Sing Air ponders domestic route
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eisle s
It's pretty academic now that Sydney access is on hold, but I understand the concept was to provide premium business and economy class - no first class.
There is no doubt that pissed off / frustrated customers from QF and Virgin would have provided substantial A320/1 loads up and down the east coast and across to PER.
On the BNE terminal side; exactly what has Virgin leased? From memory, there are far more gates available than Virgin could use.
It's pretty academic now that Sydney access is on hold, but I understand the concept was to provide premium business and economy class - no first class.
There is no doubt that pissed off / frustrated customers from QF and Virgin would have provided substantial A320/1 loads up and down the east coast and across to PER.
On the BNE terminal side; exactly what has Virgin leased? From memory, there are far more gates available than Virgin could use.
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Eisle just to clarify a few points.
VB has not purchased the terminal at BNE it presently leases less than 50% of the capacity there.
Adelaide same deal only using a few gates, and the new terminal which will be common user is on the way.
Sydney, who knows i just can't see operators being able to lock up the infastructure, commen user being the most likely outcome as per part of the QF deal at SYD.
VB has not purchased the terminal at BNE it presently leases less than 50% of the capacity there.
Adelaide same deal only using a few gates, and the new terminal which will be common user is on the way.
Sydney, who knows i just can't see operators being able to lock up the infastructure, commen user being the most likely outcome as per part of the QF deal at SYD.
Evertonian
Ok. Hypothetically, IF SQ get something going here, I doubt that Terminal space will be an issue. SQ & DJ via ANZ were going to go against QF together until Dick tore up the cheque. That plan could still be in place.
Whichever way you look at this, SQ WILL get into bed with DJ in one way or another, it just depends how up front they want to appear.
Whichever way you look at this, SQ WILL get into bed with DJ in one way or another, it just depends how up front they want to appear.
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
How about SQ and Air New Zealand? 
"God Forbid it!", the ex-An'ers cry.
Sorry guys and gals, but for MY money that presents a far better option for SQ (and Air Sheep).
I'm not trying to be abrasive by that statement, but merely ask YOU to consider what YOU would do if YOU were SQ.
QANTAS is in a strong financial position and would almost certainly want to dictate the rules to SIA.
SIA will want to be The Boss, in any venture/merger they enter into. QANTAS does NOT give them that option.
On the other side of the coin is Air New Zealand. They have an old fleet, and are in desperate need of a BIG injection (or use of someone else's equipment) to move forward.
In spite of their recent bonus payment to staff, I'll BET that this was a "power play" by Air New Zealand upper management to try to get more say in the running of their airline WHEN it is taken over.
New Zealand (Gov't and shareholders) simply don't have the BIG $$$'s needed.
Air New Zealand has access to all of the international routes that SIA are interested in obtaining over the next 10-20 years.
Air New Zealand also has access to Australian domestic routes.
That's MY call.
I'd be buying Air New Zealand shares if I were you, as once SQ enters there, the value will at least triple.
"God Forbid it!", the ex-An'ers cry.
Sorry guys and gals, but for MY money that presents a far better option for SQ (and Air Sheep).
I'm not trying to be abrasive by that statement, but merely ask YOU to consider what YOU would do if YOU were SQ.
QANTAS is in a strong financial position and would almost certainly want to dictate the rules to SIA.
SIA will want to be The Boss, in any venture/merger they enter into. QANTAS does NOT give them that option.
On the other side of the coin is Air New Zealand. They have an old fleet, and are in desperate need of a BIG injection (or use of someone else's equipment) to move forward.
In spite of their recent bonus payment to staff, I'll BET that this was a "power play" by Air New Zealand upper management to try to get more say in the running of their airline WHEN it is taken over.
New Zealand (Gov't and shareholders) simply don't have the BIG $$$'s needed.
Air New Zealand has access to all of the international routes that SIA are interested in obtaining over the next 10-20 years.
Air New Zealand also has access to Australian domestic routes.
That's MY call.
I'd be buying Air New Zealand shares if I were you, as once SQ enters there, the value will at least triple.
Evertonian
How about SQ and Air New Zealand?
I guess you must be referring to SQ/ANZ operating domestically in OZ. Sounds plausible to me, but would Joe Q fork out the hard earned to fly with them? Both are carrying a potential "legacy" over the AN demise & I'm sure QF & DJ wouldn't let the punters forget. Probably cheaper to set up too!
