QANTAS New long Haul CSM CSS intake
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QANTAS New long Haul CSM CSS intake
Well word has reached me that once again there has been a few "strange" choices for the new CSM and CSS intake.
The biggest point of contention seems to be that 3 new CSM's have only been CSS's for 6 weeks and one in particular is very unpopular!
Here we go around the merry go round, when will QF mismanagement get it into their heads that experience as a supervisor is vital to be able to carry out the job, specially in Long Haul.
The biggest point of contention seems to be that 3 new CSM's have only been CSS's for 6 weeks and one in particular is very unpopular!
Here we go around the merry go round, when will QF mismanagement get it into their heads that experience as a supervisor is vital to be able to carry out the job, specially in Long Haul.
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Couldn't agree with you any more Cartexchange.
Plenty of us, like you are shaking our heads at some of the annointees.
I'm only aware of 6 or so names but two of those clearly won't cut the mustard.
Perhaps QF approve of the technique where CSM's have to retire to the toilets for a little cry when the ****e hits the fan!!!!!!
I guess the problem is twofold.
1. QF management and more importantly those who choose new onboard managers have NO understanding of our operational environment.
Writing people up for minor uniform infractions might please the egos of sociopathic office dwellers like fat boy slim and the tarrantular but it serves NO practical purpose from the customers point of view.
I ask you. When passengers get to their destination and their friends ask, "how was your flight". Do they mention that they'll NEVER fly qantas again because someone in economy wasn't wearing their vest, didn't use their oven gloves or had earings that were too big???????
Our working environment is stressful enough without people actively creating tension, and mistrust onboard.
The end result is grumpy sullen and suspicious crew who's frame of mind manifests itself onboard for all to see.
2. They lack the ability or intelligence to promote anything other than mirror images of themselves.
-------------------
tarrantular, webster, fatboyslim, theboyscout, thekiwisociopath, lurch, ding dong??????
Leadership???????????
You've got to be kidding..............
oh BTW, don't call them onboard managers.......................around here
Plenty of us, like you are shaking our heads at some of the annointees.
I'm only aware of 6 or so names but two of those clearly won't cut the mustard.
Perhaps QF approve of the technique where CSM's have to retire to the toilets for a little cry when the ****e hits the fan!!!!!!
I guess the problem is twofold.
1. QF management and more importantly those who choose new onboard managers have NO understanding of our operational environment.
Writing people up for minor uniform infractions might please the egos of sociopathic office dwellers like fat boy slim and the tarrantular but it serves NO practical purpose from the customers point of view.
I ask you. When passengers get to their destination and their friends ask, "how was your flight". Do they mention that they'll NEVER fly qantas again because someone in economy wasn't wearing their vest, didn't use their oven gloves or had earings that were too big???????
Our working environment is stressful enough without people actively creating tension, and mistrust onboard.
The end result is grumpy sullen and suspicious crew who's frame of mind manifests itself onboard for all to see.
2. They lack the ability or intelligence to promote anything other than mirror images of themselves.
-------------------
tarrantular, webster, fatboyslim, theboyscout, thekiwisociopath, lurch, ding dong??????
Leadership???????????
You've got to be kidding..............
oh BTW, don't call them onboard managers.......................around here
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Plenty of us, like you are shaking our heads at some of the annointees.
This is probably to protect those who work there....Very few people will hire anyone who is more skillful and capable than themselves....
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The New Regime
QF management dont want CSMs CSSs with experience or the ability to think on their feet.They dont want independent managers.This is all about control and discipline.Crew doing as they're told.CSMs and CSSs reporting back on everything and everyone
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Yes,Unfortunately
I may have jumped the gun on this one.
A couple of friends were promoted who will be fantastic.
I went away on a trip and started hearing some other names.
Holly Half wits Batman.
I have to agree with Packrat its all about contol and discipline.
The company phone bill will go through the roof.With their shiny new Blackberries this new lot will call to ask permission to fart
A couple of friends were promoted who will be fantastic.
I went away on a trip and started hearing some other names.
Holly Half wits Batman.
I have to agree with Packrat its all about contol and discipline.
The company phone bill will go through the roof.With their shiny new Blackberries this new lot will call to ask permission to fart
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yes defcon, there are three that are good but what a slap in the face for some of those great candidates that didn't get it because they haven't got the interview skills yet make great supervisors, then they go and give the position to inexperienced crew.
Six weeks as a CSS is no experience at all!
Six weeks as a CSS is no experience at all!
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Negative Bid A Supervisor
How do I negative bid someone's staff number?
Flew with this twit(CSS) who didnt have a clue about time or how to work out breaks or how to deal with irate passengers.
A senior member of the crew told this supervisor to bugger off.The supervisor goes up to the CSM and complains.The CSM tells him to deal with it himself.
Game over...the senior guy took over(Ex CSS).The operating CSS was then ignored
Bit sad really.
Flew with this twit(CSS) who didnt have a clue about time or how to work out breaks or how to deal with irate passengers.
A senior member of the crew told this supervisor to bugger off.The supervisor goes up to the CSM and complains.The CSM tells him to deal with it himself.
