Falcon 7X Suspension of Flight Ops
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Have to agree on the amount of Dassault "pat on the back" comments here - its distasteful, everyone knows you should be honoured to fly one of their jets!
Appalling arrogance at Dassault which might now subside somewhat with a flagship product grounded. We can all hope.
Appalling arrogance at Dassault which might now subside somewhat with a flagship product grounded. We can all hope.
Join Date: May 2010
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US FAA has already issued an emergency AD to stop use of all Falcon 7X;
Emergency AD: Dassault Aviation Model FALCON 7X airplanes
Emergency AD: Dassault Aviation Model FALCON 7X airplanes
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Second, you don't really believe that the EASA gave them any choice in the grounding do you? The aircraft was uncontrolable in flight, think about it!
You don't know what you are talking about.
Dassault requested EASA/FAA to issue the AD.
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You don't know what you are talking about.
Dassault requested EASA/FAA to issue the AD.
Dassault requested EASA/FAA to issue the AD.
First, Dassault has the WORST customer service and product support of any manufacturer.
Appalling arrogance at Dassault
LG
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Hey Zeffy, here's a copy and paste regarding the process for AD issuance. It's the same language found at most all FAA/EASA member sites. It says that the government makes the determination...
When is an AD issued?
The FAA issues an AD addressing a product when we find that:
Second, Were you there when Dassault discussed this "request" with the EASA? I sorta doubt it. So I doubt you know what you're talking about.
Third, Does a manufacturer EVER tell the FAA/EAASA what to do? (or is it always the Feds telling them/us what to do?)
Fourth, here's a link to the wall street journal article. It spells it out clearly.
UPDATE: EASA Grounds All Dassault Falcon 7X Executive Jets - WSJ.com
Now, the article does say it was issued at the "request" of Dassault. This reminds me of a time when I heard a student pilot announce that he was low on fuel 30 miles out over a large bay. The controller asked if he wanted to declare an emergency, the student said "no", and without a pause, the controller said "OK, I'll declare one for you"
So once again, do you really think that there was an option here? Could Dassault say "screw you guys" when faced with such a catastrophic system failure?
I will say that Dassault did the right thing. When faced with a situation where there would no doubt be an AD issued by EASA, they took the high ground, acted virtuous, and demanded the AD be issued.
It's the tactic we should all do when faced with "Write down this number, and call us after you land"
FR
When is an AD issued?
The FAA issues an AD addressing a product when we find that:
- An unsafe condition exists in a product; and,
- The condition is likely to exist or develop in other products of the same type design.
Second, Were you there when Dassault discussed this "request" with the EASA? I sorta doubt it. So I doubt you know what you're talking about.
Third, Does a manufacturer EVER tell the FAA/EAASA what to do? (or is it always the Feds telling them/us what to do?)
Fourth, here's a link to the wall street journal article. It spells it out clearly.
UPDATE: EASA Grounds All Dassault Falcon 7X Executive Jets - WSJ.com
Now, the article does say it was issued at the "request" of Dassault. This reminds me of a time when I heard a student pilot announce that he was low on fuel 30 miles out over a large bay. The controller asked if he wanted to declare an emergency, the student said "no", and without a pause, the controller said "OK, I'll declare one for you"
So once again, do you really think that there was an option here? Could Dassault say "screw you guys" when faced with such a catastrophic system failure?
I will say that Dassault did the right thing. When faced with a situation where there would no doubt be an AD issued by EASA, they took the high ground, acted virtuous, and demanded the AD be issued.
It's the tactic we should all do when faced with "Write down this number, and call us after you land"
FR
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@Atakacs
And there can't be as X is usually reserved for helicopters. I suspect that Captainprop put the Xs in not say that it was Swiss registered without revealing all detail about it.
@FrankR
According to the EASA AD, that is what happened
As far as I can tell there no such aircraft among the 10 7X registered in Switzerland...
@FrankR
Second, Were you there when Dassault discussed this "request" with the EASA? I sorta doubt it. So I doubt you know what you're talking about.
Third, Does a manufacturer EVER tell the FAA/EAASA what to do? (or is it always the Feds telling them/us what to do?)
