Jet2 - 3 [Archive] - Page 4

OltonPete

22nd Apr 2008, 10:04

Probably won't happen but not as daft as it sounds?

FR would get Manchester, Newcastle, Leeds & EDI bases, which
were probably targeted for the future anyway (LBA could read DSA & NCL, MME). EDI is already announced and Manchester although close to LPL it
has not stopped BHX and EMA.

Some of the LS aircraft are owned and the 733's will find homes in
Eastern Europe & Africa with the 757's going to pax or cargo operators.

They could use some of the "20" parked 738's in smaller number on the
757 & 733 routes and that would leave crew conversion as the major cost
(and legal fees :}) and shifting around the existing FR crews to cover the bases in the short-term.

Yep still expensive but not totally mad;).

GSM would be my other guess but the less said about that the better:sad:.

Pete

gearupflapsupshutup

22nd Apr 2008, 10:08

Well for everybody involved, hope for the best!:ok:

probably Jet2 will acquire a high density A380 (the "BIG" anouncement) to do a Low Cost service to NY, loads of fending machines in (they don't want commision) sorry i am just kidding:)!

anyway, let's wait!

757 Speedbrakes

22nd Apr 2008, 10:14

757 & 733 routes and that would leave crew conversion as the major cost

I doubt it - I'd never stay to work for Ryanair and I'm sure most of my colleagues wouldn't either. We've got a few people at Jet2.com from Buzz and there's no way I'd fancy going through what they did.

If i wanted to fly dangerously I'd become a stunt pilot!!

Anyway, the above is all 'epidemic' (lol) as there is more chance of Jet2 merging with the new Northwest / Delta airline than PM selling out to MO'L!!

STATSMAN

22nd Apr 2008, 10:20

Is a fending machine a vending machine that you cannot get to work. Sorry

If they sold Jet2, the Dart Group could start up a cargo airline called Channel Express and operate F27's (if they can find any)!!

Statsman

gearupflapsupshutup

22nd Apr 2008, 10:31

yep, Fending machines (both vending and fending)

sorry got carried away :oh: bad joke

AbeamPoints

22nd Apr 2008, 10:40

Lets see.

Jet2 have no slots. They operate a different type. Their brand value is tiny. Part of their route structure it totally different to RYR. Their AOC is tied up with a wide business group.

And you think MOL in the teeth of a UK and Irish house price crash and recession will chose to spend money buying an airline that will likely go bust anyway. If for some unfathomable reason he wanted to operate the marginal Jet2 routes then he would just park his jets on their lawn and destroy them within months. No legal fees, no negotiations and no buyout price.

If Globespan, Jet 2, or Baby think that any of the large LoCo's would spend a penny in anything other than driving them to the wall then they are delluding themselves. Buzz and Go occurred during the expansionary land-grab phase. We are now in a deflationary cost saving phase.

There is no room for Baby, Jet 2 or Globe and I expect each to no longer exist 18 months from now.

EI-BUD

22nd Apr 2008, 10:47

While i dont think that Ryanair will acquire any airlines this year. I think that in the context of grounding 20 planes over the winter, a takeover of Jet2 could work really well.

The 20 738s could be (i realise training of crew would be required) sent to LS bases to operate existing routes, ie MAN LBA etc. The existing fleet could be sold or returned to the lessors, or kept on by the dart group for Frieght, and by next Spring new Ryanair arrivals (738s) could step in to fill the void of the 20 (or less) 738s that would to LS.

As i stated above while it would make sense, i dont think this will happen. However, I can see some consolidation coming within the market. Surely a tie up of a smaller LOCOs ie Bmibaby, Globespan, Jet2 would merit some wisdom?

AbeamPoints

22nd Apr 2008, 11:08

Are you on drugs?

RYR can't make a profit on 20 of its aircraft over the winter and park them up instead as it's cheaper. But you think they should start them up and use them on routes currently served by smaller aircraft operated by an airline that doesn't make any money on those routes. Yeah, great plan, stand aside Michael - here's the saviour of Ryanair coming through..

You think Channex can just walk away from their leases without penalty or just pick up freight contracts on a whim?

Here's a better plan all the way from O Learys cattle ranch. You (and Stelios) sit on a big pile of cash at hand. You operate into the teeth of the coming recession by cutting costs where possible and then bleeding money as slowly as possible. The smaller weaker rival airlines run out of blood before you do.

