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Qantas SH EBA negotiations

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Old 16th May 2024, 21:48
  #141 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by High_To_Low
I get the protections involved with having a base of 62hr (verse 53.4hr) but other than COVID everyone is doing > 62hr every BP so is it really a 12.3% payrise? Yes it’s guaranteed rather than the possibility of losing work and dropping down into the 50’s but I don’t know many SH pilots on less than 65hr and that’s those who keep there heads down and don’t chase the work.
Exactly this, what are we actually getting? I'd be surprised if once the 321 arrives and "LH" flying starts on that airframe you could even be realistically rostered to 53.4 hours. Perhaps you could, but you certainly wouldn't be working much - which I don't think the company would like. It seems like an own goal unless the hourly rate also increases proportionately.
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Old 16th May 2024, 21:48
  #142 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by High_To_Low
I get the protections involved with having a base of 62hr (verse 53.4hr) but other than COVID everyone is doing > 62hr every BP so is it really a 12.3% payrise? Yes it’s guaranteed rather than the possibility of losing work and dropping down into the 50’s but I don’t know many SH pilots on less than 65hr and that’s those who keep there heads down and don’t chase the work.
I was thinking about this a bit more and came to the same conclusion. It’s really only a bump to the base salary which, as you pointed out, isn’t really an impactful change given everyone is on over that 99% of the time anyway. I guess it would impact annual leave pay and that’s about it.
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Old 16th May 2024, 21:55
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Originally Posted by goodtimeNOTalongtime
I guess it would impact annual leave pay and that’s about it.
And hardly that given everyones average credit is well above.
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Old 16th May 2024, 22:01
  #144 (permalink)  
 
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Ok so i’m not going crazy then…I thought I’d missed something.
yes it’ll help out our Div 3 pilots regarding there super calcs but for those of us on SG it also does nothing for our super (provided we continue to fly the hours we are currently flying).
all it is is a guaranteed pay rise but other than that I don’t anticipate any extra pay going into my bank account each fortnight ….unless I’ve completely misread the AIPA update
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Old 16th May 2024, 22:02
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Originally Posted by DirectAnywhere
4 hrs pay for reserve isn’t going to cut it. There needs to be additional credits for a callout……..

……… There still doesn’t appear to be a fix for domestic slips of less than 36 hrs which create those lovely 3 day DRW patterns for 8 hrs pay which everyone enjoys so much.
-There will be higher minimum call out hours
-Any slip>30hrs domestic and international attracts av credit.

clearly you didn’t read the AIPA email or you’re not a member
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Old 16th May 2024, 22:14
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Originally Posted by A320 Flyer
-There will be higher minimum call out hours
-Any slip>30hrs domestic and international attracts av credit.

clearly you didn’t read the AIPA email or you’re not a member
Tell me where in the emails it details the additional credits payable for reserve callouts? Some additional credit has been rumoured, nothing more, and, like I said above, not quantified yet.

Where do those emails detail that RM36.2.4 has been amended to 30 hrs from 36 as you state above? There IS a suggestion the same clause will be applied to domestic patterns. However, what will that do for those DRW patterns with a BOC return and 24 hr slip that appear in open time weekly because they’re so loathed?

Unless there is a serious attempt at MDC those will stay as is.

Please don’t accuse me of being something I’m not either. It’s low and unnecessarily personal.

Last edited by DirectAnywhere; 17th May 2024 at 00:15.
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Old 16th May 2024, 22:20
  #147 (permalink)  
 
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You are right, an MGH increase to 62 hours (for instance) doesn’t equate to a pay rise in itself. I don’t remember doing less than 65 hours a BP.
However, the reserve payments are likely to be a passive credit, so you are getting an extra 12 hours (or 15 if called out on every one with new min call out of 5 hrs). So the real new min pay for 2/3rds of the rotation is 72 or 75 hours.
I’ve definitely been paid less than that on multiple BP’s.
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Old 16th May 2024, 22:38
  #148 (permalink)  
 
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The questions that need to be answered by circumventing the silly wage policy..
  • Does this make up for CPI over the last few years and does it compound >CPI for the years after that?
  • Is there any net increase for year 1 payscale for those starting after the EA is signed? It already looks like every other EA where a newstarts are left behind.
  • Does any net benefit outside of the pay freeze accumulate super?

At a minimum I would want a yes for all of these questions.
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Old 17th May 2024, 00:32
  #149 (permalink)  
 
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Just vote it down. Nothing to lose.

