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Qantas International faces 'tough' changes warns chief executive Alan Joyce
from the Australian,
http://resources1.news.com.au/images...alan-joyce.jpg NEXT month's announcement on restructuring Qantas International will signal the start of phased but tough transformation of the airline over coming years that could include replicating the airline's successful frequent flyer scheme offshore. Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce raised the prospect in a speech at a Sydney aviation conference today that was also likely to heighten speculation of a full-service offshoot in Asia. Mr Joyce told the Australia Pacific Aviation Outlook Summit that the airline's review of its international operations would aim to keep Qantas Australia's leading premium airline while strengthening the focus on alliances, reviewing non-performing business segments and expanding in Asia. "Change is always tough," he said. "But the competitive challenges we face make major change essential and our commitment to the change process is absolute. "I believe we have a major opportunity to go beyond the natural limitations of our market size and geography, to become a champion Australian company in a globalised region and world." Mr Joyce reiterated the airline's interest in Asia and China and pointed to Jetstar's rapid expansion in the region. He said there was also an enormous opportunity to leverage the mainline carrier's excellence in brand management, aviation safety and other skills. And in what appears to be a reference to a potential Asian full-service airline, Mr Joyce said the company saw continuing opportunities for the Jetstar model and "lessons to be learned for Qantas". "I want to see both our airline brands maximising their global potential," he said, adding that the frequent flyer program was also "a business model than can be replicated in other markets". Mr Joyce also used the speech to attack union leaders pursuing industrial action for being out of touch and blocking new business models. He said new maintenance regulations issued by the Civil Aviation Safety Authority to bring Australia into line with Europe recognised the enormous advances in aviation technologies. The new regulations were a huge step forward for aviation safety that Qantas was capitalising on through a new system called Project Marlin. The largest and most complex IT project ever undertaken by Qantas engineering, Mr Joyce said Marlin allowed Qantas to look at a sophisticated database and get an instant maintenance update on any aircraft anywhere in the world. The airline would start with its Airbus A380s and progressively phase in the rest of the fleet in what represented the biggest improvement to the airline's maintenance systems since record keeping began. "More broadly, Qantas is spending billions on next generation aircraft with advanced computer systems linked to ground systems to enable the detailed monitoring of aviation performance in real time," he said. "The vast majority of people within our business have helped us to maximise the capabilities of these aircraft in terms of fuel-efficient flying techniques and new product and service offerings," he said. "But our maintenance and repair costs are among the least efficient and most expensive in the world. "So it's time to catch up. We don't repair our cars the same we did 40 years ago. We can't repair our planes the same way either." my bold you can say that again AJ :rolleyes: |
Interesting to note to where Steve Creedy put the story in the Australian.
In the second half of a story hidden behind the Headline about Qantas closing its Travel Agent shop fronts. Advertising dollar wins every time. |
I think it is obvious. AJ and co DO NOT want to solve/compromise with the pilots or engineers. This is "break them time" for them. I feel very sorry for the qantas team. He is just hellbent on breaking it.
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That's right. Basically QF can allow the ban to go ahead, or espond by lockout - would seem OTT; or not accept the ban - ala the left-hand LAMEs - and not pay pilots that choose to make the union PA announcements. The FWA legislation (as I understand it) ensures that action taken by the employer is proportional to the action taken by the employees. If QF were to respond to the making of PAs by pilots with lockouts and docking of pay, I imagine it would find itself in FWA in about a nanosecond. So while these actions would be consistent with QF's bullying style, the FWA should ensure that it does not happen. |
I don't disagree shark patrol.
The PA announcement is a ban. The FWA allows an employer to reduce pay because of bans, regardless of what the ban might be, but it also means a worker can complete other work and still get paid for it. If part of your job as a pilot is to say "this is your captain speaking etc etc", and you chose to not say it for the purposes of PIA then it leaves it open for QF to deduct pay proportional to the ban taking place. It is open for QF to not accept the ban altogether though. Again the reasons behind that could be disputed in FWA |
FWA allows the company to reduce pay on the basis of how much the respective PIA 'costs' the company. The response by the company needs to be in proportion. They'd be hard pressed to argue that the PIA costs the company a single red cent.
