aircraft wreck survey bristol channel,help please
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aircraft wreck survey bristol channel,help please
Hi, I saw your old thread on pilots forum about the mosquito,
I have been a aviation archaeologist for 20 years, and have access to a EOD magnetometer
i have lists of many incidents, nearly all the aircraft losses from 1930 to 1999 ,and i am active in the field of research
recovery a restoration,I wondered if you could shed any light on the location of the engine, and more importanly have seen any other
aircraft in the channel,there must be at least 20 or so maybe more,quite a few up by lydney,the one ive been trying to get a pinpoint
on is the german Dornier 217 E4 that crashed on the mud in 1943,mid air colission with another bomber,which blew up,the bomber i was looking for was seen intact upside down a few days later by spitfires of 53 otu (Llandow) about 1 mile north of Woodspring bay on a sand bar and a local fisherman reports to seeing a complete aircraft in this area in the 1990s there are many out there ,including spitfire a Oldbury sands and a complete(minus tail) Bristol Blenhiem near Lydney which "Popped up" in the 1970s (Ive seen photos) and a Mustang mark 1 near lydney which ditched but pilot died due to head injuries reports state at the time a rescue crew came out to the wreck and rescued the body of the pilot ,,but when the RAF came to take the aircraft it had "disappeared" after the next tide,this is just a few, there is also a few Hienkel 111, a gladiator , a Hampden, Beaufort,mosquito,whitley, Lancaster SW278, corsair,javelin,whirlwind,typhoon,welington,various spitfires,harrier,
and this is all just from memory, i would have to consult my records (10000s of them) to find them all properly,
It may even be that some of you light aircraft pilots have made a grid ref or note on your flight charts as a point of interest.
I am thinking of charting a small boat and with a magnetometer start charting these wreck sites before they are lost for good , so i would appreciate any help you or anyone else could please provide,on locations, photos or siteings of anything out there over the years
many thanks
chris collins
I have been a aviation archaeologist for 20 years, and have access to a EOD magnetometer
i have lists of many incidents, nearly all the aircraft losses from 1930 to 1999 ,and i am active in the field of research
recovery a restoration,I wondered if you could shed any light on the location of the engine, and more importanly have seen any other
aircraft in the channel,there must be at least 20 or so maybe more,quite a few up by lydney,the one ive been trying to get a pinpoint
on is the german Dornier 217 E4 that crashed on the mud in 1943,mid air colission with another bomber,which blew up,the bomber i was looking for was seen intact upside down a few days later by spitfires of 53 otu (Llandow) about 1 mile north of Woodspring bay on a sand bar and a local fisherman reports to seeing a complete aircraft in this area in the 1990s there are many out there ,including spitfire a Oldbury sands and a complete(minus tail) Bristol Blenhiem near Lydney which "Popped up" in the 1970s (Ive seen photos) and a Mustang mark 1 near lydney which ditched but pilot died due to head injuries reports state at the time a rescue crew came out to the wreck and rescued the body of the pilot ,,but when the RAF came to take the aircraft it had "disappeared" after the next tide,this is just a few, there is also a few Hienkel 111, a gladiator , a Hampden, Beaufort,mosquito,whitley, Lancaster SW278, corsair,javelin,whirlwind,typhoon,welington,various spitfires,harrier,
and this is all just from memory, i would have to consult my records (10000s of them) to find them all properly,
It may even be that some of you light aircraft pilots have made a grid ref or note on your flight charts as a point of interest.
I am thinking of charting a small boat and with a magnetometer start charting these wreck sites before they are lost for good , so i would appreciate any help you or anyone else could please provide,on locations, photos or siteings of anything out there over the years
many thanks
chris collins
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google earth
I have tried google earth,but no luck, all that can be seen is the 2 wrecked tanker ships on the waters edge at woodspring bay, really need a low level flight in a chopper,at spring tides ,this is where i was hoping someone may have seen something in the past purely by accident,
i will compile a list of aircraft for the forum, and last known locations,
as allways RAF/FAA records are sketchy at the best of times,may take me a while to do though,
i will compile a list of aircraft for the forum, and last known locations,
as allways RAF/FAA records are sketchy at the best of times,may take me a while to do though,
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Mr John Penny MA of the Fishponds Local History Society has done a study of the Luftwaffe over the Bristol area 1940-1944 and has detailed the German losses over the Bristol area on the following site:-
http://fishponds.org.uk/luftbri11.html. This may be of assistance to you.
