Renamed & Merged: Qantas Severe Engine Damage Over Indonesia
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QF does indeed have the manpower for the inspections…..they are just choosing not to utilise a certain 20+ man section with vast expertise.
RE: Post #300
Thanks for the info HotDog but everybody let's not forget that the media are watching this page closely... compare the list in this article with HotDog's post and a copy and paste job appears clear as day!
Qantas 'scarebus' QF32 was a flying wreck | News.com.au
Perhaps keeping speculation to a minimum is best at the moment...
Thanks for the info HotDog but everybody let's not forget that the media are watching this page closely... compare the list in this article with HotDog's post and a copy and paste job appears clear as day!
Qantas 'scarebus' QF32 was a flying wreck | News.com.au
Perhaps keeping speculation to a minimum is best at the moment...
Perhaps keeping speculation to a minimum is best at the moment...
If something's appears a bit smelly and no one appears to be doing anything about it (who should) ... then why not involve a larger investigative audience?
The Sunstate Thread is a good example ...
Press conference tonight from Rolls Royce at either 1800 or 1900 Sydney time. I believe a fix will be announced. Dont know how long it will take.
You are correct. It will shut the engine down before the catastrophic failure can occur. Personally i dont think its an acceptable fix, you still have the problem that caused the failure in the first place.
If it means the operators are able to fly without worrying about the engine exploding then it is better than no fix and keeping the aircraft grounded.
If it is indeed a major design flaw airlines don't want to sit around and wait for RR to design, test and get certified a Mark II engine while their aircraft sit on the ground...
If it is indeed a major design flaw airlines don't want to sit around and wait for RR to design, test and get certified a Mark II engine while their aircraft sit on the ground...
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given the lack of success with software patches on the 380 for everything else, it hardly inspires confidence. The potential issue still remains.
Interestingly, the liklihood and consequence hardly makes this 'control' an effective mitigator. Guess the Q Risk Matrix is about to have some modifications of its own.
On non Pacific operations the question of commercial viability must also be raised as compliance with the AD will see the a/c back in the hangar potentially on a weekly basis.
Stby for the '$afety first' cliches to get another run
AT
Interestingly, the liklihood and consequence hardly makes this 'control' an effective mitigator. Guess the Q Risk Matrix is about to have some modifications of its own.
On non Pacific operations the question of commercial viability must also be raised as compliance with the AD will see the a/c back in the hangar potentially on a weekly basis.
Stby for the '$afety first' cliches to get another run
AT
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Just wondering how well an A380 climbes out on 4 engines at idle, if the software kicks in? 
At the rate they have found dud engines that is not likely but statistically quite possible.
You would hope they have some overriding management code that lets you know if one goes close to shutting down, before it actually does and then alerts you as to the state of others. Giving you time to divert.
Non Etops routes perhaps for a 4 holer
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4 burning, nothing turning!
(it appears may now be possible)
God bless the Sarah Jessica Parker!
Mon dieu, sacre bleu,
Is this now becoming the cheese eating surrender monkys revenge on the rest of the world?
(it appears may now be possible)God bless the Sarah Jessica Parker!
Mon dieu, sacre bleu,
Is this now becoming the cheese eating surrender monkys revenge on the rest of the world?
The bearing retainer for the IP shaft bearing is to be strengthened and a software patch is issued to shut the engine down if "something" occurs.
Guessing between the lines from the newspaper article; It sounds like RR apparently had already redesigned the bearing retainer/box/housing probably because it was aware that it was distorting under load and allowing oil to get where it wasn't supposed to be in some circumstances.
No problems with that, modifications happen all the time as experience accumulates. The part concerned is probably an elegant tracery of Inconel that might just be a poofteenth too thin..
QF engine that failed apparently didn't have this mod, which probably suggests that RR didn't think it was that critical.
Considering that QF apparently no longer even has the engineering skills to modify a cockpit door lock (Dash 400), and that the A380 engines are owned by RR, QF merely paying a low hourly charge for their use, would there be anyone at Qantas who even knew that RR was having problems with this engine? Would Qantas even have an IPC for the engine? Did QF know that RR made a modification to production and why it made it? Does QF run configuration management on its Trent 972 engine modules or is that left to RR? Would it know which modules had the old or the new part? Would Qantas have had the option of requiring the mod to be made to its engines, or does it have to take what RR gives it?
Exactly how in 2010 is Qantas managing the supply of propulsion to it's aircraft? ....Or is Rolls Royce giving us ignorant colonials what it thinks we deserve? We lost the Westgate Bridge that way.
P.S. "Software patches" have a way of introducing more bugs.
A380 fire: only new engines were fixed | The Australian
Guessing between the lines from the newspaper article; It sounds like RR apparently had already redesigned the bearing retainer/box/housing probably because it was aware that it was distorting under load and allowing oil to get where it wasn't supposed to be in some circumstances.
No problems with that, modifications happen all the time as experience accumulates. The part concerned is probably an elegant tracery of Inconel that might just be a poofteenth too thin..
