NSW State Police powers with regard to Aircraft.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Oz
Posts: 469
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
NSW State Police powers with regard to Aircraft.
I found this little gem at
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2...13/2089843.htm
Does anybody know more about this ?
Is it another example of the kneejerk policy on the run politics that we seem to be saddled with?
Or, is there a valid reason/threat to be addressed for the powers?
What on earth did the Cronulla riots have to do with civil or any form aviation for that matter?
There is no explanation as to which planes this refers to be they RPT or GA.
Maybe somebody should try and educate these erstwhile community leaders with regard to the difference between a plane (the carpentary tool) an aeroplane (being an aircraft) and a hydroplane (being a boat). Come to think of it they probably wouldn't understand.
The second last para is a either gem of educated 'reporting' or Government stupidity, I am unsure which.
The last para made me throw up. Twice.
Me thinks the NSW Police have been watching too many American 'cop chase video' shows.
Removing tongue from cheek for a minute, can anybody really throw some light on what appears to be a nonsense.
tipsy...........................
furball and another.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2...13/2089843.htm
NSW Govt extends police riot powers
Posted 30 minutes ago
Map: Sydney 2000
The New South Wales Government will permanently enforce extra powers given to police to quell riots.
Emergency powers granted to police in the wake of the 2005 Cronulla riots were due to expire next month.
But Premier Morris Iemma has told Parliament they will now be made permanent and expanded.
"Giving police the ability to stop vehicles and people who gather in an area which may be some distance from a riot and are suspected of planning to join in the unrest," he said.
He says the Terrorism Act will also be updated and expanded to allow police to search boats and planes without a warrant.
"The Government remains committed to giving the police the power they need to protest our community," he said.
Mr Iemma says police have demonstrated their ability to use the laws responsibly.
Posted 30 minutes ago
Map: Sydney 2000
The New South Wales Government will permanently enforce extra powers given to police to quell riots.
Emergency powers granted to police in the wake of the 2005 Cronulla riots were due to expire next month.
But Premier Morris Iemma has told Parliament they will now be made permanent and expanded.
"Giving police the ability to stop vehicles and people who gather in an area which may be some distance from a riot and are suspected of planning to join in the unrest," he said.
He says the Terrorism Act will also be updated and expanded to allow police to search boats and planes without a warrant.
"The Government remains committed to giving the police the power they need to protest our community," he said.
Mr Iemma says police have demonstrated their ability to use the laws responsibly.
Does anybody know more about this ?
Is it another example of the kneejerk policy on the run politics that we seem to be saddled with?
Or, is there a valid reason/threat to be addressed for the powers?
What on earth did the Cronulla riots have to do with civil or any form aviation for that matter?
There is no explanation as to which planes this refers to be they RPT or GA.
Maybe somebody should try and educate these erstwhile community leaders with regard to the difference between a plane (the carpentary tool) an aeroplane (being an aircraft) and a hydroplane (being a boat). Come to think of it they probably wouldn't understand.
The second last para is a either gem of educated 'reporting' or Government stupidity, I am unsure which.
The last para made me throw up. Twice.
Me thinks the NSW Police have been watching too many American 'cop chase video' shows.
Removing tongue from cheek for a minute, can anybody really throw some light on what appears to be a nonsense.
tipsy...........................
furball and another.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Home
Posts: 46
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Tipsy. Go back to your link and read it properly. You have failed to understand something which would answer your question relating to a connection between the Cronulla riots and aviation. Der.. there is no connection.
Here's what you missed:
"He says the Terrorism Act will also be updated and expanded to allow police to search boats and planes without a warrant."
.
Once the Act is written it will specify in detail what forms of aircraft. Hell if the police are lucky aviation will be blanketed under one term so there will be no loopholes so that terrorists can't target one form of aircraft knowing police won't have the power to board that type.
.
