Many thanks PPP, captions now on pictures in Post 160; one a bit like a gossip mag, I'm afraid!

Sorry Tim, his memory is fading.
He did recall (despite trying to forget) a flight in a Tiger in the UK and has a letter from the CAA as a momento. Some-one threatened to transport him to the colonies.

I can’t tell you how fantastic it is to see your pictures Tim. It was your team that inspired me in my early years. I never met you personally but when I joined the team in 1977 your team were already legends and heroes of mine. I first met Neil Williams when I was working for Rogers Aviation at Cranfield. He came in for fuel in an S1 Pitts. Having filled him up I was asked to swing the prop for him. Always difficult to start was a half hot injected Lycoming! The Hangar foreman had a fit and told me I couldn’t do it. For God’s sakes! I had gone solo on a J3 cub and was the Tug pilot at Dunstable on Chipmunks, swinging props was a way of life! Neil, however, spotting trouble, sat me in the Pitts and swung the prop himself. After that I knew I had to be a part of it. Neil died a few years later in the Cassa 111 out of Cuatro Vientos. His death to me was like the death of Donald Campbell must have been to those a few generations earlier.

I saw your team for the first time at Old Warden, I had borrowed the tug from the Gliding club and arrived at the field, girl on my arm and as young as I was you could see the envy in the eyes of some of the crowd! As we were air-side we had ring-side seats and I will never forget Mike Finlay cutting the ribbon inverted.

What is most humbling about all of this, is that thousands of people would give their right arm to just meat their Heroes and those that inspire them. I not only did that but my Heroes became my colleagues and indeed my friends and I shared with them some very personal moments. I laughed with them and shed a tear with them once or twice as well.

Bob.

Bob,
I was at Cranfield 74-75. Neil brought the Zlin in a few times, I don't recall him bringing the Pitts. I was a regular at Old Warden too.

Yes indeed! it was a lovely little red number! Pitts S1. I can't remember the exact date or year for that matter.
What were you doing at Cranfeild? since we we obviously there at the same time.

Student - aerodynamics, flight test & design subjects.
Did a bit of gliding, bit in the Condor and the Pups. Tiger at Cambridge.
Engineering exercises in the Jetstream & Paris.

DJPIL...Gosh! that brings back some memories! Those noisy Jetstreems I remember well, but I had forgotton about the Paris Jet. Do you remember the TSR II and the Bolton+Paul Delta wing prototype?

Bob.

Just got back from a most enjoyable week down the coast with Mrs T escaping the grandchildren, so have only just seen your post, Bob. So glad you liked the pictures, courtesy of PPP, and many thanks for your kind comments. I suspect you enjoyed your time with the team as much as I did, one of the treasured memories of my aviating life, not only because of the flying but also the chaps.

I had known Iain since being at Cranwell together, and Manx and I were on the same Canberra squadron together, so that was a good start. I had of course heard of Neil, but never met him, and did not know Mike before. And then David Perrin, of whom I have spoken before, lovely chap, great loss. Can't imagine a better bunch to be with.

Neil mentioned my name to the Falcon Jet company he part timed for, and when I joined I inherited his set of Jeppesons after he was lost in Spain. Very sad, but many thanks to him for his introduction which led to fifteen odd years of happy employment.

No worries, djpil, I'm not surprised Phil didn't remember the odd chap from those days, but wouldn't mind hearing the Tiger Moth story one day!

Hi folks,
Not exactly on thread but a nice recollection of Marcus Edwards.
We were all instructors at the RJAA(Royal Jordanian Air Academy)
Lee Jones was the boss and had organised a 12 ship formation display in Wadi Rum for the benefit of Flight magazine. Lee was not renowned for high flying and the whole thing was pretty hairy, especially if you were on the outside as i was. Anyway the pictures got taken and it was a very succesful day. On the way back up to Amman we were tailchasing through the wadi's, Markus with one of the Flight team on board. It was a warm day and he had the canopy of his Bulldog open. You can probably guess the rest. At some point they were inverted (much more fun!) and all the film, cameras etc were dropped somewhere in the desert. I guess they are still there because they were never found. The only momento of the day were some pic's taken from the ground in Wadi Rum. If I remember correctly, one of these made it into the magazine.
Happy Days!!
PS If anyone has a copy of the picture I would much appreciate it!
Cheers
Old Fart

I get the impression that everyone who flew with Marcus has an interesting tale to tell. For me, one of several was when he destroyed a boyhood illusion which formed when I saw the members of the Red Pelicans sipping orange juice at an air display in Cardiff. I was in awe of their keen blue eyes and perfect complexions. To me they looked like gods.

