Emergency scenario
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 297
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From: Buckinghamshire
STOP PRESS
Mythbusters to the rescue, this has been tested, once without help from the ground, once with help from the ground however finding the second part isn't easy, I guess people are only interested in seeing it crash!
Interesting results, not the best video, but funny in places!!
Interesting results, not the best video, but funny in places!!
Last edited by atmosphere; 6th August 2012 at 10:17.
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 227
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From: A whole new world now!!
Yes I can. Travelling back from Greece a couple of years ago from my jollies the regular Captain was taken ill. Another Captain employed by the company concerned who was travelling back from his honeymoon flew the plane home and landed it extremly well 
His take off was pretty good as well the regular guy was incapcitated on the ground.
EZY319 if we have a double pilot incap at 35,000 unless we have a type rated pilot on board we would be better off doing a PA for a priest. I too know how to contact the ground but do you seriously think a CC would be able to do all what Freda has said in this situation even if advised.
Our ground contact would probably give us lots of very kind reassurance before we either hit the side of a mountain or plough into the drink because we have no pilot sitting at the front to ensure otherwise. That's assuming we are not shot down first if we remotely became a danger to highly populated area's.
I am fellow cabin crew and cringed when I saw your remark about planes landing themselves. They need someone highly trained and qualified to tell them how and when to do this though. Otherwise they will land themselves when they either run out of fuel or hit an obstacle when flying on auto pilot.
We should know how to contact and talk to the ground as that would assist a lone pilot flying the plane. If we don't have that pilot we are screwed in this scenario.
His take off was pretty good as well the regular guy was incapcitated on the ground.
EZY319 if we have a double pilot incap at 35,000 unless we have a type rated pilot on board we would be better off doing a PA for a priest. I too know how to contact the ground but do you seriously think a CC would be able to do all what Freda has said in this situation even if advised.
Our ground contact would probably give us lots of very kind reassurance before we either hit the side of a mountain or plough into the drink because we have no pilot sitting at the front to ensure otherwise. That's assuming we are not shot down first if we remotely became a danger to highly populated area's.
I am fellow cabin crew and cringed when I saw your remark about planes landing themselves. They need someone highly trained and qualified to tell them how and when to do this though. Otherwise they will land themselves when they either run out of fuel or hit an obstacle when flying on auto pilot.
We should know how to contact and talk to the ground as that would assist a lone pilot flying the plane. If we don't have that pilot we are screwed in this scenario.
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 107
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From: liverpool
Ok so the comment I made was obviously taken out of context and apologies if I have offended or people have mis-interpreted what I said.
I am fully aware that it takes someone highly skilled and trained to land an aircraft and that there isn't a big green LAND NOW button.
However, lowcostdolly I think you may under estimate the skills of your fellow crew members. I don't think for one moment we would be 'screwed' in this scenario. When I was originally taught (many years ago) how to contact the ground in said emergency by a captain who had flown for many years and has recently retired I asked him the very same question 'would cabin crew be capable of getting the aircraft safely down with instructions from the ground?'. After much discussion he agreed we would, if the person on the ground knows what they're talking about and the crew member playing captain doesn't lose their cool. As FREDA pointed out there are many factors that could make or break the happy outcome to this scenario, but I stick by my point that I would be wary of letting anyone else into the flight deck to deal with this due to the ever present threat of terrorism.
I am fully aware that it takes someone highly skilled and trained to land an aircraft and that there isn't a big green LAND NOW button.
However, lowcostdolly I think you may under estimate the skills of your fellow crew members. I don't think for one moment we would be 'screwed' in this scenario. When I was originally taught (many years ago) how to contact the ground in said emergency by a captain who had flown for many years and has recently retired I asked him the very same question 'would cabin crew be capable of getting the aircraft safely down with instructions from the ground?'. After much discussion he agreed we would, if the person on the ground knows what they're talking about and the crew member playing captain doesn't lose their cool. As FREDA pointed out there are many factors that could make or break the happy outcome to this scenario, but I stick by my point that I would be wary of letting anyone else into the flight deck to deal with this due to the ever present threat of terrorism.
Joined: May 2009
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From: A whole new world now!!
lowcostdolly
didn't you have a copilot who could land the plane?
didn't you have a copilot who could land the plane?
This thread is about double pilot incap in the air and one of my own CC colleagues thinks this scenario will have happy ending if only we all keep watching the movies and taking the pills......
You EZYA319 will not be able to land a 319 safely in this situation, I would lay money on it.
However I'm happy to be corrected by my flight deck colleagues here and open the floor for discussion........
Joined: Mar 2006
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From: Choroni, sometimes
In my career I had a few opportunities to take friends to my simulator sessions, 727, A340, A310, A320.
Among them 4 private pilots with some hundred hours.
None of them was able to land the aircraft in one piece at the 1st attempt.
Conditions:
- aircraft in approach configuration (flaps, gear) on speed
- daylight, unlimited visibilty
- ILS support
- no wind
Among them 4 private pilots with some hundred hours.
None of them was able to land the aircraft in one piece at the 1st attempt.
Conditions:
- aircraft in approach configuration (flaps, gear) on speed
- daylight, unlimited visibilty
- ILS support
- no wind
.
Está servira para distraerle.
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 6
Likes: 1
From: In a perambulator.
You'd know of course if there were a company pilot on board? Even if they're traveling off duty or on holiday, I believe that this is standard practice on US airlines.
Next time I'm paxing on an HS748, I must remember to tell the #1 that if the flight crew pegs it, I can fly it.
Next time I'm paxing on an HS748, I must remember to tell the #1 that if the flight crew pegs it, I can fly it.
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 66
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From: ipswich
ezy so once again you go on about terrorists. do you not think a terrorist may have a plan already, or perhaps they all fly around waiting for a double incapacitation. or even someone turns into one just for the hell of it . you could always stand behind them with a crash axe and smack em if you don't like what their doing. anyway if you're flying who's gonna get my coffee
. you could always stand behind them with a crash axe and smack em if you don't like what their doing. anyway if you're flying who's gonna get my coffee
Joined: Mar 2006
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From: Choroni, sometimes
can anyone actually think of a time someone other than the regular crew HAD to land the plane? (let's put helios aside as no one landed that plane)
Back to the topic. Emergency scenarios, especially with CC, should be cause related, not academic.
AFAIK, there was never ever a case of both pilots incapacitated.
Yeah 9/11, okay, open the cockpit door for their friends
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 359
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From: Vienna
Only instance of a (PPL) passenger landing a plane I am aware of does not involve a passenger jet but "merely" a King Air: AUDIO: Passenger lands plane after pilot dies during flight » Naples Daily News .
