The way I see it is that LAMEs got Forked over big time when Bruce D. was running the ALAEA (and I know, from inside, at that time that he controlled the exec)..........and we have never ever...........................
QF management had their hand up Bruce's fundamental orifice so far...................and we never will RECOVER!

dont think the hand was up bruce,s arse think more the exec ,bruce loathe him or love him at least had the lames at heart ,he did what he had too and when he wasnt going to tow the line anymore he was given the arsan chop.bruce held off on one man transits and a host of other things the company wanted introduced without letting on.

also if bruce had been offered a current position on the fed exec now it would have been greast to see him exact some revenge . i agree certain exec members were given pay offs in the past but the past is the past.

unless we stand together we will once again vote in a lessor offer talk is cheap ,actions are strong

By the sound of the latest notice it would appear that the company has not even provided the entire document to the assn for their consideration. What is it with this mob? They fart around for over a year then come up with some half baked incomplete offer..... and they are selling it like it is the best thing since sliced bread telling us it is important that we get it bedded down asap! I smell a rat.

Does anyone know who has been offered the training as yet?

could tell ya but then i would have to kill u

Yes. Emails went out today.

Will this classify the selected ones as S$%BS if they continue with the training before the unions blessing?

is this the only way to get a pay rise,get more training coupled with a pissy 3%,what a joke(another reward for the suck holes) while ever one else can suffer:ugh:

employee perspctive , you sound as if you are bitter and twisted ,now singing a different tune since the emails have gone out ,guess it was a no ,dont worry theirs always the fun process in three years for the 787.

Let 'em go for it Annulus, anyone who signs up on the open ended agreement with no detail know exactly what they are getting into, as long as they don't come whinging to the assn later. I would be wary if I was a Snr or Supervisor though, do they retain this position down the track?

I know it does not answer the question (Snr LAME & Supervisors positions down the track)

but look at the EBA “Redeploy LAME’s as AME’s. That gotta tell you something.:yuk:

New notice from ALAEA just came through. 14:45 23/11/07 local.
GAME ON.

Game on
 

Well new leadership.....look foward to the outcome of next Tuesday....the foot is on the other shoe......yes sir reeeee

Looks like the barney is on. First business day after the election and the notice has come out for industrial action. Overtime bans, higher duties bans, secondment bans, stop work meetings. This mob don't fk around. The ad was right, they're coming back, didnt take long.

Bring it on and don't stop until M is on the scrap heap. :ok:

Gents
its time to get rid of the imbiciles that are running the show.
We listen to the "new world speel " that they preach but things get
worse! when they say "engage the workforce " they actually mean
help me because i have made a whole lot of promises to senior management
that I don't know how to keep!
well guys, all that will happen is they will blame the union or the workforce for there inability to manage., and the loser will be us!!!!!!!!!!
It is now time to fight M and DC\
Its turned into such a cluster f**k that they are making us look bad in order to save there own skins.
Its time to let the results of there action be seen.
NO OT, NO HIGHER DUTIES AND NO SECONDMENTS.
DC has taken the pride out of QF engineering and the fleet is suffering.
It is time to take action to get rid of these fools before they get rid of us!@!!!!
Stop work meetings next I say

did we reach intelligent space or has the bridge of trust been burnt in the pity city 44 gallon drum?

guess m will enjoy his power trip love in, have heard if anyone doesnt attend there will be consequences ,just like to know what ,there isnt much more he could take away

Why attend, do you want to help this clown?
 

People should show their disgust by not attending and showing continued support for this moron. After all if he has no support he has no mandate. What can he do to them then? He has put all our jobs at risk and has no integrity or ethics. He has lied and run the business into the ground.
The problem being a large proportion of those invited are that spineless and will continue to try hang on in hope their somewhat questionable rises to the top under M will continue as their credibility would be worthless under any other.
When the flush comes, I hope all those who have shown their colours and endorsement of this regime will be removed along with him.
Only then will Engineering have any chance of becoming a real MRO. :=
Long live the revolution.