There used to be a web site which had a record of all aircraft accidents in Gloucestershire http://www.rcawsey.fsnet.co.uk/glos1.htm but it appears to be dead at present.
http://fishponds.org.uk/luftbri11.html. This may be of assistance to you.
There used to be a web site which had a record of all aircraft accidents in Gloucestershire http://www.rcawsey.fsnet.co.uk/glos1.htm but it appears to be dead at present.
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john penny
thanks for the info on the websites,
but i have al the info on all incidents etc, but i am keen to hear first hand evidence of sightings etc
thanks anyway
chris collins
but i have al the info on all incidents etc, but i am keen to hear first hand evidence of sightings etc
thanks anyway
chris collins
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Chris
There used to be a group of archeology guys who called themselves Severnside aviation society, who I think were based in Portishead.
I wonder if they are still around? they would be a good source of information.
Remember watching them recover the remains of a Wellington bomber in a field between Bristol / Bath - they ended up with a 20' hole and alot of bomber. That was in the mid 1980's though.
Having flown over the Bristol Channel a number of times I have never seen anything, though TBH I did not look too hard down below.
I'll have a better look next time i'm over there.
There used to be a group of archeology guys who called themselves Severnside aviation society, who I think were based in Portishead.
I wonder if they are still around? they would be a good source of information.
Remember watching them recover the remains of a Wellington bomber in a field between Bristol / Bath - they ended up with a 20' hole and alot of bomber. That was in the mid 1980's though.
Having flown over the Bristol Channel a number of times I have never seen anything, though TBH I did not look too hard down below.
I'll have a better look next time i'm over there.
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yes i knew them,
Hi yes i knew the group very well, as i was in the south west aircraft recovery group,as a youngster, didnt ttend the keynsham wellington though,
and i am in contact with a old member of the now defunked group,who has just spent £6000 on a new deep seeking detector,
alas i know most of the info that the SAS group had, but its no more informative than what i allready have, and yes thankyou for keeping a eye out above the channel,when you fly for any "sightings" its much appreciated
Kind regards
Chris Collins
and i am in contact with a old member of the now defunked group,who has just spent £6000 on a new deep seeking detector,
alas i know most of the info that the SAS group had, but its no more informative than what i allready have, and yes thankyou for keeping a eye out above the channel,when you fly for any "sightings" its much appreciated
Kind regards
Chris Collins
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Chris, "defunked" reminds me irresistibly of Radio 4's wonderful "I'm Sorry I Haven't a Clue" and their game "Uxbridge English Dictionary":
Barry Cryer: "Defunct: to have one's rhythm removed"
Sorry...
I think Bob Stanford Tuck was responsible for a couple of Luftwaffe bombers that ended up in the Bristol Channel, probably about August 1940 if I remember his auto-biog correctly. He was based in South Wales (Pembrey?) at the time. I wonder if anything survives of them, though I expect they are in deeper water and maybe further down towards Lundy.
Good luck with your searches.
Barry Cryer: "Defunct: to have one's rhythm removed"
Sorry...I think Bob Stanford Tuck was responsible for a couple of Luftwaffe bombers that ended up in the Bristol Channel, probably about August 1940 if I remember his auto-biog correctly. He was based in South Wales (Pembrey?) at the time. I wonder if anything survives of them, though I expect they are in deeper water and maybe further down towards Lundy.
Good luck with your searches.
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channel hienkels
yes R Stanford Tuck did shoot down a couple, one crashed at Puriton near bridgewater, now built on, also one in bridgewater bay ,
another couple were shot down by "Cats eyes Cuningham" at one at andersea ,bridgewater and one near weston - super - mare, .
alas all german sites were recovered in the 1970s a 80s by various groups.
I am currently hunting Typhoons , and just sent off a licence form to te MOD for recovery of a Meteor T7 that was based at weston zoyland , ironically any wreckage will be going back to zoyland airfield if its possible as my friend has a business on the old airfield and is restoring a couple of Piston provosts,
another couple were shot down by "Cats eyes Cuningham" at one at andersea ,bridgewater and one near weston - super - mare, .
alas all german sites were recovered in the 1970s a 80s by various groups.
I am currently hunting Typhoons , and just sent off a licence form to te MOD for recovery of a Meteor T7 that was based at weston zoyland , ironically any wreckage will be going back to zoyland airfield if its possible as my friend has a business on the old airfield and is restoring a couple of Piston provosts,
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A year or so ago a local helicopter pilot spotted a prop blade sticking ot of the mud off Burnham. From the snap, it looked like a blunt ended prop absolutely typical of a Mosquito. This was reported in the local paper.