Then you mop up whichever routes you fancy whilst bending the airport operators over the back of the fire truck on charges. Any pilots now out of work are welcome to apply to RYR, paying their CV reading fee, paying for their type rating or conversion and starting on the newly reduced wage structure. And sod TUPE.

That is the future. Along with Aer Lingus going bust as the Eire Tiger dies of bird flu.

757 Speedbrakes

22nd Apr 2008, 11:16

There is no room for Baby, Jet 2 or Globe and I expect each to no longer exist 18 months from now.

I disagree. If there were only 2 loco's left in the uk then it would be the pax who would suffer the most.

Jet2 have a few factors on their side - they own all their aircraft, which is an important factor at a time of high fuel costs. It means they can sit on the ground and not cost the company lease fees.

They have been profitable for the last 20 odd years and still remain so, just!

They survived previous resessions and sept 11.

They operate charters and cargo flights as well as scheduled.

The summer season is fairly well booked.

Like him or not, the man at the top is very schrude, very clever and has than prooved his business prowess.

The company's only borrowing is from it's parent company (which has no borrowing of itself).

AbeamPoints : As your so morbidly keen to see three airlines fail, I can only assume you have no real interest in this industry. In any case, please spare a moment for those employees, of which there are many in BMI baby, Globespan and Jet2, before you make such 'off hand' remarks.

jet2impress

22nd Apr 2008, 11:17

Routes that don't make any money??? I doubt that the £18.1 million from the dart group last year didn't all come from the trucks!!! :ugh:

harrogate

22nd Apr 2008, 11:22

Most of this thread cracks me up.

STATLER

22nd Apr 2008, 11:23

Easy jet would be nice,

They could put 700's in to Leeds as they move them out of other bases, and get the crews initially on a TUPE agreement.

If they wanted to set up at LBA without a takeover they would only have to set up a stand at the entrance to the staff car park at LBA, and they would probably pick up 98% of Jet2 crews immediatley. I cant see anyone not wanting to move over! WHY?

Modern kit.
A rostering aggreement that would be followed.
Better pay.
Staff travel.
Crew food.

To be honest there would be no reason what so ever to stay at Jet2!!!!!!!

en2r

22nd Apr 2008, 12:06

Surely a tie up of a smaller LOCOs ie Bmibaby, Globespan, Jet2 would merit some wisdom?
I think a merger is the only way these airlines can survive for the long term.
That is the future. Along with Aer Lingus going bust as the Eire Tiger dies of bird flu.
Aer Lingus isn't going anywhere. They posted their highest profits ever last year, and as far as I recall they made more profit per passenger than Ryanair did! Also they have a significant portion of their fuel hedged unlike MOL! The Irish economy isn't dying, far from it. Unlike most other western economies, it isn't in recession, its just slowed down and is growing at a much smaller rate than it has in the past.

harrogate

22nd Apr 2008, 12:50

Eh?

The vast majority of western economies are merely slowing down. Ireland is no different to anyone else.

Very few western economies are in recession.

STATLER

22nd Apr 2008, 13:33

The vast majority of western economies are merely slowing down. Ireland is no different to anyone else.

Very few western economies are in recession.

We're already in a recession, its just being dressed up as something else! Very few people are out spending, the volume motor trade is on its arse, houses are falling in price and there's a sale on every high street. If thats not the sign of a recession I don't know what is!!!!!!!!

Have you heard this!

22nd Apr 2008, 14:31

just wait till tommorow for the "Big announcement"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And the big announcement is..........

What......????

The SSK

22nd Apr 2008, 14:47

We're already in a recession

Nope, nowhere near.
A recession is two or more successive quarters of negative economic growth. Neither the world, nor the US, nor the UK, nor any European economies were near that stage in Q4 last year and are not much closer in Q1 this year.

Things are slowing down for sure and will slow down a bit more yet. IMF issued its latest outlook for Europe yesterday (http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/survey/so/2008/CAR042108A.htm), it's not particularly cheerful but it's not doom and gloom either.

tonker

22nd Apr 2008, 15:01

Dunnnnaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh

http://www.jet2.com/News.aspx?id=430

Well it's big if you only have a few routes here:hmm:

EI-BUD

22nd Apr 2008, 15:19

I can assure not on drugs! Not my thing!;)

Just because Ryanair park 20 aircraft does not mean all routes are loss making, the issues here is that they realise that in winter many markets are more seasonal and hence too many frequencies routes available. Removing 20 aircraft is how they take the slack out of the system and ensure half full planes are not flying around!

