G-SOLO
 

Hallo to all,

the Pitts S2S, G-SOLO is based in southern Germany,
Neuburg-Egweil, EDNJ.
It was stored several years, but this year the owner
has changed and the plane will fly again this summer.

Best wishes,
Joachim

I found this advert today whilst flicking through some old mags.

Will the moderator have to put the new goverment health warnings across it.

Batchy.http://img51.photobucket.com/albums/...s/Rothmans.jpg

As we used to say in the Reds - " looks like a load of fags":D

.....only joking.............:eek:

I remember a fairly in depth article about the Rothmans team in a mid-1970s issue of Aircraft Illustrated. Anyone got it?

Rothmans Aerobatic Team
 

I have just won a Rothmans Aerobatic Team brochure on e.bay in mint condition when the team flew Stampes, but I can't find any date in it.
I have scrolled through all the postings trying to find a formation date for the team, but the earliest date mentioned is 1970. I believe the team was formed in 1968 or '69 - can anyone confirm this?

Thanks

Amazing what you find if you have a little dig around..

G-BADY, June 1979
http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/WebPix/rothmans.jpg

G-SOLO, Sept 1980.
http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/WebPix/GSOLO.jpg

http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/WebPix/rothmans2.jpg

fantastic stuff, it was Kelly and Williams doing the slow rolls and inverted spins in the Stampes (Wind in the Wires) & Perrin in the pitts that made me want to learn to fly.

My two year old son snuggles up most nights before bedtime in my arms and we watch the mirror stampes.. just magic stuff.

and I hasten to add, "Wings in the Sun" , the Nile low level transit trip is a special favourite with the kids (2+4)

Rothmans Aerobatic Team
 

To all interested parties:-

My name is Bob Lee. I was the chief engineer for the team and the No. 5 Display pilot from 1977 until 1980 when the team was disbanded. Reading through the material there seems to be alot of garbage about. I might not be able to supply all of the answers but what I know will probably be more acurate than alot I have seen writen on this subject so far. We can start with the fact that Geoff Masterton was not the Chief engineer, because I was! as far as I know he was never in the team. Marcus indeed is no longer with us, he died suddenly at his home in South Wales. Rod Rea was my best man - haven't seen him since! John Mclean and Andy Walbridge were the two pilots who collided at Blackpool - as the Vixon Two. Very Tragic. Andy Had just joined the Vixons, I gave him his very first flight at Lasham in a Chipmunk, years eariler. George Smith was the pilot killed in Lanzarote's first air fatality, caused by the failure to recognise and recover from an inverted spin he had entrered following an unscheduled manouvre. The last I saw of poor George was literally his foot as it was placed beside him on the stretcher! Our last season was the tour of Malaysia, led my Marcus No.1; Rod Rea No.2: Alan Dix No.3 and the man who paid for my wedding night - Thank you Brian! our very own Brian Cucumber (Lecomber). I flew as No.5 in the No.2 position and Rod flew inverted over the No.4. The formation was known as the wedge. There was a second team that year;- with Andy Legg, Bob Ruskell, Mike Cairns and another who's names escape me right now - sorry. Altogeter 9 x Pitts S2A (both teams), 1 x Pitts S2S G-Solo that I had built myself with the help of Dave Fenton, Les Scattergood and my faithfull deputy John Brobyn. Yes the Islander as well, our trusty truck, flown by Norman Rhodes.
Regarding the pictures; The Pitts without the yellow cheek lines on the fuselage are all pre 1978. We painted in the white cheek line with yellow for the summer season 1978.
There is so much to tell not enough room. If any of you wish to know more you can E-mail me [email protected]

Come on Bob, you have a mint to tell. Take your time but let us know more of inside stuff that few get to hear of. We have met a few times at Biggin. Get that pen of yours scribing Bob.

