SAPL Inquiry
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SAPL Inquiry
Rumour has it that Surveillance Australia / National Jet Systems has engaged a consultant to determine why they can’t employ or hold on to aircrew.
Anyone know any details?
Anyone know any details?
Sprucegoose
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Hughes Point, where life is great! Was also resident on page 13, but now I'm lost in Cyberspace....
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I'll be there with you Hoss, now there is just the little matter of $150k per year...
Its a joke isn't it.
Bull**** castle in adelaide grows by the day with over paid HR morons. Their answer is to send out over paid consultants asking why the people doing the real work, (the pilots) don't want to either start working for a mob that underpay, or continue working for NJS/SAPL. That alone should be a sign of the intelligence of the management.
The money they spend on these "consultants"comes from what they don't pay their pilots. NJS/SAPL do not honor commitments in their AWA'S. See the OWS web site
I would love to see the HR budget including the money spent on HR consultants legal fees and employment consultants.
Retention beyond 3 yrs is non existant.
Bonds
Pay for your endorsement
Roster issued only 1 week ahead and changes within the week.
Based in the most expensive places in Australia (Darwin and Broome) paid crap money.
They offered guaranteed jet jobs after 3 yrs but every one knows that the 717 contract is only for 5 yrs anyway, and when you do get your 717 job you go back to B scale wages as an F/O. $59K pa. Now thats a real selling point.
Bull**** castle in adelaide grows by the day with over paid HR morons. Their answer is to send out over paid consultants asking why the people doing the real work, (the pilots) don't want to either start working for a mob that underpay, or continue working for NJS/SAPL. That alone should be a sign of the intelligence of the management.
The money they spend on these "consultants"comes from what they don't pay their pilots. NJS/SAPL do not honor commitments in their AWA'S. See the OWS web site
I would love to see the HR budget including the money spent on HR consultants legal fees and employment consultants.
Retention beyond 3 yrs is non existant.
Bonds
Pay for your endorsement
Roster issued only 1 week ahead and changes within the week.
Based in the most expensive places in Australia (Darwin and Broome) paid crap money.
They offered guaranteed jet jobs after 3 yrs but every one knows that the 717 contract is only for 5 yrs anyway, and when you do get your 717 job you go back to B scale wages as an F/O. $59K pa. Now thats a real selling point.
Boocs
Not really.
Current F/A's or CC are on a B scale of sorts as well.
The earlier model F/A's are on a higher base wage, it is still way less than the F/O's base, having said that a large percentage of their $$$ comes from DTA and other allowances.
At the end of the day the CC that have been with the company longer probably have better take home $$$ than the new B scale F/O's.
Not really.
Current F/A's or CC are on a B scale of sorts as well.
The earlier model F/A's are on a higher base wage, it is still way less than the F/O's base, having said that a large percentage of their $$$ comes from DTA and other allowances.
At the end of the day the CC that have been with the company longer probably have better take home $$$ than the new B scale F/O's.
Apparently they have about 150 pilots with a safety department of 15 all based in Adelaide. Doing what? All the operations are spread around the top end. Adelaide is the quietest part of their network. Weird.
I don't know how it works but I assume it is for the whole group. Even so 15 staff to run a safety department for 150 pilots etc. They must have great morning teas.
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Jet Jobs after 3 years
"They offered guaranteed jet jobs after 3 yrs"
Just got off the phone to a friend. Apparently that doesnt happen in SAPL.
Can anyone in NJS or SAPL comment on how close the 2 pilot groups are?
Just got off the phone to a friend. Apparently that doesnt happen in SAPL.
Can anyone in NJS or SAPL comment on how close the 2 pilot groups are?
Last edited by Private Patjarr; 14th Jun 2007 at 15:17.
SAPL lost another five pilots last week.
Does that tell you something??
Does that tell you something??
The true indicator that people aren't happy are the ones who are leaving who wouldn't otherwise leave. Some of the older guys who came to SAPL for a retirement job but then retire early.
"They offered guaranteed jet jobs after 3 yrs"
Just got off the phone to a friend. Apparently that doesnt happen in SAPL.
