Qantas to call crew bluff on 'sick-out'
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Zapatas Blood..Information please
Instead of making assertions please supply some hard facts....How much are Thai and Malaysian crew paid?What are crew rest requirements on Air China?Remember though wages reflect a cost of living relative to the country in which they are paid!
Also how many cabin crew do these airlines have as a 747.400 complement?Crew complements do have an impact on quality of service available.
Also how many cabin crew do these airlines have as a 747.400 complement?Crew complements do have an impact on quality of service available.
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Qantas attendants 'bulldozed' through training
Wed "The Australian"
Qantas attendants 'bulldozed' through training
Steve Creedy, Aviation writer
October 20, 2004
QANTAS faces further checks of its flight attendant training after allegations in an internal email that controversial fixed-term flight attendants are being bulldozed through emergency procedures training.
The allegations, contained in a leaked internal memo from senior Qantas emergency procedures instructor Robert Ford, were forwarded by flight attendant union officials to the Civil Aviation Safety Authority last night.
"I am seriously concerned about the way the contingency students are being bulldozed through," Mr Ford said in the memo.
"It seems to me that the company is only interested in numbers, not quality."
About 350 fixed-term flight attendants are at the centre of a dispute between Qantas and the Flight Attendants Association of Australia about overseas bases. The FAAA fears the airline will use the fixed-termers as strikebreakers if it takes industrial action over Christmas.
The fixed-termers do 11 days' training instead of the normal six weeks, but the airline and CASA say this is because they are being trained on only one aircraft type rather than the whole fleet. But trainee assessments seen by The Australian indicate the new flight attendants believe they are not given enough time.
Mr Ford, who was unhappy about instructors' rosters, also alleged training reviews were held without course instructors being present.
"If we don't start getting the people running our two rosters talking to each other ... then the wheels are about to fall off," he said.
FAAA international division secretary Michael Mijatov said the memo indicated significant problems with training and called for an immediate CASA investigation.
"It's saying people are being bulldozed, it's saying Qantas is not interested in quality, and all this suggests the training is inadequate," he said.
But CASA spokesman Peter Gibson said two of its inspectors audited the training last week and had been happy that it was being conducted properly.
Qantas Airlines executive general manager John Borghetti said the airline's emergency procedures training for fixed-term cabin crew term training was the same as normal Qantas training and in accordance with CASA approved sources.
============================================
Qantas attendants 'bulldozed' through training
Steve Creedy, Aviation writer
October 20, 2004
QANTAS faces further checks of its flight attendant training after allegations in an internal email that controversial fixed-term flight attendants are being bulldozed through emergency procedures training.
The allegations, contained in a leaked internal memo from senior Qantas emergency procedures instructor Robert Ford, were forwarded by flight attendant union officials to the Civil Aviation Safety Authority last night.
"I am seriously concerned about the way the contingency students are being bulldozed through," Mr Ford said in the memo.
"It seems to me that the company is only interested in numbers, not quality."
About 350 fixed-term flight attendants are at the centre of a dispute between Qantas and the Flight Attendants Association of Australia about overseas bases. The FAAA fears the airline will use the fixed-termers as strikebreakers if it takes industrial action over Christmas.
The fixed-termers do 11 days' training instead of the normal six weeks, but the airline and CASA say this is because they are being trained on only one aircraft type rather than the whole fleet. But trainee assessments seen by The Australian indicate the new flight attendants believe they are not given enough time.
Mr Ford, who was unhappy about instructors' rosters, also alleged training reviews were held without course instructors being present.
"If we don't start getting the people running our two rosters talking to each other ... then the wheels are about to fall off," he said.
FAAA international division secretary Michael Mijatov said the memo indicated significant problems with training and called for an immediate CASA investigation.
"It's saying people are being bulldozed, it's saying Qantas is not interested in quality, and all this suggests the training is inadequate," he said.
But CASA spokesman Peter Gibson said two of its inspectors audited the training last week and had been happy that it was being conducted properly.