I am not fully aware of whether the aircraft are on lease or how long is left either, but if Ryanair took over they could as part of any deal ensure that these aircraft were not there headache.

And you know that Jet2 is not making any money on these routes??? Surely you can appreciate that if Ryanair took over the cost of Jet2 management would disappear. What I mean by this is that Ryanair adsorb the cost of taking over Jet2 into the big picture and the operating cost of the old Jet2 would be substantially reduced.

Aircraft operating leases are not a big issue, not if Ryanair wanted the company and it was for sale. As in the case of Buzz if a takeover occured a plan of action would occur and all would eventually progress as did Buzz.

As in the case of Aer Lingus,I believe that they are much better placed than any of the local LoCos ie they have good cost base, good operating margins, young fleet, good brand, and will be around. Brand is key as is cost base and delivery of same. They will be around..

Ryanair can trample over any airports as it pleases, it can ditch the rules all in the name of achieving lower cost and profits, but you will find, price alone is not a guarntee to supremacy in the skies.

THanks for your feedback, obvious that a lot of thought went into it!:D

ls_jet2

22nd Apr 2008, 15:25

The Greek routes from NCL have been on there for a few days, so it can't be that:hmm:.

Can't help with what it might be, but they'd better hurry up otherwise it'll turn out to be yet more bollox written about Jet2 on here.:ugh:

harrogate

22nd Apr 2008, 15:31

Nope, nowhere near.
A recession is two or more successive quarters of negative economic growth. Neither the world, nor the US, nor the UK, nor any European economies were near that stage in Q4 last year and are not much closer in Q1 this year.

Things are slowing down for sure and will slow down a bit more yet. IMF issued its latest outlook for Europe yesterday, it's not particularly cheerful but it's not doom and gloom either.

Thank you. Saved me a job.

Armchair economic analysts use the term 'recession' too readily. It has a meaning. It's not just a term given when some house prices in London fall a bit (house prices are still rising around here, by the way).

We're at the very least 6 months away from recession at present. It probably won't happen.

AbeamPoints

22nd Apr 2008, 15:42

Parking the equivalent of BmiBaby over the winter suggests that the winter will be harsh for all airlines if RYR can't make any money.

Buzz is irrelevant. The Post Sept11th era of massive LoCo expansion is firmly in the past. Buzz wasn't going to the wall. In the present economic climate every commentator and analyst is saying that several airline will go under.

Your faith in the Aer Lingus operation is lovely. Not forgetting they came within a whisker of going bust 6 years ago when they were State supported this confidence is suprising. Dublin house prices are down 12% in a year. The dependence on US corporate investment is rapidly becoming a liability as the Euro/Dollar rate rockets. No economy in the West in the last 60 years has expanded like the Republics without resulting in a recession.

You think Eire won't see one? Really?

Take away the Lingus transatlantic revenue and you are left with a small marginally profitable airline that competes on cost with Ryanair. Hardly an investors fantasy dream.

I don't wish to spend undue efforts disparaging specific airlines business models. My views are expressed merely to counter the theory that Jet2 would be an attractive purchase to O' Leary. It isn't and won't be. At any price.

You'll find very very few airlines in a mood to go out shopping in the current turmoil. Lufty for BMI - maybe. You think airlines are going to spend money on adding more regional shorthaul capacity and I say you would have to be on drugs.

groundhand

22nd Apr 2008, 15:45

Quote:
"Ryanair can trample over any airports as it pleases, it can ditch the rules all in the name of achieving lower cost and profits, but you will find, price alone is not a guarntee to supremacy in the skies."

Have to disagree.
FR do not always get what they want and then choose not to fly to the airports that won't meet their demands - their choice, their business.

FR have a proven business model (for FR) but not every airport is willing to participate as not every airport would see a nett gain by having FR operate. Again, their choice, their business.

GH

LeedsN1

22nd Apr 2008, 15:52

From earlier post (Mr @ Spotty M)

I understood it was due to start services to Newark (New York)around the end of the summer, but they were not going to be sold by Jet2, in that they were being operated on behalf of someone else.

airbourne

22nd Apr 2008, 16:29

[QUOTE

You think Eire won't see one? Really?