Can anyone in NJS or SAPL comment on how close the 2 pilot groups are?
Just got off the phone to a friend. Apparently that doesnt happen in SAPL.
Can anyone in NJS or SAPL comment on how close the 2 pilot groups are?
The gripes for each company are mainly unrelated although the ultimate source is the same I guess. NJS has this B scale thing happening and no CPI increases, where as SAPL guys are more concerned about rostering and basings.
The safety department along with engineering, payroll, HR etc are for the whole group.
*Yeah, every year or two an SAPL pilot moves across to NJS but it is very rare. It is easier to get into NJS from SAPL if you resign from SAPL, otherwise SAPL don't release you.
59K for a 717 F/O!
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So, is the pay for a 717 F/O the same for a BRM or DRW -8 F/O, (given the $10k living allowance for BRM staff)? Any more legs on the SAPL DRW superbase story?
One may consider giving up the luxury of living in a place that has little accommodation for those who need to live there, for the opportunity to live in another place and spend a couple of nights a week in other major capital cities.
Any way you look at it, the parent company not the individual company has one hell of a lot to answer for.
One may consider giving up the luxury of living in a place that has little accommodation for those who need to live there, for the opportunity to live in another place and spend a couple of nights a week in other major capital cities.
Any way you look at it, the parent company not the individual company has one hell of a lot to answer for.
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I was on the F406 for ages. They let a couple of direct entries go on the dash before me. They flunked. They had a high failure rate for direct entry guys. I wasn't too annoyed though, the 406 is a cool thing.
Even though a command was offered, I resigned.
I would even go back to SA if they just treated pilots with a little respect.
Pay them well, give them time off, have plenty of roster coverage, get seniority up and running, have a career progression. Just take some hints from progressive companies like Boeing, google etc.
http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortu...ompanies/2007/
These organisations are doing extremely well because (a) they have a great product/service and (b) people really WANT to work there.
There........Consultancy over. That'll be $219,754.21 incl GST.
- They used to have a thing in the ops manual about dismissal for .....insubordination.
Says a little about the quasi-military management. - The call out used to be $75 (work on a day off) .
$$$$$$$$$ - When they offered me a dash FO "upgrade" it came with a pay CUT.
Even though a command was offered, I resigned.
I would even go back to SA if they just treated pilots with a little respect.
Pay them well, give them time off, have plenty of roster coverage, get seniority up and running, have a career progression. Just take some hints from progressive companies like Boeing, google etc.
http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortu...ompanies/2007/
These organisations are doing extremely well because (a) they have a great product/service and (b) people really WANT to work there.
There........Consultancy over. That'll be $219,754.21 incl GST.
Last edited by WynSock; 15th Jun 2007 at 00:44.
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I'm also a former employee and have been asked to talk to the consultant. From what I can gather the military d!ckheads have blamed everybody else but themsleves for the rate of attrition and have crawled to customs saying its not their fault now the govt want to know what is the problem because 5 new dhc8s on the way and no crews to crew the existing ones, let alone the new ones.
I loved my job and the people I flew with, there was a sense of achievement that I don't get now flying SLF. The crap all started when the 92 wing dropouts started to treat the staff as conscripts. They were totally unapproachable and were hell bent on making their ideas work no matter the cost. Does anyone remember the ADL ops cell that originally claimed they could run the show with 3 staff? Last I heard they had 15 in there and were still not running it nearly as efficiently as the bases did.
Solid rosters, real callout allowances and overtime and getting rid of that ADL mentality and put the management of the operation where the action is will go a long way to improve the operation generally. Oh and git rid of those military gits.
I loved my job and the people I flew with, there was a sense of achievement that I don't get now flying SLF. The crap all started when the 92 wing dropouts started to treat the staff as conscripts. They were totally unapproachable and were hell bent on making their ideas work no matter the cost. Does anyone remember the ADL ops cell that originally claimed they could run the show with 3 staff? Last I heard they had 15 in there and were still not running it nearly as efficiently as the bases did.
Solid rosters, real callout allowances and overtime and getting rid of that ADL mentality and put the management of the operation where the action is will go a long way to improve the operation generally. Oh and git rid of those military gits.