Qantas Airlines executive general manager John Borghetti said the airline's emergency procedures training for fixed-term cabin crew term training was the same as normal Qantas training and in accordance with CASA approved sources.
============================================
Possums, it would be a great idea to just chill for a little while. Rest assured that Oldmeadow and Co. read this stuff and the CEO gets a summary of what the current staff morale and flight attendant intentions are regularly. Therefore its probably a good idea not to post everything here. There might even be the odd management troll as well.However I think I can summarise the situation at present, at least in my opinion.
1) Qantas is going to have a go at breaking the FA's union. Thats pretty obvious, otherwise they would have taken steps to control the obvious effects of the London and fixed term hires on staff morale.
The precedents for this are the Wharves dispute in Melbourne (Patrick Partners) and the pilots dispute. Both of these are worth studying.
There are a number of ways that this can play out and I certainly don't know all of them.
The first point you need to know is what you are up against. The Government WILL be briefed by Qantas in advance and you should expect them to aid and abet Qantas managment. You should also expect CASA, ATSB, etc to follow suit if they want to keep their jobs. You can expect the Packer owned press to give you a bucketing as well. My guess would be that the Qantas Board is united as one behind GD, and there will have been very considerable behind the scenes planning for this that will only become apparent when action starts. For example, letting in Air NZ, Singapore, etc for the duration of any dispute.
Battle number one is going to be for public opinion. I've mentioned this previously. If you cannot win this battle then game over - you lose.
In the Patrick partners dispute, the wharfies won the public opinion battle, managment came in with black hooded guys with attack dogs and the public didnt like it. The wharfies then made a very compelling case, ran a brilliant picket line and won the public relations battle. Common sense then prevailed and a negotiated solution was reached that was a win/win for all. The "scabs" who tried to work the docks were reviled by the wharfies and discarded by management by the way.
I guess the question is how good is the FA's union? Are Qantas conditions better than they should be? Are work practices archaic? How do they compare with international standards? I don't know the answer. Maybe you need to decide whats worth fighting for and what is worth giving away. Its up to you.
2) The second point is what can other Qantas staff do about it? Who is on your side? Is the ACTU lined up? What about the Labor Party? Are there any other unions you can call on? My guess is that Lame's and Pilots can do SFA about this unless you act as ONE, like the wharfies did, and when the Airline and Government start throwing writs around, you tell them where to stick it.
My guess is that Qantas WILL use the law in the dirtiest way possible, for example individual writs to each pilot and Lame. The only way you can beat that tactic is to operate as ONE. The minute a few of you break ranks ANYWHERE, you are done for.
In my opinion, the most you FA's can hope for is a negotiated settlement so you had better work out what you want and what you can give to the company. In other words, what is a win/win solution for both of you?
By the way, if I were you, I would immediately get the message out to family and friends NOT to make plans to fly Qantas in the near future because of the threat of industrial disruption and safety concerns over strike breaking staff. That should get management's attention.
1) Qantas is going to have a go at breaking the FA's union. Thats pretty obvious, otherwise they would have taken steps to control the obvious effects of the London and fixed term hires on staff morale.
The precedents for this are the Wharves dispute in Melbourne (Patrick Partners) and the pilots dispute. Both of these are worth studying.
There are a number of ways that this can play out and I certainly don't know all of them.
The first point you need to know is what you are up against. The Government WILL be briefed by Qantas in advance and you should expect them to aid and abet Qantas managment. You should also expect CASA, ATSB, etc to follow suit if they want to keep their jobs. You can expect the Packer owned press to give you a bucketing as well. My guess would be that the Qantas Board is united as one behind GD, and there will have been very considerable behind the scenes planning for this that will only become apparent when action starts. For example, letting in Air NZ, Singapore, etc for the duration of any dispute.
Battle number one is going to be for public opinion. I've mentioned this previously. If you cannot win this battle then game over - you lose.
In the Patrick partners dispute, the wharfies won the public opinion battle, managment came in with black hooded guys with attack dogs and the public didnt like it. The wharfies then made a very compelling case, ran a brilliant picket line and won the public relations battle. Common sense then prevailed and a negotiated solution was reached that was a win/win for all. The "scabs" who tried to work the docks were reviled by the wharfies and discarded by management by the way.
