Rothmans Aerobatic Team (& Others)
 

Just flicking through some old pictures from UK displays in the early 70's.

Lots of Pictures of the Rothmans aerobatic team in their Stampes and Pitts S-2As. Does anyone know what happened to all the pilots?

I realise that aces such as Manx Kelly, Neil Williams and David Perrin are sadly no longer with us, but all the other guys who were with the team for only a few seasons and then disappeared into oblivion..where did they go to?

I did have a list of Rothmans pilots, but cant find it anywhere..

And what happened to Phil Symmans from the Marlboro team in the 80's?

If memory serves the original Stampe four were Manx, Neil, Iain Weston and Ray Hoggarth. Then there was Mike Findlay, who went off to grow grapes in France, Nick Daniel I remember as commentator/ferry pilot at one time, Barry Tempest and Brian Lecomber were also team members. Ah, fond (if fading) memories!

Complete list would be very interesting Zlin!! one of my colleagues died this year after an illness and sadly shortly before his scheduled retirement I believe he was a member of the team for a period.Your spending a lot of time on here recently Zlin must be the quiet season !!hope you are well?.

Stampe,

Yes, must get out a bit more...Roll on the summer again :ok:

I've got the complete listing somewhere, but finding it???

All the best

Z

Heres a few;

1972 (Stampes) - Manx Kelly,Iain Weston(ex RAF College),Mike Findlay(ex RAF Qns Flt), Andrew White(ex Hunter and Sabre instructor), Nick Daniel was commentator/spare a/c

1973 (Change to Pitts) - as above

1976 No1 Colin Woods(ex RAF Vulcans, instructor and Poachers), No2 Graham Rutson (ex RAF instructor and RAFG Canberras), No3 Bob Thompson (ex RAF instructor - CFS,Gemini Pair and Swords JP teams -still current display pilot??), No4 Dave Perrin, Comm/spare was Pete Marsden

1980 (last season?) No1 Marcus Edwards,Brian Lecomber, John McClean,Rod Rea

Dave Perrin - what a talent! in 1976, at 22 the youngest aerobatic team member and won 2 years of Air Sqn aerobatic tropies.It would appear that we have lost him? -any details when?

Marcus Edwards - ex RN , instrumental in bringing the Sea Vixen back on the display circuit, his name now wiped from the cockpit rails of the great beast because of that awful Red Bull paint job ! Ugh ! get rid now!!!!!!
He wanted it restored in 899's colours -I bet hes turning in his grave.

David Perrin was killed whilst a passenger in an Alouette filming "High Road to China". As I recall from a recent article about Tony Bianchi, they had probs with a Stampe used in the film; David and Tony Bianchi were offered a lift back to base, Dave accepted, Tony stayed behind to fix the Stampe. The Alouette collided with cables while flying low... Think it was around 1982? Sad, sad, sad...

Think Brendan O'Brien also flew the spare/commentated for a season or two when they had the Pitts. (Plural of Pitts?)

Sadly it was Colin Woods who died this year after shortish but nasty illness bravely born and tragically shortly before a well earnt retirement.I have many happy memories of being Colins co-pilot especially remembering dodging CBs with him in the Caribbean!!.I,m priveleged to have worked ,flown and learnt from guys of the calibre and background of Colin.His good humour and,practical approach and stories of his aerobatic days are fondly remembered.A gentleman in every way.He told me he gave up display flying because no matter how good it had an "inevitable ending" sad but true words which I feel reflected his wisdom on many things.On a lighter note watched a video of the Skyhawks Fournier aerobatic duo at a display at Rochester many years ago by Brendan and colleague, simply amazing best airshow act I have ever seen.So much skill, so few horsepower!! Will we ever see the likes of it again.Rose tinted specs but a golden era viewed from todays point and squirt aerobatics.:ok:

<<Skyhawks Fournier aerobatic duo at a display at Rochester many years ago by Brendan and colleague, simply amazing best airshow act I have ever seen. Will we ever see the likes of it again.>>

Treadders and I have expressed this very sentiment several times on various threads here. Never bettered.

Anyone recall who was flying the Rothmans Pitts 'BAEA which crashed after take-off at Sywell in 1976? My old chum and colleague Cliff Barnett — Flight International's General Aviation editor — was the passenger, and badly injured. He recovered, but tragically was later to die in a midair over Hanover during a photo shoot.

Rod Rea has been a 146 TRI at TNT for many years

Stampe.

Brendan's "colleague" was either Mike Dentith(?) or John Taylor. You remember now? They were good. But just a tad too close to the ground for my liking but I always followed Neil Williams best advice. "When doing aeros, the most useless air is that above you."