QUOTE]

Its just a small thing, but stop calling us Eire. Its the Republic of Ireland or Ireland.

en2r

22nd Apr 2008, 16:48

Take away the Lingus transatlantic revenue and you are left with a small marginally profitable airline that competes on cost with Ryanair. Hardly an investors fantasy dream.
Aer Lingus's shorthaul network is far more profitable than their long haul network.
Your faith in the Aer Lingus operation is lovely. Not forgetting they came within a whisker of going bust 6 years ago when they were State supported this confidence is suprising.
The airline then is virtually a different airline from the airline now. The company was totally restructured, there were over 2,000 redundancies, staff terms were reduced, loss making elements of the airline were axed and the shorthaul fleet was streamlined into one model, the Airbus A320/1 family. Aer Lingus also now has a very young fleet, unlike BMI Baby, Jet 2 and Globespan.
Its just a small thing, but stop calling us Eire. Its the Republic of Ireland or Ireland.
Hear Hear!!

STATLER

22nd Apr 2008, 17:14

Armchair economic analysts use the term 'recession' too readily.

That's as maybe but we are in a recession, we just don't use the R word as we still have our heads buried in the sand. The UK, US etc economies are F##ked and one of the next things to be hit is going to be holidays.

The vast majority of the public have totally overstretched themselves and rested on the fact that their properties will pay for it.

Things can only get worse.

jimworcs

22nd Apr 2008, 17:39

but a recession is defined as "Two consecutive quarters of declining GDP". We have not done that, and neither has Eire, no matter how many sales you see in the shops; but there are dark clouds looming!

en2r

22nd Apr 2008, 17:51

neither has Eire
Its just a small thing, but stop calling us Eire. Its the Republic of Ireland or Ireland.
Why do ye persist in calling us Eire??? As airbourne said, its the Republic of Ireland or just Ireland!

speedrestriction

22nd Apr 2008, 17:52

airbourne

If you are bothered to check the front of your passport (assuming you are Irish) you will see that it says ÉIRE in nice big letters.

Even if they wanted to it would be difficult for the RYR board to justify the purchase of another airline when they have excess capacity within the current fleet and are taking pretty serious measures to keep operating costs down.

sr

harrogate

22nd Apr 2008, 17:55

We are not in recession. The economy is still growing. Slower than predicted, but still growing nonetheless.

Hopefully things will stay more realistic now, and banks won't return to the kind of irresponsible tactics that have slowed the economy this time.

We've had the boom and so far we've avoided the bust. It should sort itself out now, but lessons probably won't be learned.

It only appears f*cked when you compare it to the unrealistic, deceptive and unsustainable short-termism that's been dominating the economy for the last few years. But it's not f*cked. It's more normal now.

en2r

22nd Apr 2008, 18:08

Even if they wanted to it would be difficult for the RYR board to justify the purchase of another airline when they have excess capacity within the current fleet and are taking pretty serious measures to keep operating costs down.
After the disaster that was the attempted takeover of Aer Lingus (it got blocked by the EU and the shares have since lost over €100 million in value) I can't see the Ryanair board being in favour of any other takeover attempts anytime soon.

EI-BUD

22nd Apr 2008, 18:38

Thanks for the reply.

Firstly, I dont dispute that it will be a harsh winter, it will be a harsh winter in profit terms. Despite all this the outlook is that passenger numbers will continue to grow albeit at a softer pace. The market will probably be more hotly contested. Prices will obviously be key and hence airline costs.

I disagree that Buzz is completely different, the Buzz story supports my comments earlier that the aircraft could be displaced and replaced with parked 738s, if Ryanair wanted Jet2 and it was for sale, the state of the leases or aircraft would be irrelevant. & Buzz wasnt going to the wall?? It was losing a packet and KLM gave it away quiet literally as it was bleeding cash at an astounding rate.

Thank you for complementing my faith in Aer Lingus our national carrier. It is completely irrelevant that Aer Lingus was close to bankrupcy 6 years ago. They met the challenges so well. The outlook is that Ryanair will get into a dog fight to a bigger extent than at present with the DAA and Park aircraft, and guess what this is an opportunity for Aer Lingus!

It is sad that you see Aer Lingus going under in the near future, but think of this, Aer Lingus has made profits in the same markets where they have severe competition from Ryanair, yet Easyjet find this next to impossible, Easyjet is a good business model, but they avoid Ryanair in the same markets.

When did i say Eire wont have a recession? ('you think Eire wont see one? Really?), i am at odds to understand how you could read this from my last posts!

Passenger numbers are unlikely to drop, if a recession does materialise we may see a severe slowing in growth but i wouldnt anticipate a significant drop in numbers.