The case law given to QF drivers was that of a group of bus drivers in Canberra who refused to take cash for travel. Their union argued that they spent only 1% of the day doing this part of the job so that is what they should be docked. The company argued that they lost 50% of their income so that is what should be docked of the pay. I don't remember the specifics but FWA ruled on a combination of factors and it cost the drivers about 20%. This one is not going to register a blip to QF unless they decide to be even more antagonistic than they already have. |
Originally Posted by ACT Crusader
The PA announcement is a ban. The FWA allows an employer to reduce pay because of bans, regardless of what the ban might be, but it also means a worker can complete other work and still get paid for it.
The employer would look pretty silly docking you a week's (or even a day's) pay for making an extra PA when there is no company prescribed limit on how many PAs you can make in the first place, nor when exactly you are allowed to make them, for obvious reasons. As pointed out, it's very difficult to imagine how Qantas could possibly argue (and quantify) that the PA costs them anything at all. The company may well try to be a***holes, but there are limits as to how far they can take that in practice. |
QANTAS Pilots Strike
Folks,
I have no connection at all with either QANTAS or Australian Aviation either. On the current plan for a strike by QANTAS Pilots, I would however make the following comments. - Remember 1989/90, did this really result in better pay & conditions for those Aussie Pilots involved at the time. - Many workers in many industries throughout the world would, be only to happy to receive the present pay & conditions that QANTAS Pilots receive. - Such actions this can & will, all end in tears & I am confident I know for which party in the current dispute. Safe flying |
Keg - that was the Action Buses case. The TWU claimed in some cases two thirds of the pay was deducted. But as you say, FWA ordered that 20.1% of pay be deducted. FWA said:
the payments to drivers implementing the partial work ban should be decreased by an amount which reasonably approximates to the percentage that fare collection revenue represents of ACTION’s total expenses. According to the submissions of ACTION this formula would result in the total payment made to each driver for each shift in which the ban is imposed being reduced by 20.1%. |
thanks again for the other response carbonneutral
*Lancer* The job security clauses do not provide job security, because the document (LHCA) is only valid for an Australian based company. QantasAsia - or whatever it may be called - if wholly incorporated overseas, may be completely independent from Australian industrial law in the same way that Jetstar Asia, and Jetstar NZ is... |
The end result of the job security clause will be a new CEO at Qantas. His security relies on destroying the existing brand by replacing all staff with low cost models.
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Perhaps that's the strategy.
I am unaware of how paying Australian-based Qantas subsidiary jet pilots the same LHCA rates (the current 'job security' claim), delivers any direct benefit to existing Qantas pilots. It assumes that all future mainline aircraft will be operated by an Australian-based company, and will probably expedite an offshoring strategy in the absence of AIPA consultation or inclusion. The Jetconnect case result may alter things, but I doubt public perception will. Who knows!? |
Such actions this can & will, all end in tears & I am confident I know for which party in the current dispute. |
someone with qantas, preferably one of you pilots, please tell your main spokesman about southwest airlines' pilots in the united states. they are pretty much hands down the highest paid jet pilots on that continent. that qantas pilot salaries are too high, need lowering and are uncompetitive is just tripe. get onto your boy. tell him to counter the campaign with info such as that of a swa pilot's salary. the end game is that the profitability of an airline is all about how management do their thing. qantas' management are atrocious. swa management are the opposite, and they pay their pilots accordingly. undermine the qantas campaign to undermine you. get onto it fellas. and good luck. (ps smarmy replies accepted. no problem. just get the job done right. this is the only chance you'll ever have. fun example of a possible reply: "yeah well thanks for the assistance, bruce mate, but we're just fine 'cause we here at qantas pilots dot com already know this...and we're onto it? you know? so piss off bruce.") lol.
