BA CSD Suspended for incorrectly demanding hotel upgrade!
Join Date: May 2001
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I am just abit confused why the airline is held responsable for a descion which is taken totally out with their control by a supplier to give more than the required service. A quiet room with, Bed, Shower, toilet, telly and for me a room which the temp is bordering on freezing. Making a fuss about it is just going to stop any chance of anyone getting an upgrade in the future.
Its fair enough kicking up a stink if the room your given is sub standard in any form away from the minimum grade. But having a tantrum because one of your collegues has been lucky and given a upgrade is bloody childish. Whats next in the resturant the captain, FO and CSD all order steak do the hotel have to measure the size of the portions so the captain gets the biggest bit with most chips and the FO and CSD get the same size.
I have in the past given my room in the Marriot to the CC when it turned out she was meant to stay in the Brittania in Aberdeen. I couldn't live with myself if anything happened while she was staying there or the thought of her being upset and scared in a hotel.
MJ
Its fair enough kicking up a stink if the room your given is sub standard in any form away from the minimum grade. But having a tantrum because one of your collegues has been lucky and given a upgrade is bloody childish. Whats next in the resturant the captain, FO and CSD all order steak do the hotel have to measure the size of the portions so the captain gets the biggest bit with most chips and the FO and CSD get the same size.
I have in the past given my room in the Marriot to the CC when it turned out she was meant to stay in the Brittania in Aberdeen. I couldn't live with myself if anything happened while she was staying there or the thought of her being upset and scared in a hotel.
MJ
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BASSA aren't used to being told 'No' and think they can have their way with hotel management by throwing a tantrum just like they do with BA. This is the same union that think that when the cabin crew have demanded extra crew on a flight according to their crew matrix and the hotel doesn't have enough rooms then the pilots should volunteer to stay in the substandard hotel.
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I think a simple memo to all hotel suppliers stating that no upgrades to anyone under captain must be given without crewing approval. I am sure crewing have enough to do without having to deal with pish of crews down route having tantrums. 6 months of no upgrades. Then allow them and the first sign of any tantrums take it away again.
If they can't play with a ball without fighting take the ball off them.
If they can't play with a ball without fighting take the ball off them.
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Why punish the FOs because the cabin crew can't behave? No upgrades whatsoever for cabin crew might do the trick? The hotel already know the upgrade procedure, it's crystal clear, written in unambiguous language.
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I was thinking personally I wouldn't be bothered but i can see your point. Either no upgrades for cabin crew. And when they have a tantrum no upgrades for anyone for a while. I am sure peer pressure would sort the problem out.
Join Date: Oct 2002
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Why should the good Ccrew suffer? I hate putting everyone in the same boat. It seems BA have been reasonable in this case and it should send a message to the other fools who believe BASSA.
It won't affect the good crew who are not fools - as it wouldn't have done in the first place. Punishing crews will only make them stronger supporters of BASSA against the "nasty" management and then no one wins.
It won't affect the good crew who are not fools - as it wouldn't have done in the first place. Punishing crews will only make them stronger supporters of BASSA against the "nasty" management and then no one wins.
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Nobody is suffering. Nobody is getting less than they are entitled to.
A perk because of abuse has been removed from the equation but nobody has been punished. Do you expect to be upgraded?
Maybe 6 months of there collegues moaning about no upgrades these days will shut the arseholes up. The members of said union will tell thier union to drop it and the upgrades will start again and everyone will be happy. The simple fact that someone has been suspended will have taken someone off line creating more work for the rest. Several managers are having to waste there time with all the associated hoop jumping so they don't get a call for industrial action on there plates. So 1 person having a tantrum will more than likely have cost the company into the £1000's. No upgrades equals no tantrums which equals hopefully a larger dividend for me.
Its your collegues and your Union to sort it out or loose it. The mangment by the sounds of it wern't invovled with getting the upgrades anyway so why are they the nasty managment?. Everything would be nice and fair everyone equal. It would be a bastard for the union to argue against that one.
Or how about telling the Hotels not to upgrade anyone unless your going to upgrade the whole crew to the same level, that would work as well.
A perk because of abuse has been removed from the equation but nobody has been punished. Do you expect to be upgraded?
Maybe 6 months of there collegues moaning about no upgrades these days will shut the arseholes up. The members of said union will tell thier union to drop it and the upgrades will start again and everyone will be happy. The simple fact that someone has been suspended will have taken someone off line creating more work for the rest. Several managers are having to waste there time with all the associated hoop jumping so they don't get a call for industrial action on there plates. So 1 person having a tantrum will more than likely have cost the company into the £1000's. No upgrades equals no tantrums which equals hopefully a larger dividend for me.
