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-   -   QF Pilots PIA (https://www.pprune.org/australia-new-zealand-pacific/457000-qf-pilots-pia.html)

DirectAnywhere 11th Jul 2011 05:16

QF Pilots PIA
 
Results according to AIPA Comms

89% of eligible papers returned.

94% YES vote.

It's better to die on your feet than live on your knees. :D:{

Sad day for Australian aviation when it has to come to this.

Howard Hughes 11th Jul 2011 05:20

That is a great result, stick together guys (and gals) and I sincerely wish you all the best with your negotiations.:D:ok:

speeeedy 11th Jul 2011 05:20

AIPA Media Release


Qantas pilots vote to take industrial action in historic ballot

Qantas pilots have, for the first time since 1966, voted to take protected industrial action in pursuit of a Qantas flight/Qantas pilot clause in the new enterprise agreement.

89% of pilots eligible voted in the ballot, with 94% voting to take protected industrial action as a means of applying pressure to management to come to the table and negotiate on how to achieve the clause.

Australian and International Pilots Association President Barry Jackson said pilots will now decide on what form of Protected Industrial Action they will take.
“Qantas pilots dedicate their careers to looking after Qantas passengers, so naturally we will be doing everything possible to minimise disruption to travellers and focus the pressure on management,” Captain Jackson said.

“However, the historic nature of this vote proves just how critical a point we have reached. We believe and the public believes that when you board a Qantas flight you are entitled to a Qantas pilot in the cockpit.

“That’s part of the deal when you fly Qantas. You expect the world-leading safety culture of Australian Qantas pilots. “Yet we now have a CEO who believes you can substitute Australian Qantas pilots with outsourced and offshore alternatives without doing damage to the brand. He’s dead wrong.

“The key point of differentiation Qantas has as a brand is its Australian safety culture, built over 90 years.

“That’s what this dispute is all about. Qantas pilots want to continue operating Qantas flights, but they know management has plans to shift Qantas operations to Asia and start mass outsourcing.

“As a result, AIPA is insisting on a Qantas flight/Qantas pilot clause in the new enterprise agreement. Our members need to know that if a Qantas flight is operating, then there will be a Qantas pilot at the controls.

“It’s important for Qantas pilots, but it’s also important for Qantas passengers. We understand that the company needs to adapt and evolve to stay profitable, but outsourcing the jobs of impeccably-trained and experienced Australian pilots isn’t a smart way to do it.

“Qantas pilots remain fully willing to negotiate on what needs to be done to achieve a Qantas flight/Qantas pilot clause, and we urge management to come to the table and talk about how we can work together to take this great airline forward.”

bobhoover 11th Jul 2011 05:23

how do you like them apples AJ:E

Trent 972 11th Jul 2011 05:27

I doubt AJ will be replying with a quote from LUKE 23:34.
Probably something more akin to what the spider said to the fly.

ACT Crusader 11th Jul 2011 05:48

From the ABC

Qantas pilots vote for industrial action - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

How's that messaging going?


Qantas pilots have agreed to take industrial action for the first time in 45 years.
A ballot for protected action was sent to long-haul pilots a couple of weeks ago and today the result has come back with a big yes.
With three-quarters of the pilots' votes counted by the Australian Electoral Commission, 94 per cent have responded in favour of taking action.
After months of negotiations pilots are angry the airline's management have failed to guarantee that Qantas flights will always be crewed by Qantas pilots.
The pilots are promising an industrial campaign including work to rule and potentially strike action.
Barry Jackson, from the pilots' union, says Qantas management is determined to move its international operations offshore.
"Qantas pilots feel very strongly about where the airline is at the moment," he said before the vote was taken.
"Qantas pilots have been very honest and honourable in their intent, certainly [in] their operation of the airline, and for them to be fired up as they are, I think the result will be a fairly strong one."
Qantas says the union is demanding pay increases and free flights on top of already heavily discounted airfares.

Taildragger67 11th Jul 2011 05:54

"There's no-one I'd rather have at the controls, than a Qantas pilot".

:ok:

balance 11th Jul 2011 06:00

Overwhelming numbers. Even in EBA votes, they are never that high. In pure statistics, approximately 1780 out of 2000 voted, and of those 1673 said yes.

That is ostounding, and outstanding, and shows the true level of anger amongst the guys!

Well done fellas! Now play the PR game carefully, let Australia know what this management are doing to OUR airline!

engine out 11th Jul 2011 06:00

Time for AJ and the Board to realize the pilots and other employees will not stand to see their jobs and the company "Spirited from Australia"

Tankengine 11th Jul 2011 06:04

And despite the fact that QF will keep saying they want to negotiate they have apparently cancelled EA meetings for Wed/Thurs.
Like that will help their cause!:rolleyes:

33 Disengage 11th Jul 2011 06:14

Congratulations! Great result.

All Qantas LAMEs support your campaign -100%.