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Big White Bird,
Things can get pretty messy when you start trying to play the comparison game in the public arena. It can backfire fairly easy if you don't know all the facts/details. Or you can get stuck trying to explain details and your main message(s) get lost. Southwest's profit margins are currently really low right now and have taken a big dive even in the last 6-9 months. Paying 10year+ pilots $200+/hour won't mean much to the "hearts and minds" here... |
Joyce says QF unions are out of touch
Qantas looks to China for future, cautions 'out of touch' unions | ATWOnline
Qantas looks to China for future, cautions 'out of touch' unions Qantas declared that its future is in China, the world’s second biggest and fastest growing aviation market, but the airline needs its staff to embrace the radical change to succeed. Speaking Wednesday at the Australia Pacific Aviation Outlook Summit in Sydney, QF CEO Alan Joyce warned that “out of touch union leaders” who are resisting change don't understand that the carrier's costs are 25% above its competitors such as Singapore Airlines (ATW Daily News, July 14). “Globalization continues to change our world in profound ways and it is still changing the way we work, consume and engage—and it is still driving relentless competition,” said Joyce. “Globalization is not optional and it is not over.” According to Joyce, China is already home to seven of the world’s top 20 airports by capacity. “By 2020, China will have 15 cities with bigger populations than Sydney and the region will be home to 2.6 billion people. And by 2030 the country expects to have at least three globally recognized international airline hubs, 10 national and regional hubs and at least 244 airports,” he said. But to capitalize on the booming China and Asia market, QF needs significant change, cautioned Joyce. “Change is always tough. But the competitive challenges we face make major change essential, and our commitment to the change process is absolute,” he said. The CEO noted a significant upside: “I believe we have a major opportunity to go beyond the natural limitations of our market size and geography, to become a champion Australian company in a globalized region and world.” Joyce noted that QF subsidiary Jetstar operates Asia’s largest and fastest-growing low-fares network. “That is an amazing achievement for an Australian airline,” he said. On Aug. 24, QF is expected to announce a major restructure of its international operations and a new joint venture to establish an airline in Asia, which will be based in either Malaysia, China or Singapore. Joyce said that the future is “wrapped up in even deeper alliance partnerships and further joint ventures,” but such sentiments do not sit well with unions that fear outsourcing. According to Joyce, some of the airline’s union leaders are “simply out of touch and trying to block our use of new business models” and that could scuttle expansion plans. Joyce also claimed that some unions are blocking efficiencies that can be delivered by new maintenance technologies. “Less than a month ago, Australia’s Civil Aviation Safety Authority issued new aviation maintenance regulations that bring Australia into line with European standards and global best practice,” said Joyce. The new regulations finally recognize the quantum leap in aviation technology, particularly in the sophisticated information, material and design technologies that underpin new aircraft. However, Joyce said the QF engineers’ union is resisting the change. “Our maintenance and repair costs are among the least efficient and most expensive in the world,” he stated. “It’s time to catch up. We don’t repair our cars the same way we did 40 years ago. We can’t repair our planes the same way either. We can—and we will—be safer, smarter and more efficient.” QF is in a bitter dispute with both its engineers and long-haul pilots, who have voted for industrial action expected to take place in early August (ATW Daily News, July 12). |
...the carrier's costs are 25% above its competitors such as Singapore Airlines (ATW Daily News, July 14). “Globalization continues to change our world in profound ways and it is still changing the way we work, consume and engage—and it is still driving relentless competition,” said Joyce. “Globalization is not optional and it is not over.” Is that a realistic expectation? Should Australian textile workers ( if there are any) receive the same wages as those in the back alleys of Mumbai? Should Australian hospitality workers get paid identically to their Asian counterparts ... around $4 - $5 an hour? Consider the situation if Australia followed through with this idea ...
It's a vicious circle that doesn't make sense .... :} |
Alan also forgets that Singapore's training budget would have to be at least double that of QF's. They pay pilots to learn to fly put them through PPL/CPL/IR then put them in a Learjet at $5000 an hour, then they start endorsement training in the full motion simulator......meanwhile Jetstar and QF get FREE pilots!!:ugh:
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Should Australian textile workers ( if there are any) receive the same wages as those in the back alleys of Mumbai? Framer |
Guys the likes of AJ I don't think have any idea what they are doing. Don't forget these CEO's aren't in the same 'boat' as us worker drones they have money enuf to ride out any change in the global way of thinking & as such are just feathering their own nest to survive in the mess they leave behind in that nest.