PPP

The Rats
 

There really is too much to say! I was with the team for three years and in that time we toured West Africa, The Canaries, Spain, Greece, The Middle East, Malaysia and Borneo; interspaced with Tours of the UK and taking in the major shows in Paris and Belgium. Someone should write a book, alas there are better people than me for that job. Brian perhaps, or Bob Thomson since he was not only team leader but the team manager for both teams.
I have stacks of pictures, if I knew how to get them onto the site I could let you see a choice few.
As for personnal memories, one of my favorites is when we were in Agadir. Marcus and I head for the lift in the Hotel, Marcus decides to break wind just before entereing the lift. Unbeknown to him there was a little alcove the other side of the corridor in which two old ladies sat. We were both unaware of this until we entered the lift and turned round. Realising he had just left them with a nasty prospect, Marcus began to turn red, I was by this time turning red trying to suppress my laughter and the two old ladies began to turn red I guess from trying to hold their breath! The lift door seem to take an age to close.
Then there was the time we arived in Sino in West Africa. It was a refuelling stop. We came accross the airport in close formation, smoke on, for a run and break. Having all landed there was no-one there, and I mean not a sole! Where was the fuel? After a while and a few cigarettes, I noticed an eyeball peeking throught a crack in the door of a thunderbox. I went up to the eyeball and said "excuse me I am looking for the airport manager", what else does one say to someone in a toilet? He replied "I am the manager", "where is everyone?" I asked. "they have all gone!", "what do you mean gone? Where have they gone?". After a pause he said "they all ran away, we thought we were under attack!"

Bob.

I'm pretty sure Graham Rutson was there in the mid 70's too? Possibly left just before you arrived?

The Rats
 

It's been nearly 30 years! I believe I first met Graham out in the gulf in Dubai. He was flying some SF 260s for the airforce out there. He wasn't on my team but he might have been on the second team I would have to check. I could be wrong on both counts. Mike Cairns took over from George Smith. Mike owned the Clevland Flying Club at the time, the only place I ever know that had draught 'throwing beer' for those outrageous parties he used to have. One night we made a bazooka from Beer cans. We had seven cans with the tops and bottoms cut off, taped together. The last can still had the bottom on but a small hole was made at the end. A tennis ball fits perfectly in the tube. With a small amount of lighter fluid and a match at the little hole, the first shot dissapeared accross the bar and smashed the window on the far side of the club. Mike was not too pleased and banished us outside with it. The second shot we lost the ball, it went clean over the hangar and dissapeared to the other side of the airport!
I remember in Cairo at some special doo, with all the dignitaries present, Mike finished his wine got pissed off with waiting for a refill so he ate the glass ate the roses on the table, then proceeded to suck up about 10 cream caramels in the same amount of seconds! During the display over the Nile in the centre of Cairo someone thought it would be a good idea to start the fountain in the river which shoots up to about 200 feet, straight into the middle of the display area!
Bob.

On-MarkBob,

PLEASE tell us some more stories! And if you have the pictures too, then I'm sure somebody will help you to put them on this thread for all to see..

Welcome Bob, and keep the stories coming!

I'd be pleased to help you post the pics - PM me to discuss how we can go about it

I've just had the pleasure of watching "The Airshow", "Wings in the Sun", the Rothmans promo film, as well as another chnace to see "Man in the Sky". Superb! Looked like the trip to Cairo was fun!

Cheers,

Treadders

Anyone that fancies a go in S2A G-WREN should ring up NSF at Sibson - the aircraft has been on the school fleet for a while and does great trade... Sadly not in her Rothmans colours any more but she still has the diesel tank for the smoke...

I work for the (now merged) Rothmans organisation. Shame we can't sponsor anything like an aeros team any more, though there are still a number of posters etc round the office.:D

Hi Bob - Norman,

I heard about this thread from one of my colleagues today. 'Glad to see you are still around. You forgot Dave Fenton in your roundup of engineers from '77, is he still about? ;-) I hope that John Brobyn still walks the earth with his unique take on life. There can be few who understand aeroplanes as 'JB' does. Happy days in the CFC before we kicked of for Africa and I will never forget the ride on the back of your Harley!
It is a great shame we all never stayed in touch better than we did, I missed David and Marcus' farewell and regret it deeply. 'Tempus' does indeed 'Fugit' and maybe we all ought to get together before too long; there are many interesting faces still around and to miss the opportunity would be a shame.
You are right, there is an enormous archive of material buried in dusty cardboard boxes and I would love to collate the stories or even write the book, perhaps a collaboration? The material would make for an excellent read if it were stitched together in the right way.