I guess the question is how good is the FA's union? Are Qantas conditions better than they should be? Are work practices archaic? How do they compare with international standards? I don't know the answer. Maybe you need to decide whats worth fighting for and what is worth giving away. Its up to you.
2) The second point is what can other Qantas staff do about it? Who is on your side? Is the ACTU lined up? What about the Labor Party? Are there any other unions you can call on? My guess is that Lame's and Pilots can do SFA about this unless you act as ONE, like the wharfies did, and when the Airline and Government start throwing writs around, you tell them where to stick it.
My guess is that Qantas WILL use the law in the dirtiest way possible, for example individual writs to each pilot and Lame. The only way you can beat that tactic is to operate as ONE. The minute a few of you break ranks ANYWHERE, you are done for.
In my opinion, the most you FA's can hope for is a negotiated settlement so you had better work out what you want and what you can give to the company. In other words, what is a win/win solution for both of you?
By the way, if I were you, I would immediately get the message out to family and friends NOT to make plans to fly Qantas in the near future because of the threat of industrial disruption and safety concerns over strike breaking staff. That should get management's attention.
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Zaptas,
To address the two points that you raised in regard to my post.
Firstly, you (like many others on this forum I might add) mention the poor Qantas inflight service. But how many make the connection between management's attitude to staff and staff's attitude to customers.
In the military they always used to talk about loyalty up and down the chain of command. Personally, I only ever saw an expectation of loyalty up the chain of command. Qantas is going through a similar process. As far as QF are concerned, all that their staff represent is a drain on the bottom line. If staff are treated this way. morale plummets (as I believe it currently is). With very low morale, service standards will fall. When cabin crew mention to me that a customer is upset about something I tell them to advise the passenger to write to Geoff Dixon and see how much he cares.
Secondly, while you might not equate employees pay to executives pay, I'm sure that every QF employee coming up for an EBA in the next round certainly will. You said that executives earn their money because they regularly make decisions that could cost millions and bankrupt the company. I think given the right (wrong?) weather conditions and operational scenario, pilots make similarly important decisions. So do engineers who service the aircraft. So do cabin crew who may have to evacuate an aircraft full of passengers. So does nearly everybody who plays a part in keeping these steel tubes safely in the air - away from the confines of a plush office.
One final question - are you advocating business without morals? James Hardie, I think, followed that route and I hope that some of their executives will now face the full force of the law as a conseqeunce.
To address the two points that you raised in regard to my post.
Firstly, you (like many others on this forum I might add) mention the poor Qantas inflight service. But how many make the connection between management's attitude to staff and staff's attitude to customers.
In the military they always used to talk about loyalty up and down the chain of command. Personally, I only ever saw an expectation of loyalty up the chain of command. Qantas is going through a similar process. As far as QF are concerned, all that their staff represent is a drain on the bottom line. If staff are treated this way. morale plummets (as I believe it currently is). With very low morale, service standards will fall. When cabin crew mention to me that a customer is upset about something I tell them to advise the passenger to write to Geoff Dixon and see how much he cares.
Secondly, while you might not equate employees pay to executives pay, I'm sure that every QF employee coming up for an EBA in the next round certainly will. You said that executives earn their money because they regularly make decisions that could cost millions and bankrupt the company. I think given the right (wrong?) weather conditions and operational scenario, pilots make similarly important decisions. So do engineers who service the aircraft. So do cabin crew who may have to evacuate an aircraft full of passengers. So does nearly everybody who plays a part in keeping these steel tubes safely in the air - away from the confines of a plush office.
One final question - are you advocating business without morals? James Hardie, I think, followed that route and I hope that some of their executives will now face the full force of the law as a conseqeunce.
Last edited by Three Bars; 19th Oct 2004 at 23:35.
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
"Kaptin M. always playing the scabcard."
Do you have another more commonly used name for people who KNOWINGLY take others' jobs during an industrial dispute, Z.B.?