It is in these hard times that we are likely to see consolidation, a time when airlines will not see the merit in developing new markets and losing a fortune in wiping out competitors through cut throat competition, I agree that Ryanair will not buy Jet2, but going back to my comments originally I said that I could see the sense in it. Manchester is a huge market and a foot in the door as in existing business, would be the ideal way for Ryanair to be number 1 at Manchester. This otherwise is going to be Easyjet territory.

I dont think Aer Lingus will lose any TransAtlantic revenue in fact they are ideally placed to grow this business and they have the right path ie with tie up online with Jetblue and code share with United.

Apart from all that an awful lot of US originating passengers are using Dublin as a transit point to get to all over Europe. This business will only grow. This is what T2 is going to be used for and Aer Lingus will be ideally placed.

groundhand:
You are correct that many airports dont give in to Ryanair's whims(eg Milan Malpensa!), but sadly in many cases where Ryanair is the dominant one, they do hurt!

EI-BUD

rudolf

22nd Apr 2008, 19:52

Manchester airport website has this on the live flight information section:

LS9999 00:30 Sydney Cancelled

Part of the big announcement?

??????

Outremer

22nd Apr 2008, 22:43

.....we're all keen to talk ourselves into:

Ernst and Young report (E & Y are no New Labour lackeys).

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7357367.stm

Perhaps we should hunker down and fight our way through a slowdown rather than occupy the deck chairs on the Titanic.

Is there any real evidence that either GSM or Jet2 have fluidity problems?

napolean

22nd Apr 2008, 23:09

Speedrestriction

If you are bothered to check the front of your passport (assuming you are
Irish) you will see that it says ÉIRE in nice big letters.

True, but do you also go around calling Germany "Deutschland" all the time?.

Straight under "Eire" on the passport is "Ireland", so unless you are going to make the rest of your post in the Irish language, it would be better manners if you referred to Eire as Ireland on an English language forum.

rudolf

22nd Apr 2008, 23:25

Good grief.

Get a room!

plasticAF

23rd Apr 2008, 00:01

Jet2

Ok so some can earn £500 a month. My last comment stands, If you rely on your 'bonus' to live on your living beyond your means. Until I joined Jet2 I never got anything but basic pay. No matter how many hours I had to work to complete the job! I live within my salary and look upon any monies earned extra as a bonus. Yes it is hard on those CC who have been used to the commission levels up till now. But that's the new playing field so there's no point throwing teddy bears out of the pram. Lets all work together and make this year the best we can for the benefit of ourselves and the company.:hmm:

ncleflights

23rd Apr 2008, 00:02

harrogate and SSK whilst your correct we are not a recession as the economy is still growing what we are witnessing and most economists now seem to acknowledge the fact is that the brakes have well and truly been slammed on the economy.

Mortgage lending has dried up, credit card limits are been reduced, food prices through the roof, the cost of a tank of fuel in the family car rocketing, council tax (UK) rising at twice the rate of inflation for many families, Gas and Electricity prices rising at three times the rate of inflation and finally house prices falling in many places (not just the UK but Ireland and Spain). All these factors combined actually mean that your average guy in the street now feels much worse off and as wage rises are not keeping pace the household budget, whilst not the economy as a whole, is in recession. We all have less money to spend and this is going to hit the airline industry hard.

Most families are now looking at the budget and the first thing that is going to go is the family holiday are the weekend city break. This unfortunately is going to mean that whether we like it or not anyone in the airline/leisure industry is suddenly going to have to wake up to the fact that our jobs are a lot more precarious than they were a couple of months ago.

Whilst last year I did not think so I now believe that a couple of UK airlines will prob fail this year simply because they aint the money around in the economy to fill the capaciity available. Who that is I don't know, I suspect LS may be OK but have serious concerns about GSM simply because they still have not recovered from last years long haul fiasco and those airlines that are in the strongest position now will survive.

Sorry to be the messanger of doom and gloom but untimately we are the ones that look like paying the price for the greed shown by the banks in the rush to enter the US sub prime mortgage business. Whilst the Gov or going to bail out any bank in trouble any airline that runs into trouble is unfortunately not going to be so lucky.

ncleflights

23rd Apr 2008, 00:14

plasticAF - just to stick my two penith in here on this whole commission business. Last year when I attended the cabin crew recruitment day, I did not join you folks, so I have no hidden agenda here. I recall on numerous occasions the management from LS banging on about how the commision boosted your salary. Therefore if management are touting the commision to prospective cabin crew as part of the salary I suggest that your been rather hard on your flying colleagues within the airline for suggesting that they are living beyond their means by reagarding the commission as part of their salary!!

maat

23rd Apr 2008, 00:30

like him or not, the man at the top is very schrude, very clever and has than prooved his business prowess

As were Laker, Goodman & Newman; to name but three.

