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Merged: Jetstar EBA 4

Old 5th Mar 2008, 03:17
  #401 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The Best Place!
Posts: 202
To the Jet* 58%.

Congratulations on allowing lies and fear to decide your vote. You have now proven yourselves to be the dumbest group of pilots in the world.

Emergen and all AWAers. No really, please explain to me how you have the right to vote on an EBA you are not part of. You were the 134 pawns who have been manipulated to produce a result beneficial only to management. And too dumb to realise it.

Enjoy your next 5 YEARS. AJ et al must be laughing their arses off.

M

Last edited by mmmbop; 5th Mar 2008 at 04:28.
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 03:33
  #402 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: CHC
Posts: 40
could someone please give basic run down of new EBA $$ ect
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 04:27
  #403 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 101
Led,

One minute you refer to unity as idealistic and naive and the next itís a cynical exercise. It canít be both. You accuse me of smoke and mirrors when you canít give a straight answer to a simple question. When early in this topic you talked about this terrible history youíve experienced at AIPAís hands as a Jet* pilot, and it becomes obvious from a simple check of your previous posts that you were in EK as recently as December 2006, I put it to you that itís you who is being deceptive. But relax, no Qantas pilot is trying to (or would ever be able to if this is set up correctly) get a command in Jet* before you. (For what itís worth I already have a command.)

The GOAL would simplify fair promotional advancement as Qantas Group pilots and whilst highly desirable is not an essential part of the process to prevent one group being used against each other. That comes from the structure of the association. Again, Zep, itís been said to you on many occasions that the Jet* pilots would run as their own entity in the same way as the S/H pilot group and L/H pilot group do. AIPA has stated both verbally and in print that Jet* flying is for Jet* pilots first. They canít dictate where Qantas places the 787s, or any other new type for that matter. Your group maintains its own power and ultimately could tell mainline pilots to stick it if they tried to go against you.

The company may try and block a GOAL but they canít stop you from being represented by AIPA and itís this they have desperately tried to stop. I believe that if we can get the representation sorted out then the companies divide and conquer strategy would be defeated and there would be no downside to a GOAL from their point of view.

Nuf.

Last edited by Nuthinondaclock; 5th Mar 2008 at 05:49.
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 04:39
  #404 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
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mmmbop,
That would have to be the most accurate, and clearly the best post I have ever read on PPRuNe.
To have personally voted this EBA down twice and being a member of the Fed's of which I have resigned in disgust and joined AIPA I am ashamed of the 58% and the fact that AWA pilots where used to secure the vote by allowing them to short circuit their own AWA to join collective EBA.
SHAME SHAME SHAME 58%
You are weak.
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 05:02
  #405 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queenland, Australia
Posts: 178
mmmbop-agree but don't think the other 42%( the first majority ) are dumb at all! So 130 AWA voters say yes ( mainly for job security ) means without them the same outcome as the first NO vote would have resulted in another NO and to a greater margin.

NUF, well said.

Rostov, agree with your sentiments.

time4change-have a look at other posts/threads on JQ T & C's. This will take too long to type here.

LED, what do you want for the pilot group? Being this paranoid is bad for your health-seriously! You appear to be very passionate about the past and show contempt to future unity. What FORWARD direction do you envisage for Jq crew-old and new?

AIPA has screwed up in the past-so have we. Endorsing the previous EBA re A330 flying, look back now and wonder why/how? WE ALL make mistakes and lessons that have to be learnt. So now AIPA has shifted into gear, become more flexible and adjusting to the times. They have alot more questions to answer but at least there is direction.

Last edited by aulglarse; 5th Mar 2008 at 08:49.
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 06:25
  #406 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 114
How tragic the AFAP is involved. How many of the JPC are AFAP members? - Would they be prepared to declare themselves? At least the AIPA guys have enough balls to declare themselves.
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 06:29
  #407 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: australia
Posts: 7
and den...........
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 06:49
  #408 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: AUS
Posts: 80
How unsuprising.