Our biggest trouble is we have a weak Govt. who are slowing destroying what was once a great country. Now there in lies the real problem, aviation is just a small part of it. Wmk2 |
good one Wally Mk2... but perhaps there is a good chance that those that make the laws are listening, watching and growing tired of the coporate greed...
hopefully they will and can do something before it is too late, that or AIrcraft manufacturers make airbags in the backs of the PAX seats... |
Already done,only they are in the seat belt in some locations of new gen aircraft eg738.
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perhaps they need one on the Radome too... to stop the big hole in the ground!!
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I trust that all QF pilots only drive Australian made cars, drink only Oz wine and beer, take their holidays only in Australia to be consistent with their position...:ok:
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I trust that all QF pilots only drive Australian made cars, drink only Oz wine and beer, take their holidays only in Australia to be consistent with their position... |
Come TBM everyone around the world knows QF pilots spend their hard earned driving the latest Mercs, Audis and Beamers, drink Dom P, and leisure on the French Riviera....
indeed but only if the company pays for themmmm:{ |
TBM tosser, we pay bucket loads of personal tax in Australia and I drive an Aussie built car. What do you drive on the executive lease plan. A Hyundai?
Word is that Ms Worth has instructed ground staff to blame all delays on industrial action due to the pilots and engineers PIA. My actions and those of many of my fellow pilots protects the schedule. Bloody clowns. |
Originally Posted by TBM-Legend
I trust that all QF pilots only drive Australian made cars, drink only Oz wine and beer, take their holidays only in Australia to be consistent with their position...
I'm deeply concerned for our jobs, and I try to "buy Australian" if I can. But sometimes I can't, or the Australian product simply doesn't suit my needs, or any of a hundred other possible reasons. It's something you have to deal with and it doesn't negate the value of any other position you hold on "offshoring" an entire Australian industry. So enough of this argument, eh? You're at least the second person to make it on this forum, and it's still equally ridiculous as the first time. |
If we only holidayed in Australia ... QANTAS wouldn't have a business at all.
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Not only Bloody clowns schlong hauler, but Bloody Dishonest Clowns as well!
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It's what AJ DOESN'T say that is most compelling:
the carrier's costs are 25% above its competitors such as Singapore Airlines As they are also SMALLER, the crew will get paid less $$$$... but still inline with the formula that AIPA and QF have agreed upon for the last 40 odd years. Did he also mention that he, AJ, gets paid SIGNIFICANTLY above what the other CEO's of these airlines get paid? and not just him, his whole executive team. Why do these execs focus on cutting the cost which is 30% of the total cost, and not focus on the cost which is 70% of the cost? When he mentions "Labour" .... he includes the management team and its bonuses. IF you were to take pilots wages as a TOTAL cost of running the airline, you would find that it is probably only 5% of the total cost. I am NOT in management, and never have been, but even I know that to make money, you have to spend money. |
Today's AIPA Media Release
‘Proud of our airline’: Qantas pilot in-flight announcements commence Qantas pilots have today commenced brief and positive in-flight announcements as part of their campaign for a Qantas flight/Qantas pilot clause in their new agreement. Although each pilot will personalise the message to some extent, the approximately 25 second announcement will be roughly as follows: Ladies and gentlemen, this is (insert rank and name), together with (all participating crew) may I briefly have your attention. On behalf of all Qantas pilots we would like to thank you for choosing to fly with Qantas. We are proud of our profession and our airline and trust you will support us in keeping Qantas pilots in Qantas aircraft and ensuring our great iconic airline remains uniquely Australian. For more information and to register your support, please make your next destination qantaspilots.com.au. Thank you. Australian and International Pilots Association Vice President Richard Woodward, said the aim was to make passengers aware of why Qantas pilots are engaged in a dispute with management for the first time 45 years. "The aim of the announcement is not to argue any point to passengers, it is to gently remind them that Qantas pilots are currently fighting to stay in the cockpit of Qantas flights, "If they wish to find out more or support our campaign then they can visit our website, qantaspilots.com.au," Captain Woodward said. "We’re not trying to ram any particular point home here, because when Qantas passengers find out what management is trying to do they typically decide for themselves that it is out of step with what they want from their airline." "Quite simply, Qantas passengers do not want to see their Australian Qantas pilots replaced on Qantas flights with outsourced alternatives working to Asian conditions and standards. "We hope that this action spreads awareness of what management is up to and puts pressure on them to reconsider." |
was told that the CC were directed at their briefing not to acknowledge or comment or respond to any questions/statements by pax in connection with the announcement.
