Over the next 10 years the number of Mainline domestic pilots will become smaller and smaller.

The NEOs will still fly the trunk capital city routes at peak times but A220s will be a much more common sight.

If your a pilot wanting to try international for a few years then settle on the domestic fleet and have a family your applying to the wrong company by applying for mainline.

Haha yeah good one

There is so much made up Bulls$&t in this industry. Non of what Ollie says that is true. In fact, it’s not even legal.

Not according to forecast recruitment vs retirements for the next 5 years at least. Mainline pilot establishment planned to be about 30% bigger than early 2022 levels.

The reason why they're getting a 200 seat aircraft to replace a 174 seat one is forecast passenger growth. None of the major airports in Australia, with the exception of Perth, are planning for new terminal space in the next decade or so. There won't be enough room to park a greater number of A220s in somewhere like Sydney T3. They need bigger aircraft. Added to that the A220 is being operated, for now, by a lower paid regional carrier, which will always suffer long term pilot shortage issues hampering their growth. I could foresee that in the longer term if the company did want to integrate A220 flying on existing mainline routes the option of it being integrated into mainline would have to be considered.

Interesting point but in all my years of aviation the propensity to have a family or not has no bearing on whether you migrate to international or domestic flying. For a lot of people international rosters fit more into their chosen family lifestyle.

Some good points made there. It’ll certainly be interesting to see how it pans out over the next 10 years. New Sydney Airport will change things.

Based on tonnage vs $ (roughly) my understanding is that the A220 pilots at QF will be paid something similar to an A321 QF pilot.

A220 70T Capt on a little over $200K vs A321 101T Capt on $270K.

The 220s will never be operated under the mainline banner.

This is pure garbage.

Regarding a Group seniority list:
- I was on the AIPA committee in 2017 and a Group Opportunity List had long been our stated desire.
- Why would Mainline shoot it down, it doesn’t effect anyone at Mainline negatively so why would they care.
- And finally, as if Joyce gives a sh1t what we wanted. If the CEO wanted a Group list then there would be a Group list today. The bloke locked us out and stood us down, our feelings don’t factor much in his decision making.

As for AIPA not supporting a court case to get Jet Connect equal pay to mainline…. IT WAS AIPA’s COURT CASE!

Do some basic research, AIPA took Qantas to court to get JetConnect covered by Australia industrial law. Ie. put their pilots on the SH EA. It went to the full bench of the FWC and we narrowly lost 2-1. So your assertion is patently absurd.
AIPA Vs Qantas/JetConnect article

I'm fairly certain that the current AIPA President has been advocating a Group Seniority list for a while. If they were Jetstar Senior Managers then you were being lied to. How do I know? Their lips would have been moving. Joyce's solution to the impending pilot shortage was to establish a self-funded cadet scheme at Toowoomba.

What about a 10th year Dash 8 Captain versus a 2nd year QF SO or 7th year QF FO for the next vacancy?

There was already a seniority list integration, the Q and A pilots post QF/Australian merger. Was it perfect? No, but integrating lists will never be.

Group seniority will, on the whole, advantage mainline pilots the most, as they have the longest time in the group.

Go do your Oz medical with a CASA approved doctor in the UAE, simples!

How a group list should be structured
 

A group list should be in the following order

1) Mainline pilots as per their seniority
then,
2) Everyone else in order of date of join

there have been too many people left behind and jaded after being deemed “too valuable” to release whilst they see more junior colleagues allowed to progress their career.

it has cost myself and many others years of seniority and a multitude of 100’s of thousands. Something needs to change not for myself but for sake of future pilots coming through the system.

what vacancy do you think a 7th year QF FO would be able to get 😂😂😂

It is a hypothetical question as no Group list structure is actually in place but OlliOnion’s post seemed to be about a structure that determines who gets hired into mainline at the bottom rung. So that wouldn’t allow the transfer you suggest.

For a Group list that allowed promotional transfers between entities, you can have an arrangement like DashTrash outlined. On the day it starts all pilots at each entity have priority for promotion within their entity. Everyone hired from then on is on a Group wide DOJ seniority list. Still no disadvantage to current pilots at any entity.

It won’t happen though, as Qantas hate paying for pilots to transfer between aircraft. Tens of thousand of dollars in training costs and months of no or limited productivity. See how they just doubled mainline training freeze periods. Siloed pilot groups on single aircraft types saves money and they don’t care if we like it or not.

Who knows...how long does it take in a downturn, for example, to get a P2 seat on the A380...more or less than 7 years?

Indeed, this ^ here ^ the real reason it'll probably never fly (unfortunately)

Or if it does come to fruition there would be trade offs to offset the cost of training, like bonds, type freezes, financial penalties for moving, reduced wages etc.

Maybe it's time one of the Group Companies' pilots puts it on their EBA wish list in order to get the ball rolling up against the 3% group wage policy :E

Forgive my ignorance, but is there anything actually stopping them from removing the 'link' from the network 320s or the upcoming NJS 220s and running them as 'Qantas' branded?

Just wack a MEL on the paint work. NEF the **** out of the “link”

No, they could take paint over the ‘Link’ on a Dash 8 if they wanted to, or a JQ aircraft, or even an EFA one. They already have in a way with Jetconnect.

There’s 717s and E190s running around with business class seats on capital city routes with the word ‘Link’ on the side, so not much difference anymore.

And the 190s curiously use the “Qantas” call sign, unlike any other subsidiary (apart from Jitconnict)