And, before you ask, no, I wouldn't apply!
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SQ won't be buying seriously into Air NZ any time soon.
The most likely scenario is for SQ to have some sort of commercial tie up with Virgin and QF to buy into Air NZ.
This would still mean a "new" full service carrier. But it would be tied commercially to Virgin. This would be QF's worst nightmare, having to compete once again on a more level playing field.
The other advantage of this scenario is that any issues over terminal access would evaporate, with Virgin and the "full service" carrier sharing gates Australia wide.
It would leave Virgin Blue intact as a low cost operation, but with the capacity to expand and compete directly against QF's Australian Airlines as it unfolds it's domestic network next year.
Corrigan can see huge dollars in this. Why was he in Singapore recently? You can bet it wasn't just to see the sights.
The doctor will aslo be fairly keen to retire with at least one successful deal under his belt.
The most likely scenario is for SQ to have some sort of commercial tie up with Virgin and QF to buy into Air NZ.
This would still mean a "new" full service carrier. But it would be tied commercially to Virgin. This would be QF's worst nightmare, having to compete once again on a more level playing field.
The other advantage of this scenario is that any issues over terminal access would evaporate, with Virgin and the "full service" carrier sharing gates Australia wide.
It would leave Virgin Blue intact as a low cost operation, but with the capacity to expand and compete directly against QF's Australian Airlines as it unfolds it's domestic network next year.
Corrigan can see huge dollars in this. Why was he in Singapore recently? You can bet it wasn't just to see the sights.
The doctor will aslo be fairly keen to retire with at least one successful deal under his belt.
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Singapore In terminal Talks ??? Branson what next?
Branson prepares the shock tactics
31.08.2002
SYDNEY - He did it against British Airways. Now flamboyant British billionaire Richard Branson is bringing his shock PR tactics to bear on an Australian bank he says wants too much money to let him use a Sydney airport terminal it owns.
In a campaign reminiscent of the "No Way BA-AA" that emblazoned the tailfins of Virgin Atlantic aircraft when the British giant and American Airlines were mulling a tie-up, Branson vowed to paint "Macquarie - what a bunch of bankers" on his local Virgin Blue fleet.
He accused Sydney Airport of backing away from a handshake agreement on access fees to the terminal of collapsed Ansett Australia before the airport was bought by a Macquarie Bank-led consortium for A$5.6 billion.
"If we give in to this sort of extortion, the costs of this airline will go up, and if the costs of the airline go up, air fares will go up and that's something we won't let happen," Branson, 52, said.
"Macquarie, stop the Sydney airport rort" will be another slogan carried in an aggressive campaign to embarrass Macquarie.
Sydney Airports Corp wants to run the second terminal as a common user facility, leaving space for any new entrants.
Qantas, which operates out of the other main terminal, has agreed to take six slots in the 18-gate terminal and SAC spokesman Peter Gibbs says talks are taking place with Singapore Airlines.
Virgin Blue is 50 per cent owned by Australian firm Patrick Corp.
- REUTERS
31.08.2002
SYDNEY - He did it against British Airways. Now flamboyant British billionaire Richard Branson is bringing his shock PR tactics to bear on an Australian bank he says wants too much money to let him use a Sydney airport terminal it owns.
In a campaign reminiscent of the "No Way BA-AA" that emblazoned the tailfins of Virgin Atlantic aircraft when the British giant and American Airlines were mulling a tie-up, Branson vowed to paint "Macquarie - what a bunch of bankers" on his local Virgin Blue fleet.
He accused Sydney Airport of backing away from a handshake agreement on access fees to the terminal of collapsed Ansett Australia before the airport was bought by a Macquarie Bank-led consortium for A$5.6 billion.
"If we give in to this sort of extortion, the costs of this airline will go up, and if the costs of the airline go up, air fares will go up and that's something we won't let happen," Branson, 52, said.
"Macquarie, stop the Sydney airport rort" will be another slogan carried in an aggressive campaign to embarrass Macquarie.
Sydney Airports Corp wants to run the second terminal as a common user facility, leaving space for any new entrants.
Qantas, which operates out of the other main terminal, has agreed to take six slots in the 18-gate terminal and SAC spokesman Peter Gibbs says talks are taking place with Singapore Airlines.
Virgin Blue is 50 per cent owned by Australian firm Patrick Corp.