"You can't solve Problems using the Same Thinking that Created Them" (Albert Einstein).

maybe along with the eba ballot for protected industrial action, we should run a ballot of confidence in engineering management.

Qantas faces New Year strike
By Steve Creedy, Aviation writer November 28, 2007 05:27am
Email article

QANTAS planes could be grounded by industrial action in the new year unless the airline increases a 3 per cent pay offer to its engineers.
The airline warned passengers it would make every effort to minimise disruption to its services after the Australian Licensed Aircraft Engineers Association applied to the Industrial Relations Commission to conduct a ballot of members as a prelude to industrial action.

Engineers are key to the airline's operations because they must approve aircraft to fly.

"Three per cent just isn't quite good enough when the Australian average wage has been increasing by 4.6 per cent per year on average for the last five or 10 years," ALAEA federal secretary Steve Purvinas said yesterday. "So we're looking at an industrial action ballot that will finish on December 22."

Mr Purvinas said the action would include overtime bans, bans on higher duties and stopwork meetings but he said the union was not looking at disruptions over Christmas.

"I think we've got 60 days to actually take the action, so we'll give Qantas some time to negotiate, but we'll expect them to actually come out with a bit more of a reasonable offer than what they gave us a week or so ago."

Qantas executive general manager Kevin Brown said it was extraordinary that the union had chosen to ballot members to take industrial action the day before the parties were meeting to talk about negotiations.

"We will take every measure to put in place contingencies to ensure the smooth operation of the airline and protect our customers," he said.

The new industrial threat emerged as Qantas struck a landmark deal with its flight attendants that will allow it to use a recently established subsidiary to employ long-haul cabin crew on lower rates and longer hours.

The airline says the new enterprise agreement would lead to the creation of more than 2000 full-time cabin crew jobs in Australia over three years and allow it to better compete with overseas carriers such as Emirates.

The alternative was a massive ramping up of the airline's overseas bases with an increasing proportion of flight attendants employed offshore.

Under the agreement with the Flight Attendants Association of Australia, existing flight attendants will remain employed by Qantas Airways on current rates and conditions.

But new staff would be employed by Qantas Cabin Crew Australia on lower rates similar to those paid by Jetstar International. The deal will see them working about 25 to 35 per cent more hours than existing staff. Qantas has also pledged that the current 75-25 mix of Australian and offshore crew would remain.

The union and the airline yesterday described the agreement as a win. The union said it provided for a 3 per cent annual pay rise, a $3000 "sign on" bonus for its 3000 existing flight attendants and improved superannuation arrangements that allow salary sacrifice.

FAAA international division secretary Michael Mijatov said QCCA would employ staff on Jetstar International rates and hours but they would get better conditions in terms of annual, long-service and sick leave as well as overtime provisions.

Qantas chief executive Geoff Dixon said the agreement was positive for all concerned and opened up a range of options for current crew.

Just a note for all.

The ALAEA today were successfully granted permission from the AIRC to conduct a ballot of members for protected Industrial Action. Roll of voters closes on 4th Dec. Ballot open from 10th and closes 20th Dec.

A successful vote could lead to action including -

stop work meetings
overtime bans/limitations
secondment bans
and
Higher duties bans

Thank you Fed Sec
 

Thanks Fed Sec. All the guys I talk to around these parts (BNE) are chomping at the bit. Lifes About Murrays Exit.

Attention Bexley :ok:
Perth is ready to go. After what Murray did to us for the last year we will do whatever it takes. Of course theres the 3x DMMs and a few S/L that will bend the rules to keep it all going but the rest of us are awaiting your command.

As usual LMC's are only out for themselves, if you have a beef with your GM get over it and get on with your job.

For the people in Heavy who by the way are no more impressed with the paltry 3% offer can I say please stick to the issues and don't use the entire membership to get even with individuals in qantas mgt.

We are fighting for our survival every day with the reality being our work could go offshore if the decision was made to do so by senior mangement. The rabid dogs in the fed exec are doing little to ensure the survival of Heavy maint in Australia, of course Mr purvinass will be fine now he has taken his golden handshake from Qantas and is busy pursuing his political career.

