What's Happening at Airways NZ??
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Piggy my old chap.... As Slackie so rightly points out the Training Review has yet to be released and I'm sure most of us will be long underground before it ever sees the light of day...........
However being in the frozen wastelands and close to the action its fair to say that I have talked to the authors and have a reasonable idea of what the reports says......In fact, I understand that I'm mentioned in the report as person suitable to help rearrange certain parts of the training organisation!
The report was not well received by Aunty, such that the authors were sent away to rewrite certain parts...a move they have resisted!
In general terms it slated our recruitment system, and hence those wonderful HR persons. It slated the Training Centre (the management) pointing out that its product now is far worse than that turned out may years ago. It suggests that charging for initial ATC training is a real DUM idea............
Its not just based on a couple of peoples ideas, but based on a lot of factual data and without having read it I believe the authors have done a dam fine job! Just a shame it now resides 6ft underground.
But on a happier note we are only loosing 6 controllers this week, one remains with Aunty but operating in Tawain, the other five are off to pastures greener
However being in the frozen wastelands and close to the action its fair to say that I have talked to the authors and have a reasonable idea of what the reports says......In fact, I understand that I'm mentioned in the report as person suitable to help rearrange certain parts of the training organisation!
The report was not well received by Aunty, such that the authors were sent away to rewrite certain parts...a move they have resisted!
In general terms it slated our recruitment system, and hence those wonderful HR persons. It slated the Training Centre (the management) pointing out that its product now is far worse than that turned out may years ago. It suggests that charging for initial ATC training is a real DUM idea............
Its not just based on a couple of peoples ideas, but based on a lot of factual data and without having read it I believe the authors have done a dam fine job! Just a shame it now resides 6ft underground.
But on a happier note we are only loosing 6 controllers this week, one remains with Aunty but operating in Tawain, the other five are off to pastures greener
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Esteemed Rotty - many thanks for the info. Oh dear me, it does sound a little like Auntie has her knickers in a twist. I'm sorry to hear what you chaps are going through, and I shall be monitoring any developments as closely as I am able.
Pig
Pig
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The Techs have also failed to ratify their latest pay offer, they have also rejected a further verbal offer. Mean time NZALPA and Aunty have meet a couple of times and Aunty has gone away to consider their position.....
Aunty is having problems pleading poverty, every day in the newspaper another airline anounces that its putting more tin budgies in the air!
Meanwhile, prices here in the frozen wastelands continue to rise faster than any pay offer!
Aunty is having problems pleading poverty, every day in the newspaper another airline anounces that its putting more tin budgies in the air!
Meanwhile, prices here in the frozen wastelands continue to rise faster than any pay offer!
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So where to from here? Is it back to the drawing board? How much is Airways giving Air NZ and the Government this year? It sounds like revenue will be up with the domestic air war that has begun, involving the more profitable main trunk routes with all airlines utilising higher fee generating jets. And that's with leaving fees at the current level. Why not increase them 1% and sort out the contractual issues? Doesn't seem too hard from where I'm sitting. Even better increase them in line with CPI, that will ensure there is plenty in the pot to pay substantially more.
Seems as though Aunty is dragging her feet over negotiations with both parties at the moment .....
Why not increase them 1% and sort out the contractual issues?
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That's not surprising considering the airspace model they use
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I think the service issues in NZ are caused by a number of problems that dear old Aunty has no idea how to fix!
Firstly the workforce....the controllers are really starting to loose interest in the job. They have worked hard for the last ten years keeping the ship afloat and have been totally ignored, some recognition in the form of a decent payrise would help!
Secondly, we just don't have enough warm bodies on the seats, rosters get stretched, troops get tired and once again they loose interest.
Thirdly, all the troops we have are talking to tin budgies pretty much full time...therefore we have vitually nobody working on procedures, technology and all that stuff!
I won't mention our training system............
So its simple, its only going to get worse before it gets worse.............
Firstly the workforce....the controllers are really starting to loose interest in the job. They have worked hard for the last ten years keeping the ship afloat and have been totally ignored, some recognition in the form of a decent payrise would help!
Secondly, we just don't have enough warm bodies on the seats, rosters get stretched, troops get tired and once again they loose interest.
Thirdly, all the troops we have are talking to tin budgies pretty much full time...therefore we have vitually nobody working on procedures, technology and all that stuff!
I won't mention our training system............
So its simple, its only going to get worse before it gets worse.............
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Are things really that bad??
I am an ATCO working in Europe I was looking a NZ as a place to work, I was realy keen until I started reading this thread.
Are things really this bad,
would you say stay away???
Are things really this bad,
would you say stay away???
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Yes, I would. Several contractual, managerial, and training issues need to be sorted before I would bother to return. You'd have to save hard to afford a return trip to Europe once you're there too! 
At present it sounds like you could expect extended duty on a regular basis, a long way to go to end up disappointed, so do not set your work place expectations very high if you decide to take the plunge.
At present it sounds like you could expect extended duty on a regular basis, a long way to go to end up disappointed, so do not set your work place expectations very high if you decide to take the plunge.