Twenty years later I was in the right seat of a Red Pelican JP5 with Marcus in the left seat and, at the hold, I looked across at his blood shot eyes over the oxygen mask and wondered. At the end of a most memorable flight we walked into the bar at Little Rissington and the steward looked up and asked "Same again sir?". To be fair, he was on leave at the time and only came to work to take me up. RIP.

Rothmans and Marlboro
 

embarking on a search for information about the Stolp Acroduster Too, I happened upon this thread. I was so intrigued, I decided to add my humble piece of information.

In 1979, whilst beginning my PPL at Teesside, I was smitten by a Rothmans Pitts S2A weaving its way along the taxyway. A little like Toad from Wind in The Willows, all else was completely forgotten until this thing of beauty passed by. I wanted one!

About the same time as I gained my PPL, I heard that Rothmans had decided to withdraw their sponsorship of the team and the operating company, Anvil Aviation, was to shut down its operation at Teesside. During 1981, Bob Thompson was temporarily based at Teesside and frequented the Cleveland Flying Club. During one of his visits to the club I asked him if it would be possible to have some aerobatic instruction from him in the Pitts he had retained. There followed about five hours instruction, with me, as happy as a dog with two wotsits, finally being supervised through a basic sequence of loops, rolls of the top, slow rolls, fourpoint rolls, stall turns and cuban eights, all at quite a low level. Then Bob showed me a similar sequence how it should be done and at a considerably lower level! Bliss!
I'll never forget some of the interesting things we got up to, with and without smoke.

The aircraft I flew in was G-BGSE and I think it was virtually brand new. Many years later, for my 40th birthday, I treated myself to a session of aerobatics with Alan Cassidy at White Waltham. The aircraft was, as I recall, G-TIII. What I didn't know then was that it was G-BGSE re-registered.

Having had a long period away from flying, I decided in 2004 to return to chase my dream of flying aerobatics and acquired myself a Pitts S1, G-OKAY. After several hours of re-acquainting myself with tailwheel aircraft and being checked out in an S2, I fulfilled my 25 year old dream and took to the air in my very own Pitts. Dreams can often turn into nightmares and mine did so on this occasion. I made several mistakes which culminated in a crash landing on my first flight. Yes, I was the twit who damaged the ex - Marlboro Pitts S1. I'm now flying another aerobatic biplane and one day I will have another Pitts. Next time, however, it will be the one I should have had, an S2A. The dream hasn't died.

Several years ago, I contacted Rothmans and acquired some copies of photographs of the team. They are similar to those that have been posted, so I don't think they would contribute anything new. Something that might be of interest, however. Around 1979 - 1981, I believe one of the team's aircraft suffered an engine problem and had to carry out a forced landing. I think Brian Lecomber was the pilot. I'm sure there was a photograph of the aircraft inverted on the ground published in the Northern Echo. One day, when I have little else to do, I might search this out.

Welcome to PPRuNe Paul, great post!

There was an entertaining "I learned about Flying From That" by the excellent Mike Riley in Pilot a few years back about his first flight in the Aerobatics International Pitts G-AZPH. I can't recall the technical specifics, but suffice to say the prop parted company with the rest of the airframe, and with just a few minutes on type and no landings under his belt, Mike had to squeeze it into a small paddock. Which ended with the Pitts on its back! I know it's in the pile of recently re-read mags, I'll see if I can find it again...

By the way, I think 'ZPH is inverted again, hanging from the roof of the Science Museum!

Pitts upside down in the grass
 

We had a number of engine failures! Those engines worked very hard. The incident in question (Paul Zebedee above) happened in 1979 I think, but it wasn't an engine failure! We had flown all the way back from the Canaries after a short tour over there. The same tour that George Smith crashed and died. It took a number of days to fly home and we had some exciting moments. Going into Rennes in France the cloud base was too low, so we followed the Islander in close (Very Close) formation and followed it down the ILS. when the runway came into view the Islander did a go-around and we all landed on the runway at the same time. The Air traffic controller wasn't expecting that and went ballistic! Screeming down the radio that we were not allowed to do that, Bob Thomson simply pressed the TX and said casually "well we're not taking off again".

We arrived in England at Lydd and cleared customs, well sort of. The customs chaps had a baby over the amount of Rothmans Cigarettes we had on board the Islander. "We're the Rothmans team, for gods sakes, what did you expect!" They told us we would have to pay duty on them so we said they could keep them. They couldn't do that so in the end they just told us to take our fags and piss off. Marcus, meanwhile, was giggling hysterically over a stupid joke I had told him about an Irish man who went to the drive-in cinema, didn't like the film so he slashed the seats. Anyway...