Howard Hughes 11th Jul 2011 06:30


There's no-one I'd rather have at the controls, than a Qantas pilot
As much as I cringe every time I hear it, I think the majority agree!:ok:

ACT Crusader 11th Jul 2011 06:31

Actual numbers
 
Here's a link to the PIA ballot

http://www.fwa.gov.au/documents/indu...a_20112918.pdf

DutchRoll 11th Jul 2011 07:01

I was hoping for good, convincing, crystal clear results, but even I didn't think the numbers would be that high!

Massive kick in the guts for Alan Joyce, and a serious bitch-slap for the Chief Pilot who has been going around saying that he didn't think pilots really wanted to take industrial action.

Who is living in cloud-cuckoo land now? :ok:

Mstr Caution 11th Jul 2011 07:16

Spot on Dutchroll.

The CP stated the pilot group couldn't take an "eachway" bet, so they have returned a clear indication who they favour will look after their best interests.

djflight 11th Jul 2011 07:40

So I just hope the Midget and his management "team" are ready to make friends with pain and suffering!!!:=:{

Great effort Boys and Girls time to stick together and not let those on "cloud cuckoo land" taking away OUR careers and offshoring OUR airline!

By the way AJ if your love asia so much why don't you do us all a favour and F%$# Off there and take the Board and your "team" with you.... and let someone who cares about Qantas and it employees take control;)

Tankengine 11th Jul 2011 07:40

Actually the chief pilot was correct that most pilots don't want industrial action.

However we are forced into it by crazy managers!:mad:

It is war as far as I am concerned!:E

Hopefully we can convince the public, shareholders and managers that we deserve to be here doing the job as JT says on the pre-flight brief!:ok:

V-Jet 11th Jul 2011 08:00

There is ample evidence of atrocious management practices over at least the last 10 years. There is evidence of (and proven) illegal activity at the highest levels of the company. They are nothing but piglets feeding on the teat of hard working and highly (most?) ethical workforce available in Australia - but please show great caution with comments that could well be viewed, misinterpreted and presented to the press by the company that pays the wages of the TV stations by that wonderful lady of the skies - Olivia Worth and her lawyers....

TBM-Legend 11th Jul 2011 08:03

quick call in brian mccarthy...he'll help you win..:D

blow.n.gasket 11th Jul 2011 08:19

Brian Who?????:E

Mstr Caution 11th Jul 2011 09:01

Also who's Luke Enright?

The pilots overwhelming vote to engage in PIA & the company rolls out LE to comment to the media.

Where's AJ & OW? :yuk:

hotnhigh 11th Jul 2011 09:08

I think Enright previously worked in the premiers dept in victoria. That is the alp's side of politics. Ms Wirth previously with Joe Hockey.
Know the enemy.

bobhoover 11th Jul 2011 09:09

Luke enright appears to be a a former media contact for the now defunct Brumby government. Yet another winner to join the winning team at qf

ampclamp 11th Jul 2011 10:07

Excellent result people.
Now, be smart,be strong , be patient.
Do not be drawn to react emotionally by the lies that will be told about you, your conditions wages and PIA demands. There will be a public PR battle.
Qantas management are on the back foot in a number of ways. You have that on your side. As a profession you guys are trusted. use it wisely.

Ultergra 11th Jul 2011 10:17

Is it time for the union to drop the staff travel
benefits from the negotiations....?

Qantas use this against us all the time in terms of 25% pay rise etc, this will kill all their pathetic media spin that we are asking for something we are not. It will put the focus purely onto the job security claim which is vital.

Then the headlines will read: Qantas Management, epic fail.

Transition Layer 11th Jul 2011 11:49

I wonder if Dixon is sitting in his pub in Wagga listening to the news and still referring to us as softcocks?

QFinsider 11th Jul 2011 11:58

guys,

Dixon gave the hospital handpass to that little irish wimp.
On the end of most transactions is Dixon. The little wimp and right wing mate Clifford are behind it. Joyce is small enough to be a puppet and that is all he is. Time will show that the extreme right wing have tied one last time to raid the chicken coop.

Sonny Hammond 11th Jul 2011 11:59

What was the angle?
 
The question has to be asked.

With the vote on PIA due in today what in hell were QF up to with the FSO regarding the LWOP with EK?

Are they trying to sew a seed in the minds of the disgruntled pilots so they simply give up and leave? Thereby forfeiting the redundancy about to come there way...

They were up to something - no doubt.

What?

600ft-lb 11th Jul 2011 12:01

The seeds Dixon spent so long sowing have started sprouting everywhere now, just in time for his protege AJ to wonder wtf he's done in accepting this prestigious top job.

DirectAnywhere 11th Jul 2011 12:04

I'll bite.

I think it was a genuine attempt by flight ops to manage the surplus they've got. At the moment the surplus is around the 100 mark. It's likely to get worse after 24th August.

I don't think the pilot managers want redundancies. I'll give them that much.