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Currently working in central Europe where the students dont get paid much... but, depending on personal circumstance, it is a a liveable wage... just. Price of beer helps at about A$1.0 a pint though. Thought the studes were hard done by... Then I remembered my Airways experience where the studes pay towards their initial ATC training. In my humble opinion, not paying your "staff" during training does not help to aid recruitment. And when you consider that the students are required to pilot the tower sim for each other, they appear at times to be actually paying for the priveledge to work for Airways Tc by providing a valuable & essential service during their own training! Not good! In many parts of the world, professional trained & standardised & competent employees are paid to do this. How many times has an exercise been complicated by inept piloting I wonder?
Additionally I understand that some Towers do not require a procedural approach rating - yet if a student passes his tower training and then fails the procedural approach element he/she fails completely and departs. Would it not be better to let some go through to said towers, gain some experience, and knowledge, and then do the procedural approach elements of the App course later on? Some may still fail but you would get some bums on seats in the meantime (if of course you need them at these non procedural towers in the first place).
Just my $2 worth
Good luck to all involved in the training system down there.
Regards
DogGone
Additionally I understand that some Towers do not require a procedural approach rating - yet if a student passes his tower training and then fails the procedural approach element he/she fails completely and departs. Would it not be better to let some go through to said towers, gain some experience, and knowledge, and then do the procedural approach elements of the App course later on? Some may still fail but you would get some bums on seats in the meantime (if of course you need them at these non procedural towers in the first place).
Just my $2 worth
Good luck to all involved in the training system down there.
Regards
DogGone
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BurglarsDog:
Your comments show that you are out of touch with the current Tower sim training environment. Things have changed somewhat - it'd probably blow your mind.
By the way 2c down here are worth nothing now. They have gone the way of the moa. Cheers.
Your comments show that you are out of touch with the current Tower sim training environment. Things have changed somewhat - it'd probably blow your mind.
By the way 2c down here are worth nothing now. They have gone the way of the moa. Cheers.
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BaldEd.
Probably as its been over 12 months!
So do they employ sim pilots now?
And, as you are obviously closer to the River Avon than me at present, any news of the "report" slating certain elements of the training Centre?
Not looking to stir; but believe that Airways have the potential to be an outstanding training org / employer - some just need to realise this!
Prost DogGone
Probably as its been over 12 months!
So do they employ sim pilots now?
And, as you are obviously closer to the River Avon than me at present, any news of the "report" slating certain elements of the training Centre?
Not looking to stir; but believe that Airways have the potential to be an outstanding training org / employer - some just need to realise this!
Prost DogGone
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BD
I noted your belated raising of the value of your comments.
Yup, Airways now employ tower sim pilots - TotalControl (new tower sim) demands a higher standard than ATC trainees can provide.
The old v-belt hurdy gurdy has been put out to pasture - it's all electrons and projectors now since the training was moved out to be next to the centre.
Haven't clapped eyes on the report yet. Should be an interesting read.
I noted your belated raising of the value of your comments.
Yup, Airways now employ tower sim pilots - TotalControl (new tower sim) demands a higher standard than ATC trainees can provide.
The old v-belt hurdy gurdy has been put out to pasture - it's all electrons and projectors now since the training was moved out to be next to the centre.Haven't clapped eyes on the report yet. Should be an interesting read.
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Training Review
BaldEd
Don't be suprised if you don't get to see the full report.
You might only get to see the Executive Summary, which won't hold all the answers.
Are sabbaticals being given to controllers again, or is that just reserved for Regional Management staff???
Don't be suprised if you don't get to see the full report.
You might only get to see the Executive Summary, which won't hold all the answers.
Are sabbaticals being given to controllers again, or is that just reserved for Regional Management staff???
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An up-date
All
For your info
1)Training report summary out - as correctly predicted - did not contain much.
2) 30 October 2007
Agreement was reached in principle between Airways and ALPA
2 year contract
Year 1 - 5%, backdated 01.04.07.
Year 2 - 2%, adjusted CPI, full superability, NZ$4,000.00 lum sum payable 01.07.08.
My opinion, I will be surprised if it goes thro' ratification (just from what I am hearing around me)
I understand two from the Bay sector have withdrawn from their training and are returning to the ME, and one off the Area sector resigned last Friday.
Tech,s still to resolve their contract, and have turned down three offers.
Sabbaticals at this point in time apply to all other sectors except ATC.
SAS
For your info
1)Training report summary out - as correctly predicted - did not contain much.
2) 30 October 2007
Agreement was reached in principle between Airways and ALPA
2 year contract
Year 1 - 5%, backdated 01.04.07.
Year 2 - 2%, adjusted CPI, full superability, NZ$4,000.00 lum sum payable 01.07.08.
My opinion, I will be surprised if it goes thro' ratification (just from what I am hearing around me)
I understand two from the Bay sector have withdrawn from their training and are returning to the ME, and one off the Area sector resigned last Friday.
Tech,s still to resolve their contract, and have turned down three offers.
Sabbaticals at this point in time apply to all other sectors except ATC.
SAS