Approaching Teeside the weather was once again appalling, we were having real trouble getting even close. the Islander had gone off on some errand or other, so we were on our own, following Bob in a Bad Weather Battle formation. The whole thing was becoming impossible. I was number 2 behined Bob and Marcus was behined me, then Mike Finlay. Bob Thomson had to hop over some Pylons, I did the same and went into cloud. When I came back out Bob had dissapeared from sight and suddenly I was in the lead. Marcus came along side pointing in some direction but I gestured back that I was going down and landing. Field landings was something I knew I could do, I had been a Glider Tug pilot for a year or two. I found my field and was just about to land when I saw Mike Fin approching the same field from another direction. He hadn't seen me so I let him land and watched carefully! I followed him in. We were safe and having some kind of chat when Bob Thomson flew over, turned back and landed as well. Three Pitts in one field but where the hell was Marcus? Did you Guess? Yes that's it, he was upside down in another field! Apparently it was some kind of crop that looked like beautiful grass from the air but it was about two foot high. He hit the stuff and went clean over. He was very lucky. So remember, Tufts and turds! that's short grass anything else might overturn you!!

Bob Lee

That would be this one then:-
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e5...4-Part2036.jpg
g45

Amazing what you find...
 

Hi Bob, Norman, Rod and all others here -

Amazing what you find when you scratch around on the net! It was an absolute delight to come across you guys here, especially since my time with the team(s) was undoubtedly the most enjoyable time of my entire working life to date.

It's Sue (Sue Brown as I was then), Promotions Executive from 1979 until Rothmans disbanded the teams in favour of returning to Formula 1 racing.
After staying with the company for another 12 months to set up an in-house publishing operation, I missed the buzz too much and moved on! I did stay in touch with Jeanne for a while, but lost contact when I moved to Australia in the mid-80s.

You're right, Norman, there should be a book! Reading these threads triggers so many memories - joining the team for the Greek tour; the Playboy 25th birthday party - remember that? Nor could I ever forget the rides on the Harley, Bob...

I've come to the conclusion that having any kind of contact with the team carries a certain kudos (and why wouldn't it?) wherever you are in the world. A couple of years ago, I accompanied a friend to a flying school at Bankstown, Sydney. He'd mentioned to his instructor that I'd worked with the team - and did I get attention! Not only did I get quizzed for just about everything I could remember, but one of the guys took me up for a joyride in a Cessna and proceeded to take me through a series of stall turns and barrel rolls. I had to remind him that my job had been on the ground - unaccustomed as I am to G-force, it's a bloody good thing he didn't keep me up there for too long!

Such a shame that Rothmans pulled the plug and the proposed Australasian tour never got off the ground (pardon the pun) - it would have been a blast.

Anyway, great to know you're here, and all respect to the memory of those who are no longer with us. Now where did I put all my old photos...?

Cheers, Sue ;)

[[email protected]]

Well if you're suffering long-term withdrawal symptoms from the Pitts I've got a lovely S-2C at Camden....
http://images.google.com.au/imgres?i...lr%3D%26sa%3DG

Indeed she IS lovely, HappyJack - I might have to pop down and take a closer look one of these days!

Wow - can't believe this thread - and can't sleep either.

Grew up watching the Rothmans team at Finningley air displays and saw some of the Marlboro team a/c at Booker in the mid 80's.

Great to read the Aussie connections. I have time on some Pitts out of Bankstown and Camden that I believe are still around. I flew them over 10 yrs go now. I miss Pitts flying.

VH-FFF S2A - I still have an "award" from ground looping it in 93. Ouch !
VH-PIG S2S ex Royal Jordian AF aerobatic team. Awesome.
VH-ZZZ S2B - the infamous 'indoor Pitts' - had the tailwheel seize up and dig a rut in the Camden runway. Stopped pretty quick though !

As has been written - "there is nothing, absolutely nothing like flying a Pitts Special".

To the guys who flew with RAT - it's all your fault ! Ask my mum.