The fact the lwop has turned in to the abortion that it has, however, speaks volumes about the competency of those involved. You make sure a deal like this is 100% ironclad before you go public. A bit like the east Timor/ Malaysia refugee deals alluded to elsewhere.

ejectx3 11th Jul 2011 12:23

The staff travel claims are primarily there to address the disgrace that is smarmy one year middle managers and their families displacing 30 year captains.....:=

piston broke again 11th Jul 2011 12:30

From all of us at VA, good luck to all our counterparts over at QF. I hope u can stick it to Joyce and protect your jobs and all future Australian pilots jobs.

JustJoinedToSearch 11th Jul 2011 12:35

The way I found out about this was on the hourly news on the radio.
'Qantas pilots voted to strike, first time in x years etc. Pilots are concerned about job security, outsourcing and offshoring. *Short sound grab of Barry Jackson*.'

No mention of payrise or staff travel or anything like that, just the big points. Good start imo.

Sonny Hammond 11th Jul 2011 13:20

I'd agree of there wasn't such a solid record of QF showing contempt for its mainline pilots.

All seems very coincidental.:yuk:

I feel bad for the guys trying to sort out their future. Times are tough in that department.

SpannerTwister 11th Jul 2011 13:28

Well done guys......
 
As above, well done !!

You guys take Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays.

We'll take Tuesdays, Thursdays and Saturdays, and split the Sundays with you ! :E :E :E

Guess we'll have to figure out the bases too...

Monday...Pilots / Sydney
Tuesday..LAMEs / Melbourne
Wednesday..Pilots / Brisbane
Thursday..LAMEs / Adelaide
Friday..Pilots / Canberra
Saturday..LAMEs / Perth
Sundays..Pilots & LAMEs rotation / All other outstations

:E :E :E :E

ST

fearcampaign 11th Jul 2011 13:35

No one wanted to take Qantas Pilots as the CEO had gone public and told the world Qantas pilots were "kamikazes".:E

ACT Crusader 11th Jul 2011 21:22

Todays Creedy article in the OZ


QANTAS long-haul pilots are next week set to take their first industrial action in more than four decades after overwhelmingly backing options that include 48-hour rolling stoppages.

Ninety-four per cent of pilots taking part in the ballot voted in favour of taking protected industrial action.

Officials said the vote sent a message to management about the level of pilot support for the pilots association's job security claims.

Australian and International Pilots Association vice-president Richard Woodward would not reveal what action the union was planning, but said it would be obvious to passengers and the union would attempt to minimise disruptions.

"We can't promise that, of course, because other unions are upset with company as well," he said. "But the stuff we initiate, certainly in the initial phases, we'll do our very best to minimise any disruptions to passengers."


Related Coverage
Qantas pilots in offshore strikes Courier Mail, 7 hours ago
Pilot storm looms for Qantas, travellers Courier Mail, 7 hours ago
Qantas pilots demand more security The Daily Telegraph, 7 hours ago
Qantas puts cost of pay claim at $317m The Australian, 26 May 2011
Pilots confident over strike ballot The Australian, 25 May 2011

Asked whether a 48-hour stoppage was a possibility, he said the union had to exercise the option within 30 days. "That could be two pilots taking five minutes' stop-work action or it could be the entire pilot body stopping for 48 hours, or anything in between."

Captain Woodward said the union was willing to defer action and seek an extension from Fair Work Australia if Qantas management was willing to enter meaningful negotiations.

Talks have stalled over pay claims and a job security clause that stipulates Qantas-coded flights be flown by Qantas pilots.

Captain Woodward said the pilots had offered an 11 per cent increase in flying hours and rostering efficiencies that would let an already significant pilot surplus almost double.

He said the pilots wanted to see the surplus absorbed into other parts of the group and criticised a company move to let surplus pilots take leave without pay to work for Emirates.

Qantas said it was disappointed by the threat and was prepared to negotiate reasonable increases in pay and conditions, but the demands from the union were " excessive and unsustainable".

"The pilots' union is demanding pay increases, free flights on top of already heavily discounted airfares and a requirement that pilots on all Qantas airlines, including Jetstar, are paid the same high rates as Qantas pilots," it said. "Paying Qantas rates to pilots for our low-cost carrier Jetstar would drive up ticket prices, make Jetstar unprofitable and set precedents for other staff salaries."

Shed Dog Tosser 11th Jul 2011 21:25

Suggest not looking at PIA on Fridays or Saturdays, the only people you'll piss off is the little people trying to get home to their families.

Stick with the Mondays, Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays, knock the wind out of big business.

Employees are unlikely to be all that concerned about being stuck at home unable to get to work or business meetings.

Double tap the shares prices, or should I say, continue doubling tapping the share prices.

Do not get in the trenches with the tit for tat game, we are number three on the most trusted professions list, versus the CEO, which is quite lower on this list, stick with the mantra of company greed, off-shoring, safety, destroying an australian icon and suggestions of huge executive bonuses etc etc.

ACT Crusader 11th Jul 2011 21:26

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but is this the first time Qantas have had to explain the codeshare claim?

Bigboeingboy 11th Jul 2011 21:57

Guess what kids the AIPA exec is about to do nothing!


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