"Are you really drawing a connection between industrial relations and the breakdown of civilized society?"
I'm drawing a connection between the way people behave - regardless of whether it's an industrial relations event, or a picnic.
Dixon and Oldmeadow are now OPENLY ENCOURAGING some Australians to fight against, and try to destroy the efforts the current employees are making to SAVE their positions.
As children living in a civilised society, most of us were raised by our parents and teachers, to follow a set of moral and ethical guidelines...don't steal...don't kill.....tell the truth.....lightly gained is lightly valued.
Whether Oldmeadow and Dixon were raised this way might seem highly debatable!
Where is the credibility of a CEO who attempts to bring the employees beneath him to the lowest level possible, whilst simultaneously seeking outrageous INCREASES to his already enormous benefits and multi-million dollar income.
Absolute garbage - Dixon is one of the HIGHEST paid airline CEO's in the world!
Sunfish states, " Qantas is going to have a go at breaking the FA's union..... you should expect them (the Government) to aid and abet Qantas managment."
Look at the BIG picture - this is an attempt to ultimately dismantle Australia's single biggest union, the TWU.
And with the Howard Liberal government now freshly elected for another 3 years, and with control of the Senate as well, wasn't this to be expected?
It seems to me, that under Bush in the US, management greed at the expense of the ordinary worker (by the outsourcing of jobs to other countries - namely mainly China) has flourished.
Howard has followed Bush's ideology of "Reward the people at the top of the company, and companies will flourish, thereby creating more wealth for the country, and providing employees with work".
Problem is, the employees are NOT US residents, likewise the jobs of QANTAS employees that were once held by Australians, and Australian residents, are now increasingly being outsourced to cheap, overseas labour.
Which brings me back to a question Zapatas Blood asks, "Do you know how cabin crew at Thai are paid? Or Malaysian? Are you aware of what "min rest" means to cabin crew at Air China?"
Having worked with Malaysian and Singapore Airlines, I can answer "Yes" to part of that question.
Let me ask you, ZB a question or two.
Do you know how many MORE cabin crew each of those carriers has on say a B747, than QANTAS?
Answer - Around 7 - 10 MORE!
Do you know which Hotels the crews from those airlines are accomodated in on stays?
Answer - The very best..the Sheratons, the Hiltons, the Hyatts. And isn't it accomodation costs that Dixon is using as his reason for wanting crews based in the U.K.!!
Enough from me for now.
Currently I am a QF FF'er, and have my family and myself booked on FOUR QANTAS flights, as full fare paying pax, in the next 4 weeks.
If this un-Australian plan to screw the Australian F/A's proceeds, I shall be taking my future $$$'s elsewhere, Mr Dixon!
Do you have another more commonly used name for people who KNOWINGLY take others' jobs during an industrial dispute, Z.B.?
"Are you really drawing a connection between industrial relations and the breakdown of civilized society?"
I'm drawing a connection between the way people behave - regardless of whether it's an industrial relations event, or a picnic.
Dixon and Oldmeadow are now OPENLY ENCOURAGING some Australians to fight against, and try to destroy the efforts the current employees are making to SAVE their positions.
As children living in a civilised society, most of us were raised by our parents and teachers, to follow a set of moral and ethical guidelines...don't steal...don't kill.....tell the truth.....lightly gained is lightly valued.
Whether Oldmeadow and Dixon were raised this way might seem highly debatable!
Where is the credibility of a CEO who attempts to bring the employees beneath him to the lowest level possible, whilst simultaneously seeking outrageous INCREASES to his already enormous benefits and multi-million dollar income.
Compared to CEO's at AA,DL,AC,BA and the like, Dixon is pretty good value.
Sunfish states, " Qantas is going to have a go at breaking the FA's union..... you should expect them (the Government) to aid and abet Qantas managment."
Look at the BIG picture - this is an attempt to ultimately dismantle Australia's single biggest union, the TWU.
And with the Howard Liberal government now freshly elected for another 3 years, and with control of the Senate as well, wasn't this to be expected?