A few short weeks ago Jetstar pilots were getting sore backs from all the congratulatory slapping from their mainline 'brothers'

Now, after a (slightly) improved deal is put up and 58% of the TOTAL PILOT GROUP who CHOSE to vote have approved it, they are back to being Monkeys.

Cmon, admit it, skin deep down you really wanted to say that all along TL, dr et al....... didn't you...

I guess for the few non JQ non QF people here you need to read between the lines, what is really pi$$ing some of the vocal (and abusive) mainline guys off is that the little rag tag bunch of monkeys down the road refuse to swallow AIPA propoganda. Do what you are told and we like you, otherwise we will revert back to name calling.

Sorry Keg, I quite liked your post, but with the likes of TL and Drs batting for your team I fear the whole side is brought down.
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 06:51
  #409 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: AUS
Posts: 80
BTW, I thought the second vote by DJ drivers got up by only 54%.

Hmmmmm.
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 08:40
  #410 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: australia
Age: 70
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Does anyone out there in P-Prune land actually know what the legalities are regarding AWA signatories voting on an EBA?
I heard the last time something along these lines occured it ended up in front of a full bench of the IRC. Result ,"not allowable".

Any "no" voters out there want to grieve this?
Would AFAP wish to support any No voters if they wished to pursue this, since they are signatories to the EBA?
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 08:59
  #411 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: airside
Posts: 518
No Idea EitherCan someone give me a yes or no answer,
Did the J* troops approach AIPA when they were first formed, and did AIPA knock them back? Today 12:30


NIE ,I think you will find it was the IPC (Impulse Pilots Council) that approached AIPA back ,just before the birth of JetStar.
I'm led to believe the AIPA President of the time who said" not interested" went on to explain that legally AIPA couldn't cover them .,.He then went on to become Chief Pilot. (I'm also led to believe he was none too diplomatic in the passing of this information)

If I'm not mistaken there have been something like 3 Presidents of AIPA since then ,that's 3 generations of different thinking in AIPA. What do you think the answer would be if the same question was asked today now that AIPA is legally allowed to represent JetStar pilots, or are you one of those people who are happy to not let the facts get in the way of a good story and blame the son for his father's deeds?.

Last edited by max autobrakes; 5th Mar 2008 at 09:12.
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 09:06
  #412 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: CHC
Posts: 40
thanks man I have a copy of old contract just wondering what entry level pay is now?cant find any info on new EBA
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 09:08
  #413 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: australasia
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Max

And your position on the apology to our indigenous cousins, is?

M
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 09:10
  #414 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: airside
Posts: 518
and whats the spot price for eggs in China Maui ?
Your point being???????
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 09:23
  #415 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queenland, Australia
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time4change-f/o 55% (first 12 months)then 60% of captain approx $80k base + retention pay due next year then every 2 years(2009 & 2011). O/time tied to base (3% increase annually). 50% Credit for paxing, extra days off =10/11 days off per month.
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 09:35
  #416 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Max

Sins of the father, dear boy.

Maui
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 09:40
  #417 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Max

Interestng that you saw fit to withdraw your comment, at the same time you responded to me.

M
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 09:42
  #418 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 161
JJW said it all......

"I guess for the few non JQ non QF people here you need to read between the lines, what is really pi$$ing some of the vocal (and abusive) mainline guys off is that the little rag tag bunch of monkeys down the road refuse to swallow AIPA propoganda. Do what you are told and we like you, otherwise we will revert back to name calling"

Looking from the outside I have to say that the collective AIPA spleen venting here since the vote has been both horrific and cathartic....at least finally AIPA members have outed themselves.

And by the way.....I never specially liked AWAs....having refused a "contract" in 1989. Where the heck do AIPA representatives get off saying that it is morally wrong for a pilot on an AWA to vote to join an EBA?
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 09:43
  #419 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: CHC
Posts: 40
hmmmm not flash how is that better than last contract?
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Old 5th Mar 2008, 10:13
  #420 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queenland, Australia
Posts: 178
It's not really but I forgot to include the perfomance bonus which will look good this year I dare say...a guess is not worth putting up here on this site.
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