Third, Does a manufacturer EVER tell the FAA/EAASA what to do? (or is it always the Feds telling them/us what to do?)
To address this potential unsafe condition, Dassault Aviation has proposed to
EASA to prohibit, from the effective date of this AD, any flight operations of Falcon
7X aeroplanes, to which EASA agrees by issuing this AD.
EASA to prohibit, from the effective date of this AD, any flight operations of Falcon
7X aeroplanes, to which EASA agrees by issuing this AD.
Join Date: Oct 2009
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You guys are killing me!
First, Dassault has the WORST customer service and product support of any manufacturer. This is confirmed every single year by the AIN survey. If you don't believe me, Google "AIN 2010 product support survey"
First, Dassault has the WORST customer service and product support of any manufacturer. This is confirmed every single year by the AIN survey. If you don't believe me, Google "AIN 2010 product support survey"
http://www.ainonline.com/fileadmin/t...ort_Survey.pdf
Very interesting read!
Continued weakness in the business aviation market appears to
be reflected in a low response rate to the 2010 AIN Product Support
Survey. This years survey invited 17,284 AIN readers to participate
but only 921 completed the survey, for a return rate of 5.3 percent.
Previous participation levels were 12 percent in 2009, 10.28 for 2008
and 10 percent in 2007. According to Forecast International of Newtown,
Conn., which helped design and administer the survey with
AIN, While this response is a valid basis for determining subscriber
opinion, the decrease in participation is discouraging and appears to
be a cumulative, strong result of the poor condition of the business
aviation community over the past few years.
be reflected in a low response rate to the 2010 AIN Product Support
Survey. This years survey invited 17,284 AIN readers to participate
but only 921 completed the survey, for a return rate of 5.3 percent.
Previous participation levels were 12 percent in 2009, 10.28 for 2008
and 10 percent in 2007. According to Forecast International of Newtown,
Conn., which helped design and administer the survey with
AIN, While this response is a valid basis for determining subscriber
opinion, the decrease in participation is discouraging and appears to
be a cumulative, strong result of the poor condition of the business
aviation community over the past few years.
According to this "so called survey", the GLEX guys/gals here wonīt be very happy, eh?
I can assure you, that the Dassault Service is Excellent!
As far as I can tell there no such aircraft among the 10 7X registered in Switzerland...
And there can't be as X is usually reserved for helicopters. I suspect that Captainprop put the Xs in not say that it was Swiss registered without revealing all detail about it.
LG
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Read BAZL, there are 10 HB-....registered 7X`s
That's what I was trying to say, but was not clear enough
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9M_JON - Spot on. Good to see that someone did not only get out of bed this morning, but actually woke up. 
In fact the registration is HB-XYZ 
It is not official information yet so I will not post it here.
CP
In fact the registration is HB-XYZ It is not official information yet so I will not post it here.
CP
Join Date: Mar 2004
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Canīt vouch for the support of Dassault (other than that I once walked onto their holy ground in LBG, wearing full uniform, in my function as chief pilot of a DAX company and requested information on Falcon 2000/900 ldg/t/o performance and no-one was interested or did bother to contact me after leaving my business card there), but I know that for the 14 years I flew KingAir B200s commercially - one of with was bought 1 year old from Beechcraft - I never saw or heared anything from a Beech representative.
Yet they are rated number1 for new tpīs doesnīt mean anything as the only other contender would be Avanti....for older TPīs they are even beaten by Mitsubishi...!
We bought a used CJ2 from a dealer in Germany and the very next day I was contacted by their techrep in Germany.
Sorry for the tread drift.
Yet they are rated number1 for new tpīs doesnīt mean anything as the only other contender would be Avanti....for older TPīs they are even beaten by Mitsubishi...!
We bought a used CJ2 from a dealer in Germany and the very next day I was contacted by their techrep in Germany.
Sorry for the tread drift.
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Interesting, not all 7Xs are grounded. Yesterday at least 3 Bermudan-registered and even one EASA-registered were flying within Eurocontrol airspace.
What EASA publishes is one thing, but Eurocontrol let these birds fly anyway. Go figure
What EASA publishes is one thing, but Eurocontrol let these birds fly anyway. Go figure