It seems to me, that under Bush in the US, management greed at the expense of the ordinary worker (by the outsourcing of jobs to other countries - namely mainly China) has flourished.
Howard has followed Bush's ideology of "Reward the people at the top of the company, and companies will flourish, thereby creating more wealth for the country, and providing employees with work".
Problem is, the employees are NOT US residents, likewise the jobs of QANTAS employees that were once held by Australians, and Australian residents, are now increasingly being outsourced to cheap, overseas labour.
Which brings me back to a question Zapatas Blood asks, "Do you know how cabin crew at Thai are paid? Or Malaysian? Are you aware of what "min rest" means to cabin crew at Air China?"
Having worked with Malaysian and Singapore Airlines, I can answer "Yes" to part of that question.
Let me ask you, ZB a question or two.
Do you know how many MORE cabin crew each of those carriers has on say a B747, than QANTAS?
Answer - Around 7 - 10 MORE!
Do you know which Hotels the crews from those airlines are accomodated in on stays?
Answer - The very best..the Sheratons, the Hiltons, the Hyatts. And isn't it accomodation costs that Dixon is using as his reason for wanting crews based in the U.K.!!
Enough from me for now.
Currently I am a QF FF'er, and have my family and myself booked on FOUR QANTAS flights, as full fare paying pax, in the next 4 weeks.
If this un-Australian plan to screw the Australian F/A's proceeds, I shall be taking my future $$$'s elsewhere, Mr Dixon!
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Interesting info - when Leo Mullin was CEO of Delta, he took a 58% decrease in pay and stock options for 2002. He still netted 32.4 Million USD that year.
Doug Steedland, CEO Northwest just took a huge drop in pay and will nett this year 3.7 million USD.
To the FA's at QF. My understanding is the FAAA agreed to wage freezes during the SARS outbreak. Have these freezes been thawed or is salary still at SARS level. Is there an agreement to restore wages at some point in the future? Also, are shares still being paid to QF staff each year.
Doug Steedland, CEO Northwest just took a huge drop in pay and will nett this year 3.7 million USD.
To the FA's at QF. My understanding is the FAAA agreed to wage freezes during the SARS outbreak. Have these freezes been thawed or is salary still at SARS level. Is there an agreement to restore wages at some point in the future? Also, are shares still being paid to QF staff each year.
Nunc est bibendum
oicur, Since the SARS freeze, we've all negotiated EBAs with pay rises but we'll never get back the 3-5% lost by the freeze. We don't get shares anymore. I don't know why and we haven't had them for the last couple of years. Some people say that the company reckon there is a 'tax' issue. The only issue I can see is that when they 'paid' me $1K, I only got about $600 in the bank. That was also $1K flat whether you earnt $15K or $500K.
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This information a cut and paste from the International FAAA-
Please do not reply to this email. Send all correspondence to [email protected]
October 20, 2004
Attention: All Qantas Long Haul Flight Attendants
A DREAM SHATTERED
Reprinted below is a letter received by the FAAA from a fixed term flight attendant that needs no further comment.
I would like to become a member of the FAAA after my colleagues and I from one the Qantas Flight Attendant training classes attended a meeting with you.
It has been a long time dream of mine to become a flight attendant and what an honour it was at the beginning to be accepted for training into Qantas, the leading airline in the world. But my thoughts have changed and frankly I am scared of the unknown situation that has presented itself to me.
I was given a contract for a three months fixed term for training under the proviso that I not have any other employment during this time. Three months isn't long but I thought ok – I've got my foot in the door and there may be a chance of maybe getting a full time position if I pass all the training. But at that stage, I was unaware of what Qantas' intentions were.
Therefore I agreed, I was in a group of wonderful people. We all trained so hard, as this was our dream and we wanted it so badly even with training at ridiculous hours.
During our time of training, there were lots of rumours, for instance that we were only being trained just in case of a strike from the full time flight attendants. We were given instructions about confidentiality and not to give any information to anyone about what we are being trained for. Our EP instructors were excellent teachers but they had no information for us – there were also rumours that we could be offered full time positions in London but whoever we asked we hit a brick wall and no one could tell us anything of what was going on.