The idea is if there is a report made to police of suspected terrorist activity on any type of aircraft the police won't have to wait for some magistrate to issue a warrant so they may board. I'm sure you human rights activists would be happy that police must follow due course and time wasting applications to magistrates to gain entry without permission.
Are you happy that the a
hole packing the bomb under his clothes has boarded, buckled in and reached a height of 30,000 feet before the police got their warrant issued? No? Well wake up and don't question the expansion of powers.
.
By the way I don't like Iemma or any of his idiot mates, but I'll support any expansion of police powers to make our airline industry safer.
.
Play nice mudpig and keep the insults to yourself.
Tidbinbilla - Dunnunda and Godzone Moderator
Here's what you missed:
"He says the Terrorism Act will also be updated and expanded to allow police to search boats and planes without a warrant."
.
Once the Act is written it will specify in detail what forms of aircraft. Hell if the police are lucky aviation will be blanketed under one term so there will be no loopholes so that terrorists can't target one form of aircraft knowing police won't have the power to board that type.
.
The idea is if there is a report made to police of suspected terrorist activity on any type of aircraft the police won't have to wait for some magistrate to issue a warrant so they may board. I'm sure you human rights activists would be happy that police must follow due course and time wasting applications to magistrates to gain entry without permission.
Are you happy that the a
hole packing the bomb under his clothes has boarded, buckled in and reached a height of 30,000 feet before the police got their warrant issued? No? Well wake up and don't question the expansion of powers..
By the way I don't like Iemma or any of his idiot mates, but I'll support any expansion of police powers to make our airline industry safer.
.
Play nice mudpig and keep the insults to yourself.
Tidbinbilla - Dunnunda and Godzone Moderator
Last edited by mudpig; 14th Nov 2007 at 02:15.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Oz
Posts: 469
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Oooops, excuse me for asking.
Mudpig, I regret to advise you that I am not in the habit of blindly believing everything a government tells me. It would be better to not confuse aviation (be it airline or GA) safety with that rampant growth industry known as "Security". Very different animals, both of them.
I was under the impression that aviation law was the responsibility of the Federal Parliament, not the States (and Territories).
.
tipsy.......................
I resisted the temptation to suggest that the Police keep their snouts out of aviation.
Mudpig, I regret to advise you that I am not in the habit of blindly believing everything a government tells me. It would be better to not confuse aviation (be it airline or GA) safety with that rampant growth industry known as "Security". Very different animals, both of them.
I was under the impression that aviation law was the responsibility of the Federal Parliament, not the States (and Territories).
. tipsy.......................
I resisted the temptation to suggest that the Police keep their snouts out of aviation.
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 331
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Damn, and I thought this topic might have been about a new way to keep aircraft silent....... 
Only kidding mate, only kidding!! But you have to admit, it could read that way.
Keep playing the Devil's Advocate, aircraft.
Only kidding mate, only kidding!! But you have to admit, it could read that way.
Keep playing the Devil's Advocate, aircraft.
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Perth
Posts: 57
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Aviation is Constitutionally a FEDERAL responsibility
What a lot of bloody rot. Now we have ASIO Act, CASA Act, DOTARS Act, AFP Act.......well well now it will be the NSWPOL Act all to counter the so called "Aeronautical Terrorism Threat".....what a load of rot and very very dangerous for all of the aviation industry participants and not forgetting the passengers....possibly a greater threat than the actual "Terrorist Threat"
Who actually is in charge of Aeronautical Counter-Terrorism in Australia....who is the Authority with the most power......Next it will be the local Council Ranger given power to stop/storm/shoot to kill and ask questions later after all they do own most of the aerodromes in Australia.
Aviation is Constitutionally a FEDERAL responsibility!!!
who was the famous person who said "rule by FEAR its the human beings greatest weakness"
Who actually is in charge of Aeronautical Counter-Terrorism in Australia....who is the Authority with the most power......Next it will be the local Council Ranger given power to stop/storm/shoot to kill and ask questions later after all they do own most of the aerodromes in Australia.