Understand that they were told to say "I'm sorry I don't know anything" I wonder what the CC & their Union feels about Q making them seem like brainless muffin sellers? Bit sad eh AT |
AIPA and ALAEA people please listen.
You are not getting your message out to the great un washed. All I hear on the news is from that silly woman "Qantas Pilots want all JQ and QF Pilots paid the same, this not sustainable, airfares would rise,people will lose jobs and we will shut down ops blah blah etc etc……." No word is heard from the Unions refuting this claim or giving out real data proving this is all BS. You are not being heard, QF management are getting all the sound bites. For goodness sake STEP IT UP. |
NP...I agree !!
Apart from Ben Sandilands and Crikey! no-one else wants to listen to us ....... AJ....... "Hi, I'm AJ and I want to spend a zillion dollars advertising my product with your media outlet, but I'm not comfortable spending that amount of money at a time when my company might be receiving negative reports in your media". Media Editor.... "Hi, I'm the editor, and as a fiercely independent media outlet we publish everything WE CONSIDER to be "news-worthy". Let me give you an example Mr J....If the CEO of one of Australia's biggest companies says something, we would consider that news-worthy and publish it. On the other hand, Australia has hundreds of unions with thousands of union-officials, releasing tens-of-thousands of media releases, we cannot possibly publish all of those media releases, and even if we did, I cannot possibly envisage how they would be important enough to be in the first 20 pages (10 minutes) of our papers (shows)...nudge-nudge-wink-wink.........." ST |
I agree, step it up.
Even on channel 10 news this morning, their intro was "Qantas pilots will be interrupting passengers entertainment to make PA's" and "Qantas management are 'disppointed' over this action by pilots." Where are the pilot reps?? |
I share many of the frustrations here, but I think you have to be a little circumspect.
The media are just regurgitating the garbage a very well resourced QF media relations department spin to them. They don't see it as their job to do a forensic investigation of the facts anymore (those good ol' days are long gone, for the most part). The only people who will really care about being "interrupted" during their entertainment will be passengers. Those same passengers will be pleasantly surprised when the PA is made, but it doesn't actually say anything hugely controversial or interrupt anything, least of all their entertainment. Those same passengers then go on to being a bit miffed at Qantas for lying to them, and will likely tell their friends about it too. Once a lie or two is exposed, they get to the point where they don't believe anything Alan Joyce or Olivia Wirth spin to them anymore. This is where Qantas, in feeding crap to the media, can come unglued. Sure, it's only a personal opinion, but I don't think Qantas are as far ahead in the PR game as people like to think they are (or at least, not for long). As far as the cabin crew go, I wouldn't expect too many problems. If there is one thing which can unite tech and cabin crew, it is a seething distrust of Joyce and management cronies (yeah, you know who you are, don't you? :suspect:). |
That PA is perhaps the 'weakest' from of industrial action I have every heard of. What is the next plan, I am not overly familiar with Australian Employment Law, does further action require another ballot??
Passengers are just going to either ignore such a PA or complain about being disturbed by it. I can almost guarantee that the majority of the population don't give a sh*t about Qantas Pilot for Qantas Aircraft, they just want the cheapest fare. The same as we all want the cheapest goods when we shop around. The best way to spark a good public interest in whats going on is to park up a few aircraft. |
Nice enough message by the crew , I can't imagine anyone getting too upset with it . But , how does it further the cause ? make you seem nice guys ? Yes , convince QF management to back off ? I don't think so.
Guys , the clock is ticking if you don't want to join the guys who worked in the Engine Shop , on the outside looking in , then step up and get fair dinkum . |
This is a marathon, not a sprint. There is an image to be crafted here. the PAs are the first step in that. No need to go all '89 right from the start! :ugh: Personally I'm quite pleased at the strategy. It's conservative, it keeps our options open and it's doing our best to keep the passengers on side in the short term.
... does further action require another ballot?? Passengers are just going to either ignore such a PA or complain about being disturbed by it. I can almost guarantee that the majority of the population don't give a sh*t about Qantas Pilot for Qantas Aircraft.... |
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