To tell you the truth, “the xxxx hit the fan” on our last day of training. All the ones in our group that had passed the training exams were so excited to learn that we were now going to get fitted for our Qantas International Uniforms. To our disgust we were fitted with King Gee pants and a polo top. We wondered why they were treating us differently after all the intense physically draining intense training we had just completed and passed. We thought that the Qantas image was professional and corporate and something to be proud to wear but what we were fitted for was of a very poor dress standard.
Then a few of us were given contracts again – stating that we were not guaranteed fixed term – three months. And would be given four weeks notice of termination. People in my group were so mad, some of us giving up full time positions for a chance to become a Qantas International Flight Attendant.
I am totally and utterly disgusted in how Qantas is treating us – they don't seem to want us to become first class flight attendants – they just want us as back-up if the strike goes ahead. This is shattering news as we are after full time positions not just for a week or two and then left out in the cold with no job and no security
What really made me scared – if there is a strike we were told that we would not be flying with professional flight attendants? We “strike-breakers” would fly together and how dangerous does that sound. We were told that we could be working in all areas – first class, business and economy. Personally if I were a passenger who paid for a first class ticket I would expect first class service, not a person who has minimal training of only eleven days. I passed the crash course but I would have been happy to train for longer as to benefit the service and safety of the passengers I would be entrusted to serve. Experience is gained from working with other more experienced people and not literally chucked in at the deep end as they were implying we would be doing.
Our training group is scared that we are becoming the meat in the sandwich of this whole affair. What is going to happen to us? We want to become flight attendants and no one will answer our questions! The most information we received was only on our last day of training and it only feels like the only people we can trust is the FAAA and ourselves.
Therefore please find the following completed application forms for my membership with the Flight Attendant Association Australia .
Yours sincerely,
xxxx xxxx
This newsletter was written and authorised by
Michael Mijatov, Divisional Secretary - International
-------------------------------------------------------------
Our Bangkok based flight attendants are also being given two day course entitled " How To Be A CSM In Three Easy Steps".
For the life of me I cant imagine there would be too many tech crew eager to fly with a cabin full of such well meaning yet dangerously inexperienced cabin crew.
Remember how hard it was to get eight beers put on ice??????????
Swiss Cheese????
The holes seem to be beginning to line up to me.
Oh well, never mind.................. nothing must come in the way of Geoff"s bonus.
L2P "S.T.R"
Please do not reply to this email. Send all correspondence to [email protected]
October 20, 2004
Attention: All Qantas Long Haul Flight Attendants
A DREAM SHATTERED
Reprinted below is a letter received by the FAAA from a fixed term flight attendant that needs no further comment.
I would like to become a member of the FAAA after my colleagues and I from one the Qantas Flight Attendant training classes attended a meeting with you.
It has been a long time dream of mine to become a flight attendant and what an honour it was at the beginning to be accepted for training into Qantas, the leading airline in the world. But my thoughts have changed and frankly I am scared of the unknown situation that has presented itself to me.
I was given a contract for a three months fixed term for training under the proviso that I not have any other employment during this time. Three months isn't long but I thought ok – I've got my foot in the door and there may be a chance of maybe getting a full time position if I pass all the training. But at that stage, I was unaware of what Qantas' intentions were.
Therefore I agreed, I was in a group of wonderful people. We all trained so hard, as this was our dream and we wanted it so badly even with training at ridiculous hours.
During our time of training, there were lots of rumours, for instance that we were only being trained just in case of a strike from the full time flight attendants. We were given instructions about confidentiality and not to give any information to anyone about what we are being trained for. Our EP instructors were excellent teachers but they had no information for us – there were also rumours that we could be offered full time positions in London but whoever we asked we hit a brick wall and no one could tell us anything of what was going on.
To tell you the truth, “the xxxx hit the fan” on our last day of training. All the ones in our group that had passed the training exams were so excited to learn that we were now going to get fitted for our Qantas International Uniforms. To our disgust we were fitted with King Gee pants and a polo top. We wondered why they were treating us differently after all the intense physically draining intense training we had just completed and passed. We thought that the Qantas image was professional and corporate and something to be proud to wear but what we were fitted for was of a very poor dress standard.