Its your collegues and your Union to sort it out or loose it. The mangment by the sounds of it wern't invovled with getting the upgrades anyway so why are they the nasty managment?. Everything would be nice and fair everyone equal. It would be a bastard for the union to argue against that one.
Or how about telling the Hotels not to upgrade anyone unless your going to upgrade the whole crew to the same level, that would work as well.
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WERE ALL FORGETTING SOMETHING!!!
Has this incident actually occured??? Most unlikely and there seems to be no prove to support it...all that is being said about either BA or BASSA is all being manufactured by you lot!!!
Has this incident actually occured??? Most unlikely and there seems to be no prove to support it...all that is being said about either BA or BASSA is all being manufactured by you lot!!!
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............. and therein lies the problem apaddyinuk
The relationship between BASSA and Cabin Crew is one of Parent sibling or Teacher pupil.
Just recently after a diversion due a wildcat strike, BASSA members were told under NO circumstance were they to leave their respective hotels until they had had 2 nights local rest, problem was it was Friday and Saturday nights and most people had something planned and wanted to hire cars and drive home, BA of course coul'nt provide any transport on the Saturday morning for fear of upsetting BASSA and the 2 night rule.
apaddyinuk, what part of any of my posts has been "manufactured"?
The relationship between BASSA and Cabin Crew is one of Parent sibling or Teacher pupil.Just recently after a diversion due a wildcat strike, BASSA members were told under NO circumstance were they to leave their respective hotels until they had had 2 nights local rest, problem was it was Friday and Saturday nights and most people had something planned and wanted to hire cars and drive home, BA of course coul'nt provide any transport on the Saturday morning for fear of upsetting BASSA and the 2 night rule.
apaddyinuk, what part of any of my posts has been "manufactured"?
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Mad Jock - No I never expect an upgrade, indeed I am very happy to get one and feel quite lucky to do so when it happens. By 'punish' I mean that should an upgrade be on offer, why should I lose out due to the actions of a selfish fool who made a fuss ahead of me? I don't make fusses like that, nor do I demand anything from a hotel. If there is a problem I always try to fix it in the politest way I can and I treat all the workers at the hotel with respect.
I just hate the "take it away from everyone" attitude, when it is the lowest common denominator that causes the problem. there are a number of things we cannot do in BA due to the actions of some idiots and I don't think treating the rest of us like children is the answer. Deal with the problem person (or union!) and let the rest of us carry on being professional.
I just hate the "take it away from everyone" attitude, when it is the lowest common denominator that causes the problem. there are a number of things we cannot do in BA due to the actions of some idiots and I don't think treating the rest of us like children is the answer. Deal with the problem person (or union!) and let the rest of us carry on being professional.
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I've only read the first couple of posts, but despite what really happened, i can believe this behaviour of Hong Kong.
I've worked for a few airlines now, crew wise and ground staff and i've always heard about people in Hong Kong being trigger happy when it comes to complaining about airline staff.
I've seen it myself when travelling on standby - reasonable people that i wouldn't have thought we're being rude pulled into an office when they get back with a complaint from that outstation. I had to act as witness on that occasion to say absolutely nothing offensive happened!
I think the good people of Hong Kong aren't used to people being up front about asking for upgrades - and especially those who've come off a 14 hour flight and may be a little disheveled.
I've worked for a few airlines now, crew wise and ground staff and i've always heard about people in Hong Kong being trigger happy when it comes to complaining about airline staff.
I've seen it myself when travelling on standby - reasonable people that i wouldn't have thought we're being rude pulled into an office when they get back with a complaint from that outstation. I had to act as witness on that occasion to say absolutely nothing offensive happened!
I think the good people of Hong Kong aren't used to people being up front about asking for upgrades - and especially those who've come off a 14 hour flight and may be a little disheveled.
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I think striparella has proberly spotted the real reason why or if it occured. I still think peer pressure is the best way if not the only way to control these idiots.
The problem with selective policys is it leaves you wide open to victimisation claims. Mind you if the members of the union told the union that they wern't happy with what was happening. And with the union involvement a person gets banned would that work?
I feel quite sorry for the poor person that needs to sort it out. Thier knackard if they don't do something and knackard if they do.
What would happen if a member of flight deck behaved like that?
Anyway why is CC getting involved arguing with the Hotel If they are part of a full crew and they are not happy tell the Captain and they should deal with it. There's another solution all contact with outside service providers must be through the Captain
The problem with selective policys is it leaves you wide open to victimisation claims. Mind you if the members of the union told the union that they wern't happy with what was happening. And with the union involvement a person gets banned would that work?