Anyway, as I got older I realised I WANTED to get older! ;)

It was John Taylor. I seem to recall the pair of them arriving at West Malling and one of the Fourniers suffered a gear collapse... probably just a minor inconvience...! And B O'B turning up at Redhill sans Taylor who, if memory serves, had lost the engine while getting airborne from Biggin. Brendan was needed for the commentary at Redhill! Ah, indeed, the Skyhawks... And as the film music thread says, accompanied by Pink Floyd... Youare right IFR, they did wind up close to the ground in the finale. Seem to recall they started high and gradually descended to maintain the pace on the available HP.

I recall the Rothmans fairly well, but none better than the solo display (G-RKSF?), David Perrin at Biggin Hill in 1981 or '82... I was pushing my bike up the main road past the threshold when the Pitts blasted overhead, inverted and seemingly so close one could catch it in one's outstretched arms. Probably not as at the very least the prop would have gone though the fence, but it might explain the challenged foliage I now sport...!

Brian Lecomber and John Taylor now perform an excellent close formation duo in a pair of Extra 300s if you have yet to see them.

Think the Rothmans team continued until 1980 (with a second team set up in the mid-East due to demand apparently! – pilots anyone??), the solo until 1982. That would tie in with Dave’s untimely death – thanks for the info, very sad. And Colin Woods – RIP.

Thought the solo was G-SPIN?

The 1974 Rothmans were – I.F.Weston, M.D. Findlay, D.H. Mills and Dave Perrin.

I’ll carry on digging through my airshow memorabilia- I’ve got tons of info that may help anyone out whose interested re display pilots etc.

What happened to Phil Meeson??

I'm sure Mike Dentith had a stint with the Skyhawks/ Unipart duo- did they try a trio at some stage ??

I remember the first time seeing "Skyhawks" and/or "RF4 duo" on a flying display programme and as a teenager with modern miltary interest only, I certainly wasnt thinking of powered gliders!!
Ended up being a tad disapointed but they certainly grew on me - great airmanship and cracking music (but always played far too loud over the pa and so it became piercing and distorted)
Great days:ok:

Ah, and one of those names is a regular on this forum! I've lost your email address Tim... (bl@@dy Outlook!)

Not sure about G-SPIN, it was imported second-hand from the US, while the others were all brand spankers... G-RKSF stood, of course, for Rothmans King Size Filters... cough...

Blimey, the second team...

G-BADW-'AEA, were the original aircraft, ('DW still registered with Bob Mitchell, he of the stored Miles delights)

G-BGSD-'SF and G-RKSF registered in 1979 were the second team... Or did they replace the originals?

Phil Meeson is still running Channel Express isn't he?

After B O'B moved on to truck top landings and flying ski-equipped Tin Otters, Matthew Hill, Mike Dentith and Tizzy Hodgson variously flew with the team.

The combination of O'Brien's and Taylor's silent aerial ballet and 'Shine on You Crazy Diamond' always gave me goosebumps. Another piece of Pink Floyd 'music' still does: the sound of former PF drummer Nick Mason's Ferrari 250GTO!

And Dave Gilmour's P-51D... shame it's gone back to the US!

Just a bit of info on pitts G-BADW, I last saw it looking VERY VERY dusty in a museum storage hanger on the southside of Cosford in the mid/late 90's along with several(3) of Bob Mitchells 'PT-Flight' aeroplanes :D

Maybe someone else knows more regarding the current location/condition of these lovely aeroplanes ?

Neg G:D

All still there, I think, along with his ex-Rothmans Stampe 'AWIW, KZ-VIII (how nice it would be to see that flying again) and Stephens Akro.

Ah yes the Akro was there but sadly no Stamp, mind you I am talking of possibly 6-7yrs ago, obviously you've seen them since then.
Are they all flying again or just gathering dust ?

Neg G :D

Saw photos a while back, all gathering dust. There were some exchanges on this Forum some months ago (maybe the MMMMiles thread?) castigating Bob Mitchell for hanging on to all these, and his two Miles classics, but they're his aeroplanes.

The hanger in which they are stored seems to suffer in the winter. A friend saw the Whitney Straight not so long ago and the damp was having a serious effect on it. Posession
is indeed 9/10ths of the Law but it's an incredibly sad situation for the aircraft.

The Rothmans solo aircraft that David Perrin flew was Pitts S-2S G-SOLO. G-SPIN was never a Rothmans aircraft.

My recollection of the rest of the team's aircraft over the years is:

BADW, stored at Cosford with Bob Mitchell
BADX, Crashed in Lanzarote, 26.5.78, Pilot killed (who??)
BADY, Crashed 29.6.84
BADZ, On rebuild in Devon.
BAEA, Crashed at Sywell on 19/4/76, passenger Cliff Barnett killed.
RKSF, Sold to Denmark 1983
BGSD, Sold to France 1982
BGSE, Still around in the UK as G-TIII
BGSF, Sold to Italy, 1982
SOLO, Still around, but Permit lapsed

Think they also used G-BDKS & BECM but I'm not 100% sure.