Then a few of us were given contracts again – stating that we were not guaranteed fixed term – three months. And would be given four weeks notice of termination. People in my group were so mad, some of us giving up full time positions for a chance to become a Qantas International Flight Attendant.
I am totally and utterly disgusted in how Qantas is treating us – they don't seem to want us to become first class flight attendants – they just want us as back-up if the strike goes ahead. This is shattering news as we are after full time positions not just for a week or two and then left out in the cold with no job and no security
What really made me scared – if there is a strike we were told that we would not be flying with professional flight attendants? We “strike-breakers” would fly together and how dangerous does that sound. We were told that we could be working in all areas – first class, business and economy. Personally if I were a passenger who paid for a first class ticket I would expect first class service, not a person who has minimal training of only eleven days. I passed the crash course but I would have been happy to train for longer as to benefit the service and safety of the passengers I would be entrusted to serve. Experience is gained from working with other more experienced people and not literally chucked in at the deep end as they were implying we would be doing.
Our training group is scared that we are becoming the meat in the sandwich of this whole affair. What is going to happen to us? We want to become flight attendants and no one will answer our questions! The most information we received was only on our last day of training and it only feels like the only people we can trust is the FAAA and ourselves.
Therefore please find the following completed application forms for my membership with the Flight Attendant Association Australia .
Yours sincerely,
xxxx xxxx
This newsletter was written and authorised by
Michael Mijatov, Divisional Secretary - International
-------------------------------------------------------------
Our Bangkok based flight attendants are also being given two day course entitled " How To Be A CSM In Three Easy Steps".
For the life of me I cant imagine there would be too many tech crew eager to fly with a cabin full of such well meaning yet dangerously inexperienced cabin crew.
Remember how hard it was to get eight beers put on ice??????????
Swiss Cheese????
The holes seem to be beginning to line up to me.
Oh well, never mind.................. nothing must come in the way of Geoff"s bonus.
L2P "S.T.R"
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Great post sunfish and three bars.
Those post have lifted the standard on this topic. I am now waiting for the QF trolls the reply.
Can anybody give a ball park date for when the strike will occur...or will this not be determined until after the sick-out....or will this be kept quiet until notification to the IRC?
U2
Those post have lifted the standard on this topic. I am now waiting for the QF trolls the reply.
Can anybody give a ball park date for when the strike will occur...or will this not be determined until after the sick-out....or will this be kept quiet until notification to the IRC?
U2
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U2,
The current long haul fa EBA expires on Dec 17th. From Dec 18th long haul crew can take protected industrial action but they must give three days notice to QF, so Dec 21st would be the earliest date.
The FAAA has made it clear they will only recommend/support protected industrial action. The threat of a mass sick out, which I personally believe a lot of crew will agree with, has been organised by a separate group of crew.
The current long haul fa EBA expires on Dec 17th. From Dec 18th long haul crew can take protected industrial action but they must give three days notice to QF, so Dec 21st would be the earliest date.
The FAAA has made it clear they will only recommend/support protected industrial action. The threat of a mass sick out, which I personally believe a lot of crew will agree with, has been organised by a separate group of crew.
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Can I recommend to all Qantas crew (and any other interested parties) an excellent film-documentary titled 'The Corporation'? I don't know about Australia but it is currently showing at Village Hoyts Queen St, Auckland. Some of you might be able to nip in during an overnight. There are multiple showings. It provides excellent insight into what drives large corporate organisations, such as Qantas! Here is a link:
http://www.village.co.nz/vistait/vil...eID=HO00001194
http://www.village.co.nz/vistait/vil...eID=HO00001194
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Where ever there is sprayin'
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Standby FA's
A friend of mine has just been through the very rushed FA course. They did it over a course of ten nights.
My friend has always wanted to be a hostie and when she got this job she was so excited and of course believed everything she was told! She, like all the others on the course, are now concerned as to what they have got themselves involved with.
