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Another day, another QF incident

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Another day, another QF incident

Old 25th Jan 2023, 00:45
  #101 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by No Idea Either
Is AD to PH really EDTO? Didnít think it was that far off the coast. Couldnít they just re-route a bit closer pending the fuel on board? Seems a bit strange to me.
it isnít but 6 years ago it changed from 90 to 60 mins to align with ICAO.
now on many Bight routes we have all the EDTO palaver for circa 5 mins of EDTO.
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Old 25th Jan 2023, 01:03
  #102 (permalink)  
 
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Forrest is usually nominated as a suitable alternate so that ETOPs is not required. No one in their right mind would divert there but it ticks the boxes. Possibly FRT was not available on that day and the crew simply overlooked that the ETOPs entry was required.
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Old 25th Jan 2023, 01:10
  #103 (permalink)  
 
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The aircraft involved was an A330. So using Forrest and Ayres Rock may not be options?
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Old 25th Jan 2023, 01:46
  #104 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Capt Fathom
The aircraft involved was an A330. So using Forrest and Ayres Rock may not be options?
Ayers Rock is not an approved A330 airport and Forrest is laughable.

Plus, even if the A330 could land at Forrest, EDTO rules stipulate that you canít just park on the runway and close the airport.
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Old 25th Jan 2023, 04:51
  #105 (permalink)  
 
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Arhhhhhh……..A330, that explains a lot.
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Old 25th Jan 2023, 11:01
  #106 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by morno
Ayers Rock is not an approved A330 airport and Forrest is laughable.

Plus, even if the A330 could land at Forrest, EDTO rules stipulate that you canít just park on the runway and close the airport.
not any more they donít.
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Old 29th Jan 2023, 09:31
  #107 (permalink)  
 
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They're certainly on a roll!

Qantas flight from Sydney to Coffs Harbour is forced to turn back (msn.com)
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Old 29th Jan 2023, 09:41
  #108 (permalink)  
 
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Those are my favourite kind of turn-back: the ones done ďdramaticallyĒ.

Last edited by Lead Balloon; 29th Jan 2023 at 10:26.
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Old 29th Jan 2023, 10:54
  #109 (permalink)  
 
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Wouldnít it be great if the Pilot Unions approached the media and offered an insight into why these turn backs occur (and have occurred for the entirety of commercial aviations existence) by appearing on the Tele/radio interviews and talked up the professionalism, skills and safety first approach that is regularly displayed by Australiaís Professional Pilots.

The need for continued respect and support for Pilots many of whom suffered significant financial strain over the past few years due to ĎCovidí and overly and unnecessary aggressive cost cutting by the large airlines stagnating a Pilots wage yet they continue to strive to be the safest ensuring Aussie families are safe whilst on an Aussie airline.
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Old 29th Jan 2023, 10:58
  #110 (permalink)  
 
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Media don’t care about the truth. It needs to be dramatic to satisfy the appetite of the advertisers. $$$$.
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Old 29th Jan 2023, 12:05
  #111 (permalink)  
 
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Wouldn't work. They see a potential story, and they'll jump right at it, whether or not it is wrong to do so.
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Old 29th Jan 2023, 20:03
  #112 (permalink)  
 
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Youíd be taken out of context and selectively edited. Explaining nuanced things to the general public with the attention span of a gnat will never work.

those with long enough memories will remember when the media of the day chose one airline and reported everything like this and the other got none. It was QF for a while, then AN. then back to QF.

This spotlight will fade. Hopefully soon.
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Old 30th Jan 2023, 01:45
  #113 (permalink)  
 
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This article informs rather than sensationalises.

https://www.traveller.com.au/how-far...-engine-h29hg8
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Old 30th Jan 2023, 03:19
  #114 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by compressor stall
Youíd be taken out of context and selectively edited. Explaining nuanced things to the general public with the attention span of a gnat will never work.

those with long enough memories will remember when the media of the day chose one airline and reported everything like this and the other got none. It was QF for a while, then AN. then back to QF.

This spotlight will fade. Hopefully soon.
True. It's not that long since Virgin had that nose-wheel detach and roll into the grass, they were alerted to it by a Qantas crew passing them on an adjacent taxiway. Then ensued weeks of nit picking BS directed at VA for things that were so laughably minor that watching paint dry was more interesting.

It's not just the mindless reporting of insignificant BS though, would the media please buy some f--king dictionaries or at least Roget's Thesaurus - EVERY article or report starting with the boilerplate weasel words of "Was FORCED to turn back...." "It COMES AFTER..." and "The Pilot MANAGED to land the aircraft safely...."

It sounds moronic. I can handle the idiocy of the reporting but these catchphrases that are trotted out makes it seem as though the entire media establishment couldn't manage a brain between them or at the very least, a vocabulary.

It's not just aviation though. The media is equally moronic with other reporting - one politician never attacks another they 'slam' them, an upcoming stint of bad weather apparently has the entire population of the affected area "BRACING" for the weather. While we're on that subject, it used to be called 'weather', we never needed to add 'event' on the end of everything. Like I've said before, it's like the moronic use of the word 'space'. It isn't the aviation industry anymore, it's the 'aviation space'. If that is a valid use of the word, why don't they, when talking about NASA or Space-X say 'the space space'??