See what they come back with after over 90% of us vote no.
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Old 17th May 2024, 01:30
  #150 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Beer Baron
However, the reserve payments are likely to be a passive credit, so you are getting an extra 12 hours (or 15 if called out on every one with new min call out of 5 hrs). So the real new min pay for 2/3rds of the rotation is 72 or 75 hours.
If that’s the case (not confirmed yet) then effectively it’s a 6% pay rise over a planning divisor of 68hrs, even if you aren’t called, or a 4% pay rise over an average year.
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Old 17th May 2024, 02:02
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Originally Posted by DirectAnywhere
Tell me where in the emails it details the additional credits payable for reserve callouts? Some additional credit has been rumoured, nothing more, and, like I said above, not quantified yet.

Where do those emails detail that RM36.2.4 has been amended to 30 hrs from 36 as you state above? There IS a suggestion the same clause will be applied to domestic patterns. However, what will that do for those DRW patterns with a BOC return and 24 hr slip that appear in open time weekly because they’re so loathed?

Unless there is a serious attempt at MDC those will stay as is.

Please don’t accuse me of being something I’m not either. It’s low and unnecessarily personal.
I’ve actually picked up the phone and called AIPA SH EA team. I suggest you do the same…. If you are a member.

Obviously nothing is agreed until after the vote but that’s the current state of play with the negotiations.

I certainly believe any slip anywhere >\= 24hrs should have average credit. Maybe that’s where round 2 will get us. Here’s hoping.

Many of the mechanisms they’ve negotiated are things we’ve been wanting for years so I think they’re doing a great job so far.

As I said before….. marathon, not a sprint. Having said that let’s not take too long till the next downturn.
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Old 17th May 2024, 02:27
  #152 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by dr dre
If that’s the case (not confirmed yet) then effectively it’s a 6% pay rise over a planning divisor of 68hrs, even if you aren’t called, or a 4% pay rise over an average year.
Agreed. I’m not saying there are vast riches in it, simply showing that it offsets a 3 or 6% pay freeze and it is just one part.
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Old 17th May 2024, 02:47
  #153 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Beer Baron
Agreed. I’m not saying there are vast riches in it, simply showing that it offsets a 3 or 6% pay freeze and it is just one part.
It definitely doesn’t offset a pay freeze. That would require an increase in the hourly rate.

What it does do is provide is a better pay floor.
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Old 17th May 2024, 03:06
  #154 (permalink)  
 
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Either way it is garbage after 10 years of going backwards.
it’s a slap in the face yet again.
way below inflation, still working for no pay (at times), half rate paxing, garbage staff travel, no bonus system.
AIPA has been talking about all of these issues…then nothing achieved.
it's a big NO from me…and everyone I’ve talked to.
PIA
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Old 17th May 2024, 03:11
  #155 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Gas Chamber
Either way it is garbage after 10 years of going backwards.
it’s a slap in the face yet again.
way below inflation, still working for no pay (at times), half rate paxing, garbage staff travel, no bonus system.
AIPA has been talking about all of these issues…then nothing achieved.
it's a big NO from me…and everyone I’ve talked to.
PIA
All points I hope we can address in the final agreement when it’s voted on. If it takes PIA then I’m in…. I know most are.

We are moving in the right direction though.
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Old 17th May 2024, 05:22
  #156 (permalink)  
 
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Ask any MEL FO how many hours they got rostered this month.. any increase to MGH is a win.

I'm not suggesting it's worth voting up on that alone, but lets also not trash can it completely.
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Old 17th May 2024, 05:27
  #157 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Give it the herbs
Ask any MEL FO how many hours they got rostered this month.. any increase to MGH is a win.

I'm not suggesting it's worth voting up on that alone, but lets also not trash can it completely.
What are the MEL guys averaging each roster?
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Old 17th May 2024, 07:51
  #158 (permalink)  
 
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Having said that let’s not take too long till the next downturn.
I think this point is understated - don't muck around, or you'll miss the boat.
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Old 17th May 2024, 08:26
  #159 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by A320 Flyer
All points I hope we can address in the final agreement when it’s voted on. If it takes PIA then I’m in…. I know most are.

We are moving in the right direction though.
Most FOs….maybe. But not most CPTs. Looooooong way to go before I’ll be participating in any PIA. And it would have to be pretty dire for me to go down that path.
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Old 17th May 2024, 08:57
  #160 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sameoldsameold
Most FOs….maybe. But not most CPTs. Looooooong way to go before I’ll be participating in any PIA. And it would have to be pretty dire for me to go down that path.
Why? They’ve been sticking it to you for years
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