I really hope they are not treated badly by the rest of QF crew, as they all went into this pretty blind and have now discovered nothing was quite what it seemed. And like all the rest of us, all this girl wants is her dream job, and thought thats where she was headed.
It is not a nice situation for the current FA's and the new 'standbys'.
Cheers,
Troup.
My friend has always wanted to be a hostie and when she got this job she was so excited and of course believed everything she was told! She, like all the others on the course, are now concerned as to what they have got themselves involved with.
I really hope they are not treated badly by the rest of QF crew, as they all went into this pretty blind and have now discovered nothing was quite what it seemed. And like all the rest of us, all this girl wants is her dream job, and thought thats where she was headed.
It is not a nice situation for the current FA's and the new 'standbys'.
Cheers,
Troup.
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Australia
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A friend conducted the interview for the 'new people' on 3 month contracts. He/she has been told by the company that they will never fly with existing crew and there is no chance of them ever being made permanent. Too much animosity if permanent crew found out they were working with strike breakers.
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
That would be par for the course, str.
Post 1989 the airlines refused (unofficially, of course) to allow scabs and non-scabs to work together by not employing the "cleanskins".
The head of the Ansett Pilots' Union cited Safety as the reason.
Apparently if QANTAS have stated that the strikebreakers would not be allowed to mix with the non-scabs, they must also consider that they (QF) are creating a safety issue by employing these people.
Maybe Geoff will set up ANOTHER airline, just for the 3-monthers!!
Post 1989 the airlines refused (unofficially, of course) to allow scabs and non-scabs to work together by not employing the "cleanskins".
The head of the Ansett Pilots' Union cited Safety as the reason.
Apparently if QANTAS have stated that the strikebreakers would not be allowed to mix with the non-scabs, they must also consider that they (QF) are creating a safety issue by employing these people.
Maybe Geoff will set up ANOTHER airline, just for the 3-monthers!!
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: OZ
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I think that one thing that all parties must appreciate is that Australians don't really want to pay for first class travel (GENERALLY). By increasing LCC we have increased the customer base and affordabliltym therby reducing first class passengers.
However, in Asia, where people dress up just to go down to the local mini-mart, many people who can afford to fly will pay extra to get a premium service. Additionally, they also prefer to fly national or Asian carriers. Additionally, labour is much cheaper than in OZ.
The point that I'm trying to make is that I don't think that QF longhaul, in its current form will be competitive in the premuium service market, especially in Asia.
To see this we only have to look at how QF have set up Australian to service the Japan region and soon to be JETSTAR Asia to be the LCC model.
What the F/A must appreciate is that the service that they used to provide is no longer economically desired.
i.e Australian (GENERALLY) don't want to pay a high price for a premium service they don't really want. We are happy to fly VB or Jetstar, so long as we get there safely.
In saying this the flight attendants must realise that to keep their jobs and pay they need to win as one. From reading other posts here it is a obvious that if they fracture or fall they are going to be screwed.
"United you prosper, divided you lose."
I'm sticking my neck out here, but I'll accepted any criticism.
U2
However, in Asia, where people dress up just to go down to the local mini-mart, many people who can afford to fly will pay extra to get a premium service. Additionally, they also prefer to fly national or Asian carriers. Additionally, labour is much cheaper than in OZ.
The point that I'm trying to make is that I don't think that QF longhaul, in its current form will be competitive in the premuium service market, especially in Asia.
To see this we only have to look at how QF have set up Australian to service the Japan region and soon to be JETSTAR Asia to be the LCC model.
What the F/A must appreciate is that the service that they used to provide is no longer economically desired.
i.e Australian (GENERALLY) don't want to pay a high price for a premium service they don't really want. We are happy to fly VB or Jetstar, so long as we get there safely.
In saying this the flight attendants must realise that to keep their jobs and pay they need to win as one. From reading other posts here it is a obvious that if they fracture or fall they are going to be screwed.
"United you prosper, divided you lose."
I'm sticking my neck out here, but I'll accepted any criticism.
U2