I also seem to remember that S-1 G-AXNZ was also painted in Rothmans Colours at one time, but cant be 100%

The Stampe Club Journal had details of the Stampes they used, but like my sheet of paper with details of their pilots, it's buried in the loft somewhere....

Stampes AWIW, AYCG and AXYW were definates, and AYIJ was also used for a time.

They were good days...Be nice to see 4 Pitts Specials again as a display item. Makes a change from Yaks.

Ah yes, G-SOLO, forgot the one that parted me hair! RKSF made up the four ship with the 'BGS* team.

Think you are right, G-BDKS replaced G-BAEA, and G-BECM certainly was around in Rothmans scheme at one point...

Presumably G-BADY was one of the Fleetwood mid air collision aircraft.

As Aerohack says, Cliff Barnett survived the Pitts crash but was sadly lost along with Steve "Propliner" Piercey after their photo mount (an Aztec?) collided with a Beech 1900 at Hanover. Was privileged to meet Steve a couple of times, a super bloke. Last saw him a week or so before his death. I may still have Roger Bacon's tribute in Flight to the pair in the loft... Total Aviation People, the ultimate Bacon accolade...

The homebuilt Pitts S-1C G-AXNZ was indeed painted in full Rothmans livery. I have it in mind that it was used as a static promotional exhibit, or am I confusing it with a non-flying S-2A?

Treadders: Yes it was a Aztec in which Cliff and Steve died, along with a South American photographer friend of Steve's. A terrible day.

Only just seen this thread:
1974 season:

Manx Kelly leader, Mike Findlay No2, Iain Weston No4, and yours truly hanging on like grim death and trying to keep up with the rest, No3. Brendan O'Brien was commentator, crew transport driver, spare aeroplane pilot, and excellent value. I would have liked to see his Fournier displays.

Manx had to leave early in the season to sort out the Carling Team in Canada, so Iain took the lead, and Neil Williams slotted in at No4, in amongst all his other display duties. Towards the end of the season, when Neil became unavailable, David Perrin joined. He was easily the youngest member of the team, the only one who had not been in the RAF, and had very limited formation and display flying experience. But he took to it like a duck to water, took the No2 position, and Mike flew No4 from then on.

As has been said before, Manx, Neil and David all tragically left us some time ago, particularly tragic in Davids case, a super young man. Iain, who was instructing on simulators at CSE for many a year, sadly died last year. I hadn't heard anything of Mike for ages, hope his wine growing is going well.

I was only with the team for that year, and was just about getting the hang of it, but I became a grandfather about then, and this didn't really fit with the youthful image Manx wanted! Actually, it was by mutual agreement, I thought it was time to get a proper job, and I think I only got the job in the first place because Manx and I had been on the same Canberra squadron in Cyprus and I wandered into the Rothmans hut at Booker to say hello, when he was looking for a pilot, and I was looking for a job!

Great fun, great experience, and I wouldn't have missed it for anything. G-BADX was my aeroplane, sad to hear of it's demise, and the uncertainty over the others.

The non-flying S-2A mentioned in my last post was also 'G-RKSF'. It had a full factory-spec fuselage with truncated, detachable wings. It was in Keith Fordyce's Torbay Aircraft Museum at one time, then went to Toyota as 'G-CARS'. Can't recall what Rothmans used 'XNZ for then.

What an amazing response to a simple query! :ok:

Keep it up chaps, there's lots more to find out.

I'll venture into my loft this weekend and find that sheet with all the details..Probable find a load of other stuff too, and I won't be popular with Mrs Zlin.

Zlin

Z526: I did just ascend my loft, at Mrs Aerohack's behest (annual retrieval of Christmas decorations). Stumbled over a box of old videos, and among those that fell out was 'Man in the Sky' devoted to the young David Perrin. Had forgotten it was there, can't remember anything about it, but when I've refreshed my memory with a viewing or two I'd be happy to loan it to any posters on this thread who might be interested.

