Jet2 Autumn 2014

[Lord Spandex Masher]

No. You don't need to explain.
So you did understand? Or you didn't, like you first suggested?
I understand that you are in the lowest paid medium to large sized jet carrier in the UK, with the worst working conditions and lowest grade of management by fear.
Actually you are wrong. But I couldn't give a :mad: either way.

I also get the picture that you're a patronising, pole climbing management wannabe, who quite frankly knows absolutely no better, because you joined from an even worse airline.
Wrong again. Not a good record so far. You really know absolutely nothing about me, what I know or what I think.

Does that cover it?
Cover what? Your difficulty in understanding a sentence or simple mathematics? Not really.

[Artie Fufkin]

Rumour has it, the number of leavers has got so bad, the "once a year" recruitment policy is being binned, with year round, continuous recruitment replacing it.

Anyone else heard this one?

[Lord Spandex Masher]

No, another long day sailing and barbecuing actually, which is rather relaxing. And like I said you know nothing about me.

It's still not clear whether you understood simple maths or not...

As a Jet2 reject I wonder why you're so involved in this thread?

[Sean Dillon]

And into a new week...and 2 more resignations from the 757 fleet!

It's a good job there isn't such a thing as a winter flying program! Bets on when aircraft will be parked up?!

[Lord Spandex Masher]

What do you find so satisfying about resignations?

[Sean Dillon]

It's all positive news my little Prickly friend!

Think of all those good folk bettering their careers and employment packages by quite a margin, their job satisfaction and long-term choices. Think of all those guys that have been stuck on turbo-props for years that now have an opportunity to get onto a jet, and then ultimately move on themselves in a few years to that career airline...think of all those Pilot Apprentices that will be moving onto type-rating courses within/less than 12 months...

It's all fantastic industry stuff my little angry sailor! The fact you don't get it?! - Reverend Meeson Cool-Aid drinker!

Have a great day my little patronising, argumentative cabin boy!

[Lord Spandex Masher]

You've answered the wrong question. I didn't ask why it was good for the industry, which is readily apparent, but why you find them so personally satisfying. I don't see you posting about every resignation at other airlines.

Surely you should be enjoying your commute and time at Cranebank by now instead of teasing your Jet2 hard on everyday, you sad man.

[bluepilot]

Sean, congratulations, I hope your career move works out for you and the future brings all that you wish for. Can I ask you now please as a former colleague to leave those of us who are enjoying our career at Jet2 and also have hopes and dreams to let it go? You may have a dislike for your former employer but your posts are hurtful and unnecessary to your former colleagues. Thanks

[rumour mill]

This thread seems to have far less traffic from potential applicants than the last two years of recruiting. I wonder if that is due to a decrease in interest in the positions or people from the last two years who had a similarly difficult application process just can't be bothered applying? I certainly had to mentally prepare myself for another few months of misinformation and poor communication. Having previously been through a sim assessment and placed in the pool only to be eventually forgotten. I hope this year is a little different.

[rudolf]

I concur with bluepilot, SD grow up or take your bitter unwanted and childish vitriol elsewhere.

[Cliff Secord]

What is a cool aid drinker? You keep mentioning it. Koolaid is an American drink. Can't see the context you're using it in.

[Artie Fufkin]

From Wikipedia;

"Drinking the Kool-Aid" is a figure of speech commonly used in North America that refers to a person or group holding an unquestioned belief, argument, or philosophy without critical examination. It could also refer to knowingly going along with a doomed or dangerous idea because of peer pressure. The phrase oftentimes carries a negative connotation when applied to an individual or group. It can also be used ironically or humorously to refer to accepting an idea or changing a preference due to popularity, peer pressure, or persuasion. The phrase derives from the November 1978 Jonestown deaths, in which over 900 members of the Peoples Temple, who were followers of Jim Jones, committed suicide by drinking a mixture of a powdered soft drink flavoring agent laced with cyanide. Although the powder used in the incident included Flavor Aid, it was commonly referred to as Kool-Aid due to the latter's status as a genericized trademark.

[taxi_driver]

My point about Orion was that many fore runners of J2 have come and gone. Here today gone tomorrow. Many doing quite well, but caught up in the endless take overs and mergers in the industry.

Have management made any moves to steady the ship? Surely this is busy busy season?

[Boeingmann]

There is a 'BRICK-WALL' approaching

And you are heading straight for it. Anybody that has doubts about Jet2 all they need to do is look at the Dart Group share price which is at all time high. The City folks are no fools.

[CQ]

Richard Branson quote.
Learn to look after your staff first and the rest will follow.

Even FR have adopted a charm offensive to both customers and staff.
Where FR leads others follow, eventually.
Learn the lesson.

Air Crew ARE one of your most valuable assets.

[ZeBedie]

Just to add some perspective...in Monarch, all pilots are on an 85% percent contract with no prospect of 100% working.

[itsnotwhoyouknow]

Its not that we are saying other places aren't having a tough time, the threat of the next problem at Monarch must be awful, and many of us have gone through redundancies in the past, lets hope they stay and turn it around. I know Jet2 management will be licking their lips if Monarch were to fail, the influx of pilots would solve all of their problems... apart from the training aspect, the year round training program must be leading to TRE/TRI's looking elsewhere for more enjoyable employment.

Morale is at an all time low, management burying their heads in the sand and denying all knowledge. The rostering questionnaire due out will not be pretty reading, and the results will no doubt not be distributed to the workforce like the last one.

So no, things could be worse, and we know that, but with certain management factions and lack of care resignations will continue UFN!

[Facelookbovvered]

Jet2 in now the biggest employer of ex bmibaby pilots, the people at Norwegian that wanted/needed a Northern base have long since joined Jet2 or Ryanair, the ex baby pilots remaining in Monarch are now approaching the 3 year point since flying the 'bobby' so its not just a few days in the sim anymore.

[Flying Wild]

Which rostering questionnaire?

The one distributed to the yes men who will tell the company that everything is rosy.

[LoopGuru]

The application this year indicated that there would be some online tests, namely personality, numerical and verbal reasoning. So far only the personality test has appeared. A colleague says he had the same, but then another says he had the numerical reasoning test. Can anyone clarify what tests they have had? I'm starting to worry their online system is playing up again.

Regards
Loop

[papazulu]

Can anyone clarify what tests they have had?

Applied 1 week ago, got personality, verbal reasoning and numerical test. No email or acknowledgement so far, however the job-application page shows "received" status and that all online assessment have been completed.

Indeed their online recruitment system left a lot to be desired few years back, so hopefully this is a better version.

Good luck

PZ :uhoh:

[The Crew]

Dont expect to hear a thing from the recruitment department unless they need you. Like Norwegian, easyJet and the rest , they lack the decency of basic communication skills.

Ostensibly, the pilot employers can treat you as they wish because they know you have no other options or you certainly would not have gone through all the hassle of applying.

[JB007]

Well, over 100 of their pilots have got other options so they may want to start embracing that "Take me There" thing!

[Harry palmer]

For those who only received the personality test had you applied and completed the online tests previously within the last 12 months. I think it means your scores are still valid.

[Artie Fufkin]

JB007

Well, over 100 of their pilots have got other options so they may want to start embracing that "Take me There" thing!
not sure what you mean? I have in on "good authority" from LFFH that only 17 pilots have left in the last year, all of which were young FOs bound for BA long haul and they also think that Jet2 is an employer of choice.


:ugh:

[Chesty Morgan]

Ah, but he's biased. He's happy to enjoy last minute roster changes at his current employer but bemoans roster stability at his last.

Any sense there?

[JB007]

Hello Spandex! Missing you!

[Station_Calling]

I have in on "good authority" from LFFH that only 17 pilots have left in the last year, all of which were young FOs bound for BA long haul and they also think that Jet2 is an employer of choice.


Yes - mainly FO's but also Captains. Only 17? More than 17 alone from MAN have left. They're going to BA, FR, the sand pit. And BA short haul as well as LH. Complete rubbish you have been given "on good authority"

[LoopGuru]

For those who only received the personality test had you applied and completed the online tests previously within the last 12 months. I think it means your scores are still valid.

I last did the tests at the end of 2014. I've no idea if I passed them; like many others, I only received a PFO at the start of this year when it appeared Jet2 were about to be inundated with ex Monarch pilots.

My current application status says Under Review.

Loop

[Jet2_320]

Station_Calling what Artie Fufkin wrote is the nonsense management has been feeding the workforce since January. The actual figure is somewhere between 85 and 100 pilots. For the reasons why they have left us, have a look at all the negative comments in this topic.

[Chesty Morgan]

Certainly that rate isn't sustainable but it can only mean better things for those that stay.

BA or the desert lifestyles aren't as attractive as they used to be and commuting contracts in the Far East have far exceeded anything you'll get at Thiefrow or the Sandpit.

I have an 8 mile, 13 minute commute, I do two sectors a day, sometimes I work (but never fly) 6 days in a row but then I get at least 3 off and I do bugger all in the winter, which means I can go and spend a lot of time in another country's summer on full pay. The only time I get close to an FTL limit is when the French or Spanish get their knickers in a twist and go on strike (1 times use of discretion in 4 years). Compare that to BA where you will do 900 hours a year, normally three sector days (enjoy that 2 hour turnaround and visit to the crewroom between flights which makes your day even longer), normally night stop - in a different hotel each night as you do hotel tours around Europe - drive the M25 every other day or commute which used to cost me the better part of 500 quid a month at least. Yeah, yeah I know in 36 years time you'll be earning top scale but I'll be retired long before then and don't care anyway.

Lots of people here whine about management (I presume you think you can do better?) but who cares what they do. I get paid on time every month and have as little to do with management as possible, which is nothing. And no, I don't read Tailwind or the latest department communication.

I go to work, have a laugh, then go home.

Oh, and flying a 25 year old aeroplane is no different to flying a 2 week old one which I used to do regularly. They all break every now and again, it's your job to deal with it.

[A4]

.....I do two sectors a day, sometimes I work (but never fly) 6 days in a row but then I get at least 3 off and I do bugger all in the winter, which means I can go and spend a lot of time in another country's summer on full pay.

That sounds like my world 15 years ago - winter off, work hard in the Summer. In today's cut throat, cost efficient world do you think this is sustainable long term? Presumably the aircraft are paid for so that gives some cost saving. However, it looks like an accountants dream scenario to take the knife to it.

[Chesty Morgan]

Who knows?

But when I eventually end up working as hard as everyone else is now I think I'll be grateful for the slack years I'm having at the moment.

[Twiglet1]

NNUTS
Nothing new under the sun. What's wrong with F/O's moving on. Good luck to them. I know a Captain who joined Jet 2 and almost immediately asked to return to his previous employer (unlucky). Grass is green. Things may / may not get better and winter is only 3 and a half rosters away.

[TRY2FLY]

......winter is coming ..........


Right off to Jet Blast

[Spitfire Mk9]

Hi everybody!

I seem to have a problem creating a login profile on the Jet2.com careers page.