Historical gap filling:- Teeside - formed late 1977

Team 1
Bob Thompson, Marcus Edwards, George Smith (Finn), David Perrin.

Islander Support Aircraft/Team Manager - Me

Engineers
David Fenton, Bob Lee (spare A/C Pilot), John Brobyn, Dilip Patel, Frank Wykes. Les Scattergood.
Home Team at Anvil.
Mike Dent was Chief Engineer for Anvil Aviation, he was in charge of the Flying Club servicing that Bob Thomspon had started and support for both teams while they were away.

George crashed from a spin which he entered from the inverted on base. It didn't happen on display but during the recovery to land after a Feathers (upward) Burst. I (we) believe that the spin was deliberate and used to position himself as he was high after the burst. I saw it as a positive flick entry and believe he cocked up the exit having missed the line one too many times. I had dinner with George the night before and we talked at length about his plans post RAT. Anyone who knew him would testify to the fact that he was unique, he certainly had talent and a bundle of qualities. Was it really twenty eight years ago?
'Finn', (Mike Findlay) replaced George in Lanzarote at short notice from his 'day job' in France renovating cottages with the occasionally flit to the Sudan to spray crops. The last time I heard from Finn he was with British Aerospace teaching where I understand he was very highly thought of.

Team 2. 1978-80
Mike Cairns, Rod Rea, Alan Dix, Brian Lecomber (Andy Warbridge - spare a/c pilot)
Bob Ruskell, Andy Legge, Pete Jones.

As I remember Mike Cairns Joined Team 1 for the Greek and first Middle East Tour. He flew as No.3 Dave Perrin No.4. When the second team was formed he took over as team leader team two, and Alan Dix became No.3 team one. Mike Finn flew in the No.4 position working up in Dubai during the first ME Tour.

I was trained to follow into the team but sadly I missed a chance whilst away on tour and never took my place as Rothmans sponsorship ceased in '80; any slot that I might have taken evaporated. Following Mike C in the '2 slot' was a riot; I almost lost control several times laughing at his 'twitch'. What a character and talent, he could turn his hand to anything; we met for the occasional sherbet in the mid eighties when he was in the Prestwick area spraying detergent on the sea. I gather he lost his license (it must have due to something he ate) and worked for British Aerospace (Prestwick) as a simulator instructor helping the next generation on it's way. I have flown with a number of them and they speak with respect and fondness for the skill and the kindness he showed them during their time in his care. Mike departed this life in the US, I believe from a heart attack. I doubt we will see his like again.

I left RAT 1 in Cairo in 1980 toward the close of the Middle East Tour after training my replacement. I joined the Royal Oman Police Air Wing in Muscat for three years and after a circuitous route through the Charter world, joined BA in '89 onto the Tri-Star. The -400 and a spell on the 737-400 followed and I am now back in LH enjoying the 777. I write this in the early hours of Saturday morning in the 'Inn at the Ballpark' in Houston before the ride home this afternoon.

Take care Bob, what an excellent thread! Probably the most memorable years of my life.

[email protected]

PS: I edit this as old info floods back into an addled brain (or my pals remind me).

PS: Graham was from the 'Pre-Anvil' era, he may have been on the team during the latter part of the Stampe or the Pitts. When we met him he was instructing in Dubai for the UAE Air Force flying both the -260 and the Macchi. He was instrumental in the arrangements for our 'hosting' by the Air Force in Dubai. I have no idea where he is now.

I used to work with Graham Rutson at Oxford about 6 years ago. Iain Weston (sadly departed) was there as well.

