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Vistajet Future

Old 4th Feb 2019, 16:37
  #61 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Europe
Posts: 263
Originally Posted by FLYDUS View Post
If you say Netjets with their 6/5, okay your opinion. I would not like it. I would rather go for 17/13
Wow. I don't know what to call this. Crazy? Delusional? Take your pick.

The NJE roster means less days of work per year, less time away from friends and family, both consecutively and cumulative. At NJE you do all your training on duty days and vacation is on top.

Vista just doesn't compare. To state otherwise is insane. Ridiculous.

Sorry to be so blunt. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but the facts are the facts.
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Old 4th Feb 2019, 16:59
  #62 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: schermoney and left front seat
Age: 53
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Originally Posted by 733driver View Post
Wow. I don't know what to call this. Crazy? Delusional? Take your pick.

The NJE roster means less days of work per year, less time away from friends and family, both consecutively and cumulative. At NJE you do all your training on duty days and vacation is on top.

Vista just doesn't compare. To state otherwise is insane. Ridiculous.

Sorry to be so blunt. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but the facts are the facts.

Iīd like to work 6/5 rather than 17/13 BUT if he likes it better, than thats his opinion. Period.
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Old 5th Feb 2019, 07:23
  #63 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
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Originally Posted by His dudeness View Post
Iīd like to work 6/5 rather than 17/13 BUT if he likes it better, than thats his opinion. Period.
Absolutely. I was just trying to say that Vista's rostet is objectively worse than NJEs. It's more work and for less pay, too.

To like vista's roster better than NJE's is really quite irrational.
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Old 5th Feb 2019, 07:30
  #64 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Europe
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Originally Posted by Humpmedumpme View Post


As long as itís the same as yours? Would love to sit next to you for six days......just imagine 17.........

17/13 works for me, 6/5 doesnít. Opinion and fact. 17 is long but Iíd prefer that to the ballache of proceeding more than once a week.
You couldn't be more wrong about being on tour with me. We almost always have a great time and respect each others opinions, of course.

I imagine during 17 days on you will frequently be required to take an airline mid-tour. For example when an aircraft goes into maintenance or when you need your two local nights off to reset the duty clock but the aircraft needs to keep flying. So I don't think you will necessarily only have two airlines per 17 day tour. Granted, the same is true for NJE, sometimes.

However, in NJE your airline is in business class if it's longer than six hours. In Vista it's always eco, right? Now that would be a real pain for me.

In Vista you do all your training on your OFF days. In NJE it's on duty days.

And what about vacation? In NJE vacation is subtracted form your paid duty days.

Overall, I'm sure you work many days less at NJE per year and you get paid more, too. And you are gone for less time in one stretch.

It's ok to be happy enough with the vista roster but I really have a very hard time understanding how anyone could consider vista's roster better. Objectives it clearly isn't better. And even subjectively I struggle with that assessment. Now, if we were talking a true 14/14 or 15/15 with long haul travel in biz the I could see how some might like that better than 6/5 or 7/6. It still wouldn't be my preference, though.
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Old 5th Feb 2019, 07:43
  #65 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 25
Itís only 17/13 if you disregard the extra days you are required to do every few months and the 4 off periods disturbed by training and pointless company parties.
each of those 13 days loses between 4 or 5 days so at best with the 18 ďoff daysĒ you must work youíre working 18/12 or 19/11 with precious little compensation for it.
Itís far from a bad company but if you look at the overall package for FOs NJE is miles better and other companies are offering substantially better money for similar roster patterns that are a bit less stable but still allow for paid leave Vista gives you zero leave because thatís what your off days are for... It isnít Captains that are leaving, itís FOs and if you look at that package in isolation Vista is terrible.
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Old 5th Feb 2019, 17:44
  #66 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
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Originally Posted by Humpmedumpme View Post
Whatís the time to left seat at NJE?
Probably long. No-one knows.

But that doesn't make the Vista roster better than the NJE one
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Old 5th Feb 2019, 18:30
  #67 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 25
Originally Posted by Humpmedumpme View Post
Whatís the time to left seat at NJE?
Vista is 6 - 8 years at the moment (anyone claiming otherwise is delusional or lying) NJE is between 8 and 10 probably. Vista FOs arenít leaving for Netjets - but they are leaving. Netjets FOs are much less in a hurry to move on in spite of the lack of upgrade. Evidently the promise of an upgrade to Captain at some point in the future isnít quite enough to keep them, maybe some paid vacation might help, or some more effective fatigue management.

Last edited by Boabity; 5th Feb 2019 at 19:28.
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Old 7th Feb 2019, 16:45
  #68 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Germany
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733Driver,

totally get your points, especially pointing out the 4 months per year we had to do OPC/LPC, CRM and Strategy Days during our OFF.
My main reason to leave was the eco proceedings and those 4 months.........

There are plenty of valid reasons, i decided to leave after almost 12 years, and i am really happy where i am right now.