Don't know what is taught in English classes now but it isn't the English Language I remember. Order a coffee at Maccas and the response or direction to 'park to the left' is almost unrecognisable as English and is more of a continuous grumbling drawl.
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Old 30th Jan 2023, 03:52
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Originally Posted by AerialPerspective
Don't know what is taught in English classes now but it isn't the English Language I remember. Order a coffee at Maccas and the response or direction to 'park to the left' is almost unrecognisable as English and is more of a continuous grumbling drawl.
It's no longer English. It's more focused on learning about human experiences, or figuring out what authors meant when they wrote a sentence in a particular page, or analysing a bunch of Shakespeare plays, or writing an essay about some random movie. The 'English' in English classes is virtually non-existent. They don't teach how to have correct grammar, punctuation, or how to sound more advanced when you are writing or speaking, all in an effort to avoid offending someone. It's one of the many things that make the education system a disgrace.

Last edited by VHOED191006; 30th Jan 2023 at 04:03.
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Old 30th Jan 2023, 10:20
  #116 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by VHOED191006
It's no longer English. It's more focused on learning about human experiences, or figuring out what authors meant when they wrote a sentence in a particular page, or analysing a bunch of Shakespeare plays, or writing an essay about some random movie. The 'English' in English classes is virtually non-existent. They don't teach how to have correct grammar, punctuation, or how to sound more advanced when you are writing or speaking, all in an effort to avoid offending someone. It's one of the many things that make the education system a disgrace.
I agree with you.

My daughter was doing a Year 10 assignment related to a book she had to read. She found the questions confusing and working out what the task was - her mother and I (although separated for 11 years) always placed a priority with the kids on reading and comprehension and spent time telling them about words and their meaning, both of the kids in tests when they were in primary school came back with reading ages 4-6 years beyond their age. At 14 my eldest was reading the Memoirs of Ulysses S Grant and had also read Colin McLaren's excellent book about the JFK Assassination 'the fatal shot' I think it is called.

Anyway, I read the bloody instructions 4 times and couldn't make any sense out of what they were asking, sounded like a lot of weasel words strung together with bad grammar and spelling to me - I consider myself reasonably well read and it helps I have a pretty good memory for things I'm interested in, such as reciting speeches made by famous people from beginning to end and this was just not logical. I'd almost go as far as saying the report questions were written by a moron who shouldn't be teaching anything. Earlier in High School when I'd help the kids with their homework, I'd sometimes, just for sh-ts and giggles, send the homework assignment instructions back with all the teacher's spelling errors corrected and grammar as well.

People will say "Oh, what does it matter if you know what they meant". Well, it DOES matter because in many industries and dare I say it in critical places like a war zone and even diplomacy, understanding and precision MATTERS. Anyone remember "Four Greens" being misheard as "All Greens"?? Minor example but I often think of that example "Last night I had my parents for dinner" to illustrate why grammar matters.
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Old 30th Jan 2023, 11:27
  #117 (permalink)  
 
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an upcoming stint of bad weather apparently has the entire population of the affected area "BRACING" for the weather. While we're on that subject, it used to be called 'weather', we never needed to add 'event' on the end of everything.
Be thankful it was just a Weather Event and not another Rain Bomb.

(Part of the problem with the English syllabus seems to be that pretty much everything is now a text, and has to be deconstructed. The poor kids are so busy deconstructing Simpsons episodes and the backs of chip packets that they donít get much of a chance to learn about spelling and punctuation.)
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Old 30th Jan 2023, 13:03
  #118 (permalink)  
 
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Apologies for continuing the thread drift; but I struggle to understand why, just after an ‘unprecedented weather event’, people are being, or have been ‘evacuated’. What is the fascination with having enemas after such an event?
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Old 30th Jan 2023, 13:19
  #119 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by AerialPerspective
She found the questions confusing and working out what the task was - her mother and I (although separated for 11 years) always placed a priority with the kids on reading and comprehension and spent time telling them about words and their meaning, both of the kids in tests when they were in primary school came back with reading ages 4-6 years beyond their age.

At 14 my eldest was reading the Memoirs of Ulysses S Grant and had also read Colin McLaren's excellent book about the JFK Assassination 'the fatal shot' I think it is called.

Anyway, I read the bloody instructions 4 times and couldn't make any sense out of what they were asking, sounded like a lot of weasel words strung together with bad grammar and spelling to me - I consider myself reasonably well read and it helps I have a pretty good memory for things I'm interested in, such as reciting speeches made by famous people from beginning to end and this was just not logical.
Oh, the irony. I read your post but had to start at the beginning again a number of times in an effort to understand it. I quoted the three worst "sentences" above. I saw nothing wrong with your spelling but the problem is variously the absence of punctuation, mis-use of punctuation including the dash symbol, blending of numerous sentences together into long, woefully incorrect sentences, absence of words in sentences, and that favourite old chestnut the dangling preposition, an example of which is you wrote "...for things I'm interested in" instead of "...for things in which I'm interested."

I strongly agree with the point of your very last statement: grammar does matter.
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Old 30th Jan 2023, 18:36
  #120 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Eclan
Oh, the irony ... I strongly agree with the point of your very last statement: grammar does matter.
The irony indeed, Eclan; from a grammatical perspective, your diatribe is little better than that of AerialPerspective.

When I read Aerial's post I noted a number of the points you mentioned. However I decided that as it was conversational English, as opposed to instructional English, it mattered little. In this case his or her point was well made and, compared to some other posts I've seen grace the pages of PPRuNe, their transgressions were minor.

I get your humour, it certainly raised a chuckle here, but the thrust of various posts relating to education and the confusion that can arise from poor sentence construction should not be lost.

That said I don't especially agree with VHOED191006's inference that comprehension is unimportant. As students we analyse Shakespeare's prose in order to learn the subtleties of the language, and how to interpret what people are saying. To my mind without this we'd be in a worse mess when it comes to deciphering the intent of written instruction, and we might as well give up on funny repartee such as that of twentyelevens, itsnotthatbloodyhard, and yours.

FP.

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