Welcome aboard Norman
 

Welcome aboard Norman, thanks for helping me out. Rmember Guinea Bissau? We were flying up the coast of Africa and we didn't have a clearance to overfly Guinea Bissau. It was quite a problem since they were reputed to be hostile. A decision was made to fly around it out to sea. However, we were still concerned that they might attack us since our formation may have been mistaken for an airforce. What Norman may not remember or even know is that those of us with a Pitts to fly were not too concerned, we rekoned that we could outmanoeuvre most of what the Bissau airforce could muster, our concern was very much for Norman and the Islander with the rest of the support crew on board. We figured that if we were to be attacked it was most likely they would go for the big prize! neadless to say we made it OK without incident.
I am deeply sorry to hear about Mike Cairns, RIP Mike. If there was ever a naughty boy in the team it was Mike, he was naughty! I remember that the Sheriton Hotel in Dubai had this water feature which cascaded water down from the seating area in the lobby. The water eventually dropped a whole floor level to the restaurant by way of a waterfall. One night Mike emptied a whole packet of soap powder into it. The consequences were spectacular. Most of the hotel staff were suddenly employed to repel a wall of soap suds from entering the restaurant. Eventually someone turned it all off and it had to be completely drained and re-filled.

Bob.

To Treadders
 

Hi Treaders,
If you could help me gets some pics on, it would be nice to do. If you can send me an E-Mail to my mailbox listed above (previous string) I could send you some picture files. I would also give you some idea what each pic is about and what was going on.

kind regards,

Bob.

Graham Rutson was a Flight Ops Inspector for the CAA at Gatwick last time I saw him, about a year or two ago. Not sure if he's still there.

On-MarkBob:

Send me a PM and I will reunite you with Rod.

RodtheSod
 

Hi Bob, Norman et al,

Great thread! I considered joining last year but thought interest had waned. Thanks JW411 for putting me in touch with Bob - why people chose me as a best man, or even godfather, heaven knows.:\ Thanks Jabberwok for the nice pic of me in G-BADY attacking the tower at, I believe, Ronaldsway - did you take it?
It was interesting to read the different versions of the 'Threadneedle'. Tim Mills (9th Feb 2004) describes the version we did with Marcus as leader although we pulled up to about 70 degrees before bunting to the same angle of climb and reversing back to a second opposition with No4. The trim change was horrific in the bunt from about 90 to 190mph at the bottom and the trim lever was far too far away in my state of terror. The first time Marcus and I practiced this as a pair with me in the 2 slot, he was so surprised and mesmerised to see me still in close at the end of the bunt he forgot to pull until we'd passed through the vertical. There followed a distinct lack of airspeed and ideas and we both auto-rotated, him to the right and me to the left. The image of his Hartzell and spinner head-on and about 6ft from mine is permanently etched in my memory bank. By the time either of us had regained sufficient composure to speak on the radio we were 20 miles distant and diverging! Would love to see more pics - my last ex-wife destroyed most of mine.

Indeed I did. Here's a longer sequence from the June '79 display..

http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/WebPix/rothmans5.jpg
Someone got seriously ribbed for not having smoke on but I forget who..

http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/WebPix/rothmans.jpg

http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/WebPix/rothmans6.jpg
Pretty close to the tower..

http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/WebPix/rothmans4.jpg
http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/WebPix/rothmans1.jpg
http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/WebPix/rothmans3.jpg

I only have one shot from June 1980.. Was that the year strong winds stopped the display?

http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/WebPix/rothmans7.jpg

Right, here are On-MarkBob's photos, with his descriptions!:

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q...raph/roth1.jpg
I believe we were in transit from Kota Kinabalu to Tawau crossing the virgin rain forest. We had to fly high to get over the foothills of Mt. Kinabalu which rises to 14,000 feet. That's me in BADZ with Rod Rea in BADY on my right wing. Taken from the Islander by John Brobyn. Interestingly, Rothmans gave us all parachutes for the crossing as the only realistic method of survival should we have an engine failure and end up having to crash land in the tops of the trees!