Aussie Pitts

VH-FFF - so-called because the owner reckoned that "if it flies, floats or f***s, it's cheaper to rent than to buy") is still at Bankstown. It's been somewhat in the wars over the years. Apart from that ground loop, a student managed to taxi it into the tailplane of another aircraft on the taxiway; then the owner had a mid-air collision with another Pitts during a mock dogfight and the operator got pinged by CASA for under-recording the hours and ordered to increase logbook times by 40% or so.
VH-PIG - still at Bankstown, though it spent several years in the hangar until the owner could afford a new engine. I believe it's operating now.
VH-ZZZ - now in Victoria (Morrabbin, I think).
Camden has the Pitts S-2C (VH-JAX) and a Pitts S-2B (VH-TKV). I've flown them both, and whilst I have to admit to being biased, I'm a great fan of the S-2C. It's a little easier to land (but still quite a different proposition compared to the average trainer) and the 3-blade prop and improved controls make it feel significantly more powerful and higher performance than the 'B.
You should take a flying holiday in Sydney - park yourself in the B&B across the road from Camden airfield, and come and get some serious hours on the Airborne Aviation S-2C. 2- 3 hours a day and you'd be back up to speed in no time!

HappyJack260

Why thank you. Next time I'm down I will definately look you up.

K

Tempting, very tempting Happy Jack, but I find it hard enough to get in and out of a Ford Falcon these days, so Pitts is out of the question and will have to rely on my 30+ years memories! Yours looks lovely, and has rather more poke than the ones I remember, must be even more fun. Will call in if passing to have a look. All the best.

Noveliste 2000, good to know another ex Rothmans member is here in this fair land, though I left well before you joined. I do just remember Jeanne. Happy days.

Tim

We must arrange to get together in NSW sometime and tell more stories.
PS: VH-ZZZ is now in Brisbane.

There's also VH-OXX, an s2a at Bankstown by the same outfit as FFF, (currently sponsored by Redbull) so I'm not sure if that precludes it from rental.

Rod Rea
 

Hi,

I'm A pilot for TNT airways and have flown a lot of times with rod rea.

Sadly he went to pension, because i liked flying with the guy. I know he's now living in turkey and hopefully enjoying his time off in the sun.

If someone has made contact with him, say hello from kristof.

By the way, my best mate has got a great picture from you guy's in his living room.

Formation foto taken on the top of a loop, and signed buy the guys.

best regards

Kristof

Rod is well and kite surfing and selling property in Turkey. Give him a little time and he will pop up I have no doubt.

G-SOLO
 

Hello to all,

it took some time, till I recogniced that this thread is still alive. Had to read many pages. Nice to hear from Bob Lee, builder of G-SOLO.
As I postet 2 years ago, G-SOLO is here in southern Germany.
It was stored since the late 90's and his permit to fly expired.
Sadly it was not possible to renew the british permit to fly.
My friend Hermann tried it in 2004. In 2005 he tried a N-reg. which
also failed. Now it's in the german reg as D-ESHS but still not in the air.
I will post some pictures when it's back in the air.

I am very interested in the history of G-SOLO.
All info welcome.

Regards
Joachim

Old and Bold
 

Been reading this thread with great interest after searching for info on the Rothmans Team - who I've now become fascinated with. Managed to get hold of a copy of 'Man in the Sky' along with other short Rothmans related films after reading this thread - watch it when I can't fly. What a fantastic team! It's a real pity there are no Pitts display teams operating full time in the UK now. It's a superb display machine and now has that growing 'vintage' appeal combined with a performance that in the right hands, can still hold its own with the modern Carbon Fibre machines.

For me, gazing skyward at a Pitts display by Brian Lecomber as a boy, was an experience that seemed to linger in the pit of my stomach to adulthood. it's great to read the stories by those involved with the Rothmans and display flying in general over the last 30 years - your experiences are the envy of other pilots. I have a Pitts S1-D now - culmination of a long held dream and I'm getting to grips with the basics - go to sleep at night designing sequences I have no chance of performing! Still, one day! Give me a few years and I might be posting to start another all Pitts team myself!

hats off to you old bold guys.

whifferdill

Stick with it and don't be pessimistic. In my 2 years with RAT I must have watched Brian fail to perform 100's of sequences. He got to be very good through years of painstaking practice, and after 2 years almost hacked formation flying (sorry Brian, couldn't resist that). I hope you do start another team, but you'd do better with more power-to-weight than the S2A.

Regards,

rod

Thanks Whifferdill, only there for a year and still remember the thrill of it all. Enjoy yourself, all the best.

Tim

Old and Bold
 

Thanks to rodthesod and Tim Mills for the encouragement - I will stick with it, and the S1D. Plenty of inspiration for me reading this thread. My S1 is a great little machine with plenty of room for me to grow into, performance wise, at the moment. Be a good while I think, before I'll be needing more performance than that! A constant speed prop would be nice though........can't even open up full straight and level without overspeeding.

All the best

Overspeed in straight and level with full power, now there is an interesting concept. Does that mean you have to work at not climbing during your sequence then whifferdill? BTW, your handle was one of David P's favourite expressions.