Judging by the posts on this site I expect my comments to elicit a reaction, but before you do think about what we are about to do, what the consequences will be and where it will end. I am not a management stooge and am happy to stand up for our rights but les make sure we know what we are fighting for and what it may cost.

Its a democratic process why the contempt
 

It’s your vote section 41, use it how you please. No everyone sees grey clouds or is waiting for the sky to fall in. At least now the membership has a choice which won't be undermined or manipulated by a dodgy company stringed exec.

Don't just have a bitch; tell us why we can't aim higher than 3% and at least meet average wage growth of nearly 5% with record profits and huge productivity and efficiency gains.
Let me guess, your quite high up the tree and are aligned with the psycho terrorism this company uses to bash its employees to control costs rather than being smart enough to capitalise on its greatest asset.
When M, Cox and Vincent are pulled I hope the deadwood is cleaned up as well and replaced with people that actually know what LAME’s do. Look at the destruction these clowns have left behind.

:=

I see you are a new ppruner 41 and what a time to join the debate. It seems you have been falsely convinced that taking action will be the downfall of us all. Wasn't it inaction from our union that closed SHM and led to greater offshoring? Would this have happened if we stood up for ourselves at the time and supported our workmates from our line stations? Do we have individual gripes against managers because they are making woeful decisions that have led to more offshoring and loss of many line contracts? Is this enough reason for us to want to act to remove tham?

I think so along with the majority in Adelaide. Bring it on.

Sect 41,

Call their bluff. Don't be afraid of finding new work. That fear is exactly what they're relying on to push through substandard payrises.

Stand up to the ba$tards and tell them that if they don't pay you a fair days pay then they can shove their job up their ar$e and send the work wherever they bloody well like!!

If worst comes to worst then I guarantee that you will find work to sustain you and your family with the current skills shortage(who knows-a new job may even pay more and you'll probably love the change).

Your terms and conditions have been eroded for the last 5-7 years and if you allow it to continue you will be going backwards even more. You have nothing to lose and everything to gain by taking a hard line. I think its a good time to give QF some hard negotiating back in return for all their sob stories of the last few years!!

section 41=pointy end=management stooge

What are we fighting for ?
 

Section 41 , this must be your first and only job.

You have to stand up and do what is necessary to get fair conditions. This management will try all strategies to get you to work more and take less. They then pay themselves big bonuses for getting you to do just that!!!

Wake up and look around you. :uhoh:

You're in this industry now and you'll find that you will have more than one employer in your career.

(There is life after Qantas..........:D..)

section 41 your not a Dolly are you,i can't afford to go on strike i have 6 investment houses to pay off blah blah blah,grow a back bone and be a man,be a man.
All these threats of them about off shoring Syd H.M if we don't except their terms which we did and they still shut it down,and now look at the **** their in:ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh:

Six replies, five insults/abuses,

You guys are predictable as ever.
Am I mgt stooge- No I will fight when I think we can win.
Have I ever worked for another organisation- in my 25 years in aviation (19 of them as a Lame) I have worked in a number of airlines and MRO's.
I am not scared or protecting my investment properties simply trying to make ends meet. I have seen the devstation of long industrial disputes first hand overseas, its not a nice thing!
Of the people who have posted how many of you are not from line maintenance angling for your grade 12 while the guys in heavy struggle along on their 5 or 6.

If you get to stick it up your bosses thats all that matters to you

YES
 

This day is called the Feast of Crispian: He that outlives this day, and comes safe home, Will stand a-tiptoe when the day is named, And rouse him at the name of Crispian. He that shall see this day and live t'old age, Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours, And say "To-morrow is Saint Crispian": Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars And say "These wounds I had on Crispin's day." Old men forget: yet all shall be forgot, But he'll remember with advantages What feats he did that day.

so whats your point, are we to shed blood and become a band of brothers?

About Time
 

Good to see the tide is turning. The $$$ at the big red rat have been going backwards for years, unlike the profits!!!!