J-Man

23rd Apr 2008, 09:06

Whilst your having a barney, i guess this so called 'big announcement' never took place. Suprise suprise. I was hoping for some more routes from leeds.

no sponsor

23rd Apr 2008, 10:13

"Like it or not the Treasury must use its standing in the international markets to borrow and fund the mortgage lenders directly,"

That report has another agenda. We live in a capitalist market environment, what will be will be. No amount of the government wasting my money will alter the crisis we are all facing.

Oil is now $119.37 per barrel :eek:

tonker

23rd Apr 2008, 12:15

Where's the "Jet2 buyout" thread gone?:suspect:

757 Speedbrakes

23rd Apr 2008, 12:45

Hopefully the Moderators are having a clamp down on treads that are complete B*****ks! :hmm:

harrogate

23rd Apr 2008, 13:21

It was a laughably mental thread, completely lacking in substance and based entirely on speculation. Let's hope it's been deleted.

tonker

23rd Apr 2008, 13:57

Let's hope the speculation and bollocks helps my shares.

We wouldn't want rumours on the rumour network would we:\

harrogate

23rd Apr 2008, 16:22

But it wasn't a rumour.

It was baseless sh*t stirring.

luvly jubbly

23rd Apr 2008, 17:37

This is how us GSMers felt a couple of months ago when it was our turn......

I guess it's FlyBE's turn next!:ugh:

plasticAF

27th Apr 2008, 11:02

ncleflights

Usual story, only half the info :O That does smack hard. I offer my apologies to ALL the cabin crew I have angered. I'll push off now and get on with some work

LeedsN1

27th Apr 2008, 12:17

Jet2 joins European budget airline association

25.04.08
Leeds Bradford Airport (http://www.lbia.co.uk/) based budget airline Jet2 has joined the European Low Fares Airline Association (ELFAA). It becomes the 12th airline member of the association.
John Hanlon, Secretary General of ELFAA, said: ‘We are delighted to welcome Jet2. From start up of a low fare model in 2003, the success of the airline has been such that it has rapidly grown to carry some 4 million passengers in 2007 across the UK and Europe, using 30 of the most environmentally-efficient aircraft.’
Jet2 is headquartered at Leeds Bradford Airport and operates from hubs at Manchester, Belfast, Edinburgh, Leeds Bradford and Newcastle to 34 destinations in the UK and 12 European countries. ELFAA airline members include: clickair, easyJet, Flybe, Myair.com, Norwegian, Ryanair, Sky Europe, Sterling, Sverige Flyg, transavia.com, Wizz Air.

Mr.Brown

28th Apr 2008, 16:11

using 30 of the most environmentally-efficient aircraft.’
in 1985 maybe

BorisJohnsonsJohnson

28th Apr 2008, 16:33

what happened to the big announcement? maybe it'll involve an announcement about commencement of a leeds to new york service to start in september and running through til januaryish, then to recommence in summer 2009 on a more permanent basis. maybe theyll use existing 757 aircraft. maybe because of the captive audience the fares might not be particularly low. maybe ;)

tonker

28th Apr 2008, 18:10

Boris Johnson once appeared on a celebrity question of sport.

During the horse racing questions he was asked to name the most dangerous race?

" Oh yah i know this one" Boris said confidently.

"The Arabs":O

take-off

29th Apr 2008, 10:12

using 30 of the most environmentally-efficient aircraft.’

in 1985 maybe

That made me laugh too,

A300BOY

29th Apr 2008, 10:20

So whats the difference between a 1985 General Electric CFM-56 fitted to the Jet 2 aircraft and a 2008 General Electric CFM-56 as fitted to the brand new Boeing 737-800 delivered recently to Ryanair, not too much difference methinks ! so statement pretty accurate.

kick the tires

29th Apr 2008, 10:43

Its not all about engines!

Try a very thick inefficient wing on the -300 compared to the critical wing of the -800.

