Jetstar International Frequencies

[The_Cutest_of_Borg]

Sydney - Honolulu 3 per week
Sydney - Bali 2 per week
Sydney - Phuket 3 per week
Sydney – Vietnam 3 per week
Sydney - Osaka (Kansai) Daily
Osaka (Kansai) - Brisbane - Daily
Melbourne - Honolulu 2 per week
Melbourne - Bali 2 per week
Melbourne - Bangkok 3 per week

The wisdom of the JPC revealed. "Look at all these great destination we go for ya fellas!"

"uhh but do I get paid for sitting on my arse for 5 days in Bali, after getting my five stick hours to get there?"
"uhhhhhh, Look at all these great destinations we got for ya fellas?"

Enjoy Jetstar guys... oh but thats right. You were never going to go to International operation till the conditions improved were you? Let some other guy come in and then come over the top via seniority when the good times finally roll!!

[Keg]

Do the J* crew get paid allowances or are they on a per diem per hour? It'll be VERY expensive in Japan if you don't get either of those! Even then, the per diem had want to be more about $5AUD per hour away to make any inroads on the Japanese yen!

[TwinNDB]

But don't forget guys, they were told that the wages would not be too bad when they flew over the amount required for overtime!

Good luck doing the min required for that figure boys!

Well done to the JPC guys - truely a great effort for furthering aviation in OZ

Twin.

[Bazzamundi]

The first 5 trips to each destination will at least be exciting. Give it 12 months, and the financial bite of only managing a bit over 60 hours per month on average will be a bit less enjoyable. If you can fill your roster with Japan and back once a week, well that may get you to 75 hours, but I would say that for every Japan (high flying density for time away trip) you will probably get one of less flying for more time away.

When you start sitting in Vietnam over Christmas, back to Bali for another laze around a few days later, all when the family/friends are on holidays, the gloss wears off slightly. Several days in Bali will be appealing, but during wet season it is not so exciting. Especially on your 10th trip there for the year. Honolulu is also great, but once again, when you have been on the road pretty much for the last 6 months with the odd few days at home, sitting around in an exotic place is not always as much fun as it is made out to be when sometimes you just really wish you could be home.

The cruelest blow comes when you walk in the door one day and your child does not recognise you. Happened once early on in my career with an 18 month old son, and I can tell you priorities changed after that. That was the worst pain I have ever endured. Nowadays, even the dog takes a while to forgive me now when I arrive home from a week long trip.

Personally, given the pay rise, and if you can really believe the novelty of these exciting new places does wear off, I would much rather hang around the domestic scene.

[Pete Conrad]

Bazza, hit the nail on the head, in their mad dash for scragging for work such as their Impulse mentality allowed, the twits are now and forever stuck with crappy flying, flying a trashy product..Oh but hang on, we got this for ya fella's.

Nice going to RH and the JPC for flying the routes for a bargain 40% less!!!

[AnQrKa]

Bazzmundi

“Happened once early on in my career with an 18 month old son”

“Nowadays, even the dog takes a while to forgive me now when I arrive home from a week long trip.”

So, let me get this straight. You are denigrating the Jetstar guys for voting to crew an aircraft that will do really crappy flying with long boring overnights that will be detrimental to the pilots family life. Because the “novelty” will wear off, you are suggesting that they don’t do it.

And yet, by your own admission, they will be undertaking an operation that you yourself have done for a considerable time and apparently still do to this day.

I have to ask the question – If you are unable to negotiate a better rostering practice within mainline after all this time, then why on earth do you expect the pilots at a startup to be able to?

[TwinNDB]

AnQrKa,

I think you will find that what Bazzmundi was refering to is that although the Qantas rostering system has some fairly long trips in them (but not too bad - the longest is 12 days for S/O's) there are other benfits and conditions within our EBA that overall make it not too bad - dare I say it - without doubt the best in Aus.

The JPC on the other hand have managed to negotiate flying at a rate somewhat lower, without the conditions (minimum days at home) and a requirement for overtime that by the looks of the current schedule will not be met. When you add those sorts of things into you work place EBA it will very quickley take away any shine to the job.

While on that note, I do honestly not care wether it is Jet*, Qantas or Australian Airlines that operates routes for the Qantas Group, so long as the conditions are fair and do not continually undermine the others. I feel the Australian Airlines deal offered a very good compromise for both the Company and the pilots operating and if the Jet* deal had been negotiated along similar lines (as AIPA was trying) the Jet* pilot group would have had a much better deal to vote on.

Sadly UNITY is something very lacking at the moment within such a large Qantas Group and until we have the collective negotiating power af all pilots within this group (Eastern, LH, SH, Jet*, Jet* int Susntate and other pilot groups that wish to join) with an equal say in how AIPA is run and voting rights, then I dare say that what happened with Jet* and more recently the closing of Australian Airlines (but rebranding in QF colours) will continue.