- REUTERS
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Ansett revival possible
September 03, 2002
SINGAPORE Airlines could be considering a proposal to revive the collapsed Ansett airline.
Less than two week's short of the anniversary of Ansett's failure, Channel Nine tonight reported a proposal to revive the airline would be put to Singapore's board.
Singapore Airlines consultants in Australia began secretly assembling a proposal for a full domestic competitor to Qantas about six months ago, with the proposal completed about a week ago.
Sydney Airports Corporation Ltd spokesman Greg Russell told Nine he believed Singapore was serious in its Australian domestic airline bid.
"We have every reason to believe this is being considered very seriously indeed," he said.
It is believed the Singapore domestic fleet in Australia would comprise 24 Airbus aircraft.
The Singapore proposal found the Ansett brand name still had strong support among Australians.
However, Ansett lawyer Leon Zwier said tonight there had been no discussion with Singapore Airlines.
"We're not sitting down to talks ... we're not doing deals with Ansett names or parts," he said.
"Although if they want to talk to us they would be welcome."
An Ansett administrators' spokeswoman would not comment on any speculation the airline was seeking a "domestic airline solution in Australia".
September 03, 2002
SINGAPORE Airlines could be considering a proposal to revive the collapsed Ansett airline.
Less than two week's short of the anniversary of Ansett's failure, Channel Nine tonight reported a proposal to revive the airline would be put to Singapore's board.
Singapore Airlines consultants in Australia began secretly assembling a proposal for a full domestic competitor to Qantas about six months ago, with the proposal completed about a week ago.
Sydney Airports Corporation Ltd spokesman Greg Russell told Nine he believed Singapore was serious in its Australian domestic airline bid.
"We have every reason to believe this is being considered very seriously indeed," he said.
It is believed the Singapore domestic fleet in Australia would comprise 24 Airbus aircraft.
The Singapore proposal found the Ansett brand name still had strong support among Australians.
However, Ansett lawyer Leon Zwier said tonight there had been no discussion with Singapore Airlines.
"We're not sitting down to talks ... we're not doing deals with Ansett names or parts," he said.
"Although if they want to talk to us they would be welcome."
An Ansett administrators' spokeswoman would not comment on any speculation the airline was seeking a "domestic airline solution in Australia".
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SQ have their Board Meeting on the 11th and are "almost certain to give the go-ahead for an Australian operation". 24 Airbus aircraft initially, full-service. Apparently they have done market research and determined that the name "ANSETT" is still held in high regard. Lets wait and see I suppose.
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Airline silent on Ansett revival
Singapore Airlines is not confirming or denying a report that it is interested in reviving Ansett.
Channel Nine has reported that Singapore will soon consider a plan to launch a new Ansett using 24 airbus aircraft and employing around 3,000 staff.
A spokesman for Singapore Airlines says Australia is a market of interest for the airline, which operates 70 flights a week into the country.
The spokesman says Singapore is keeping its options open for the Australian market.
From ABC News
Channel Nine has reported that Singapore will soon consider a plan to launch a new Ansett using 24 airbus aircraft and employing around 3,000 staff.
A spokesman for Singapore Airlines says Australia is a market of interest for the airline, which operates 70 flights a week into the country.
The spokesman says Singapore is keeping its options open for the Australian market.
From ABC News
Bottums Up
Can someone please explain to me, why SQ would wait for a year or more to resurrect AN. All the while allowing the old customer base to erode, and QF & VB to become more entrenched?
Surely if SQ really were interested, the time would have been soon after the AN collapse, or, after M&M failed to get Tesna to proceed at the latest.
Surely if SQ really were interested, the time would have been soon after the AN collapse, or, after M&M failed to get Tesna to proceed at the latest.
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AAP
Ansett revival possible
By Karen Michelmore and Jane Williams
September 03, 2002
SINGAPORE Airlines could be considering a proposal to revive the collapsed Ansett airline.
Less than two weeks before the anniversary of Ansett's collapse, Channel Nine reported a proposal to revive the airline would be put to Singapore's board on September 11.
Singapore Airlines refused to confirm or deny the report, but said it was keeping its options open.
It stressed Australia remained an important market.
"Our position remains the same," Singapore Airlines told the AFX-Asia wire service.
"We are keeping our options open in the Australian market."
Speculation has been circulating about the entrance of a third carrier into the domestic Australian airline market for several months.