Game over...the senior guy took over(Ex CSS).The operating CSS was then ignored
Bit sad really.
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At times I shake my head and understand others cynicism towards the company's selection of candidates for promotion. We have all worked with wombats in the past, from all sorts in the seniority pool, and can usually pick them within a minute of a briefing.
However, I want to congratulate ALL of the recent successful applicants. They put themselves on the line and have come out on top. We all have access to that opportunity but only a handful of us seize it. Let's celebrate their success and also be thankful that it's an Australian based member of the Long Haul community. The alternative isn't worth considering. Granted, some outstanding crew were not successful and this is unfortunate. Let's continue to offer them our support and encouragement for the the next recruitment and hope they are fortuitous.
The challenge is now for those candidates to prove their worth. The eyes of many in the cabin crew community are upon them!
However, I want to congratulate ALL of the recent successful applicants. They put themselves on the line and have come out on top. We all have access to that opportunity but only a handful of us seize it. Let's celebrate their success and also be thankful that it's an Australian based member of the Long Haul community. The alternative isn't worth considering. Granted, some outstanding crew were not successful and this is unfortunate. Let's continue to offer them our support and encouragement for the the next recruitment and hope they are fortuitous.
The challenge is now for those candidates to prove their worth. The eyes of many in the cabin crew community are upon them!
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Yeah And5678 but what about all those who can do the job but are not a$@# lickers and don't get the job?
Shouldn't it be the ones who are the best get the job not the ones with no family who spend more time in the office than on an aircraft.
Shouldn't it be the ones who are the best get the job not the ones with no family who spend more time in the office than on an aircraft.
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RedTBar, I agree with you whole heartedly. There is some amazingly skilled crew on the aircraft that given the opportunity would make exceptional CSM & CSS's. How do we assess that ability in a transparent and fair way for all crew? Are you confident that it is any more infallible than the current recruitment process?
In regards to crew who spend their time crack licking in the office, that isn't just the domain of single people. I am sure there is a fair share of family makers in that group as well. Many of us single ones have lives outside of QF that preclude us from spending the time in the office too. As I suggested in my last post, let's offer them our support for the next time the opportunity arises and hope they succeed and allow for a more representative group of CSM and CSS's.
In regards to crew who spend their time crack licking in the office, that isn't just the domain of single people. I am sure there is a fair share of family makers in that group as well. Many of us single ones have lives outside of QF that preclude us from spending the time in the office too. As I suggested in my last post, let's offer them our support for the next time the opportunity arises and hope they succeed and allow for a more representative group of CSM and CSS's.
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Failure
There is nothing worse than working for and receiving a promotion only to find that you are not equipped for the task.
You have been set up to fail.
Why were you promoted?
The reason is clear ....you cant cope so you will continually seek assitance from the office.
Through you THEY will manage.
Unfortunately for you, the crew will treat you with contempt and the pax will crucify you.
Letters will flow in from pax and performance assessments from crew will be scathing.
The office will turn on you.
You are a scapegoat...promoted and then berated.
You have been set up to fail to satisfy the CC management agenda
You have been set up to fail.
Why were you promoted?
The reason is clear ....you cant cope so you will continually seek assitance from the office.
Through you THEY will manage.
Unfortunately for you, the crew will treat you with contempt and the pax will crucify you.
Letters will flow in from pax and performance assessments from crew will be scathing.
The office will turn on you.
You are a scapegoat...promoted and then berated.
You have been set up to fail to satisfy the CC management agenda
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You have got to be kidding
Can someone out there give me just a little advice on how i might overcome the major urge to lean over the table and slowly remove my mismanagers head at the neck IF i go in to receive, and pretend to eat, that s*** sandwich they call feedback?.
Slowly but surely this process is eroding any belief that i may have had that it is a merit based system of selection.
How can someone who has been in a position for less than a bid period be deserving or worthy, (thats the def of merit by the way) of success in this process.
Please dont place me in the sour grapes dept. The very fact that the questions asked throughout the interview day centered around experience. For example, "in your experience can you tell me when..." " As a CSS can you give me an example of...." " How did you manage a situation involving...." and so it went on.
Please tell me how one answers these questions and of course many more around the same themes if one has been in the position of CSS for just some weeks!!
For many of the applicants, and unfortunately unsuccessful applicants, the pile of upward feedback forms by Crew and CSMs is to say the least, LARGE. Are these simply ignored? Are our Managers saying that they do not trust the people that they are relying on to fill the feedback forms?.
Many of these applicants had KPF****** I,s that put them into the holy grail of sweet number 4!. According to the jokes in there this constitutes the highest level as a 5 is simply unattainable for a mortal.
Me thinks that perhaps the Merit based system needs a new more befitting name, any suggestions, please.
Slowly but surely this process is eroding any belief that i may have had that it is a merit based system of selection.
How can someone who has been in a position for less than a bid period be deserving or worthy, (thats the def of merit by the way) of success in this process.
Please dont place me in the sour grapes dept. The very fact that the questions asked throughout the interview day centered around experience. For example, "in your experience can you tell me when..." " As a CSS can you give me an example of...." " How did you manage a situation involving...." and so it went on.