Well, several names here.
Someone wrote that Cairns was a 'naughty boy'. You have no idea how naughty; I had the room next to him in RAF Bruggen, Germany. Got no sleep for about three months.
I worked for Dixie when I joined Airworld and I still 'phone him every week. He looks exactly the same as in the piccy but he is twice the girth.
John Connor works for the same outfit as I.
Good stories from you all !

Cairns..... god bless him. He is drinking pints of Bacardi Coke with St Peter as we speak and shagging every angel he can get his hands on. I oubt there will be another like him again though few will know what a kind hearted soul he was. Clever too, particularly with his hands; such a practical guy.

No saint for sure but a one off.

VH-PIG is now resident in Hamilton, NEW ZEALAND. Has been getting a good workout over the last couple of weeks.

Oh to be "semi retired" and have your "toy" readily available!!!

Just discovered this thread late despite being a regular pprune reader.

I was in the Royal Selandor Flying Club, Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia last year and the RATS are still featured in pictures on the walls of the club despite the years gone by. For me is was a reminder of my novice flying days in 1981 when I first got the flying bug thanks to a chance meeting with Marcus Edwards in a pub in Bridgend South Wales. This led to me meeting John Mclean but the most influencial figure from the RATS was Bob Lee.
We were close friends for a few years during his time as chief engineer at Cambrian Engineering and I have happy memories of times he took me as ballast test flying the Vixen 2 Pitts or just the many ferry flights he put my way.

He rebuilt my first aircraft, G-ARRP, still flying but now as G-LIZI.

Marcus was a superb person to have in any bar after a days flying. "Matey" was his way of addressing his friends as he stood with a pint in his hand. Vixen 2 were Marcus and John McLean flying their old RATS ships. Paul Layzel (now Touchdow Aero Centre Old Buckenham) got them work flying for Jaguar and BMW I seem to recall.

I still have a video of Marcus and John which they did for Polydor records.
I was a deejay on a morning BBC Radio Wales programme and Polydor needed
a couple of aircraft to do a 3.5 minute video for a Song titled Out Of This World for a group called Shakatak for Top of the Pops. Vixen 2 did the job
from an airstrip near Bristol. (remember that Bob?)

They were superstars in Malaysia judging by the albums in the flying club at KL. They clogged all the roads with punters coming to see their displays.

Marcus had a black labrador and he gave me a pup which became a fond companion for many years.

I understand Bob Lee left the engineering biz and became a full time pilot which is where I always knew his calling was.

s&l ovrspeed - for hotstart54
 

Late reply, but.....

No, it just means I have to start throttling back when the airspeed gets much above 140mph.

I thought this thread was gone, but I'm glad it's back. (if it ever went).
Just a quick and somewhat belated Hi to Mike F from the CFC, god did we have some fun with that old cherokee of yours, but that's another story. Also to Sue Br, over in Australia now it seems.

Well, I was in Cape Town a week ago and you'll never guess who I met down there, it was quite bizarre realy. The guys name is Martin Wilkens and not alot of you will know of him but he was the MD at Rothmans at the time of the team and the team was his 'baby'. I was invited to the Erinvale golf club for dinner by the mens Captain, and also sitting at the table is the golf clubs' president Martin Wilkens. It didn't mean anything at the time until we got talking. What a bloody coincidence! Anyway I thought I would pick his memory and find out why they pulled the plug. It turns out that he was desperate to keep the team going but was outvoted because of something going on in Belgium, from what I understood, but by that time the night was getting on a bit. He said that it turned out to be a big mistake and they should have kept the team. Anyway, water under the bridge. He sends his regards to all.

I've now been in touch with most of the leftovers from my old team, since this thread, it's been great to talk to and be in contact with them.


Keep the thread going all.

Regards, Bob Lee.

Fantastic thread.

I had the pleasure of being introduced to John Mclean in June 82. I had just managed to harness the fearsome power of a C150 and wobble round my first solo circuit, when John walked in during the de-brief. He then proceeded to strap me into the front of GBECM and show me what a real aeroplane can do in gifted hands. Gyros were toppled for days. It cost me a pint!

There used to be the John Mclean Trophy which was the first aeros competition of the season held at Bodders International. Is it still going?

Also managed to dig out my copy of Man in the Sky. Awesome! 12 year old daughter sat through it with her jaw on the floor.

Some of the excellent photos I posted on this thread for others have unfortunately disappeared with the demise of our old company website (now hosted by our parent co - so I can't take liberties any more!). Soon as I can gather the originals together, I will repost using my Photobucket account.

John was good like that, he gilded an amazing day and framed it forever.