Air Hamburg
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Europe mainly
Posts: 68
Air Hamburg
Can anyone shed some light in regards to that player ?
What I heard about them is absolutely devastating....
Here only few examples:
-Phenom 300 FO earns as little as 1800€ Brut per month
That leaves you with roughly 1200€ a month, now make a living/pay your ATP loan back.
-Duty time always starts 30 minutes prior scheduled departure time, proceedings (airlines, rentals etc) are never accounted as duty
Nevertheless, Crews are requested to show 2h before the flight in Winter, to prepare the Aircraft/De-Ice etc
Is this not totally illegal ?
This is the point that annoys me the most. 6h Airline to Moscow, Taxi etc etc, then 12h of flight Duty, NO PROBLEM !
-Principal from the authorities (Luftfahrtbundesamt) who is supposed to check their operation for compliance does not care at all
Does he maybe even freelance for them ?
-if you are willing to share the Hotel room with your colleague, Dinner is on the company
If only one of this is true it is already scandalous imho.
There is operators out there who treat their crews respectfully, respect duty times and EU-Ops regulations. How are they supposed to compete on a market with companies like AH ?
Can anyone shed some light ? Flight time wise they seem to become the second biggest operator in Europe. On the race to the bottom they already appear #1
What I heard about them is absolutely devastating....
Here only few examples:
-Phenom 300 FO earns as little as 1800€ Brut per month
That leaves you with roughly 1200€ a month, now make a living/pay your ATP loan back.
-Duty time always starts 30 minutes prior scheduled departure time, proceedings (airlines, rentals etc) are never accounted as duty
Nevertheless, Crews are requested to show 2h before the flight in Winter, to prepare the Aircraft/De-Ice etc
Is this not totally illegal ?
This is the point that annoys me the most. 6h Airline to Moscow, Taxi etc etc, then 12h of flight Duty, NO PROBLEM !
-Principal from the authorities (Luftfahrtbundesamt) who is supposed to check their operation for compliance does not care at all
Does he maybe even freelance for them ?
-if you are willing to share the Hotel room with your colleague, Dinner is on the company
If only one of this is true it is already scandalous imho.
There is operators out there who treat their crews respectfully, respect duty times and EU-Ops regulations. How are they supposed to compete on a market with companies like AH ?
Can anyone shed some light ? Flight time wise they seem to become the second biggest operator in Europe. On the race to the bottom they already appear #1
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Netherlands
Age: 12
Posts: 37
Not surprised in Germany
I flew a turboprop for a certain German operator in Cologne and lost all my respect for the Luftfahrtbundesamt (LBA). So I am not surprised at all to read about Air Hamburg.
My experience with this other German turboprop operator out of Cologne:
No scheduling
- 8 days off a month were not given nor rostered. It was always a surprise when you return home and how long.
No rostering of standby duties
- 24/7 standby, sometimes waiting all day in lobby of hotel and fly all the night.
Falsifying techlogs and duty times records
- well this doesn't need any explanation...
The list continues...
A year ago I started a topic under a different name to stay anonymous, afraid of loosing my job. That was always the threat when you asked any 'difficult' questions.
See here: http://www.pprune.org/biz-jets-ag-fl...ml#post9262134
I was a young naive F/O and left because the above given reasons to an operator who respects his crews and is oversighted by a different and more competent CAA. Out of Germany thank god!
My experience with this other German turboprop operator out of Cologne:
No scheduling
- 8 days off a month were not given nor rostered. It was always a surprise when you return home and how long.
No rostering of standby duties
- 24/7 standby, sometimes waiting all day in lobby of hotel and fly all the night.
Falsifying techlogs and duty times records
- well this doesn't need any explanation...
The list continues...
A year ago I started a topic under a different name to stay anonymous, afraid of loosing my job. That was always the threat when you asked any 'difficult' questions.
See here: http://www.pprune.org/biz-jets-ag-fl...ml#post9262134
I was a young naive F/O and left because the above given reasons to an operator who respects his crews and is oversighted by a different and more competent CAA. Out of Germany thank god!
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Germany
Posts: 122
well I can't say anything about this operator if those items are true or not.
But what I can definetly say: this all works- until something happens. Nobody is aware that the duty begins when you go through security check- the picture from the camera is the proof and will be checked after a crash. The fuel slip has a time printed on, etc etc people seem to forget that. Also proceedings everything will be checked after an accident, including how many beers you had and so on.
