Qantas Recruitment
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Join Date: Aug 2018
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Qantas unconscionable
My son was invited to join the Qantas future pilot program. After successfully completing the 12 week transition program at Adelaide he was told he needed to go and get 12 months experience. My son has now racked up $40,000 dollars worth of debt to fund this invitation from Qantas and lost working income during that period.. All th way along he was led to believe that upon completion he would be sent to Sydney for paid training.
Another example of of big business in Australia acting unethically. How can a corporate entity like Qantas get away with such miserable behaviour?
Another example of of big business in Australia acting unethically. How can a corporate entity like Qantas get away with such miserable behaviour?
Join Date: Jul 2013
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How can a corporate entity like Qantas get away with such miserable behaviour?
If that upsets you enough (and I see no reason why it shouldn't) I would suggest to your son that he considers a far more lucrative career than being paid a relative (and ever reducing) pittance to be insulted by professional liars and thieves and get enough cash together to fly in his spare time. For fun.
Last edited by V-Jet; 6th Aug 2018 at 22:59.
Nunc est bibendum
My son was invited to join the Qantas future pilot program. After successfully completing the 12 week transition program at Adelaide he was told he needed to go and get 12 months experience. My son has now racked up $40,000 dollars worth of debt to fund this invitation from Qantas and lost working income during that period.. All th way along he was led to believe that upon completion he would be sent to Sydney for paid training.
Another example of of big business in Australia acting unethically. How can a corporate entity like Qantas get away with such miserable behaviour?
Another example of of big business in Australia acting unethically. How can a corporate entity like Qantas get away with such miserable behaviour?
I strongly suspect your son son wasn’t invited. It’s a presumption on my part but I reckon he applied and was accepted.
How did he perform whilst there? Given the desperation of QLink to get new starters the fact he was told to go and get some experience would indicate to me that he’s either rubbed someone up the wrong way or he’s shot himself in the foot.
He knew the debt issue going in. He was always free to say ‘no’ to the ‘invitation’ but given it wasn’t really an invitation at all then he (and you) should have been eyes wide open as to how this might play out.
Now, I don’t know your son from a brick and maybe QLink have acted unconscionably in this matter but there is a part of the story that we are missing here. Care to fill in some blanks?
It’s important for everyone to understand that the QFPP is not for mainline but for QLink. They’re just using the Qantas name as a branding exercise to make it seem as though an A380 or 747 flight deck is just a couple of years away. Given that is the starting point is it any surprise when other stuff isn’t quite as it seems?
May I suggest that QantasLink isn’t desperate to “get new starters”. What they are desperate for is already type-rated pilots to minimize costs and expenditure (and some would suggest also to lock in or “sponsor” foreign pilots hoping to gain Australian citizenship).
May I suggest that QantasLink isn’t desperate to “get new starters”. What they are desperate for is already type-rated pilots to minimize costs and expenditure (and some would suggest also to lock in or “sponsor” foreign pilots hoping to gain Australian citizenship).
Qantas isn't so much 'buying' pilots, but in reality it is 'selling' Australian residency.
A bit like online piracy sites being shut down by the same government. The sites themselves were getting paid advertising from sponsors and argued they were only 'selling' a website. Movie studios argued they were in effect selling (at least facilitating) stolen goods. Selling product they hadn't created, nor paid for in essence.
Qantas will get cheaper pilots, because part of the pay deal is residency. What Qf will get away with 'paying' is more a question of what value an individual places on gaining Australian residency.
Qantas will get cheaper pilots,because part of the pay deal is residency. What Qf will get away with 'paying'is more a question of what value
If not then what is the union doing to address this?
If they are hired under the same EBA as local pilots then they will not be cheap, especially given the administrative burden for offshore visa entrants.
Join Date: Aug 2018
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Hi All
Sorry to ask this yet again but I'm new and can't seem to find out much as to what QF will put you through on the stage 2 testing in SYD. Apart from the group planning stuff etc and HR interview do they put you through a rehash of the talent Q questions?
For someone quite experienced and older are they really looking to fill the big gaps in their regional arm and its all smoke and mirrors to get you to apply or would you be considered like anyone for mainline?
Any info would be much appreciated.
thanks
Sorry to ask this yet again but I'm new and can't seem to find out much as to what QF will put you through on the stage 2 testing in SYD. Apart from the group planning stuff etc and HR interview do they put you through a rehash of the talent Q questions?
For someone quite experienced and older are they really looking to fill the big gaps in their regional arm and its all smoke and mirrors to get you to apply or would you be considered like anyone for mainline?
Any info would be much appreciated.
thanks
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How's he expected to impress his mates and his Instagram followers without shots of the cockpit along with the #dowhatyoulove #bestofficeintheworld #pilotlife tags?
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Does that 12-week course actually cost $40K? I didn’t know that.
Nevertheless, 12 months in the bush never hurt any pilot, in fact they would probably look back on it as the best 12 months of their life.