I flew with the RAT's for the 1971 season in Stampe SV4C's flying G-AYGR or G-AYCK in the No. 2 slot. A fabulous experience especially since I had no formation aerobatic time or training prior to joining the team. Not only that, but my first airshow with the team was the afternoon of the day I joined.........!!! One day I will write it all up for one of the aviation magazines but I can confirm that on the odd occasion adrenalin was brown. Great blokes and fantastic pilots. Had to pack it in at the end of the 1971 season as, O thee of little faith, I lacked confidence in Rothmans continuation as sponsors beyond the end of 1973 and I had a wife, two kids and a mortgage to keep happy along with my day job of being CFI at Sibson.
I did blot my copybook in 1972 when I totally demolished a borrowed G-AYGR in a mid-air collision at a Barnstormers display at Weston-super-Mare. My subsequent apologies were accepted with a somewhat crinkly smile by Manx and Judy his wife.
The best source of information might be Jeanne Frazer who was the RAT's admin ace for a number of years from 1972. She is still involved with the airshow scene at Duxford with the Fighter Collection.

Ah, now I know who you are, G-KEST! The Kings Cliffe address should have been a give-away. Have a glossy 10 x 8 of your moment of impact somewhere, and I think one of you displaying your split bonedome afterwards (plus, one I took of you wearing some rather more bizarre headgear with IAC's Mike Heuer at South Cerney in '86).

Aerohack,

Man in the Sky - One of the best British flying films made IMHO.... A regular viewing lifts the spirits at once!


G-KEST, I know who you are too ;)

Why don't you write it all down, and let us all know what it was like? That picture of your unfortunate 'coming together' at Weston is one of aviations classics.

Bob Thompson is Martin Baker's test pilot, flying the Meteor at Chalgrove. He's the only one current on it, because they've had to modify the seat ... he's a bit on the tall side.

I'm sorry to hear about Colin Woods. How dreadful for Viv.

The Zlin was G-AVPZ if that stirs any memories and the date was 5 May '68... other than that, gleaned from British Civil Aircraft, I know nothing...

Got your number as well, G-KEST!

Two other names from the Rothmans Team -
Alan Dix late 70s and John McLean early 80s.
I think John McLean was killed in a mid-air during a display at Blackpool (?) in the mid 80's.

I have a vague recollection that Stefan Karwowski flew with the team in the late 70's but I didn't know Stef until about 1982 so I'm not certain.
What a pilot! My introduction to warbirds was flying around in the back of a P-51 with Stef, and staying in for displays - in the good old days before the nannies introduced rules.
Loss of an outstanding natural pilot, and more important a very good friend, when Stef was killed - flying a Pitts for fun whilst on holiday with his family in New Zealand.

Tudor Owen


[Edit]
Someone asked about Philip Meeson. I still see him very occasionally. He's a very successful businessman. His most well-known company is Channel Express, but that's only part of the very successful Dart Group Plc which he owns.

Aerohack,
I have been after that video for years and would appreciate a copy if thats O.K?

Alexis,

I won't copy it (copyright infringement), but you are welcome to borrow the original, and what you do with it while you have it is your business. ;) PM me your address.

I wouldn't mind a quick squint at it as well after Alexis if that's OK Aerohack...

Cheers

Treadders

Sounds like we need a distribution list! Yes, no problem, Treadders. Either PM me or Alexis your address, and when I hear from him I'll get it started on its journey (though not yet found tyime to watch myself!).

Enjoying this thread -a great interest of mine, old airshows - loads of knowledge & nostalgia out there!

G-BECM was definitely with the Roths at some stage and was used by the "Jubilee duo" in 1977 along with G-BCXD, flown by Bob Thompson and Marcus Edwards.

1975 Roths were: Mike Findlay,Iain Weston,Dave Perrin, Colin Woods and comm/spare was Ben Kershaw.

Interesting to hear about Bob Mitchells collection - especially the KZ8 - thought that was long lost.

Anyone recall Peter Philips in the Andreasson BA4B - a stalwart of early '70s shows - my God that display was L - O - W!!!

And James Black and aforementioned Neil Williams of Aerobatics International - Zlins G-AWJX & AWSH & Pitts S1 G-AZPH - seemed to be everywhere.

I picked up a pretty good video called "Sky Spectacular", made up of 3 films including the mini documentary of Concordes first flight "She Flies". The other two are "The Display" featuring mainly the Roths and Manx Kelly solo plus loads of other goodies (Belgian Slivers F104 duo, Lightning F1, RAF Phantoms, VC10, Poachers, Blue Eagles, Nimrod, Victor SR2, Vulcan etc etc- gibber gibber!!) at Biggin Hill in 1973 & a documentary again on the Roths shot in Spain late in their life - '79/80? Grrreat stuff!!

Slightly off topic but another good video is "where the big birds fly" - all about a Vulcan crew low flying in Canada circa '74 - truly awesome.

Thanks Aerohack, I have PM'd you - at least I think I have!

I can recall Peter Phillips looping an Islander/Defender at Bigign Hill in 1976... Might have seen the BA-4, but ashamed to admit I don't remember it!

I trust you would have seen the Black Knight as well?