Aviation is Constitutionally a FEDERAL responsibility!!!
who was the famous person who said "rule by FEAR its the human beings greatest weakness"
I don't want to be the best pilot in the world - Just the oldest
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Here and there
Posts: 1,013
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Emu me ol,
As much as I sympathise with your frustrations I regret to say that after spending the last 4 days at a seminar and workshop involving Airline security, DOTARS, CASA, Airport Operators etc one thing is abundantly clear.
The current security regime is NOT going to change - well probably not in our lifetime anyway. There is already talk of extending the screening requirements to jet charter as well as RPT and charter turbo prop. Also ASICs could well be a requirement at ALL security controlled airports including those that until now have been exempt ie, GAAP fields.
Suggest you hang on for the ride because complaining on an anonymous website is going to about as effective as the proverbial ash tray on the motor cycle. DOTARS have in the past and will continue to push THEIR agenda because it secures their jobs and the ministers position. Don't like it? Well you could apply for one of those postions recently advertised by ASIO for security operatives and anylists. Once there you can use your influence to downgrade the threat level. Until then though I wouldn't be burning my ASIC in protest.
As much as I sympathise with your frustrations I regret to say that after spending the last 4 days at a seminar and workshop involving Airline security, DOTARS, CASA, Airport Operators etc one thing is abundantly clear.
The current security regime is NOT going to change - well probably not in our lifetime anyway. There is already talk of extending the screening requirements to jet charter as well as RPT and charter turbo prop. Also ASICs could well be a requirement at ALL security controlled airports including those that until now have been exempt ie, GAAP fields.
Suggest you hang on for the ride because complaining on an anonymous website is going to about as effective as the proverbial ash tray on the motor cycle. DOTARS have in the past and will continue to push THEIR agenda because it secures their jobs and the ministers position. Don't like it? Well you could apply for one of those postions recently advertised by ASIO for security operatives and anylists. Once there you can use your influence to downgrade the threat level. Until then though I wouldn't be burning my ASIC in protest.
Evertonian
Hmmm, an interesting situation me thinks.
Whilst its fraught with possibilities, I can see at least one positive aspect, one I have experienced first hand.
Many moons ago, when the A310 was still a novelty, we used to handle JesAir out of Tulla. I was dispatching it at the gate (which was stand off BTW) when a couple of the local plods came to the aircraft with one of our CSO's. They'd explained that they needed to talk to one of the punters that had already boarded the flight. So, they all came to the top of the steps & our intrepid young lass went onboard to fetch said punter. The cops then stood to one side, out of view which, I might add, was a task in itself on a set of portable steps!
Anyways, after asking said punter to come to the doorway due to a need to check his ticket, our intrepid young lass followed him forward. As he stepped onto the steps, the cops launched themselves at him & had him up against the aircraft in handcuffs in no time! Again, this was on a set of portable steps & I was hanging on for dear life as she bucked & swayed in the commotion.
It turns out that this chap had done a nasty little number on a kid in a shopping centre & he was heading VFR back to Bulgaria!
So, whilst happy that the little scrote was caught, it raised quite a few concerns. (1) Our staff member was put in a potentially dangerous situation & had NFI what he was wanted for. (2) With forewarning, we could have sent a couple of larger blokes (myself included) on instead of her. (3) She was rather shocked & a little distressed as events unfolded and realisation of who she had dealt with set in. And, (4) the fact that the cops did not have sufficient time, or even the authority, to go onboard & grab him themselves!
Whilst its fraught with possibilities, I can see at least one positive aspect, one I have experienced first hand.
Many moons ago, when the A310 was still a novelty, we used to handle JesAir out of Tulla. I was dispatching it at the gate (which was stand off BTW) when a couple of the local plods came to the aircraft with one of our CSO's. They'd explained that they needed to talk to one of the punters that had already boarded the flight. So, they all came to the top of the steps & our intrepid young lass went onboard to fetch said punter. The cops then stood to one side, out of view which, I might add, was a task in itself on a set of portable steps!