I get the following msg:
'Your log in credentials cannot be validated. You may have created an account in the past, if so please click the 'forgot your password' link on the Welcome page to reset your password.'

I can't recall having ever created an account in the past (I only got drunk once in my life having holes in my memory, but that was years ago in college :ugh::confused:).

Did anybody have the same problem?

Also, can anybody confirm the latest T&C.

You can PM me.

Thank you for the reply

Cheers

[cgwhitemonk11]

Been invited to an assessment on Aug 5th if anyone fancies meeting up the night before in LBA? PM me if you like. Experienced FO, non rated and non jet... 2300TT and applied on the day it opened, did the tests the following morning.

Also is the pay scale on PPJN correct? Could one assume that you would go in directly on the FO pay scale of circa 50k and not the SO pay scale? Because 50% of the SO scale during the first couple of months would be rough.

Any current Jet2ers who could clarify would be appreciated.

[heliusac]

Also is the pay scale on PPJN correct? Could one assume that you would go in directly on the FO pay scale of circa 50k and not the SO pay scale? Because 50% of the SO scale during the first couple of months would be rough.Not sure on the PPJN scales that 50kish is SFO not FO I think? SO is just for pilot apprentices so with your experience you could expect FO which is 40k something but maybe a current Jet 2 FO could correct me on that?

Expect 50% until end of line training, if non TR that will be 3-6 months depending on time of year. I think they changed things last year where if you go beyond 13 weeks and it is their fault they will increase the wage anyway.

Post 50% it is pot luck on contracts, you may go 100% straight away or 70% for some time. Most people I know recently were 70% for 12-15 months so you should prepare for that in your budget if you are successful.

[Harry palmer]

How long are people waiting from application to reply either way?

[cgwhitemonk11]

Cheers for the reply, I guessed the 50K was too good to be true! Is it 50% of 100% or 50% of 70% if that makes sense? And once on the line with flight pay (if such a thing exists) what could an FO expect to take home on 70%?

Three colleagues who sat in the pool from the previous round of recruitment just got offered 100% in their base of choice. I will worry about the contract stuff if/when I get an offer but the apprentice i spoke to on the phone was very relaxed and straight forward so hopefully the assessment is the same. I waited 2 weeks for the call.

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

SO is the Pilot Apprentices, not sure why the salary is but it's painful.

FO is just over £50k

SFO is around £56k.

Expect half pay until passing your final line check. I joined already type rated, requiring the minimum of an OCC,LPC and 10 sectors....which took 2 1/2 months!:ugh:

That being said, we did receive a partial refund from the company due to the longer than expected training period. This effectively bought the time on half pay down to 7-8 weeks.

From what I've seen, your experience of Jet2 will largely depend on your base. In my experience at my base the people are great and I look forward to going to work while being far enough removed from management at LBA to remain anonymous. Which is the best way to be at Jet2!

As for the company itself, there's enough on this thread for you to make up your own mind so I'll leave that subject alone. Just go in with your eyes wide open!

ATB

2W2R

[cgwhitemonk11]

Great, thanks for that, I think I could handle the pay cut for that period of time with the long term gain in mind. It is the same with any airline, as it is with life, there will always be those who are not happy... but Jet2 would suit me so hopefully it all goes well

[heliusac]

FO is just over £50k

SFO is around £56k.Sorry I stand corrected.

It's 50% of 100% and sector+duty pay on top during line training (I think correct me again!).

As I say it's random on base/contract, I know 2 from my old company that got 100% 1st base choice and several others got 70% and no base choice at all!! Seems like the 100% and base choice always comes through in the end except for EMA which seems to be the most popular choice and as such can take a long while.

As for 70% FO take home no idea but 70% skipper was about £4200ish mid summer and about £3200ish mid winter and you will be on a few £K less than that as 100% FO and less sector pay so should give you a rough idea.

I guess it depends on where you have worked before for perspective. My story is fairly typical, as I would take being home every night in the UK and living in the north any day of the week over bigger money/shinier planes or living down south or abroad. Add to that a good mix of interesting destinations, full flights, a company that makes profit (novelty to me) and what I think is good money (see previous companies!). So personally think it's great but can see why some people don't like it and why some are looking to move on.

[The Crew]

I bet if they only paid expenses for the first year, and 50% for 2 more years, you guys would lap it up. Its better than being unemployed you would shout.

Who's married with kids at independant school, taking home around £4000 ave/ month? Ah thought so.

Shiney big jets on big salary has its attractions .
Living in Leeds with November " off" hmmm

[cgwhitemonk11]

No actually i think it is The Crew and scratching the sky who miss the point, if Jet2 offer me 70% without the need to move base it would be a 5k pay rise, 100% would be a 15k pay rise. So why wouldn't i accept?! Do you know why office staff get full time contracts? Because its a **** job that no one wants to do. Pilots get bent over the desk because we are an inherently selfish group who have allowed our own T's and C's to spiral, we only have ourselves to blame. If we had half the self respect of the tube drivers we might stand half a chance, but last time i checked you couldn't buy yourself into the front seat of a tube at 18yrs old with no experience. Also no one forced you to pay 'upwards of 100,000 pounds' for your licence, I paid less than half that for mine and have worked for 4 different companies so far, never has the interviewer commented on what school I went to.

[HeartyMeatballs]

Just to add my thoughts. Whilst it would be great to get full pay throughout training, I did four months months without any pay with my current lot whilst doing the TR, and in month five earned about £400 for a couple of office days we did.

Just think that's four months I did with zero pay whatsoever. I had to pay for my own accommodation and had to sell my car (a six year old Korean hatchback, nothing fancy) just to make ends meet. So it certainly isn't a Jet2 issue alone. It could be better but it could be a lot worse.

70% would suit me fine if I can get my local base. I currently spend £600-700 on commutting and accommodation per month, not to mention the nonexistent lifestyle. It may be a pay cut (I'm currently 75%) but I imagine I would be better off financially, and you cannot put a price on the quality of life it would bring.

Good luck to all those who are applying.

[cgwhitemonk11]

I totally agree, its about time we have a bit of leverage behind us, my current crowd don't seem to understand that if every one of their pilots goes to BA or Jet2 this year that the airplanes won't fly themselves!

[Chesty Morgan]

I should remind you that there will always be applicants for such a job. To not apply, would be to help others in their job hunt and is a sure fire route to the poor house.

Changed your mind?

[Coffin Corner]

Two or three years ago they offered me the B757, 70% contract, pay my own type rating, and don't get any pay until I start online. Suffice to say I politely turned them down.

[Chesty Morgan]

I suspect most people would rather have a job with the expectation of Ts and Cs improving, as they must, than wait to have a job with improved Ts and Cs.

[Chesty Morgan]

CC, I believe that was the deal dreamed up to take advantage of soon to be redundant Flybe bods.

Unsurprisingly not many accepted it.

The irony is you would be much better off now had you taken it.

[Coffin Corner]

Chesty. This was before the redundancies kicked off, I think this was when jet 2 opened up to non type rated bods for the first time in eons. I reckon it was about 3 years ago. I believe they were phoning alot of people up offering similar deals to which alot said no but as this was the first signs of recruitment in the UK for a while I would imagine alot said yes. I just couldn't accept it because my mortgage still needed paying for the 3 months minimum it would have taken me to get online.

[Chesty Morgan]

Interesting. I came here in 2012 (under the shadow of redundancy) as a 737 DEC, 100% bonded.

It was only shortly after that I heard about this "deal" from friends who'd stayed at Flybe. They said it felt like Jet2 was trying to take advantage of their current employment position!

Wasn't there a presentation specifically for Flybe types to attend at Leeds?

[Coffin Corner]

Maybe it was four years ago, it was certainly way before the redundancy situation at Flybe and it was certainly in the middle of the recession. I believe the feeling was jet 2 were phoning up candidates and offering this to "test the water" to see what pilots would accept and what they wouldn't accept. I know a fair number of my colleagues were offered something similar, as were some of my colleagues in other airlines.

[heliusac]

To be honest it's all market lead, whilst there was a glut of pilots on the market the companies could dictate the terms. I am lead to believe all of the new joiners this year are all 100% I have personally since May this year spoken to 4 pilot's that have joined on 70% and have heard of more.

I agree that 50% pay while training is rubbish and 70% contracts are less than ideal. However you have to look at your own individual circumstances to make that kind of decsion. For some people 70% at Jet 2 will be the same or more than they were on with their previous employer and for some it is an employer that is on the verge of making you redundant or going bust. The 70% part leaves you with 5 months per annum off pro rata. If you book your leave right you can end up with 4 straight months off, in that period you can work somewhere else to make up your wages.

Add into this a free type rating and a small financial sweetener if your training drags on. Add to that living in the north UK and being home every night is an absolute necessity for your personal circumstances and you start to see why people make the choice to go to Jet 2. Is there any other choice in the UK that meet those requirements (especially for DEC) these days?

Yes it's not ideal and 50%/70% is bad for the industry but don't be so quick to judge people that do take it because for many there is simply no other choice. In the schemes of things the deal at Jet 2 is nowhere near as bad as many other employers and once you are on your 100% in your base of choice it's amazing how quickly you forget the misery of 50%/70%!

[Mr Angry from Purley]

Narrow
Do office staff get offered 70% contracts, until "as and when" the company can make them 100%?

Do office staff get paid 50% until the company have enough time and resource to train them? After all, an area that most trainees have little control over, and is indeed, purely under the control of the company?

No, I didn't think so.

One of the down sides to be a Pilot is they are highly paid (in most cases) assets. Certainly in my previous airlines they were on more $$ than the MD and a lot lot less commercial pressure.
Jet 2 are a seasonal airline as you know. They are just taking advantage of the market conditions. As you know it's quiet common for Cabin Crew to be seasonal so instead of laying Pilots off (fearing they won't come back unlike a lot of cabin crew do) they go to these 70% contracts. Yes it's crap but it might suit some F/O, get the hours and move on, or Captains - move close to home for family reasons.

My experience of Office Staff levels is lean n mean and the 30% saving for a Captains salary will pay for a few!

:\

[sixfootfive]

Office staff also have no job security. No attempt at a 'Just Culture' or even explanation for removal. No union representation. No guarantee of location. No notice period. Guess all this equals what the CAA would call churn.....

[G-IZMO]

Anyone else out there doing online tests have server speed issues? Far from ideal on a times test. Wondering which end of the line the problem might be!

[Scott_T]

How are the online tests? are they as difficult as before? any good ways to prepare? last year they were very very hard

[flying apprentice]

Verbal reasoning ! Am I the only one who cannot complete even half the questions in the allotted time ?

[Harry palmer]

Have people started to hear either way? PFO or interview date?

[HeartyMeatballs]

I submitted mine and completed the assessments about a week ago. Not heard anything either way yet but I'm sure it will be a good while before we hear any news.