A300BOY

29th Apr 2008, 11:03

Thanks " Kick the tires" I am sure you are correct about the wing virtues but do you think he was referring to thet kind of environmental efficiency ?? as a local Lba resident (by choice) the noise affects my environment most on a daily basis and the Jet 2 aircraft are no worse than the brand new Ryanair models. However I hope Jet 2 go from strength to strength and then when new aircraft join the fleet you will be happy with your new wings and I will be happy with the excellent service the company provides from Leeds.

BigT2207

29th Apr 2008, 11:58

Did Jet2 not buy new engines from Pratt & Witney.

Big T

Skipness One Echo

29th Apr 2008, 12:57

Try a very thick inefficient wing on the -300 compared to the critical wing of the -800

Oh dear God that's just complete rubbish, the -800 is compartively better but the -300 is a good machine where well looked after.

Did Jet2 not buy new engines from Pratt & Witney.

No idea, but the CFM56 is the ONLY engine on the B737 from the -300 onwards.

BigT2207

29th Apr 2008, 16:01

My memory is not what it was this is from June Last year

Jet2 signs engine maintenance deal

22.06.07
Pratt & Whitney announced that Leeds Bradford Airport based low-cost airline Jet2 (http://www.jet2.com/) ainis the second customer for its Global Materials Solutions CFM56-3 aftermarket parts program. It follows United Airlines as a confirmed customer on the program, with the company adding that a third unidentified customer from China also has also been signed up.
Jet2 has awarded Pratt a 15-year fleet management program covering its 21 737-300s that ultimately will include all of the 48 parts Pratt is developing for the CFM56. Pratt valued the agreement at more than US$275 million. Engines will be maintained at Pratt's Norway facility.
The airline's CEO, Philip Meeson, said: 'We have competition on our routes. Why shouldn't we have competition on engines?'
Jet2 expects to carry around 4 million passengers this year. It serves 39 European airports from six in the north of England.

So its just maintenance no new engines

Big T

kick the tires

29th Apr 2008, 16:50

Skipness,

The -300 is a direct deriviative of the old -200 and dates from the very early 80's. The wing is the same as that old girl, but a number of aerodynamic improvements were incorporated to improve efficiency including modified leading edge slats.

The -700 new wing has greater chord, span and wing area. To demonstrate the efficency, simply look at the crusing Mach number of .78 to .8 ish, compared to .74 on the -300. Think of it as trying to push a shed through the skies, blunt frontal area needs more thrust to get it moving, so burns a lot more fuel than that required for a more slimline or streamlined version.

The engines cannot be simply grouped together as CFM 56. The series are TOTALLY different, the only commanality being the core of the engine.

The Next Generation 737s feature more efficient CFM56-7B turbofans. The CFM56-7 combines the core of the CFM56-5 with the CFM56-3's low pressure compressor and a 1.55m (61in) fan. (Simple google search!!)

Torquelink

30th Apr 2008, 08:49

Jet2 has awarded Pratt a 15-year fleet management program covering its 21 737-300s

HOW old will that make the fleet when the contract expires!?

:)

jet2impress

30th Apr 2008, 09:06

About as old as Ryanair's -200's were when they retired them! :O

A300BOY

30th Apr 2008, 14:59

Still think the comments were reasonable !!! the Cfm-56 has evolved as has the wing design but the -300 is still pretty environmentally friendly ! I fly the A300 with the CF6-50 installed. The CF6-80 is a much better more powerfull developed version but one or two extra patterns round the biggin Hill hold would prabably be the difference between the two !

Squark7000

30th Apr 2008, 18:37

With the engine and wing improvements, the 737-700 has a fuel burn of
around 10% less per hour then the -300. Take the higher cruise speed
into account and the actual fuel burn per trip will be slightly better then
10%.
Now add winglets if you wish (can be to both the 300 and 700) and the
improvement becomes slightly better as the 700 winglets are slightly
larger and thus slightly more effective.
Additionally, the 700 is cheaper to maintain by design. i.e. in years to
come, a 20 year old 700 will cost less to maintain the a current 20 year
old 300.

TSR2

5th May 2008, 16:02

Anyone know what happened to the MAN-FAO flight this morning. According to Flight Stats it left MAN more or less on time but arrived FAO some 2 1/4 hours late. Just curious.

Ex Cargo Clown

8th May 2008, 02:16

Ok, well here is my Jet2 experience.

Manchester - Budapest

Booked a flight for myself and the other for a weekend away, unfortunately Thursday thru Saturday was all we could manage due to work commitments, This was booked in February, the flights were in May.

All of a sudden in March, Jet2 cancel the Wednesday flight. Of course we had booked hotels and made arrangements etc. Because of "Operational Reasons".