QF engine that failed apparently didn't have this mod, which probably suggests that RR didn't think it was that critical.
Considering that QF apparently no longer even has the engineering skills to modify a cockpit door lock (Dash 400), and that the A380 engines are owned by RR, QF merely paying a low hourly charge for their use, would there be anyone at Qantas who even knew that RR was having problems with this engine? Would Qantas even have an IPC for the engine? Did QF know that RR made a modification to production and why it made it? Does QF run configuration management on its Trent 972 engine modules or is that left to RR? Would it know which modules had the old or the new part? Would Qantas have had the option of requiring the mod to be made to its engines, or does it have to take what RR gives it?
Exactly how in 2010 is Qantas managing the supply of propulsion to it's aircraft? ....Or is Rolls Royce giving us ignorant colonials what it thinks we deserve? We lost the Westgate Bridge that way.
P.S. "Software patches" have a way of introducing more bugs.
A380 fire: only new engines were fixed
ENGINE-MAKER Rolls-Royce modified its newer Trent 900 aircraft engines to address a potentially dangerous oil leak.
But it failed to fix the issue on older engines such as the one that exploded on a Qantas Airbus near Singapore last week.
The disparity was revealed by a senior Airbus executive yesterday as he explained two fixes the British engineering firm was proposing to get airlines hit by the problem back in the air.
The repairs and an offer by Airbus to send new engines from its production line could lead to the first of the Qantas A380 fleet being back in the air as early as next week.
........
Rolls-Royce has produced software that will shut down a Trent 900 engine before it has turbine disc failure, like the one that destroyed the QF32 engine near Singapore and extensively damaged the plane.
It will also install a part, believed to be a bearing box, in engines aimed at preventing the oil leak thought responsible for the fire that caused the intermediate pressure turbine disc to disintegrate.
News that the modifications have already been made to newer Rolls-Royce engines has raised questions about why the engine-maker did not address the problem on older models before last week's spectacular failure.
Rolls-Royce, which faces a hefty compensation bill and is copping flak for its public handling of the explosion, issued a statement last night. It confirmed that the failure of "a specific component in the turbine area of the engine" on QF32 had caused an oil fire that led to the disintegration of the IP turbine disc.
"Our process of inspection will continue and will be supplemented by the replacement of the relevant module according to an agreed program," it said.
...........................
Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce said yesterday the airline believed it would be just days before the first A380 flew again.
Mr Leahy said Airbus had not yet seen any signs the Qantas incident had damaged its brand.
ENGINE-MAKER Rolls-Royce modified its newer Trent 900 aircraft engines to address a potentially dangerous oil leak.
But it failed to fix the issue on older engines such as the one that exploded on a Qantas Airbus near Singapore last week.
The disparity was revealed by a senior Airbus executive yesterday as he explained two fixes the British engineering firm was proposing to get airlines hit by the problem back in the air.
The repairs and an offer by Airbus to send new engines from its production line could lead to the first of the Qantas A380 fleet being back in the air as early as next week.
........
Rolls-Royce has produced software that will shut down a Trent 900 engine before it has turbine disc failure, like the one that destroyed the QF32 engine near Singapore and extensively damaged the plane.
It will also install a part, believed to be a bearing box, in engines aimed at preventing the oil leak thought responsible for the fire that caused the intermediate pressure turbine disc to disintegrate.
News that the modifications have already been made to newer Rolls-Royce engines has raised questions about why the engine-maker did not address the problem on older models before last week's spectacular failure.
Rolls-Royce, which faces a hefty compensation bill and is copping flak for its public handling of the explosion, issued a statement last night. It confirmed that the failure of "a specific component in the turbine area of the engine" on QF32 had caused an oil fire that led to the disintegration of the IP turbine disc.
"Our process of inspection will continue and will be supplemented by the replacement of the relevant module according to an agreed program," it said.
...........................
Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce said yesterday the airline believed it would be just days before the first A380 flew again.
Mr Leahy said Airbus had not yet seen any signs the Qantas incident had damaged its brand.
Keep asking the questions sunfish. You never know who is listening out there. Mind you it wouldn't be clifford and the likes after the "senior management only" gig yesterday.
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Rolls-Royce has produced software that will shut down a Trent 900 engine before it has turbine disc failure
Can't wait for the first software glitch to shut down a perfectly servicable engine. Hopefully it won't be all 4 at once!
But of course "it can't happen" can it?
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"Great! Now we have the aircraft able to shut down an engine without input from the pilots."
I think you will find the software fix results in setting the engine at idle as apposed to shutting it down.
This is something that Airbus has been designed to do for 25 years, its nothing new.
Welcome to the new world. Is a software glitch any more concerning than a rudder hardover? Or fuel icing flaming out both engines?
I think you will find the software fix results in setting the engine at idle as apposed to shutting it down.
This is something that Airbus has been designed to do for 25 years, its nothing new.
Welcome to the new world. Is a software glitch any more concerning than a rudder hardover? Or fuel icing flaming out both engines?