For the tests is read up on currency conversions (A to B to C etc) and it was s hectic 20 minutes! The verbal reasoning I found ok. The 220 personality questionnaire took ages as the iPad didn't seem to like it. Perhaps it's better doing it on a desktop.

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

It won't be long folks, interviews are taking place in Leeds today.

The company will just about get through this summer by the looks of it although things are beginning to get chaotic. Next summer is a different story altogether if the rumoured number of guys and girls in the BA and FR Hold Pools turns out to be accurate!

As for these online tests, they're not too taxing (unless they've changed in the last couple of years) but none the less a load of utter s***. Jet2 HR behaving as if they're better than they are!

Good luck to those applying. Nice people at Base level but join with your eyes wide open!!!

2W2R


I submitted mine and completed the assessments about a week ago. Not heard anything either way yet but I'm sure it will be a good while before we hear any news.

For the tests is read up on currency conversions (A to B to C etc) and it was s hectic 20 minutes! The verbal reasoning I found ok. The 220 personality questionnaire took ages as the iPad didn't seem to like it. Perhaps it's better doing it on a desktop.

[Flying Wild]

The company will just about get through this summer by the looks of it although things are beginning to get chaotic. Next summer is a different story altogether if the rumoured number of guys and girls in the BA and FR Hold Pools turns out to be accurate!


FO's are constantly hitting the 100hr in 28 day limit this summer due to the numbers of FO's leaving for the likes of BA.

[saladdodger]

Any indication of how many positions are on offer yet and the deal that is on the table from anyone that has already interviewed?

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

Any indication of how many positions are on offer yet and the deal that is on the table from anyone that has already interviewed?

Lots of positions will be available on both fleets at various bases.

I believe the deals being offered are weighted more towards 100% contracts this year but I've also heard of HR continuing to take the p*** by offering 70% contracts too. The current thinking seems to be NTR get 70% and TR get 100%.

But that could all change as resignations from people off to BA and FR continue to land at LFFH.

[3ply]

I did the assesments recently. I found them difficult and no chance i could complete the tasks in the allotted time. I presume this is the whole idea to introduce a time pressure element, but even so.

Rocket scientist m not, however the numerical reasoning stuff was A level statistics. Which i did . Years ago. And mechanics. If you need a calculator then its hardly a reasoning test?

Im not going any further if this is what they are looking for. Im B767/757 rated with 6000 hours P1 on my UK licence.

The process is all a bit baffling to those of us who have been use to the face to face interview process.

Ill stick to what i know, oh yes flying !

[drag king]

The process is all a bit baffling to those of us who have been use to the face to face interview process.

Glad to hear I am not the only one here! I don't mind the odd tech's Q&As sheet but...personality test and verbal reasoning after you are past the 1/2000 hrs mark?

Too many decent ones would slip through the net, I guess.

Well, at least Jet2 HR man is an extremely approachable guy so one can still go fact-finding after 4 weeks of nothing heard...

DK :(

[Narrow Runway]

I think that personality and psychological tests will form a huge part of licensing, medical and recruitment in the future.

The unfortunate events in the French Alps will demand it.

[drag king]

I think that personality and psychological tests will form a huge part of licensing, medical and recruitment in the future.

Possibly but from what I gather right now it seems more that everyone is tarred with the same brush, regardless of whether they are cadets or experienced guys under scrutiny. Not sure it's so wise in terms of quality vs. quantity.

My 2p

DK :rolleyes:

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

I'm very sceptical about the value of verbal and numerical testing when it comes to airline recruitment. I've completed and passed half a dozen or so of these bloody things since entering the industry. In the early days I guess it's a measuring stick when there's nothing else to go by. However, passing the Basic flight training without the ability to read, comprehend and deal with numbers would be very difficult.

The benefit of these tests dwindles with experience and for guys with a type rating and hours on type they become nothing more than another way for HR to justify their corner of the wage budget. My 2p worth anyway.

Back on topic, when I joined J2 a number of guys and girls were asked to repeat one or more of the test elements if they were Type Rated and a quick bum on a seat. My point is that these tests may not necessarily be a barrier to joining the company and this is particularly true at a time when J2 are DESPERATE for experienced, rated pilots.

[fade to grey]

Recruitment processes always turn into a farce the minute HR are involved.

Do a sim test, chat for 30 mins ( the widely known share El sheikh test).

Just look at big airways ? They took on two of the biggest tossers I ever met, but turned over many good people I know.

[Chesty Morgan]

Recruitment processes always turn into a farce the minute HR are involved.

Do a sim test, chat for 30 mins ( the widely known share El sheikh test).

Just look at big airways ? They took on two of the biggest tossers I ever met, but turned over many good people I know.

It seems like they've kept those standards for the latest round of recruitment too.

Doesn't it Sean?

[Honiley]

Management at Base level are getting it and are concerned! Chatting to the lads leaving, LBA is in its own little world!

[Artie Fufkin]

Management at Base level are getting it and are concerned! Chatting to the lads leaving, LBA is in its own little world!

https://insidecroydon.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/crisis-what-crisis.jpg

[B737 Linc]

Hi, can anyone enlighten me about the current recruitment drive at Jet2? I am currently at Turkish Airlines, but The DGCA is at loggerheads with the CAA. They won't validate UK licences currently, so have to look for a new position!
Any info would be great, from salary to conditions and recruitment process?
Lincoln

[GLAinsider]

You can browse the pilot vacancies at http://jet2careers.com/career-search?searchkeyword=Pilot

[PressTheTit]

Does anyone know how many NTR FO's will be recruited this year ? Having read most of this thread (if believed) it seems to be a changing landscape at Jet2 so a rough idea of numbers would be great.

[Artie Fufkin]

I was told that over 150 pilots will be recruited over the next year, with the pool of type rated pilots currently running somewhat dry. No mention of FO/captain split.

Lucky old training department.

[Harry palmer]

Have any non rated people been called for the next stage yet?

[speedrestriction]

i only wonder about the character assassination questions; if a candidate did very badly and were deemed to be a potential liability, would Jet2 be obliged to inform your relevant licensing authority to inform them of a potential German wings in the making ?
Food for thought .

Don't be daft, of course not. Hardly food for thought.

[PressTheTit]

I also did the tests about a month ago now. I'm guessing that I passed them as I've had no feedback to the contrary ? Profile just says application recieved.

[4Screwaircrew]

Chating to an old friend still in the Jet2 family, he advises 165 pilots required to bring them up to full strength for next year with no expansion and that flights have been cancelled recently due to a lack of crew.

I don't know if he is correct, but it appears to closely match what other ex colleagues have suggested, if correct then the trainers are going to be stretched and so will the sim centre, this doesn't allow for any further attrition from "the airline of choice".

[The Crew]

165?, thats a shed load of inexperienced guys. Even if half have 500 hours and a P2F 737, hardly helps on a dark windy november night for a newly promoted Capt.

Btw how many hours do FOs need for command upgrade?
Do current FOs get by passed by direct enteries with more hours?

Are DECs hated by the current crop of remaining FOs who couldnt get into BA ?

[PressTheTit]

They could always do the unthinkable and employ guys with some other aviation e experience to fall back on ! Sick of beating this worn out old drum :yuk:

[PressTheTit]

Before I am lambasted for my last post, I realise J2 are about the least guilty airline of destroying the industry with P2F !

[Jet2_320]

4Screwaircrew same what we were told within the base.

I would only recommend Jet2 if you are non rated and are planning to use it as a stepping stone to get yourself moving up the career ladder again. If you are rated I wouldn't recommended it.

You are always going to find negative people and overly positive people on pprune. The latter group are generally people we live local to the base, the ones who had a fast track career and those who have passed the point were it would be sensible to move on. The first group on the other hand are generally the people who have worked for other airlines and are unable to cope with the (unstable) summer roosters or the company culture.

Whichever of those two groups you find more convincing within this topic or the Jet2 topic within "Airlines, Airports & Routes", with over 15% of the pilots leaving (and many more to come) there must be something going on.

[Jet2_320]

PressTheTit if they could they would. However a pilot who hasn't flown a heavy turboprop or medium/heavy jet would need 40 line training sectors, if they have it's 20 line training sectors and rated would be 10 line training sectors.

With the amount of pilots who have left the training department doesn't even have enough capacity to train the heavy turboprop or medium/heavy jet guys who joined. They tried to find rated pilots but realised they couldn't find any who were willing to apply and pass the selection.

[PressTheTit]

Shame for me.:ugh:

[heliusac]

I would only recommend Jet2 if you are non rated and are planning to use it as a stepping stone to get yourself moving up the career ladder again. If you are rated I wouldn't recommended.
or (standard answer) you have seen how much worse it can be elsewhere, want to get back to the UK, want to live in the north, want to be home every night, want to have really easy winters etc etc
Are DECs hated by the current crop of remaining FOs who couldnt get into BA ? Not so sure about the BA thing but in my time as DEC NTR I have only flown with one person who made it abundantly clear they had a problem with DEC NTR. Pretty much every other FO/SFO I have flown with have been talented people, some very experienced and more often than not a real pleasure to fly with especially when you are new on type. The big suprise to me was how many of these much more experienced on type FO's/SFO's would show real respect for you as captain and would very much want to tap into your previous airline experience on other types which for some of us is considerable.

I think quite a few SFO's at my base just can't be bothered with the difficult command procedure as it may mean a base move or failure etc so are happy to just sit tight or wait for other jobs they are applying for. Pity for the company/them but great news for people like me!

[Twiglet1]

165 crew required = 82 crews divided by between say 5 and 6 crews per aircraft = a bloody lot of aircraft to recruit for let alone train as mentioned. If its true then the flow has to be reversed

[Station_Calling]

the current crop of remaining FOs who couldnt get into BA ?

Quite an insult really. Some FO's actually don't want to go to BA and are happy carving out a different path - which may or may not mean staying put for a while...

[Chesty Morgan]

I would only recommend Jet2 if you are non rated and are planning to use it as a stepping stone to get yourself moving up the career ladder again. If you are rated I wouldn't recommended it.


Happily I believe the grand total of nobody will pay your advice the slightest bit of attention.

[mini-jumbo]

@de fumo in flammam - when did you apply?

[The Crew]

I believe they will bin an applicant if they fail to meet the companies expectations with regards the psychometric evaluation. With around 220 questions, the structure will certainly indicate any undesirable qualities a applicant may have.

I actually think these psychometric test could have far reaching implications on a pilots career. Airlines talk. So do licensing authorities. Information is so easily shared now, and information is power.

I would expect Jet2 are looking for a very specific type of employee, judging by the anount of effort they have put into devising the online assesments.

Clearly they cant say they want a 30- 35 year old 2000 hour captain, single with no debts or hidden agendas. But the tests will allow them to reduce the pile of CVs without rejection based on race, age or religion.
Remember the equal opportunities part of the application. I mean who are jet2 to ask me wether im bi sexual asian . Its HR none sense .

[Mr Good Cat]

I mean who are jet2 to ask me wether im bi sexual asian . Its HR none sense .