Anyway, is still believe that 6/5 for me personally doesn't fit as good as my current 14/14 is doing. I just like the fact to come home and almost feel like having a vacation every month. but as we could both see on the replies, everybody is different and has its unique ways of dealing in this challenging industry.

Happy landings.
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Old 7th Feb 2019, 20:46
  #69 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
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Posts: 263
Thanks FLYDUS,

Glad to hear you are happy where you are now. I can totally see that a good 14/14 gig can be quite appealing to some.

Take care :-)
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Old 15th Feb 2019, 18:35
  #70 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Uk
Posts: 89
What, prey tell, is a ď strategy day ď and why are you doing it on days off ?
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Old 15th Feb 2019, 20:33
  #71 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
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Originally Posted by Meester proach View Post
What, prey tell, is a ď strategy day ď and why are you doing it on days off ?
You go to Malta to get drunk with your friends while pretending like you want to be there but really youíd much rather be at home. At some point in the proceedings at least one person with the initials TF tells you that you donít work hard enough in spite of providing the boss with double digit growth... again.
you get to meet people youíve not met in the company and will probably never meet again and meet a few that you got drunk with last year.

Some of it is fun but itís not worth the ballache and 5 days of your time. They go because itís mandatory. It does make you feel like part of something bigger for a week or so.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 18:36
  #72 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: UNITED KINGDOM
Posts: 30
Boabity- if vistajet is that bad, why donít you resign. Companies donít get double digit growth with negative people like you (if you are in fact working for vj). If you donít, then keep going - your jealousy shines through mate.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 18:49
  #73 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Far away from LA
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Originally Posted by nibs2007 View Post
Boabity- if vistajet is that bad, why donít you resign. Companies donít get double digit growth with negative people like you (if you are in fact working for vj). If you donít, then keep going - your jealousy shines through mate.
Austria is the key word here. Same thing at the other one.. People get drunk, the Owner complains that he does not make money, that he has to recruit more pilots, because they are leaving in too large numbers..etc...
The thing is , the market has evolved a bit, and people whom were on a standby list somewhere are leaving, and the new one's ( despite FO, that would take any jobs anyway) have the choice..
They will have to tune and tweak a little the T&Cs, but they are running a cash machine..no worries..
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 19:24
  #74 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: UNITED KINGDOM
Posts: 30
36 pilots left last year mate. Thatís 36 out of 350. And two of them were fired. Clearly you donít know your facts. Scary that you fly a plane...right seat only I hope....
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 23:26
  #75 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK
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Originally Posted by nibs2007 View Post
36 pilots left last year mate. Thatís 36 out of 350. And two of them were fired. Clearly you donít know your facts. Scary that you fly a plane...right seat only I hope....
The first number was true in Sept by December it was a lot bigger. The second one has never been true even if you add in the Jet Aviation crew.
Iíd say my thoughts are a pretty accurate reflection of how things go down, you may think itís negative, then again you havenít yet been flying for vista yet. Good luck, itís a good place to get lots of experience.
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Old 17th Feb 2019, 19:34
  #76 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: UNITED KINGDOM
Posts: 30
Boabity - I am sure there is more to life then being online just after quarter past midnight... just to confirm your intel is factually incorrect!

Would you please stop spreading fake news!

You should act more positively, responsibly and least to say professionally thatís what our industry expects from us.

Now that we are getting little personal and you know my aspirations. Let me give you quick summary,
excited to say the least, working on truly global operation with some of the most amazing and hard working people I have ever meet. We are developing company so comes with lots of hard work across the spectrum.

So I simply say itís Horses for courses, as you know pastures arenít always greener, are they?

I hope this clears any misconceptions and wish you move on.

On that final note, could I ask who exactly is Boabity?
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Old 17th Feb 2019, 20:20
  #77 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: France
Posts: 367
Nice try, nibsi!

PS: have you ever thought of the possibility that "quarter past midnight" may be "quarter past 2pm" somewhere else in the world?
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Old 18th Feb 2019, 16:31
  #78 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: schermoney and left front seat
Age: 53
Posts: 2,271
Originally Posted by EatMyShorts! View Post
Nice try, nibsi!

PS: have you ever thought of the possibility that "quarter past midnight" may be "quarter past 2pm" somewhere else in the world?

If the "nibs-person" is either ops or management, then it does not know this unimportant fact. Thats why they think we are continuously on holiday trips.
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Old 19th Feb 2019, 20:44
  #79 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
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Originally Posted by nibs2007 View Post
36 pilots left last year mate. Thatís 36 out of 350. And two of them were fired. Clearly you donít know your facts. Scary that you fly a plane...right seat only I hope....
Boabity is spot on with his description of the strategy day. Afraid of the reality? 36 / 350 is 10.2% staff turn over. Sounds pretty high in my ears?
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Old 19th Mar 2019, 11:25
  #80 (permalink)  
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Join Date: May 2018
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It is high...says a lot about VJ!!
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