Singapore Airlines consultants in Australia began secretly assembling a proposal for a full service domestic competitor to Qantas about six months ago, with the proposal completed about a week ago.
The Nine Network said it believed the Singapore domestic fleet in Australia would comprise 24 Airbus aircraft.
Sydney Airports Corp Ltd spokesman Peter Gibbs confirmed an evaluation team had come out to look at the former Ansett terminal.
"We believe their assessment was very serious and very measured," Mr Gibbs told AAP.
"We have had ongoing discussions with them, but what they propose to do as far as setting up an airline is entirely up to the Singapore Airlines' board.
"We know nothing more than we did a couple of weeks ago."
Administrators have retained Ansett's heavy maintenance facility, a number of aircraft and a chief pilot with an air operators certificate enabling the aircraft to keep flying.
Singapore Airline was touted as the possible saviour of Ansett in the weeks before Ansett's collapsed last year when it owned a 25 per cent interest of Ansett's parent company Air New Zealand.
Later that year Singapore Airlines agreed to help Ansett administrators set up a viable business proposition for potential buyers.
It also agreed to speak to Lindsay Fox and Solomon Lew about taking on a role with Tesna, the pair's failed bid to relaunch the carrier.
Singapore Airlines is a member of the world's major airline team-up, the Star Alliance, which was left without an Australian domestic connection when alliance partner Air New Zealand cut Ansett adrift.
Ansett lawyer Leon Zwier said tonight there had been no discussion with Singapore Airlines, although talks "would be welcome".
An Ansett administrators' spokeswoman would not comment on any speculation the airline was seeking a "domestic airline solution in Australia".
An analyst said a third airline did not make commercial sense.
"There is a general sense out there that it is complete commercial madness for them to give it a go, but that has never stopped people in the past," he told AAP.
"The whole market is pretty well served at the moment."
Qantas shares were 12 cents lower today at $4.15.
AAP
Dow Jones 11:14 AEST
[Dow Jones] SIA spokesman offers no comment on renewed talk carrier preparing to set up domestic operations in Australia. But reiterates long-term interest in Australian market; "we are always looking at all options available for our long-term development in this market." Also denies speculation SIA has or will purchase former Ansett's domestic airline operating certificate.
Ansett revival possible
By Karen Michelmore and Jane Williams
September 03, 2002
SINGAPORE Airlines could be considering a proposal to revive the collapsed Ansett airline.
Less than two weeks before the anniversary of Ansett's collapse, Channel Nine reported a proposal to revive the airline would be put to Singapore's board on September 11.
Singapore Airlines refused to confirm or deny the report, but said it was keeping its options open.
It stressed Australia remained an important market.
"Our position remains the same," Singapore Airlines told the AFX-Asia wire service.
"We are keeping our options open in the Australian market."
Speculation has been circulating about the entrance of a third carrier into the domestic Australian airline market for several months.
Singapore Airlines consultants in Australia began secretly assembling a proposal for a full service domestic competitor to Qantas about six months ago, with the proposal completed about a week ago.
The Nine Network said it believed the Singapore domestic fleet in Australia would comprise 24 Airbus aircraft.
Sydney Airports Corp Ltd spokesman Peter Gibbs confirmed an evaluation team had come out to look at the former Ansett terminal.
"We believe their assessment was very serious and very measured," Mr Gibbs told AAP.
"We have had ongoing discussions with them, but what they propose to do as far as setting up an airline is entirely up to the Singapore Airlines' board.
"We know nothing more than we did a couple of weeks ago."
Administrators have retained Ansett's heavy maintenance facility, a number of aircraft and a chief pilot with an air operators certificate enabling the aircraft to keep flying.
Singapore Airline was touted as the possible saviour of Ansett in the weeks before Ansett's collapsed last year when it owned a 25 per cent interest of Ansett's parent company Air New Zealand.
Later that year Singapore Airlines agreed to help Ansett administrators set up a viable business proposition for potential buyers.
It also agreed to speak to Lindsay Fox and Solomon Lew about taking on a role with Tesna, the pair's failed bid to relaunch the carrier.
Singapore Airlines is a member of the world's major airline team-up, the Star Alliance, which was left without an Australian domestic connection when alliance partner Air New Zealand cut Ansett adrift.
Ansett lawyer Leon Zwier said tonight there had been no discussion with Singapore Airlines, although talks "would be welcome".
