and Aerolineas del Sur to fill this needing since those two carriers have only 732A, so i you dont find anything in Lan, go to those two carries after.
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Argentina
Sorry guys, don't mean to keep repeating the same old question...but here goes anyway. Can anyone give me a little insight as to the current pilot employment situation in Argentina? Corporate and Airlines, Yes I am a citizen, but have being living abroad for a LONG time.
Thanks, any info will be appreciated
Thanks, any info will be appreciated
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jobs
No DASH 8 jobs in the caribbean far too many type rated guys here who got laid off from the impending merger.Preference once hiring resumes will be for local pilots.
Regards
Regards
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Hello there fellas!!!!!!!!!!
If you are still interested in flying in Latin America, just go to COPA. They are still cancelling flights due to lack of pilots. As far as I'm concerned, they are in need of people desperately!!
Just as a reminder, the fly B737s and EMB190s.
Good hunting!!!
AA
If you are still interested in flying in Latin America, just go to COPA. They are still cancelling flights due to lack of pilots. As far as I'm concerned, they are in need of people desperately!!
Just as a reminder, the fly B737s and EMB190s.
Good hunting!!!
AA
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. . . go to COPA. They are still cancelling flights due to lack of pilots. As far as I'm concerned, they are in need of people desperately!!
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Important Information Shared
These Kind Of Posts Are One Of The Most Important For People With No Job And Wanting To Get One But Before We Decide Whre To Go And As You Said Which "door To Knock" Thgis Is One Of The Best Ways I Know To Gather And Share Information ,it Would Be A Shame And Very Very Unfare That Our Future Might Depend On Your "mood" , You Should Have Never Daid That In Public More Over If You Are The "moderator".
Thanks
Thanks
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captain on dornier 328. 4000 hours total time. over 3000 on turboprop
Alpine pilot, you could do a search in Colombia, SATENA (9N), flies 6 Do328s and also flies ERJ145s and 170s, I flew for them for 3 years, as for the airline I guess I would have to consider it more like a mix betweeen an Air Taxi operation and an Airline, they fly to very remote locations in Colombia the pay is average in colombia terms but maybe low to you considering you are coming from europe, anyway if you need more info let me know.
AV
AV
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Copa Airlines is hiring street captains, 5000 TT 1000 TPIC airline experience and they will hire expats for captain positions from what I understand. have you looked into them? (you may just be a little short on time, maybe another year in europe?)