Am I the only one who just had an image flash up, of Alan Partridge watching Bangkok Chick Boys? :D

Seriously though, airlines and authorities simply don't have tumecto share the psych data and wouldn't e stupid enough to believe it could indicate a madman anyway. My guess is Andreas Lubitz could easily outwitted the 220 questions... It's just simply a way for HR to whittle down the applicants to a more manageable level.

[PressTheTit]

Does grate when people imply young and single without kids equates to somehow being of a more stable state of mind.I'd argue if our German friend had kids of his own he may not have found it an acceptable thing to do !

[The Crew]

Im not implying that single are more stable. I was simply stating, that if Jet2 had a preference, it would be for 30 somethings, single and no hidden agendas, i.e. huge debt or possible .gambling habit They cannot state this in their adverts, equal opportunities etc. However, its unlikely they will recruit anyone simply to be politically correct. By using a comprehensive selection process, they can legally whittle out the undesirables, i.e. wrong race, age, or even body mass. They of course are not unique in allegedly using a selection "process" allowing circumvention of so called equal opportunities for all.

Singles are preferred by LoCos as they have less responsibilities and therefore can tolerate the ups and downs of the seasonal business that is say Jet2. I don't remember getting a discount during the winter from my private school, nor any mortgage reduction. The salaries are simply too low for todays pilots to enjoy the lifestyles and securities offered 20-30 years ago. When I was a kid, Pilots were always thought of as dashing types in their E Types, with their Surrey detached mansions.

The reality of the modern day Jet2 pilot, apparently, is a 10 year old Daihatsu, driving to going to the local OFSTED criticised school, with a rusting Aldi shopping trolly in their front law. Oh what aspirations some have lol.

[tonker]

Hence why every airline on the planet is now struggling to fill a position, less and less people were prepared to invest so much time and effort to fill.

BA, Emirates, Ryanair etc are all in desperate need of experienced crews and are now finally prepared to start paying a more apt going rate. The boot folks, is now firmly on the other foot, and we should keep it firmly on the neck of those who try and diminish our t&cs purely to fund the grotesque greed of the few at the top.

[Callsign Kilo]

The reality of the modern day Jet2 pilot, apparently, is a 10 year old Daihatsu, driving to going to the local OFSTED criticised school, with a rusting Aldi shopping trolly in their front law. Oh what aspirations some have lol.

What a lot of sh1te. LOL 😩

[A and C]

It would be interesting to put board members through the psychological tests...... I suspect most airlines would find issues with those results !

[heliusac]

I was simply stating, that if Jet2 had a preference, it would be for 30 somethings, single and no hidden agendasEveryone on my course when I joined was in their 40's/50's, married and had a hidden agenda of working in the north of the UK for an airline that didn't threaten them with/make them redundant every 6 months.

[PressTheTit]

Anyway, what I wouldn't do to drive my first car again ! A 1988 white Daihatsu Charade GTti, 1L 3cyl Turbo injected.

Not 100% off topic....

[matt85]

Hello,

Seriously contemplating Jet2 for family reasons and would appreciate it if somebody could help me out with a few questions in return for beer! Experienced FO, 3000+ heavy, but no Boeing.

I have read the entire thread but would be grateful if people could help me specifically with the following.

1. Understand summers are "crazy busy", winters quiet. In complete confidence, would somebody be kind enough to send me a sample roster of each? I would just like to get a handle on start/end/duration/sectors in a typical FDP, amount of time sitting around on the ground etc.. Winter: Lots of home/airport standby or just pure days off? Roughly how many? Blocks? Requests etc: How many, if any, weekends can a Junior/Mid/Senior guy expect to get off a month? Days off: Fixed after roster publication I assume?

2. Coming home purely for improvement in lifestyle with a requirement to be based c.60 min radius LBA and home most nights. In truth, even 70% would work for me. Given this, is there anybody else you would be strongly considering over Jet2? P.s I am not paying for any rating out of principle!

3. Heard rumours of Airbus orders. Any update on this?

Anything else relevant would be appreciated.

Cheers.

[mini-jumbo]

Understand summers are "crazy busy", winters quiet
Busy depends what you are used to, but yes, they can be hectic. There is no roster pattern (fixed or otherwise), and you can expect plenty of changes to the published versions. Days off don't change once published, but the duties either side can (and do) change.

Typically 2 sector days.

How busy you'll be is base dependant. If you are at a base with lots of trainers, I don't imagine you'll be getting much flying at the moment - or next year with the volume of recruitment planned.

amount of time sitting around on the ground etc If you mean on turnarounds, little if any. An hour max, usually 30 - 40 min turnarounds. Unless you are on airport standby, once you're home, you're done.

Winters are quiet, expect plenty of home standby, and probably airport standby if MAN or LBA based.

Heard rumours of Airbus orders. Any update on this?No update, They're still looking at different options, but there is an upgrade program on the cards for the winter to modernise some of the existing fleet.

[DDobinpilot]

Hi guys,

Have had a browse through this thread, but just wanted to confirm a couple of things for Jet2 non rated applicants. Currently a 747 FO in Asia looking for a potential route home. So just had 3 quick questions.. Do the company cover the cost of the type rating? From reading on here it seems they do but no pay during training (approx 4 months?) just wanted to confirm this.. And also is the pilot jobs network salary scale fairly accurate? So starting wage would be around £50k?

Any info would be hugely appreciated.

[heliusac]

Hi guys,

Have had a browse through this thread, but just wanted to confirm a couple of things for Jet2 non rated applicants. Currently a 747 FO in Asia looking for a potential route home. So just had 3 quick questions.. Do the company cover the cost of the type rating? From reading on here it seems they do but no pay during training (approx 4 months?) just wanted to confirm this.. And also is the pilot jobs network salary scale fairly accurate? So starting wage would be around £50k?

Any info would be hugely appreciated.

Type Rating fully covered including hotel/breakfast/mileage
3 year reducing bond starts after final line check (used to be £28k but I think it may be less now they have their own training facility)
You get 50% (of 100%) basic salary whilst training and sector/duty on top whilst line training. Usually takes 3-6 months depending on time of year. They gave some courses a financial bonus because the training went on too long. I heard their cutoff is 13 weeks now then they give you full basic salary anyway (but not 100% certain on that). Full salary (or 70% etc) after FLC
F/O Wage starts around £50kish (or 70% of that if that's your contract). 70% seems to last for anything from a few months to 15 months

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

Recruitment road shows now planned for Dubai and Abu Dhabi in the hope that some of those looking to get home will be tempted. Things must be getting tight for such drastic action to be taken.

[Harry palmer]

Are they not getting enough applicants?

[drag king]

Recruitment road shows now planned for Dubai and Abu Dhabi in the hope that some of those looking to get home will be tempted. Things must be getting tight for such drastic action to be taken.

At least they could take a sweep through their CV backlog, send off the PFOs to those that have been hanging out for MONTHS (i.e. NTR but still experienced) and go ahead with their things. I cannot blaime J2 (or any other operation) for looking at TR/Experienced folks but I think everyone deserve an answer within a reasonable time. Last time I applied the PFO took in excess of 12 months to arrive!

Are they not getting enough applicants?

See above

DK :*

[Harry palmer]

Well said DK. I've still got an application in from 3 years ago and still waiting to hear either way lol! ; )

I know people that are still in the said hold pool that haven't heard a thing from them. If they require the rumoured numbers for next year you'd think the HR team would be working 24/7 getting the yes or no's out ASAP.

[highfive]

So FO salary really starts at £35k for 15 months. What Gulf based FO flying widebidies is going to demean themselves enought to take this ? After tax £2300 per month. Thats reality.

[highfive]

P.S You reap what you sow. If J2 HR/ personal are so condescending as to not even make the effort to simply send out a courtesy email re hold pool prospects after an applicant has applied, exposed themselves to their psycosoddomy, then it says a whole lot more about this bunch than anything written on prune.

[BigGeordie]

Highfive, you might be surprised how many F/Os in the Gulf would be interested in returning home having discovered that the streets certainly aren't paved with gold and the "tax free" salary doesn't go as far as they thought it might. Throw in a sadistic company culture and 7+ years to command along with 95 hour rosters- suddenly lo-cost in Europe begins to look quite attractive.

Yes, they would take a pay drop but what price living at home?

[Cuillin Hills]

At least you got a reply after 12 months, Drag King!

I know type-rated people who passed the assessment day last year and didn't even get told they had passed it until they pushed for an answer!

J2 didn't even come back to them after that - most of them are very happy DECs at Ryanair now.

[Twiglet1]

The only issue Jet 2 will have is the training pipeline. People will want to join them as despite what is being said they remain an 'attractive' proposition. With the turnover plenty of Commands, new FO's, training opportunity etc.
There will always be attrition unless they try and arrest the situation thru any initiatives to keep crews happy (good luck with that ) . The only good news is that crews that apply will be aware they work hard in the summer and have frequent roster changes would you believe 😮😮😮

[DDobinpilot]

Type Rating fully covered including hotel/breakfast/mileage
3 year reducing bond starts after final line check (used to be £28k but I think it may be less now they have their own training facility)
You get 50% (of 100%) basic salary whilst training and sector/duty on top whilst line training. Usually takes 3-6 months depending on time of year. They gave some courses a financial bonus because the training went on too long. I heard their cutoff is 13 weeks now then they give you full basic salary anyway (but not 100% certain on that). Full salary (or 70% etc) after FLC
F/O Wage starts around £50kish (or 70% of that if that's your contract). 70% seems to last for anything from a few months to 15 months


Thanks for the info! :)

[gorter]

Have they changed the bond again then. Very recently the bond started reducing a year after final line check. So the 3 year bond was effectively 4. If you find 2 jet2 pilots on the same contract you probably deserve a medal.

And to those who never heard back. I'm honestly not joking, they probably lost your application.

[Chesty Morgan]

Gorter, did you ever read your own contract?!

The bond does start reducing after a year but it reduces over the following two years. Ergo, effectively three years.

[gorter]

I started before there were bonds old chap. Just relaying what others have told me.

[Chesty Morgan]

Well, you are wrong.

Might be worth researching what you're pontificating on lest you start to look silly. Old chap.

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

Until recently the bonds aka 'Training Agreements' were over 3 years, non reducing for 12 months from the date of final line check. This means the balance reduced on a pro rata basis over 24 months. So it is most definitely a 3 year agreement, not 4. However, I have it on very good authority that these have now been amended to start reducing from the date of final line check.

The whole 'Training Agreement' is a joke as far as I'm concerned. Ok if the company has invested something in you or a Type Rating but for Type Rated joiners the whole thing is a disgrace.

Cue the "you didn't have to sign it brigade"....

[DjerbaDevil]

http://www.pprune.org/middle-east/565725-jet2-will-visiting-uae-recruitment-drive.html

[papazulu]

...meanwhile this tread has gone very quiet.

Any one (NTR) with their application acknowledged "received" for 6+ weeks and yet not a beep?