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q...raph/roth2.jpg
This is the Islander over the sea off Guinea Bissau in the story I have just told on earlier on this thread.

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q...raph/roth3.jpg
Here's G-SOLO just before it's maiden flight at Teesside Airport. I don't have the negative and the print is now well worn! The chap with the interesting barnet is me!

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q...raph/roth4.jpg
The team: Alan Dix, George Powell (Rothmans Rep), Rod Rea, Marcus Edwards and Brian Lecomber. Location is somewhere in Malaysia. Note the PSP below the feet (pierced steel planking) that played havoc with the tail wheels. I had to fly one of the Pitts into Singapore to have it welded back on after it broke off taking part of the rudder post with it.

Not wanting to be a butt-in-ski or such, but I'm thoroughly enjoying the thread. Have no connections to the team or a/c except one small detail.
I picked up four 1/72nd plastic kitsets by "LS" way way back, probably mid 80s, of the Rothmans Pitts. Come time for a break after one or two major kit projects I'm finally going to finish them.
I still think the blue & white scheme surpasses much of the red stuff I've seen these days.
Many thanks for the pics, fellers. Major help.
:ok: :D

The Colours
 

Hi, RiskyRossco,
If you need the colours for your models they are:- Fiat Orient Blue, Ford Olympic Blue, Ford Diamond White, and Mid Chrome yellow. Even after all these years they are forever etched in my memory. Funny how we can remember such crap and the names of the people I shared a little of my life with I find difficult. Since I got involved with all this I have now been in touch with Rod, Norman, JB and BT (Bob Thomson), Just a few more to dig up and we will be a full team again!!

Bob.

How kind of you, Bob! Thank you, dear Sir.
The kits have all the decals however, closer inspection of the photies tells me the yellow and dark blue are off by a fair bit.
Well, you live and learn.
:ok:

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e5...001_edited.jpg
A completed example of the LS Pitts. I think it is still available but with a Toyota sponsor set of transfers.
g45

Grow45, from distant mmory of that kit, your pic must be about 500% size! It's tiny...

I've seen the LS Rothmans kit available on a website that sells kits in the last few days if anyone wants one - PM me for details (I'll be back late this evening!)

Great to see this thread back on top, splendid stories from after my time, and those pictures took me back thirty two years or so!

I'm glad someone else was terrified doing the dreaded formation bunt, rodthesod, I thought it was just me. I must admit, we never got up to the near vertical again before pulling through, so far as I remember, and am quite glad we didn't. I nearly did when leading David Perrin through a practice shortly after he joined us. He seemed to be coping so well that I thought about it, but sensibly never did, for reasons rodthesod mentions. But David was a natural, even then, and would have coped, as he did like a duck to water when he took over from Neil Williams in the team. Very nice young chap, and a great loss.

If I knew how, I would post a picture of the suave sophisicates of the 74 team, to compare with the rough old lot who came later! Great pictures, thanks.

Tim (Blue 3, as was )

Yep, grow, that there be the critter. And, yepyep, she don't take much space. Since splashing paint on the first one my skills have improved and the stripes will look a whole heap neater.

RiskyRossco & Grow45

For your models RAT , certainly in my time, never used the optional sliding canopies - we 'ad it tough in them days. Seriously, too much trouble to open if we had to exit in a hurry.

Tim Mills

Thanks, I thought I was alone in my fear. The box slow roll used to get a bit hairy at times too. I got seriously close to Marcus on occasions and I think we once may have touched. As No2 I was always short of rudder power as airspeed decayed in the last 1/4 and, in the early days, I sensed the ground was a bit too close as I skidded out of position.
The Hairyside always followed a loop to gain entry speed and the whole thing, including initial climb and No4 rejoin took too long so we dropped it in favour of a complete vic outside loop. No4 did a mini-solo while we climbed, and it was a doddle for him to rejoin when we were back on top of the bunt with low speed. We did the full looping display if we had 1100ft cloudbase, but I always sensed the proximity of grass/water when we bottomed out.
Yes, Dave P was fantastic (RIP) and he could do it all without exceeding any limits unlike at least one of his notable predecessors.