I don't want to be the FOM in this company, here in Germany we say: at least one of your legs is in jail already.
But what I can definetly say: this all works- until something happens. Nobody is aware that the duty begins when you go through security check- the picture from the camera is the proof and will be checked after a crash. The fuel slip has a time printed on, etc etc people seem to forget that. Also proceedings everything will be checked after an accident, including how many beers you had and so on.
I don't want to be the FOM in this company, here in Germany we say: at least one of your legs is in jail already.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Europe mainly
Posts: 68
I wonder why not one single Pilot of the mentioned company can give a statement and shed some light ?
Is there so much internal pressure ? Given the size of AH it is impossible that none of there pilots has seen this thread and could give a reply..
Is there so much internal pressure ? Given the size of AH it is impossible that none of there pilots has seen this thread and could give a reply..
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Near Stuttgart, Germany
Posts: 898
I wonder why not one single Pilot of the mentioned company can give a statement and shed some light ?
And no, I don't work for that company. I know pilots who work there or who worked there in the (recent) past, but writing here what I was told by them would be hearsay only and completely useless.
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: DUS
Posts: 141
I think you are a little bit too optimistic there, one can very easily fire an employee in Germany: Just send him his dismissal notice (two lines are enough) and stop paying the person's salary. The employee will in return take the employer to court, win the litigation and will be awarded one additional salary per two years of employment as compensation (for a four-year employee that is a mere two months - peanuts in the aviation business). In the end, you will be standing there with a worthless piece of paper (verdict) and still without a job. ��
If they really dislike you, the might hire a lawyer who will look at your expense claims from the last couple of months and then argue that the mutual trust is irretrievably broken because you claimed 1.20 EUR incorrectly. This then justifies a summary dismissal without any notice or compensation.
If they really dislike you, the might hire a lawyer who will look at your expense claims from the last couple of months and then argue that the mutual trust is irretrievably broken because you claimed 1.20 EUR incorrectly. This then justifies a summary dismissal without any notice or compensation.
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: schermoney and left front seat
Age: 53
Posts: 2,330
It is very difficult for an employer in Germany to get rid of an unwanted employee after the six-month probation time have passed.
Given the current political situation in Germany, you will not find anybody saying bad of their Soviet ...
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: The World
Posts: 1,224
A little bird tweeted me that the Bomb finally exploded at AH.
Seems they LBA had a deeper look into their books and seemingly that ended not so great for AH
Seems they LBA had a deeper look into their books and seemingly that ended not so great for AH
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: France
Posts: 410
And that means ...?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Europe mainly
Posts: 68
We will see, actually still waiting for someone 'within' the company to give an honest answer.
Can not be fear for the job not to speak up, there is easy methods to post anonymously so every idiot could do it...
What I heard is that they now are being watched closely by the LBA on adhering to flight & duty limitations. E.g. positioning by airline/rental/train/taxi now has to be taken into account calculating duty times...
Who is next to report that austrian big player to the authorities ? Company called like a failed former MicroSoft Operating System ?
EU OPS towards destination (US), then positioning back (EU) under private ops or vice versa... All with the same crew, shame on them...
Its 2017, and we should all demand to be treated fair ! I am fed up with all that bollox. Wild West in GA -> lets make it finally history together !
By the way, I do not care if AH or however pays whatever to their employees, this is up to the individual to accept it or not.
If someone accepts 1800 Gross, fine with me. But any operation needs adhere to the rules. Full Stop
Can not be fear for the job not to speak up, there is easy methods to post anonymously so every idiot could do it...
What I heard is that they now are being watched closely by the LBA on adhering to flight & duty limitations. E.g. positioning by airline/rental/train/taxi now has to be taken into account calculating duty times...
Who is next to report that austrian big player to the authorities ? Company called like a failed former MicroSoft Operating System ?
EU OPS towards destination (US), then positioning back (EU) under private ops or vice versa... All with the same crew, shame on them...
Its 2017, and we should all demand to be treated fair ! I am fed up with all that bollox. Wild West in GA -> lets make it finally history together !
By the way, I do not care if AH or however pays whatever to their employees, this is up to the individual to accept it or not.
If someone accepts 1800 Gross, fine with me. But any operation needs adhere to the rules. Full Stop
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: EUSSR
Posts: 381
EU OPS towards destination (US), then positioning back (EU) under private ops or vice versa... All with the same crew, shame on them...