PZ :ok:

[Harry palmer]

Still says under review! Applied over a month ago. Does it change from received to under review or under review to received if you have passed the tests etc?

[Mr Good Cat]

Seems there's a big drive for experienced non-rated DECs on at the moment so possibly will be dealing with FOs a little later on in the autumn.

They're out in the Middle East for the next couple of weeks.

[B737900er]

Im assuming on the hope to convince guys to join on a 70% contrac,t with a 3 year bond and 50% during your training, and then to have the privilege of getting taxed 40%:ugh: Good luck is all I can say.

Nice holiday for the recruitment team though

[Mr Good Cat]

Im assuming on the hope to convince guys to join on a 70% contrac,t with a 3 year bond and 50% during your training, and then to have the privilege of getting taxed 40%:ugh: Good luck is all I can say.

Nice holiday for the recruitment team though

It's 100% contracts for experienced Captains, even non-rated. Less pay, more tax for sure... But by the time you've balanced it all out the chance to be based back in the UK at your airport of choice swings it for a lot of guys. No other airline can offer this at the moment so I'm sure a few will take advantage of it.

It's a win-win as Jet2 know that the guys they're getting will be in it for the long-term and won't be jumping ship for an overseas contract or downgrading to the right seat in BA in the future.

Won't be for everybody but no harm in checking things out at The Westin roadshow over a cold beer or two :ok:

[Mr Angry from Purley]

Come on then B737-900ER anymore negatives to put interested crews off.
If it's that bad at EK/FZ good on Jet 2 for trying to tap the market. :\

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

It's 100% contracts for experienced Captains, even non-rated. Less pay, more tax for sure... But by the time you've balanced it all out the chance to be based back in the UK at your airport of choice swings it for a lot of guys. No other airline can offer this at the moment so I'm sure a few will take advantage of it.

It's a win-win as Jet2 know that the guys they're getting will be in it for the long-term and won't be jumping ship for an overseas contract or downgrading to the right seat in BA in the future.

Won't be for everybody but no harm in checking things out at The Westin roadshow over a cold beer or two :ok:


Are FR not offering 100% FR Contracts at the base of choice for DEC's? Are EZY not offering the same at LGW? I appreciate that a LGW base isn't idea for everyone but it certainly captures a very large number when compared to LBA.

I agree it's a novel idea and in principal it sounds like a good one but at a time when EK are parking up aircraft due to a lack of crew, I'm surprised its being allowed to happen at all.

It's going to be an interesting 12-18 months at Jet2. There aren't that many pilots leaving at the mo and while it's not insignificant as a percentage, MANY more resignations will arrive at LFFH when the rest show their hand over the coming year or so. Meanwhile, management will continue to tell themselves that they're doing a wonderful job and pilots are just fickle creatures bouncing from one shiny thing to the next. The more pressing concern as far as I can see is the number of experienced, long term senior cabin crew leaving for pastures new. Many going off to admin jobs and giving up flying altogether after being treated so poorly. Experience is required on both sides of the flight deck door after all.

[Mr Good Cat]

Are FR not offering 100% FR Contracts at the base of choice for DEC's? Are EZY not offering the same at LGW?

Actually, no. Not for non-rated long-haulers like myself anyway.

Ryanair won't commit to a base on the contract unless ex-FR and also still rated. For non-rated they want you to pay the rating.

For EZY, which would probably be the short-haul airline of choice for many - they want you to pay for the rating AND spend 5 years frozen at LGW followed by joining a long, long transfer list for the regional bases. That won't suit guys like me who have no interest in anywhere south of the Midlands.

Without wanting to sound pretentious (please understand I'm really not) it's nice that at least one airline out there is prepared to look for experienced crews AND pay for the rating. This is the same airline that runs the Pilot Apprenticeship scheme that helps out those 18 year old kids who don't come from the ranks of the financially fortunate (I was there once 20 years ago). It's all market-driven of course, but at the moment it's a nice touch.

[Penworth]

I think you'll find the pilot apprentice scheme is for those already with a CPL/IR, many of whom have spent £100k+ at Oxford, so not exactly a scheme for poor 18 year olds! It's not a bad scheme overall though - in exchange for 18 months in the office or crew room, and 18 months on the line on the paltry second officers salary, they get the type rating paid for and a permanent UK job.

I agree though that it's encouraging that they are recruiting NTR crews and are prepared to cover the type rating. They've clearly realised there's no other way to recruit the experienced crews they need given their expansion plans and difficulty retaining the crews they already have!

[JB007]

Mr Good Cat - really?! An open ended 50% salary, no duty pay during simulator training, a 'Training Agreement' for the type-rating...yep, 'paying for it' indeed! Wake up man! Read your one-sided contract VERY carefully!

Petworth is spot on, in view of present retention and no interest from type-rated, NTR pilots is all they can attract, end of!

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

It's encouraging that Jet2 are funding the TR upfront as opposed to asking you to raid your savings, true. It's also good for new guys / girls fresh out of school. The Pilot Apprentice Scheme is great for those looking for a leg up into a first flying job. They get decent exposure to various areas of the business with many ending up on a TR course sooner than expected. I've had the pleasure of meeting a number of them that have come through my base, some of which have recently appeared on in the crewroom as operating crew and I couldn't be happier for them. Regardless of the company's motives for using such a scheme, it's good for those that get onto it, especially at a time when bums on seats are urgently required!

As for experienced NTR joiners, from what I've seen and experienced, it's a pleasant place to work day to day, especially if you live not too far from your base. The company has some very serious soul searching to do if it hopes to attract and retain people IMHO but thats another matter and something that has already been discussed at length on this thread. All I can recommend is join with your eyes wide open and don't fall for the sales pitch. But then that can be said of many jobs I suppose.

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

Mr Good Cat - really?! An open ended 50% salary, no duty pay during simulator training, a 'Training Agreement' for the type-rating...yep, 'paying for it' indeed! Wake up man! Read your one-sided contract VERY carefully!

Petworth is spot on, in view of present retention and no interest from type-rated, NTR pilots is all they can attract, end of!

SANDWICHES

(Sorry, private joke)

[Chesty Morgan]

Mr Good Cat - really?! An open ended 50% salary, no duty pay during simulator training, a 'Training Agreement' for the type-rating...yep, 'paying for it' indeed! Wake up man! Read your one-sided contract VERY carefully!

Petworth is spot on, in view of present retention and no interest from type-rated, NTR pilots is all they can attract, end of!

It's not an open ended 50% salary. You're as bad as Gorter chuffing on about things you don't know anything about anymore.

Anyone would think you've got an agenda...

[JB007]

Hello Spandex! Still missing you!

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

It's not an open ended 50% salary. You're as bad as Gorter chuffing on about things you don't know anything about anymore.

Anyone would think you've got an agenda...

Anytime at all on 50% salary is a big issue for many prospective joiners. Lets be honest, it's insult to make TR sign a Training Agreement, put them on half salary "to cover training costs" and not pay duty pay during training either. The pilot jobs market was weak enough to allow such things up until recently but going forward it needs to stop if Jet2 hope to attract any TR crew. For the sake of those sticking around, I hope the company realises this pronto! With BA, EZY, FR, TOM et al all looking for a significant number of pilots over the next few years, Jet2 HAS to up its game if it hopes to survive.

[taxi_driver]

Is anything being done to retain people? Retain surely cheaper than Replace?

Can they physically train all of these replacement crew in a sensible time span? The throughput of their sim centre and the number of line sectors available must be causing them a headache?

[Chesty Morgan]

2 Whites, I agree but then it's up to each individual to accept or decline it.

To BS about it being open ended when it isn't just indictates lack of knowledge or an agenda. One makes you look stupid the other petty and childish. There's a lot of that on this thread.

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

Chesty

You're quite right, we're all grown ups and no one held a gun to our heads. However, when I joined there was ZERO mention of any bond until I got the call offering me the job. By which point I had put a reasonable amount of time and effort into the process. It had been made very clear prior that the half pay was to cover the cost of groundschool. Not great but I knew about it before I applied so while I strongly disagreed with it, no one else to blame on that one. When I questioned the bond it was hastily brushed over as a mere £4500 to cover groundschool....Jet2 are trying to be clever stinging people twice for a significant amount of cash with very little input for TR joiners. Hence the lack of TR people knocking at the door now things are picking up. Everyone else has woken up to the prospect of the lack of experienced people on the market but J2 insists on carrying on wiith these insulting practices. Naive in the extreme. 70% contracts, half pay, no duty pay, unreasonable training bonds for TR joiners. below market rate salaries, zero perks / benefits (unless you're Leeds based where you can get a ticket on then'Flying Tiger' bus for a whopping discounted fare of £4.80 instead of £6, woopeee!!!)....a few may be tempted but it's hardly the way to instil loyalty and longevity into a work force.

Look how CC are treated, £700 training costs for a summer only contract! My point is that responsible employer invests in its employees and makes them want to stay. It doesn't hold a gun to their head with the above mentioned BS to try and force them to stay

[JB007]

Well said 2W2R - the big picture of J2!

And just to clarify, when I joined J2, my 100% TR Contract stated "50% salary until completion of my line check". How long it took them to roster that line check was 'open ended', in fact, I did the type rating quicker than it took me to get on line at J2!

[Mr Good Cat]

Well said 2W2R - the big picture of J2!

And just to clarify, when I joined J2, my 100% TR Contract stated "50% salary until completion of my line check". How long it took them to roster that line check was 'open ended', in fact, I did the type rating quicker than it took me to get on line at J2!

Fair enough, if that's the way things were done at the time.

Fortunately it seems to have changed for the guys joining now on non-type-rated 100% contracts.

[mini-jumbo]

I believe they have now capped the 50% salary to a set number of weeks, or FLC - whichever is earlier. Can't remember off the top of my head how many weeks it is though.

It's still ridiculous but hey ho. The varying offers and differing contracts is still an issue, it seems to vary day by day, week by week. Be clear about what it is you want from the start, and there is every chance you'll get it.

[Chesty Morgan]

And just to clarify, when I joined J2, my 100% TR Contract stated "50% salary until completion of my line check".

That's my point. When you joined isn't now, things have changed and you're non the wiser.

You have an agenda against Jet2, we get it. But at least try and be factual.

[bluepilot]

its interesting behaviour for a moderator eh?

[Jet2_320]

Chesty Morgan and Blue Pilot why is it you always have to attack the people on here who don't share your view with regards to how great the company is?

People have different opinions about Jet2.com and based on the amount of pilots leaving (over 85 as far I'm aware) there are quite a few who don't share your overly optimistic views with regards to Jet2.com. With regards to the contract issue new pilots still got offered 70% contracts in the last intake as was also stated in "Tailwind" a few months ago.

Earlier in this topic somebody asked if something is done to retain the pilots/staff. To do this one has to admit first we have an issue with retention and there is a shortage of experienced pilots. 737 management has been heard saying "they don't give a sh*t how many leave because there are plenty out there" and a recent update from management stated only 3% more pilots left compared to last year.