Anyways, after asking said punter to come to the doorway due to a need to check his ticket, our intrepid young lass followed him forward. As he stepped onto the steps, the cops launched themselves at him & had him up against the aircraft in handcuffs in no time! Again, this was on a set of portable steps & I was hanging on for dear life as she bucked & swayed in the commotion.
It turns out that this chap had done a nasty little number on a kid in a shopping centre & he was heading VFR back to Bulgaria!
So, whilst happy that the little scrote was caught, it raised quite a few concerns. (1) Our staff member was put in a potentially dangerous situation & had NFI what he was wanted for. (2) With forewarning, we could have sent a couple of larger blokes (myself included) on instead of her. (3) She was rather shocked & a little distressed as events unfolded and realisation of who she had dealt with set in. And, (4) the fact that the cops did not have sufficient time, or even the authority, to go onboard & grab him themselves!
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 131
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The current security regime is NOT going to change - well probably not in our lifetime anyway.
Way to be a citizen of a democracy! Great work.
AustralianMade
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Out in the weather!
Age: 54
Posts: 917
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
NSW State Police powers with regard to Aircraft.
Please tell me they've been granted special powers to arrest him if he keeps posting drivel on Proon!
I don't disagree with a police to search a aircraft, with the proviso that there is reasonable cause. I would expect their warrant card entitles them to detain and search in any case.
The reality is that if and when we have a (real) aviation terrorist incident in Oz, the investigation will no doubt reveal that the perp DID NOT have an ASIC and the aircraft was NOT searched by police.
To a terrorist, aircraft other than RPT would probably be of little interest, so maybe they'll copy what they did in Iraq where they regularly kill scores of people with cars, trucks, bicycles and explosive garments.
I imagine they could fill up a cement mixer with explosive and nuts and bolts and detonate it at a place of their choosing. After that, the "authorities" will then insist on a CMDSIC (Cement Mixer Driver Security Identity Card).
Or maybe anyone with a backpack (remember London 2005?) will need to pay $186 for a police background check before they get their BPSIC, and of course, renew it every 2 years.
Terrorists will always be a step ahead of authorities and have shown they will be creative and resourceful in their endeavours, i.e we would never have known of the "Shoe Bomber" had his plan been successful. They will play the odds and keep coming up with something new.
I should mention the security guards on the Harbour Bridge. IMHO they will simply be additional victims, but then it will break their boredom. Their chances of stopping something is zero.
The reality is that if and when we have a (real) aviation terrorist incident in Oz, the investigation will no doubt reveal that the perp DID NOT have an ASIC and the aircraft was NOT searched by police.
To a terrorist, aircraft other than RPT would probably be of little interest, so maybe they'll copy what they did in Iraq where they regularly kill scores of people with cars, trucks, bicycles and explosive garments.
I imagine they could fill up a cement mixer with explosive and nuts and bolts and detonate it at a place of their choosing. After that, the "authorities" will then insist on a CMDSIC (Cement Mixer Driver Security Identity Card).
Or maybe anyone with a backpack (remember London 2005?) will need to pay $186 for a police background check before they get their BPSIC, and of course, renew it every 2 years.
Terrorists will always be a step ahead of authorities and have shown they will be creative and resourceful in their endeavours, i.e we would never have known of the "Shoe Bomber" had his plan been successful. They will play the odds and keep coming up with something new.
I should mention the security guards on the Harbour Bridge. IMHO they will simply be additional victims, but then it will break their boredom. Their chances of stopping something is zero.
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia
Age: 61
Posts: 122
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ever noticed the conflict between the pollies much-loved "you've nothing to fear if you've nothing to hide" and the remarkable resistance most of them show to providing transparency in government? There's been some interesting recent reading about the money they waste on legal fees opposing FOI requests on things that might possibly embarass them...