Fighting for your survival, rubbish. Who has the manpower and capacity just waiting around for QF to unload their fleet on. No one. There are shortages of manpower world wide.

Give it your best shot now, as you will only have to contemplate the same in 5 years.

And yes, there is life after QF, lovin it.

SP.

Why don’t engineers get a bonus every time an A/C departs on time.

Sounds fair to me, GD & Co get one for just doing their job!

L ets
A ve
M urrays
E ntrails

section 41
don't worry fella, these clowns would send the work offshore in
a heartbeat if there was a cheaper / available option.
Its the bluff they use on us every time.
And just because you are in heavy doesn't mean you are
on your own. We get threatened daily with jetstar , john holland,
Easa b1/b2 , 380 ,losing customers , and tiger air is coming
blah blah ect and so on!!!!
Now I came to think of it it was easy back in heavy 'cause
they only used to threaten sending the work offshore.
FACT these F**KWITS running the show have ballsed things up soooo
bad that all they have left is to blame the union and the workforce.
You are no company stooge, just concerned for you job , and
rightly so.
However SP has been a major pain in the ass to muz and co.
and he has bone some really good work so far.
Now is the time to take them on and expose them for the
lying frauds they are!!!! That is how to save your job
Keep the faith

M FIDDLES WHILST ACS BURNS.

For those who don’t know, today and tomorrow, all members of the ACS supervisory structure have downed tools(pens) to attend M’s latest Leadership Forum, or “Love in” as they’ve become known. I’m sure everyone’s having a great time hunkered down in The Airport Hilton, surrounded by “Intelligent Space” and “ACS core values”, with every word, speech and group hugging exercise being carried out/performed with “Strategy Map II principles” as a guide. A laugh a minute I’m sure! Oh and before we get going don’t forget the safety brief on how to exit the room if anything untoward should happen. I hope a risk assessment or at a minimum, a safety observation was carried out before hand.

All the DE’s and foreman have dutifully succumbed to M’s fear campaign of “there will be ‘consequences’ for non attendance” Ha ha ha, what did you all think would happen if you pulled a sickie and didn’t front? I wonder if everyone completed the required homework before attendance at kindergarten this morning? Yep, that’s right…. homework – every student must complete their own personal “Leadership plan” and bring it along for marking. I’m sure M is under the false assumption that people who fix aircraft for a living actually like being a part of this crap. Good thing though is that once a LAME, always a LAME and the built in scepticism and distrust of anything sprouted by M will be in plentiful supply. Sure there are the “Yes” men who will outwardly go along with whatever the latest agenda/stuff up is but I think the silent majority will all be bored to tears and count the seconds until it’s all over.

The word on the street is the real agenda is an attempt to get the supervisor’s “on board” in support of the company’s paltry EBA offer. Try and get the DE’s and foreman to sing the praises of the EBA to the ‘troops’. How do you do this? Well, what was in the offer? – basically not much for the troops but a nice sweetener of an increase for all the supervisor/higher duty allowances and some movement of quota positions that only affect or are of benefit to those at the ‘top end of the tree’
At the same time keep the engine of the fear campaign running at full rev’s. i.e “consequences” for non attendance, we can’t compete with other MRO’s, our wages are “unsustainable”, more than a 3% increase would cause the sky to fall in, John Holland is on the horizon, etc,etc,etc. All the same old crappy propaganda cranked out again at EBA time.

The 3rd floor probably know the LAME’s have had enough over the years and now want some real recognition in the form of a “fair and decent” pay rise from the current EBA. They know the past methods and pathetic powerpoint sales jobs from the likes of the Fat Controller will no longer ‘cut it’. They even reached for the cupboard straight away to bring out that old faithful “If this isn’t voted in you risk having the back pay taken away”. Not even a little to and fro – BORING. They know it’s an impossible job to sell us this turd so therefore the latest efforts to get the supervisor’s “on board” in an attempt to sell it from within and avoid the upcoming industrial action –can’t wait till January! After all, as part of the ‘ACS Leadership Team’ one of your tasks is to lead the boys in a way which is in keeping with the ‘corporate’ line. One of the DE’s in syd has already been down ‘on the floor’ warning the boys about the consequences of their vote and playing up the fear campaign No doubt all those in attendance will be threatened with all manner of consequences if they don’t carry out higher duties or do overtime when the action starts. Good old divisive tactics – I for one have faith that the majority currently soaking up M’s crap will not take the bait or the fear from above and wholeheartedly be a part of any action should it become necessary/imperative. Remember guys, if it comes down to it, you will be involved in legally sanctioned action, approved by the Australian Industrial Relations Commission in an effort to improve your working conditions – no more, no less.