[Chesty Morgan]

I don't "always" "attack" anyone. I am refuting their knowledge.

I don't think the company is "great", in fact far from it. But you don't need to lie or exaggerate to try and prove a point. On that note the majority of new contracts were 100%, yes some 70% contracts were offered and accepted. That's a bit different to:

new pilots still got offered 70% contracts in the last intake as was also stated in "Tailwind" a few months ago.

Isn't it?

[bluepilot]

Jet2-320, this will be my only reply to you. Over the years in your many aliases (most of which have been banned) you have continued to slag off, spit bile and attack anyone in regard to Jet2. Your words and opinions in my view are worthless as you never have any balance or thought, just venom.

[marcus1290]

Just my two cents as some folk are a little out the loop with regards to what the apprenticeship entails.

Its a maximum 12 month scheme resulting in a fully bonded (3 year) TR on 73 or 75. Within this 12 months, theres 3 months 'development' at The Mint and LFFH gaining experience of the company. This is to create a strong working relationship with folk that flight deck deal with every day and folk that they may deal with once every 5 years. Its about learning the business. After that, its out on a placement which is most likely in a crew room helping flight deck with their daily duties.

I'm an apprentice at J2, and although i have no other airline experience, i absolutely love it. I have no issues with the place at all and everyone i have met so far have been brand new. Something which was new to the scheme when i started was having a bash at operating as cabin crew. Some of you may laugh at this but the experience was fantastic. First hand experience of what happens on the other side of the door has a real eye opener and i have a huge amount of respect for cabin crew and the job they do. I'm 1/3 of the way through the 12 months, but rumour has it that type ratings could be coming our way over winter. On a previous course, two lads were rated after 4 months of the scheme. Operational requirements.

I'm incredibly lucky to be in a position to receive a fully paid for 737 or 757 TR as a first job. There can't be many opportunities like that in Europe or even the world.

A final side note, J2 prefer the modular route for their apprentices. I would say that less than 10% of apprentices went Integrated, and i don't know anyone on the scheme from oxford or CTC.

Best to you all,

Marcus,

Pilot Apprentice and Proud.

[Flying Clog]

Good on you Marcus, and good on Jet2. :)

[Mr Good Cat]

I second that.

I was lucky enough to have HSBC bankroll my training before 9/11, followed by a (then) small airline taking a chance on me with only 170 hours total flying experience.

Without that opportunity I wouldn't be here - so it's nice to see Marcus is benefitting from one of the few opportunities to get a foot on the ladder without a financial benefactor (although there's nothing wrong with that either I may add - you play the cards you are dealt with of course).

Good luck and look forward to flying the line with you in the future! :ok:

[Pin Head]

Hi

Please can someone tell me what time to command is at Jet2.

High houred rated guy. 10000hrs TT. 2000NG. 4000 756. All RHS.

Thanks

[Johnny F@rt Pants]

Jet2 is a "meritocracy", once you have the required hours you apply for Command, are then assessed and finally go through the Command process. So, the answer to your question is that it depends on your ability. Without previous Command experience you would join as an FO, it's then down to you, there is no reason why you couldn't get a Command within 12 months providing you make the required standards.

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

Jet2 is a "meritocracy", once you have the required hours you apply for Command, are then assessed and finally go through the Command process. So, the answer to your question is that it depends on your ability. Without previous Command experience you would join as an FO, it's then down to you, there is no reason why you couldn't get a Command within 12 months providing you make the required standards.

Tell that to any one of the numerous command ready people that have either recently left or are in the process of leaving. From what I gather, the current command selection procedure is in the process of being looked at and re-written.

With 10k hours you'll certainly have no problem with the 3000 Factored Hours required and would appear experienced enough to handle a mature and sensible command assessment....when one is written.

2 stripes until 6 months from final line check, then you can apply for SFO and Command at the same time. Both of which go to a selection panel for review.

Good luck!

[737 CL]

Hi Guys,
Anybody Knows the average take home for DEC? I´m considering to apply for B737 DEC. Is it possible to be Based in ALC for flying the NG in the future?

[Chesty Morgan]

Hi Everyone,


Just wondering if any type rated, experienced First Officers had heard back any news yet regarding assessment (or even heard anything back).


I applied approximately a month ago but still not a word. Would have expected something if the rumours regarding the number of leavers at J2 are true. My application status on the careers page is still stating "application received".


737 rated and current (+2500 hours on type).

I've heard that NTR bods are being dealt with first as they take longer to get on line.

Stick with it.

[Chesty Morgan]

737 CL, average take home could be anywhere between about 4200 to 5400 - winter/summer/base/pension etc. dependent.

Forgot to say you will probably get an ALC base of you want but there's no NG there at the moment.

[drag king]

I've heard that NTR bods are being dealt with first as they take longer to get on line.

Is that after the raid to the sandpit will be over? NTR, no-jet, every other box ticked.

Same reply/situation R_R (which is at the opposite end of the spectrum)...and likewise 2011. Application received since >6 weeks.

Headless chickens spring to mind...

DK :(

[Charlie_Mike]

Does anyone know what or if there's a significance between 'application received' and 'under review' in the application status ? (Apart from the pure English meanings of the phrases!)

Thanks

[Harry palmer]

Have any non rated FO applicants been called for interview? If so what types are they coming off ie Airbus, dash 8-400 etc, larger types?

[Penworth]

Pin head

Tried to send you a PM but your inbox is full.

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

Just spoke with Philip

Will speak with him again very soon. Be assured at the top there is an understanding. The process may seem elongated. There is a reason.

Cream rises.

Really?

You'll have to excuse my scepticism but when I spoke to Phillip about 6 weeks ago there was zero understanding, just got talked at with a sales pitch and told how lucky we were to have a job......what's changed? (that's a serious question, not sarcasm)

[Bam Thwok]

Ha Ha Ha......

Well done "Silverhawk"..... 2 Whites 2 Reds obviously doesn't know of your "connection"
Hook, Line and Sinker comes to mind.

Cream rises....and **** floats !

[Ivan aromer]

Silver hawk, nice wind up!!
Hope you are using the correct HiVis now.

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

I wasn't aware of Silverhawk's identity or his "connection", but I am now.....:ugh::ugh::ugh:

[B737900er]

When the big man PM told me he had one of the best tasting toasties he's had in a very long time onboard his LBA-ALC flight, I shut off after that.

I have to say when you talk to the big man, you do get a sales pitch.

[2 Whites 2 Reds]

When PM appeared on our flight, he spent a good 10 mins delivering what was a pleasant enough but very patronising sales pitch. We were told over and over how lucky we were to have a job and that he's a firm believer in remunerating people well as paying below market money only leads to experienced people leaving. While doing so he made reference to MON Engineering losing experienced engineers due to a dive in T's and C's.....

All of this with no sense of irony at all. My colleague and I starred blankly at each other and laughed all the way home. Unreal.

[Busbo]

Is this for real:

Pilots - Come and Meet Jet2.com in Dubai and Abu Dhabi-Latest Pilot Jobs-Latest Pilot Jobs (http://www.latestpilotjobs.com/jobs/view/id/1628.html)

They are going all the way to UAE to look for pilots!!!!

Is it that unbelievable?

There's alot of experienced pilots out there looking for a way home. Jet2 isn't the only option at the moment though although if your heart is set on a particular base then it might well be.

The standard of the apprentices I have flown with has been excellent, without exception. However you can't expand an airline without bringing in experience.

Jet2 needs pilots and the Middle east has plenty of pilots wanting a UK job. Sounds like an innovative and entirely logical idea to me. I'm sure they'll bring home a big wodge of CVs.

[Mr Good Cat]

Well I don't understand why they are going out there unless they do plan on running assessments whilst they are there.

I know people want to come back but surely RYR would be better.

In the last year I know of 18 pilots who have moved from Jet2 to RYR and that's just at 1 base I know of.

But Ryanair want guys to pay for the 737 rating and won't commit to your base of choice on the contract.

You won't get many experienced guys who: (1) are prepared to pay for a 737 rating and (2) prepared to go any base other than North UK / Scotland or wherever is home.

Sure - it's significantly less pay - but as long as it's enough to get by, then taking the family to your home base is too good an opportunity to turn down for many.

[Mr Good Cat]

While it's true there are guys/gals who don't end up in the base of there choice I know personally 7 people who all got the base of there choice. 6 cadets and 1 direct captain.

I too know guys who got their base of choice with RYR - but they were all rated 737 guys ex-RYR who were offered the chance to return as DECs from being FOs in EK.

The opportunity that Jet2 are presenting is to experienced EK current Captains not rated on the 737/757 who want to come home to the North UK / Scotland / NI. For them it's a case of compromising on the money, in return for a base that's written in stone on the contract - which Ryanair just won't do for NTR DECs at the moment. Maybe that will change in the future if they are short enough of crew.

I know that there are a fair few EK DECs wanting home right now, even with the pay cut. Some will want to wait a few years, some are ready to jump ship now. I'm one of the ones packed up ready to go.

[Deano777]

And of course it'll appeal to those who want to come home regardless of what base they're offered because Jet2 will be a conduit just to get back to the UK, once here they can then move on if they require. Being 4,000 miles away from home or a few hundred is a no brainer. I know which one I'd take.

[Mr Good Cat]

And of course it'll appeal to those who want to come home regardless of what base they're offered because Jet2 will be a conduit just to get back to the UK, once here they can then move on if they require. Being 4,000 miles away from home or a few hundred is a no brainer. I know which one I'd take.

No moving on for me though... just want my base and prepared to put in the hard hours in the summer and relax a bit in the winter. They can do what they like to me at work, as long as they pay me enough to have a reasonable life and I'm able to play with my kids in the countryside every evening or so.

In addition to that - I'll be sleeping in my own bed rather than a torpedo tube in the economy cabin, and sleeping at night-time instead of departing at 3am every shift listening to Mumbai HF for entertainment.

:ok:

I think I could handle long-haul at 70 hours a month, but mixing the long and short-haul and Ultra-long-range stuff at 95 hours a month has taken it's toll. :yuk:

[silverhawk]

Jet2 could get all the type rated FOs they need from the KLS pool. I've been operating with several of them recently and am very impressed. A much better product than EMT turn out for RYR.

Captains are a different story. The only way to attract them is with much more money. The current market rate for experienced Captains is massively more than Jet2 pays.

I do miss Jet2 and especially the Blackpool base, but since I left in 2009, I have been to a lot of great places and made a lot of new friends and a whole lot more money. It is a stable place to work, but no one there will be as rich as an airline pilot should be.

Btw, on the rare occasion I wear a hivis, I still use that same one. Cheers.

[monkey.tennis]

Have any NTR FOs been offered a 100% contract recently or is it all 70% at the moment?

[Harry palmer]

Have non rated FO applicants been invited to interview recently? If so from which carriers and types ie heavier types like the dash 400?