Tim, send me your pic, I'll happily add it to the collection in my hidden company directory! (They'll suss me one day...) [email protected]

If treadigraph runs out of room (or when the boss finds out what he's doing!), send the pics to me and I'll put them on the web for you. I was at Cranfield College at the time and saw many of your displays - at the time I thought "I must get one of those" and did. I went on to lead a Pitts formation aerobatic team down here for a while.
You guys were an inspiration to a whole generation.

Thanks Treaders and djpil, in fact pprune pop had already offered, and I sent them to him, with many thanks. Maybe he will put them on if he thinks they are worth it, quality not all that hot, I'm afraid.

I see your team, djp, was in 1980, how did it go? I used to visit Luskintyre, near Maitland in the early 90s, when I was doing ground school lecturing at the Cessnock flying school. They had four Pitts, I think, ex Jordanian if I remember, but I never knew if they formed a team there; I know one of the chaps there used to give an excellent individual display in one of them.

Rod, fun wasn't it, the box slow roll I mean. Of course I never tried it as No2, but certainly found the ground looking rather close as we went into it, and still can't really work out how it all worked as No3, but don't lose sleep over it these days!

Oh well, aged ride on, and even older tractor these days, quite exciting enough!

Tim


And as promised here are a few of Tims' pics:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...i8tor/RAT1.jpg
Taken by Flight photographer flying with MIke Finlay No2 position, Iain Weston leading, self No3
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...i8tor/RAT2.jpg
Briefing by Iain, self looking apprehensive, Mike looking relaxed.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...i8tor/RAT3.jpg
Left to right, self, Mike, unknown (apologies to whoever), Iain, Manx in characteristic attitude and humour!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...i8tor/RAT5.jpg
Suave sophisticates during visit to give displays over Monte Carlo. Neil Williams shaking hands with Prince Rainier and hiding Mike. Also present Iain and self, and Gregory Peck and friend amazed at meeting these celebrities! During the visit, Neil took Princess Grace for a flight, and Iain flew Princess Caroline, they enjoyed it.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...i8tor/RAT6.jpg
Team over Monaco harbour, Iain in front, Mike No2, self No3, and Neil in the box. Shortly after this Neil had to leave and David Perrin joined, flying No2 (as though he had been doing it all his life ), with Mike going to No4 and doing all the clever bits Neil used to do.

Tim, Perhaps you can click 'edit' and just add narrative as you would like. PPP

Our team earned a lot of money for our club and was successful for many years. A tragic accident a few years after I left.
The guys at Maitland didn't do any formation aeros that I'm aware of. Phil does a great display. We'll probably discuss this again over a bottle of red this weekend at the national championships.
Somewhere I have some Super 8 movies of your displays. I distinctly recall that box slow roll at Paris ('75?), it looked difficult.

Thanks djpil, and please give Phil my regards if you see him. He probably won't remember me, I was the chap with the whistful expression wandering about the hangar full of Pitts and lovely reconditioned Tiger Moths. We did talk of my Rothmans time,and he asked me our display sequence. I couldn't remember it well and so I'm afraid was not much help. I do remember his display, I think he practiced over Cessnock now and again. Splendid.

I wasn't in the team when it went to Paris, only did one year, 74, and having had my fun thought I ought to get a proper job! That and a mutual agreement with Manx that my suddenly becoming a grandfather wasn't exactly the youthful image required!

That roll, difficult to start with, but became routine with practice. Being on the inside of the roll to the left, I worried about the first half, and delighted to see Rodthesod hated the last bit, when the ground was rather adjacent to him as No2!

Just a looker-in!
 

As a raw newcomer to flying training, I remember in '81 drinking long into the night with John Maclean & Marcus Edwards at Sunderland Flying Club, after they'd given me a flip each, with full routine :} :D. They could only use one of their Pittses - G-BDKS; the other being grounded with a tailwheel problem.

RIP, gentlemen.

Kev