Of course, the membership of the Association may decide not to begin action, 50% of the membership must vote, and 50% of the return must be in favour of action for it to be lawful. To my mind there is ‘that feeling’ in the air at the moment that the vote will be for action. A bit like that feeling in the air before the recent federal election, however substitute M for Little Johnny. There are so many people disengaged from any form of management at the moment it’s laughable, and those LAME badges now have a bigger and bigger following – I’m seeing them on more and more vests. Ha ha ha.

Once all the supervisors are back, let's see which ones will be having 'informal' meetings, walk arounds and "chat's with the boys" while singing from M's songsheet. It will be interesting - a word of warning to those who try it on, the boys won't be listening and they'll see straight through you. After all, where are all the great improvements that were supposed to come from the last round of love-in's, which took the form of a 'Deliverance' style river trip?

I’m strapped in and ready to go…….. waiting by the letterbox for my ballot paper and looking forward to it. Bring it on.


P.S. For those at the “Love In” be warned about being tempted to slip down the road to the Rowers for a few cold ones. One of M’s first tasks after moving into the 3rd floor was to sack four of your co-workers for this very offence. He’s not a ‘fan’ of drinking and you may still be classed as being ‘at work’ in a legal sense. If you can’t resist the temptation , keep your eye out for Managers son’s who may just be lurking in licenced premises with a camera phone. Hey, there might even be random testing in the morning in accordance with policy. Stay under 0.02% fella’s !!

Great post Big M :ok:

Im not sure if our 3 brainwashed DMM's would bother giving us
a run down afterwards as they know they will be laughed out of the room.
We never listen to them at the best of times and hopefully one of them
will be leaving for ADL very soon.
PER cant wait for the vote!
SP keep up the great work!

Oh dear,
Big M, if everything you posted wasn't so true, I would laugh. Unfortunately, all you said is very close to the mark. You did however forget to mention "Crossing the bridge of trust"

:ok:

Nice one Big M
 

Yes Big M, well said! Everyone knows this is an uncompetitive EBA offer. Surely the company must know that when they try to recruit the front line supervisory staff to sell the deal, any hard earned respect and goodwill that a supervisor has with his staff is immediately evaporated as soon as he or she starts to spruik the substandard deal. I guess this just another tactic from QE to try and avoid the inevitable. Unfortunately it is wasted time at this stage. The supers would have been better off staying on the job and getting planes out. Luckily for us the majority of the membership are not in M’s Leadership Team. Good to hear Sydney and Perth are ready. I can tell you BNE is itchin. Anyone know how MEL is looking?

This post is interesting in that it vilifies Section 41 for having an opion and quotes the Bard as if the Asn is engaging in a battle.
Why hasn't any of the posters questioned the salary of the Fed Sec especially since as of the redundacies he is no longer in the employ of the Aircraft Industry.
The ALAEA is not the Aircraft industry it is merely an instrumentality of the business.
Much like the Salvos are part of the Stock market.
We all question the executive salaries of Airline Management but the Non for profit Organisation salary structure of an employee funded institution should remain unquestioned.
Not for profit means no Tax I'm sure we would all like to enjoy that privelege.

The previous to last Fed Sec D.K. was castigated for his held postiton by this one but of course passing judgement of things of the past are not in the current context.
Since we are into quoting the Bard "No man can sit in judgement over those who have ruled before him unless he too his judged by himself" As you like it.

Sa