[cgwhitemonk11]

Yes NTR applicants have been to interview and have gone through the assessments, from 777 to dash to jetstream. I was one but am in a strange situation and looking for some advice from any current Jet2 guys, particularly any SO in the recruitment dep. I passed the interview but was sent home due to the lack of sim slots on the day and am currently waiting to hear back from the HR guy. Its been two weeks now and not heard anything, emailed last week and no reply, I'm happy to keep waiting but just concerned my emails might not have been picked up for whatever reason. Any advice or is it a case of we'll call you....

[Chesty Morgan]

'Phone them ASAP. .

[Johnny F@rt Pants]

But bear in mind that the person you need to speak to is currently in the Land of Sand on the recruitment seminars.

[Turkish777]

Regardless of that you get screened by someone prior to being put through to HR..:ugh:

[cgwhitemonk11]

Yeah I gather the top man is away so I will give it until the end of the month before I start calling. In fairness as annoying as it was to not get it all done on the day the process seemed very straight forward and everyone was very friendly and helpful. Only advice I can really give to anyone applying is that if you stay in the hotel across the road make sure you order the full set of hot chicken wings and not the half portion.... you get a free pint with the full portion! :I :)

[The Crew]

you're suppose to drown your sorrows after ... you see the terms and conditions. Good luck though, chicken wings is all you will be eating once your on " that" salary

[Pilotinfo]

Hi cgwhitemonk11, apologies you have had to wait, however, if you contact me at [email protected] I will make sure you get a response on Monday 24th August with SIM slot availability.

[squawkident.]

Hi,

Can someone please post the DEC Captain salary?
ppjn mentions £82000 basic but I've also heard its £89000

How much realistically is sector pay worth?
Do the company contribute to a pension?if so how much?

I heard a 8-10% pay rise might be round the corner?

For non rated DEC, the 75% is for one year or 6 months?

Thanks

[Paddingtons wellies]

I think it is closer to £84,000 basic. We had a 3% lift in April. I don't think there is any truth in the pay rise being missed if you haven't been signed off, certainly not something I have ever heard.

The sector and duty pay does add up. I put about 5% into the pension and my take one is around £4,600 in the winter and gernally over £5,000 in the summer.

[heliusac]

Salary 100% Captain is £83,581.

Duty/Sector varies but summer roughly +£1k pm and winter couple £100 pm.

Non TR DEC it's 70% for some 100% for others with no pattern as to who get's what. 70% lasts as long as it lasts, sometimes as long as 15 months.

Wild rumors of payrise, BALPA are trying for 6% but the reality may be something different!

[BigGeordie]

What is the story with the 50% salary during training? Does that apply to NTR DEC as well?

[Chesty Morgan]

Yes, unfortunately. There is now a time limit for how long you stay on it if you haven't finished your training, I believe it's 13 weeks maximum.

[cgwhitemonk11]

Just noticed your message now, thanks a lot I got an invitation earlier in the week, just waiting for confirmation.
Cheers!

[heliusac]

What is the story with the 50% salary during training? Does that apply to NTR DEC as well?

50% of 100% basic pay until FLC or 13 weeks whichever sooner. Flight and duty pay on top during line training.

[highfive]

So they really expect an experienced EK 777 guy to pack up their life and work for a take home of around £2700/ month for 13weeks?

Pilots must really hate the desert.

[Ivan aromer]

[So they really expect an experienced EK 777 guy to pack up their life and work for a take home of around £2700/ month for 13weeks?
Well I suppose it remains to be seen how many they recruited from the desert on their recent holiday!

[B737900er]

I have noticed on the advertisement that they offer a "great benefits package" What are the benefits they provide?

[Mr Good Cat]

So they really expect an experienced EK 777 guy to pack up their life and work for a take home of around £2700/ month for 13weeks?

Pilots must really hate the desert.

No, I don't hate the desert. It's a harmless bunch of sand dunes.

Luke Skywalker didn't hate the desert, but then again he didn't live in Mos Eisley.

Horses for courses, to each his own.

[Commuter0815]

Some people can adopt to middle eastern working conditions, the money helps a lot. I was there as well, hated it like hell and ejected asap, after 2 years. Since then ghosting around in some european companies, most of them bad but still happy not to be down there anymore any being a piece of (very) high priced cattle without any working rights. Point.

This not to offend anyone, just some can live with that **** what they do down there, other ,like me, not. I prefer to live in free countries and for companies that are bad but are forced by european laws to obey rules that are clearly written down.
Of course you pay a price, but that's up to each individual pilot. Is it necessary to fly this brand new , shiny planes? Is money really everything? Do I really need this beautiful car and that expensive hotel/gym membership(especially for wife and kids) and so on.

I decided that I cannot take all that money with me into the tomb and voted for nice landscapes and european freedom.

I will have as well a look into that Jet2 option, even not being english/scottish(but loving Scotland) and moving up there if they want me. Let's see.

[DooblerChina]

Roll up roll up, forget your 777s and 380s, we're offering knackered old 73s and 75s, and a 50% pay cut to boot... oh and you can forget you private healthcare, housing provision, chauffeur pickups, city layovers & first class travel... cos we at J2 are offering an industry below average 5% pension!!

J2 recruitment road shows in Dubai? seriously? I spot a jolly!!

[Mr Good Cat]

private healthcare, housing provision, chauffeur pickups, city layovers & first class travel

Sounds great.

Interesting though that a significantly higher number of pilots (Captains mainly) will be heading the other way, despite the perks as advertised by the commercial dept.

Just sayin' :ok:

[Penworth]

The pension is actually 8% for Captains, which (although pretty poor) is still more than Thomson will be offering new recruits soon DooblerChina!

I heard a rumour recently that new joining DEC's from the Middle East have been told a basic salary of about £100k. Anyone else heard this? Sounds implausible to me considering the rest of us skippers (apart from those on increments) are at least £15k below this level.

[Ivan aromer]

Quote.
I heard a rumour recently that new joining DEC's from the Middle East have been told a basic salary of about £100k. Anyone else heard this? Sounds implausible to me considering the rest of us skippers (apart from those on increments) are at least £15k below this level

I wonder if there are ANY recruits from the sandpit and how many of those will still have a current 73/75 rating? So PTF or bonding? (Not PM's favoured option since the two numpties who took the 73 rating and ran)

[EPRman]

Penworth,

A poor 10% actually.

[DooblerChina]

Penworth, incorrect statement about pension provisions at TOM but this isn't about my employer. My main issue is that there must be plenty of FOs command suitable. I know one guy in particular who has fell into the face doesn't fit category. Good pilot, good bloke just doesn't prescribe to the corporate babble and he will remain an FO because of it. Crying shame.

Meanwhile your recruitment team are hoovering up exit planners.... these are going to be people with cash in the bank looking to get home and get a cheeky pay check before retirement. Now who would be the better Captain? I would suggest a promoted FO any day of the week.

Anyway, as you alluded to, nothing to do with me so I'll say ta ta.

[Penworth]

I completely agree regarding internal upgrades being preferred. The company professes to having the same view but when it comes down to it, guys who would make great captains don't get through and I can't understand why. They're consequently losing these folks to BA and elsewhere. This combined with a preference for taking low houred guys onto the pilot apprentice scheme is I feel going to result in an experience shortfall in the future.

(Regarding Thomson's pension, just going off what I read on PPJN - 10% in 2016 and 7% in 2017)

[Mr Good Cat]

I wonder if there are ANY recruits from the sandpit and how many of those will still have a current 73/75 rating? So PTF or bonding? (Not PM's favoured option since the two numpties who took the 73 rating and ran)

Yes, there several guys joining from the ME, at least from my airline anyway. Non-rated Captains (bonded for 3 years) and I think a couple of FOs too.

Meanwhile your recruitment team are hoovering up exit planners.... these are going to be people with cash in the bank looking to get home and get a cheeky pay check before retirement. Now who would be the better Captain? I would suggest a promoted FO any day of the week.

I can assure you that not one of the guys joining from here is cashed-up, close to retirement and looking for a cheeky pay check. We all just want to come home. No one is naive enough to think that it's going to be a chocolate-coated gum drops gig - we have all come from where you are now, so we know the score. Actually most guys coming home are in their 30s and 40s rather than their early sixties.

I know it's not nice to have a DEC suddenly jump in to that left seat that you're working hard towards achieving - we've all been there - but I can assure you all the guys joining that I know of personally are highly experienced, highly disciplined and well below retirement age. No over-inflated egos here either so don't worry about that sort of stuff. It's a win-win for the Company as they know these guys won't be leaving anytime soon looking for mega $$$ or big shiny new widebodies...

Hope there won't be too much bitterness shown towards DECs - if you put yourself in this position would you turn down a Captain position at your place of choice if it was offered?

[Ivan aromer]

A word of warning. I recall one of the CRMIs saying that the goal posts @jet2 are fitted with very efficient castors. So Caveat Emptor.

[Cuillin Hills]

Mr Good Cat

As a non-type rated DEC joiner are you, and your colleagues, being offered a 100% or 70% contract?

[Mr Good Cat]

Mr Good Cat

As a non-type rated DEC joiner are you, and your colleagues, being offered a 100% or 70% contract?

100% for the guys I know who are joining from the ME.

[B737900er]

But are the ME guys getting £100k contracts though?

[Mr Good Cat]

But are the ME guys getting £100k contracts though?

Errr... No.

Just the same as everyone else of course.

[Mr Angry from Purley]

Good news for Jet 2 if they are getting guys coming home from ME. A lot of posters seem to struggle with the concept of EK guys joining given all the "roster woes" at Jet 2. Just goes to show it's not all about the roster stability (suspect EK rosters are fairly stable)

[Cuillin Hills]

Mr Good Cat


But are the ME guys getting £100k contracts though?
Errr... No.

Just the same as everyone else of course.

Not true - several well qualified, if not better qualified DECs, still on 70% contracts from last year.

[Mr Good Cat]

Not true - several well qualified, if not better qualified DECs, still on 70% contracts from last year.

What are we talking about here?

I thought the question was about £100k contracts. No one I know has been offered anything more than the standard salary.

If you're talking about 100% full-time contracts - yes, all those I know who are joining/applied from this way are 100% but I can't speak for anyone else.

As for better qualified DECs - I'm just commenting on the thread for the purpose of providing information to the best of my knowledge, to those who are interested in joining... I'm not here to get into a debate about who is more qualified to do this job. If you want pick a fight about that one you need to speak to one of your English/UK colleagues at the offices. I was offered a job and accepted it, just like you did when you joined, no?

Anyway, look forward to working with you and being professional at all times buddy. :ok:

[Dutchformula]

Hi guys.

I finished the verbal reasoning assessment last week on the career page. Upon completion i clicked 'complete' and it was sent across the North sea.

Looking at the assessments tab it said i still i had to do the test i just did. I sent them an email on the address i got for problems with the application. Does anyone know if they respond to it. And if yes in a fair amount of time?

Rgrds.

[Cuillin Hills]

I stated a fact, Mr Good Cat, and you tell me I am looking for a fight!