Please tell me how one answers these questions and of course many more around the same themes if one has been in the position of CSS for just some weeks!!
For many of the applicants, and unfortunately unsuccessful applicants, the pile of upward feedback forms by Crew and CSMs is to say the least, LARGE. Are these simply ignored? Are our Managers saying that they do not trust the people that they are relying on to fill the feedback forms?.
Many of these applicants had KPF****** I,s that put them into the holy grail of sweet number 4!. According to the jokes in there this constitutes the highest level as a 5 is simply unattainable for a mortal.
Me thinks that perhaps the Merit based system needs a new more befitting name, any suggestions, please.
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Understand This
It is not a merit based system!!!
It is system based on their selection criteria that only the chosen ones will meet.
The whole interview process is a sham.These people are chosen because they will do as they are told.I think surfside6 has summed it up perfectly.
Unless you are tapped on the shoulder dont even bother applying
If everyone got together and no one applied then just maybe the process would change
People who have never flown promoting people who can't manage.
Call it the "Webster Farce" system(of choosing not promoting)
It is system based on their selection criteria that only the chosen ones will meet.
The whole interview process is a sham.These people are chosen because they will do as they are told.I think surfside6 has summed it up perfectly.
Unless you are tapped on the shoulder dont even bother applying
If everyone got together and no one applied then just maybe the process would change
People who have never flown promoting people who can't manage.
Call it the "Webster Farce" system(of choosing not promoting)
Last edited by Le 3rd Homme; 8th Jan 2008 at 10:05.
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Is there any way of getting a copy of the promotions list???
I realise that there is the issue of privacy, but I would like to know who got the coat.
It wasn't so long ago that they use to publish a list.
Ah the good old days.
I realise that there is the issue of privacy, but I would like to know who got the coat.
It wasn't so long ago that they use to publish a list.
Ah the good old days.
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look!some of the guys that got it deserve it
,
three that I know! and they will be good!
however what concerns me is that the position was also given to some CSS's that had only been in the job for 6 weeks, they have no experience at all, and two of them weren't even good flight attendants, one of them is known for his extremely fiery temper, (would love to be on the a/c when the sh!t hits the fan)
blurter8 you have summed up my sentiments exactly, the whole interview process is a farce, it should only count to 5% of your eligibility in getting the position.
, three that I know! and they will be good!
however what concerns me is that the position was also given to some CSS's that had only been in the job for 6 weeks, they have no experience at all, and two of them weren't even good flight attendants, one of them is known for his extremely fiery temper, (would love to be on the a/c when the sh!t hits the fan)blurter8 you have summed up my sentiments exactly, the whole interview process is a farce, it should only count to 5% of your eligibility in getting the position.
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First off I agree with the general sentiment.As explained in one post by an applicant lots of questions about experiences on board and how they were handled then next minute they select..................... well except for three, I dont know the rest.untilwe do its harsh to judge. Why werent some candidates with 20 plus years selected. Does that experience as a CSS mean nothing?
Stop for a sec everyone. If you think this process has become a farce wait and see who gets selected if the EBA gets voted up.
The union has agreed with the companies view that previous experience in a non-flying managerial role is all you need, oh and to have all the right answers in an interview.
To those in the Company that read this who are managers where exactly in management 101 was this promotional stratagem written?
we are all considered negative by suggesting that experience as a supervisor on board for at least 1-2 years should count for something.
To those who are successful and read this I sincerely wish you all the best and good luck. It is not their fault they are in this situation. They have had the opportunity to apply and did so.
If any of you are not happy about the process it is no use bitching on here! after the EBA vote it will be open slather for anyone with 4 years as a flight attendant.
If you think this is a bad move let the union know.
If you vote yes to the EBA then this selection method is one of the ramifications.
Learn to live with it
Dont think you wont fly with them, we all have to do reserve sometime
Stop for a sec everyone. If you think this process has become a farce wait and see who gets selected if the EBA gets voted up.
The union has agreed with the companies view that previous experience in a non-flying managerial role is all you need, oh and to have all the right answers in an interview.
To those in the Company that read this who are managers where exactly in management 101 was this promotional stratagem written?
we are all considered negative by suggesting that experience as a supervisor on board for at least 1-2 years should count for something.
To those who are successful and read this I sincerely wish you all the best and good luck. It is not their fault they are in this situation. They have had the opportunity to apply and did so.
If any of you are not happy about the process it is no use bitching on here! after the EBA vote it will be open slather for anyone with 4 years as a flight attendant.
If you think this is a bad move let the union know.
If you vote yes to the EBA then this selection method is one of the ramifications.
Learn to live with it
Dont think you wont fly with them, we all have to do reserve sometime
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Mutiny On The Rat
I have only ever heard of one QF Crew staging a Mutiny...It was in LHR around 10 years ago.The crew got together,rang Sydney and said that they had lost confidence in the FSD and were staying put until a replacement was found.
The FSD was paxed home and is no longer with company.
I think this scenario will be played out often over the next couple of years.
The tie is not worth the cost of the colour.
The FSD was paxed home and is no longer with company.
I think this scenario will be played out often over the next couple of years.
The tie is not worth the cost of the colour.