Twin.

[Bazzamundi]

AnQrKa,

I am not buying in to the mud slinging. My post is an attempt to point out that the joys of international flying to exotic ports are not all that people dream of them to be. There are negatives, and for many, they will be choosing whether or not to take up the long haul international or stay with the domestic arm of Jetstar.

When I started in Qantas, every trip was greater than 10 days, some longer, and this was what caused the dramas in my personal life back then. Nowadays, I am away for about 15 or 16 days per month, and my point is to illustrate that this amount of time away from home can also provide obstacles to family life. For me, and many, to be away from home for say 20 days per month means you may as well not waste money paying for rent or a mortgage. From my interpretation of the agreement, and the schedules just promulgated, it can be reasonable to assume that some will be away for I would say at a guess more than 15 days per month to achieve decent stick hours.

At the end of the day, it is horses for courses. My major point has been that if you have the choice, look at all the positives and negatives, not just the exotic destinations. For a small pay increase, I personally would stay domestic, but others may choose to do otherwise (I wish them well). I am not in any way saying don't do it - just be aware of the negatives.

As to my situation which you take joy in taking a shot at - with the conditions we have in mainline the constant travelling and time away from home takes it toll. If you think that the mainline boys and girls have got it too easy with the cushy terms and conditions in their agreement, you obviously have not much knowledge of international ops. Despite what you all may think, we do work hard, and all of us face challenges that being away from home present. You have a go at me for doing the long trips back then, but conditions and otherwise were also different then. Quality of life for longhaul flying has long been fought and earnt over a lot of years.

My only other point of advice I have learnt through experience over the years - a longhaul award like QF's works really well for international flying, but not domestic. On the other hand, domestic short haul awards work really well for domestic flying but not so well for longhaul. However, due to all the mudslinging that has happened, people really don't want to know anything from those grossly overpaid and underworked egotistical mainline people who think they know everything (thanks to one or two wankers in the past we have all been tarred with the same brush). Everyone knows better like we all once did (myself included). Time teaches you things, bit like experience in the aircraft.

Good luck.

[Eagleman]

Gents,

the JPC ...sorry have to stop else Woomera will close the thread

hope you guys are proud of yourselves not just for this EBA disaster but you previous lies and questionable behaviour

[Taildragger67]

Just in case anyone's interested in the press release from the Rat website:

http://www.qantas.com.au/regions/dyn...06/apr06/Q3418

[numbskull]

Now that Australian Airlines staff are operating QF aircraft under a "wet lease", what is to stop Jetstar staff operating QF aircraft under the same terms once they are both operating the same aircraft eg A330 and 787?

[ur2]

Nothing at all.
Now you can see the real danger in all of this.

[Buster Hyman]

Some days, I miss the airline industry...other days, I feel sorry for everyone still there.

[Crusty Demon]

Given the provisions of the agreement, I would say at a guess that when cruise f/o's are employed, nobody will be staying in Bali. It will most probably be an operate over and back night trip (or hopefully day).

Also remember that those long days in HNL are great, but the cost of drinking beer in Japan and Honolulu are quite expensive. A mild to moderate drinking session will cost you more than a huge night out with dinner included back home in Aus. Not something you will be able to do on a nightly basis unless you are rolling in coin.

[Going Boeing]

Does anyone know the details of the CAO 48 exemtions that JQ are operating under. If they are the same as QF domestic (& AN when they were around) then they are limited to 13 hours duty time and 3 hour time zone change with no extension available even with relief pilots. This would not allow operations from SYD to HNL. It's possible that the JQ domestic pilots stay operating on the exemptions and JQ Intl pilots fly under normal CAO 48 rules with cruise relief pilots!

[The_Cutest_of_Borg]

You can find it here.

http://www.casa.gov.au/aoc/fatigue/regs/part02.htm

International ops are different to the domestic exemption.

[skyshow]

Now that Australian Airlines staff are operating QF aircraft under a "wet lease", what is to stop Jetstar staff operating QF aircraft under the same terms once they are both operating the same aircraft eg A330 and 787?

Umm... I am sure that is the whole point. Its probably the main purpose of Jetstar (domestic and international). Qantas mainline will reduce in size and Jetstar get larger. In several years time, the reverse will probably happen. Jetstar will reduce and Qantas become larger (though the 'wet leasing' arrangement that GD is getting used to - where Jetstar's award will be running the Qantas brand, just like AO will be shortly.

Last one to the bottom's a rotten egg.

[Howard Hughes]

Originally Posted by skyshow

Last one to the bottom's a rotten egg.

Rotten eggs actually float!!