You stated that you were joining on the same salary as everyone else - I am trying to point out that you are starting on a better salary than a number of people.

Fact - you are being offered 100% contract as a NTR DEC.

Fact - there are a reasonable number of NTR DEC (a couple are friends of mine) who are on 70% contracts having been just as honest and willing as you were at the interview. They are as well qualified (I'll drop the better qualified bit to keep the peace) as anyone from Emirates.

As for me - I answered the telephone questions from the pilot apprentice as honestly as I could. Still waiting but not the end of the world for me.

It would be a bit strange if I subsequently joined on 100% (and I would be as pleased as you obviously are) whilst people who joined before me are still on 70% .

Now do you see where I am coming from?

You are correct in saying that the problem is created at J2 Head Office.

[Mr Good Cat]

Okay, I see where you are coming from on the 70% thing but I have no idea on Company politics I'm just coming to do my job as safely, efficiently and professionally as I can and go home at night and forget about work.

Any pilot will ALWAYS accept a suitable job offer irrespective of whether it affects current employees. I'm not saying it's right, it's just the way it is. I had a good reason to come home and I took the job :sad:

I wouldn't worry about delays on being contacted - most guys seem to have a wait before being contacted.

:cool:

[Honiley]

Top Cat - you're already a Cool Aid Drinker! Have you even started yet?!?

[taxi_driver]

Fair to assume that someone looking to come home from the sandpit will have a cv in at several companies? Maybe some empty seats on courses next march.

And just how much training capacity is available to get large numbers of NTR people on line in a sensible time scale?

Any moves to improve things for existing crew? Fix the leaks before putting more water in the bucket?

[Ivan aromer]

Mr Good Cat

Did they they offer you a management position as well?
Now that would be a poisoned chalice for anybody with half a brain.

[mini-jumbo]

Any moves to improve things for existing crew? Fix the leaks before putting more water in the bucket?

Rumours are that someone has been tasked with pilot retention and fixing the leaks as you put it.

But as with all things here, we'll wait and see if anything comes of it. Meanwhile, many people (from all ranks) keep looking and applying elsewhere.

I expect another winter of resignations unless they announce their retention plans in the next week or so. With virtually all airlines recruiting or planning to recruit, time is of the essence to improve morale and keep people from leaving.

They've scraped through in terms of crew this summer, but I think next will prove far more challenging.

As to training capacity, no, there isn't enough capacity to train vast numbers of NTR joiners, mainly due to the limited sectors in the winter, and the lack of trainers to train them.

Overall, it's not a bad place to work, there are lots of little things which need fixing, mostly stemming from the flying club era. Grown up terms, and grown up ideas are what's required. But generally, you go to work, work with some great people, and are tucked up in your own bed at nights, which has its advantages.

As the saying goes - beatings will continue until morale improves.

[tonker]

There are simply much better offers out there, North and South.

All the airlines are now struggling to get crews with experience. 20 years of diminishing t&cs, together with a much restricted cash flow for training just hasn't attracted the numbers of wannabes like we all once were(are!) And now a bun fight is starting with Emirates visiting Jet2 bases, and Jet2 doing exactly the same in Dubai.

Jet2 is a good place to work, but with a few small changes it could be a great place to have and finish a career.

[Paddingtons wellies]

Hi Tonker

As a current 737 captain at jet2 who wants to live in the North of the UK, where or what is a better option?

This is a serious question.

PW

[tonker]

ill send you a PM.

[Ivan aromer]

Snappy hi-vis?

[Busbo]

With all due respect Silverhawk, that didn't answer the question in any way.

We all know there are big bucks to be had if you want to chase them around the globe but to those of us who wish to know their kids, keep their wives (or husbands) and see their family in the North of the UK.......there ain't much choice.

[Twiglet1]

That means no then Tonker?

[tonker]

No it means I'll send you a PM with what colleagues at Easyjet, Ryanair and Thompson are telling me are telling me about their recruitment and current deals.

Plus the news from folk who've gone long haul with BA, but stayed living in the north.

[Weathergirly]

27 new NG's but no Pilots required. Don't get excited these don't even come with window blinds and only replace some of the tat you guys have to fly. Maybe they will give you a decent salary now you have responsibility for Aircraft that are actually worth something!

[tonker]

Our primary responsibility is to the passengers, and the value of the airframe is irrelevant. BA fly 300's.

[Chesty Morgan]

One would need to be more mature and experienced to realise that though.

Perhaps when she gets her command....

[Busbo]

No it means I'll send you a PM with what colleagues at Easyjet, Ryanair and Thompson are telling me are telling me about their recruitment and current deals.

Plus the news from folk who've gone long haul with BA, but stayed living in the north.

Could we not just post the big insight here?

Although from the above list I don't see the holy grail. From my understanding Easy will base freeze captains for 5 years with no recruitment straight into the north. Ryanair MAY give you your desired base if you're lucky, no guarantees and it's still Ryanair. Thompson don't accept DECs.

As for BA commuting, yes it's an option but for those that value their time at home highly it will never be attractive. Also an unlikely choice for an already experienced captain.

I stand to be corrected on any of the above, genuinely.

[Tarisio]

Thomson, not Thompson.

[Dutchformula]

Good addition^

Anyway, has anyone heard anything yet? Maybe theyre waiting until the job closes and then evaluate everyone? Any news?

[heliusac]

27 new NG's but no Pilots required. Don't get excited these don't even come with window blinds and only replace some of the tat you guys have to fly. Maybe they will give you a decent salary now you have responsibility for Aircraft that are actually worth something!

Most likely fleet replacement for the 300's and just a few 300's left for the mail. So that's probably why they don't need 27 aircrafts worth of new crew. I don't think window blinds are very important but a commitment to 27 new aircraft is surely something to be happy about?

[16024]

I don't think window blinds are very important but a commitment to 27 new aircraft is surely something to be happy about?

I don't think commitment was ever in question, with the general expansion of recent years. This is a game change, though.
Still, the City seems happy with it, so who am I?

[Mr Angry from Purley]

No it means I'll send you a PM with what colleagues at Easyjet, Ryanair and Thompson are telling me are telling me about their recruitment and current deals.Plus the news from folk who've gone long haul with BA, but stayed living in the north.

Tonker

Paddington said he was a current Jet 2 Captain.

[Weathergirly]

16024- window blinds are important- that's why they are fitted. Do you not fly your aircraft with passenger comfort in mind? Maybe you do but at the same time the poor passengers in the back are cooking like roasted chickens. I have used J2 many times and each time I'm told that the crew are happy to help and it's all about me! All I ask is stop cooking me. 32 degrees in Ibiza about a month ago on the scorching Tarmac and I'm sitting sun side of the Aeroplane. I put the safety card in the window to prevent myself sizzling and some jumped up 40 plus Cabin Attendent tells me to remove it. I tell him that I am cooking and I get told to be quiet or the police will be called! Happy to help me get removed.
The blinds are an important part of the aircraft and should not be removed. Whoever even suggested it needs to be kicked up the backside. Did anybody carry out a risk Assesment? I bet not. You lot should try to learn from Airlines that have been around the block a bit - check them out next time down route on a hot day with the sun shining. You will see all the blinds are down sun side keeping the cabin cool. You'll be turning off the Air-conditioning next to save a few more pennies.

[16024]

That's an interesting story.
Why was it directed at me?

[JaxofMarlow]

Actually 16024 it has nothing to do with your comment and is not an interesting story because it is b***** and has nothing whatsoever to do with a pilot forum. Troll alert.

[Ivan aromer]

Quote. Actually 16024 it has nothing to do with your comment and is not an interesting story because it is b***** and has nothing whatsoever to do with a pilot forum. Troll alert.

That's a bit harsh IMO
Actually from the pax point of view a cool environment is very nice. As a 75 Captain I do keep the aircraft cool as far as I can. Window blinds do help. It keeps tempers from running wild.
PM and his minion's obsession with saving a few pennies, (and yes I know all the arguments about running the apu/packs on the ground and the cost of a tonne of fuel) is fruitless.
PM knows the cost of every thing but the value of nothing!

[mini-jumbo]

Weathergirly - then you should be happy with the new announcement. The more 800's the less chance of you sweating down the back. The 300's AC packs aren't as efficient as the 800 - there are no cooling issues on the 800, even in 32 degrees on the ground.

I assume you were on a 300, and if it's any consolation, it gets just as hot in the front, there literally is nothing the crew can do - yes, window blinds would help in this situation, but alas, we don't have them.

[CAP509castaway]

I think you will find that the overheating of cabins is problem with the 300 aircraft, which is being addressed by th purchase of 800 models:ok:

[Ivan aromer]

I assume you were on a 300, and if it's any consolation, it gets just as hot in the front, there literally is nothing the crew can do - yes, window blinds would help in this situation, but alas, we don't have them.

The efficiency of the packs on the -300 is irrelevant if the SOP is to not have the APU running! As for heat in the front, try turning off the window heat.

[Chesty Morgan]

Good job it's not SOP to not have the APU running when it's hot then.

[The Crew]

Jet2 Now re advertising for DEC/DEFO type rate applicants only. Apparently they considering 777 as rated. Most 'bus guys getting PFO emails, regardless of experience.
No desperate, actually as picky as ever. Stock market woes should sort this company out .

[Ivan aromer]

Good job it's not SOP to not have the APU running when it's hot then.f
Define SOP hot! No there isn't one.

[mini-jumbo]

Nobody I know would be daft enough to switch the APU off on a -300 down route with temperatures higher than low twenties.

If you've got ground conditioning, then of course you'd use it and not the APU, but if not, the APU stays running. Even then, the amount of cooling is inadequate but it's better than nothing.

I can't recall seeing an SOP stating that we must shut down the APU on every turnaround, and even if there was, common sense should prevail.

[Ivan aromer]

Quote: "I can't recall seeing an SOP stating that we must shut down the APU on every turnaround, and even if there was, common sense should prevail"

Well I am a regular traveller (2x per month) on a -300 route to southern France. On to stand GPU in, APU OFF. Pax swelter, CC swelter on the T/R, oncoming pax being toasted in the finger as the incoming pax leave. On two occasions have had to divert to Marseilles, same deal No APU whilst crew talk to Mission control.
Perhaps the common sense store was closed on these days?

[Reversethrustset]

Or maybe we can get back to talking about Jet2 recruitment. :-)

[Ivan aromer]

Or maybe we can get back to talking about Jet2 recruitment. :-)
As it used to say on old charts: Here there be Dragons

[Chesty Morgan]

Good job it's not SOP to not have the APU running when it's hot then.f
Define SOP hot! No there isn't one.

Hot is subjective so I can't define it. When I decide as the captain that I need air condition the APU stays on. That is the policy. There is no SOP to
not have the APU running!.
:mad:

[Ivan aromer]

Hot is subjective so I can't define it. When I decide as the captain that I need air condition the APU stays on. That is the policy. There is no SOP to
Quote:

Well done you!