An Ansett administrators' spokeswoman would not comment on any speculation the airline was seeking a "domestic airline solution in Australia".
An analyst said a third airline did not make commercial sense.
"There is a general sense out there that it is complete commercial madness for them to give it a go, but that has never stopped people in the past," he told AAP.
"The whole market is pretty well served at the moment."
Qantas shares were 12 cents lower today at $4.15.
AAP
Dow Jones 11:14 AEST
[Dow Jones] SIA spokesman offers no comment on renewed talk carrier preparing to set up domestic operations in Australia. But reiterates long-term interest in Australian market; "we are always looking at all options available for our long-term development in this market." Also denies speculation SIA has or will purchase former Ansett's domestic airline operating certificate.
short flights long nights
Revive the name, for the perceived good will, that I can sort of understand. Revive the whole airline..........???? somehow I doubt it.
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Wed "Sydney Morning Herald"
Qantas dips on new entrant talk
September 4 2002
Singapore is tipped as wanting to take on the Flying Kangaroo - if it can find a mate, writes Mark Todd.
Rumours that a new entrant had secured terminal space at Sydney Airport as a precursor to launching a domestic service were back again yesterday. Predictably, Qantas shares were sold off on fears of what a third operator would do to the cosy duopoly the airline shares with Virgin Blue.
It's hard to see anything happening soon. Singapore Air, the most likely to set up in Australia, has a board meeting later this month. The matter will get an airing then.
But Singapore Air isn't anxious to start a business here on its Pat Malone after burning a pile of cash in Ansett. It is thought the Asian carrier is trying to sound out the views of other potential investors.
There are signs that competition is already on the rise in Asia, with Cathay Pacific last week announcing it would add flights to Melbourne and Brisbane. And Qantas has applied to boost capacity to Hong Kong.
This will pretty well lock up the Hong Kong route.
Shares in Qantas eased 12c to $4.15.
Qantas dips on new entrant talk
September 4 2002
Singapore is tipped as wanting to take on the Flying Kangaroo - if it can find a mate, writes Mark Todd.
Rumours that a new entrant had secured terminal space at Sydney Airport as a precursor to launching a domestic service were back again yesterday. Predictably, Qantas shares were sold off on fears of what a third operator would do to the cosy duopoly the airline shares with Virgin Blue.
It's hard to see anything happening soon. Singapore Air, the most likely to set up in Australia, has a board meeting later this month. The matter will get an airing then.
But Singapore Air isn't anxious to start a business here on its Pat Malone after burning a pile of cash in Ansett. It is thought the Asian carrier is trying to sound out the views of other potential investors.
There are signs that competition is already on the rise in Asia, with Cathay Pacific last week announcing it would add flights to Melbourne and Brisbane. And Qantas has applied to boost capacity to Hong Kong.
This will pretty well lock up the Hong Kong route.
Shares in Qantas eased 12c to $4.15.
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Just checking out the flights on the
DJ site under schedules,check this out:
01/9/02-26/10/02
SYD-MEL = 17 flights a day
SYD-BNE = 12 flights a day
MEL-BNE = 7 flights a day
27/10/02-29/03/03
SYD-MEL = 11 flights a day (down 6 )
SYD-BNE = 10 flights a day (down 2 )
MEL-BNE = 6 flights a day (down 1 )
Not sure whether this is due to the terminal
problem at SYD, the maitainance problem or
making way for a 3rd airline.
Wirraway
DJ site under schedules,check this out:
01/9/02-26/10/02
SYD-MEL = 17 flights a day
SYD-BNE = 12 flights a day
MEL-BNE = 7 flights a day
27/10/02-29/03/03
SYD-MEL = 11 flights a day (down 6 )
SYD-BNE = 10 flights a day (down 2 )
MEL-BNE = 6 flights a day (down 1 )
Not sure whether this is due to the terminal
problem at SYD, the maitainance problem or
making way for a 3rd airline.
Wirraway
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Wirraway,
I think thats an old schedule from October on as it does not have PER/SYD etc. No idea why they leave stuff that is not current on the site.
Try requesting a flight after Oct and see how many flights come up.
Cheers
I think thats an old schedule from October on as it does not have PER/SYD etc. No idea why they leave stuff that is not current on the site.
Try requesting a flight after Oct and see how many flights come up.
Cheers