My God, in my day if someone had said go fly bush for 12 months and there’ll probably be a turbo-prop gig waiting for you at the end I would have pinched myself to see if I was dreaming...
Anyway if that was my son I would be fully encouraging him to do just that. If it does turn out to be only 12 months, he’ll mature 5 years in those 12 months and be a far better pilot for it. If he hasn’t the stomach for that then he’s probably in the wrong industry.
Some of the “Command Decisions” I had to make in the bush were much harder than anything I’ve had to deal with in over 3 decades of jet flying since.
There is a lot of negativity on this website... I still think my job is the best job in the world (and I’m nearing retirement), and I just did a 12 hour 4-sector day in a narrowbody jet. I loved my time in the bush, but it also makes me appreciate the job I have now.
So I would suggest that your son needs to either Harden The F Up and work on becoming what employers want, or get out while he’s still young.
Or is it possible that he’s not complaining, and you are just complaining on his behalf?
Nevertheless, 12 months in the bush never hurt any pilot, in fact they would probably look back on it as the best 12 months of their life.
My God, in my day if someone had said go fly bush for 12 months and there’ll probably be a turbo-prop gig waiting for you at the end I would have pinched myself to see if I was dreaming...
Anyway if that was my son I would be fully encouraging him to do just that. If it does turn out to be only 12 months, he’ll mature 5 years in those 12 months and be a far better pilot for it. If he hasn’t the stomach for that then he’s probably in the wrong industry.
Some of the “Command Decisions” I had to make in the bush were much harder than anything I’ve had to deal with in over 3 decades of jet flying since.
There is a lot of negativity on this website... I still think my job is the best job in the world (and I’m nearing retirement), and I just did a 12 hour 4-sector day in a narrowbody jet. I loved my time in the bush, but it also makes me appreciate the job I have now.
So I would suggest that your son needs to either Harden The F Up and work on becoming what employers want, or get out while he’s still young.
Or is it possible that he’s not complaining, and you are just complaining on his behalf?
Are pilots recruited from overseas not covered by the Qantas EBA?
If not then what is the union doing to address this?
If they are hired under the same EBA as local pilots then they will not be cheap, especially given the administrative burden for offshore visa entrants.
If not then what is the union doing to address this?
If they are hired under the same EBA as local pilots then they will not be cheap, especially given the administrative burden for offshore visa entrants.
they are instead giving away citizenship as a bonus rather than increasing or improving their package
The other point is how many do they really think they can get? The US is desperate for pilots and pay is increasing quickly. Maybe a few Europeans who want to try living in a warmer country and no doubt a handful of South Africans happy to GTFO. I believe that Australian airlines are kidding themselves if they think that there is a huge pool of pilots overseas who are just waiting for the chance to move to a now quite expensive Australia. We shall see.
How do their cadets get their ATPL unlocked
Qantas link are not in a position to give anyone citizenship, that would be the Australian Government. Now I have not checked the fine print but usually at the end of the visa period the person has to leave, not always as they can apply for PR. Again that is not citizenship.
The other point is how many do they really think they can get? The US is desperate for pilots and pay is increasing quickly. Maybe a few Europeans who want to try living in a warmer country and no doubt a handful of South Africans happy to GTFO. I believe that Australian airlines are kidding themselves if they think that there is a huge pool of pilots overseas who are just waiting for the chance to move to a now quite expensive Australia. We shall see.
We do not have "locked" or "frozen" ATPL in Australia.
The other point is how many do they really think they can get? The US is desperate for pilots and pay is increasing quickly. Maybe a few Europeans who want to try living in a warmer country and no doubt a handful of South Africans happy to GTFO. I believe that Australian airlines are kidding themselves if they think that there is a huge pool of pilots overseas who are just waiting for the chance to move to a now quite expensive Australia. We shall see.
We do not have "locked" or "frozen" ATPL in Australia.
That is the whole purpose of a 4 year 457 Visa. 4 years on the 457 plus a 1 year “Bridging Visa” gives you 5 years in country. You are now eligible for Permanent Residency.
You may underestimate the value many many foreigners place on Australian PR. Whilst most were not interested in a 2 year stint before returning home, there is no shortage queuing up for PR.
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Icarus2001,
4 year Temporary Skill Shortage (482) VISA plus 1 year Bridging VISA = eligible for PR
Then after 1 year PR = eligible for citizenship
Likewise, we do not have a “457 VISA” in Australia anymore
Sta5fhl, yes Jetstar have an ICUS program to enable cadets to reach their ATPL command time requirements.
4 year Temporary Skill Shortage (482) VISA plus 1 year Bridging VISA = eligible for PR
Then after 1 year PR = eligible for citizenship
Likewise, we do not have a “457 VISA” in Australia anymore
Sta5fhl, yes Jetstar have an ICUS program to enable cadets to reach their ATPL command time requirements.