I feel quite sorry for the poor person that needs to sort it out. Thier knackard if they don't do something and knackard if they do.
What would happen if a member of flight deck behaved like that?
Anyway why is CC getting involved arguing with the Hotel If they are part of a full crew and they are not happy tell the Captain and they should deal with it. There's another solution all contact with outside service providers must be through the Captain
Last edited by mad_jock; 30th Oct 2005 at 11:51.
mad_jock
Your comment :"All contact through outside service providers should be through the Captain" -had me rolling on the floor - though I am inclined to agree with you nevertheless
........You are assuming that all "our" Cabin Crew see the Captain as their "boss"/"chief representative"/"chief facililitator" when away from base......
Your comment :"All contact through outside service providers should be through the Captain" -had me rolling on the floor - though I am inclined to agree with you nevertheless
........You are assuming that all "our" Cabin Crew see the Captain as their "boss"/"chief representative"/"chief facililitator" when away from base......
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Folks we are talking about one individual CSD amongst several hundred others.If the individual in question has indeed stepped out of line, then he / she will have had to answer for it back at base.
Speaking as a CSD at LHR I feel that any discussions regarding the relationship between CC and FC should be kept in house on our own forums.
As for hotel rooms, Has it got a bed, a bog / bath, telly. Is it clean? Then I'll have it.
Has the skipper been given an entire floor? Good luck to them and anyone else who gets a good room.
BA crew have enough bad press, some of it is earned, most of it is not. I am sad that this has become a BA bashing thread.
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I don't think it has become a BA bashing thread. It relates more to do with personal interactions with each other when some peoples behaviour effect the working conditions of others. The problem which is being discussed could just as easily be in the engineering contract world or sales rep as it could in the airline.
And keeping it all under the sheets is a bit late now. I don't think many of your customers have much sympathy now when they hear of industrial strife at BA.
And I am not suprised you want to keep the relationship between Pilots and CC (BTW I always thought CC where part of the flight crew team but there we go) in private you must out number them by at least 6 to 1. And there would be no outside points of view telling you its not normal and in some points totally wrong.
BTW when down route these CC who decide not to look on the pilots as "incharge" and even on the ground resposable for their safety, comfort and well being. I hope the Captian and FO returns the favour by not bothering their arse when things go tits up.
MJ
And keeping it all under the sheets is a bit late now. I don't think many of your customers have much sympathy now when they hear of industrial strife at BA.
And I am not suprised you want to keep the relationship between Pilots and CC (BTW I always thought CC where part of the flight crew team but there we go) in private you must out number them by at least 6 to 1. And there would be no outside points of view telling you its not normal and in some points totally wrong.
BTW when down route these CC who decide not to look on the pilots as "incharge" and even on the ground resposable for their safety, comfort and well being. I hope the Captian and FO returns the favour by not bothering their arse when things go tits up.
MJ
Isn't BA (or their employees) being a little precious about the whole deal?
Can someone give me a logical justification as to why the technical crew should have better rooms than the cabin crew?
And maybe someone can also debunk the urban myth that the captain enjoys separate transportation from the remainder of the technical crew who travel separately from the cabin crew.
Difficult to believe in this day and age.
Isn't it the airline's responsibility to ensure adequate accommodation for their crews, with clear standards that are integral to the contract with the hotel and are communicated to the crews?
And isn't the airline responsible for monitoring those standards, both by inspections and providing for a reporting mechanism.
Can't agree more with the chappy from Lufthansa Regional.
This all sounds pretty much driven by class thinking a la Titanic.....
Can someone give me a logical justification as to why the technical crew should have better rooms than the cabin crew?
And maybe someone can also debunk the urban myth that the captain enjoys separate transportation from the remainder of the technical crew who travel separately from the cabin crew.
Difficult to believe in this day and age.
Isn't it the airline's responsibility to ensure adequate accommodation for their crews, with clear standards that are integral to the contract with the hotel and are communicated to the crews?
And isn't the airline responsible for monitoring those standards, both by inspections and providing for a reporting mechanism.
Can't agree more with the chappy from Lufthansa Regional.
This all sounds pretty much driven by class thinking a la Titanic.....
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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Can someone give me a logical justification as to why the technical crew should have better rooms than the cabin crew?
And maybe someone can also debunk the urban myth that the captain enjoys separate transportation from the remainder of the technical crew who travel separately from the cabin crew.
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Can someone give me a logical justification as to why the technical crew should have better rooms than the cabin crew?