Dick W
Dick W
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mossie in mud
yes i remember because we helped try and identify it, problem is MOD will not licence a recovery because pilot is still missing, the mossie crashed post war in the 50s ,,thanks anyway Dick , there are so many out there but rarely you get the chance to see one,
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Flew across the channel Wednesday, from Clevedon to Cardiff Docks on my way to Haverfordwest - water too deep to see anything, alas.
Sorry to thread creep, do you know what happened to the wreakage that the south west aircraft recovery group recovered from the Keynsham Wellington back in the 1980's?
I've researched the crew over the years, only 2 weeks ago I recieved the Canadian navigators service record.
Sorry to thread creep, do you know what happened to the wreakage that the south west aircraft recovery group recovered from the Keynsham Wellington back in the 1980's?
I've researched the crew over the years, only 2 weeks ago I recieved the Canadian navigators service record.
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wreckage
hi,
well to be honest i dont know, i was a very young boy of 14 when i got involved with the group, more or less just as it was folding up, due to goerge morleys ill health, although i do remember the keynsham wellington, was really a SAS dig, and some of the SWARG were invited,so we never really got a say in the matter, and me being a boy, certainly had no say what so ever, it annoys me because there was stuff from various incidents that "Disapeared", I know goerge tryed so hard to get a small building somewhere to have a little museum, but no museums were interested, also when we tryed to get the control tower at charmy down, the council blocked it, so we were doomed from the start, it makes me mad because there is a wealth of aviation history in the south west, and yet no one wants to donate or with a very small rent allow a small museum to start, such a shame,
A great place for a museum that is in the middle of the south west would be Weston Zoyland, as its central, and has a flying club,shame i cant get a grant for the old tower thats left there decaying,would be ideal as a little museum,
any how i was off the beaten track,last i knew some of the wreckage was on show at St Athan,many years ago when the SAS had some of there stuff on display there, also rumours when the group collapsed most of it got sold off without the actual "Finders" being told ,mainly to dilip sarkar, the aviation historian, Perhaps he has some of it, I will ask my mate if he knows any where abouts of wreckage from the said wellington bomber ,
TTFN
Chris
well to be honest i dont know, i was a very young boy of 14 when i got involved with the group, more or less just as it was folding up, due to goerge morleys ill health, although i do remember the keynsham wellington, was really a SAS dig, and some of the SWARG were invited,so we never really got a say in the matter, and me being a boy, certainly had no say what so ever, it annoys me because there was stuff from various incidents that "Disapeared", I know goerge tryed so hard to get a small building somewhere to have a little museum, but no museums were interested, also when we tryed to get the control tower at charmy down, the council blocked it, so we were doomed from the start, it makes me mad because there is a wealth of aviation history in the south west, and yet no one wants to donate or with a very small rent allow a small museum to start, such a shame,
A great place for a museum that is in the middle of the south west would be Weston Zoyland, as its central, and has a flying club,shame i cant get a grant for the old tower thats left there decaying,would be ideal as a little museum,
any how i was off the beaten track,last i knew some of the wreckage was on show at St Athan,many years ago when the SAS had some of there stuff on display there, also rumours when the group collapsed most of it got sold off without the actual "Finders" being told ,mainly to dilip sarkar, the aviation historian, Perhaps he has some of it, I will ask my mate if he knows any where abouts of wreckage from the said wellington bomber ,
TTFN
Chris
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Cheers Chris, would be nice to find out if any artifacts remain of the Wellington.
Like I said previously, I recieved from Canada the service record of the navigator (Sgt Don Paterson), including a complete accident report. In addition I recieved from New Zealand the Pilots records including a photo (WO Harvey)
A friend and I managed to find some small items after SAS and your group finished with the site, mostly dozens of rounds of live .303 ammo!
We thought it would be a good idea to remove the cordite from said ammo then set light to it in an old tin
I was 15 at the time!
Like I said previously, I recieved from Canada the service record of the navigator (Sgt Don Paterson), including a complete accident report. In addition I recieved from New Zealand the Pilots records including a photo (WO Harvey)
A friend and I managed to find some small items after SAS and your group finished with the site, mostly dozens of rounds of live .303 ammo!
We thought it would be a good idea to remove the cordite from said ammo then set light to it in an old tin
I was 15 at the time!