Now oddly enough, I've worked in the airline industry long enough to know that they chopped the flights because they could use the equipment on other routes, for a better yield.

Why offer the BUD in the flight engine, well after the summer schedule was out ???

And what did I get in return, fly on the Tuesday, which was impossible due to work, or fly the Thursday, which would have left us two days.....

Did they ever treat me like a customer ??? No, I was passed from Indian call centre to unanswered email. In the end after call after call, and then email after email, I got a settlement to move my flights by 28 days. Unfortunately, it took myself and my partner 2 months to sort dates where we were both available to get the initial booking, so this offer was ridiculous. Of course they wouldn't move the booking to say sometime sensible like September.....

Absolutely the worse airline I have ever dealt with, and that is going some. And thankfully I have persuaded a group of people to cancel their BFS-TLS travel based on my experience, and I will happily tell everyone I know what a dreadful, and disgusting airline these scumbags are.

dbertman

8th May 2008, 06:48

I flew Leeds-Dusseldorf with them back in April last year and thought they were great.

rpmac

8th May 2008, 07:42

I flew with them last October Leeds to Palma and thought they were great.

ls_jet2

8th May 2008, 08:01

So you expect Jet2 to continue a service that hasn't got enough bookings on it to warrant it running:rolleyes:. Sorry, but in this day and age it isn't going to happen:=, and whilst it might have been inconvenient, it must have made commercial sense.

As for your experience thereafter, well it does sound a bit of a fiasco, but if you think we're the worst then you'd better not try any of the other lo-co operators or you're in for a shock:{.

I too travel with Jet2 regularly, four or five times a year to be precise for the last four years, and I have never had a problem. A few delays, but nothing major, and from what I have seen when it's gone really pear shaped Jet2 will at least get you home as soon as poss unlike most others.:ok:

682ft AMSL

8th May 2008, 08:06

Leeds - New York (Newark) appearing the Jet2 booking engine this morning by the look of it.

HiflierEK

8th May 2008, 08:29

New york charter service announced this morning, starting in november !

BLKsheriff

8th May 2008, 09:27

£250 each way before tax & the rest

Ex Cargo Clown

8th May 2008, 09:28

ls,

Lo-cost or not, they are an airline and must abide by airline rules, especially those laid down by the EC.

I'm seeing them in court. They have breached EC regulations as I should have been placed on the first AVAILABLE flight, whether that is on LS or not is not important.

To be honest I hope I put this band of cowboys out of business. Treat your customers with contempt and it will come back to haunt you.

Kev 1

8th May 2008, 09:41

These "cowboys" as you call them are doing a smashing job at offering low fares from Northern Airports, where Easyjet & Ryanair do not provide the destinations or fares that they so often advertise heavily.

Think you hoping to take them out of business is wishful (if not down right stupid) thinking on your part, and as someone in the airliner industry I would have thought you would have known better than to make such ridiculous comments.

Judging by what you wrote, Jet 2 seem to have offered you to change your flights for 2 8days around your date of travel, now if that isnt enough time to re-arrange then I dont know what is to be honest.

Don't suppose your a tree-hugger or ex-employee of Jet2 who is trying to tarnish their reputation are you? Seems that way to me...

wawkrk

8th May 2008, 19:25

Clown,
You are obviously a very very very experienced traveller,not.

Laws or no laws, only the mainline airlines can afford to throw money around.
In fact, even they cannot do anymore.
By public demand,the good old days are over.
The new airlines must control their costs or die.

As for Jet2. After having used them probably 100 times,they are for sure a cut above the rest with an excellent business model.
Very professional,nearly always on time or even early.Great pilots.
I have travelled the world and flown with hundreds of airlines,and Jet2 have got it right.I reckon they wont be too bothered about loosing your business and that of your ill informed friends clown.
My flight this morning? perfect.

3redsnawhite

8th May 2008, 20:08

Hey ex clown,

I worked in banking for two of the big boys(Not NR) for 10 years. Didn't see us closing shop due to a complaint despite P-ing off 60% of our customers on a regular basis. Get a grip.:rolleyes: We all have bad experiences in life.

On the positive side you have prompted my first post. Big up Jet 2 for the New York venture. I really hope it works. Lets discuss that instead.

3RAAW

lbalad

8th May 2008, 20:19

Great news,I am sure this limited series of flights will be booked up pretty damn quick!.Think they will end up putting more flights on.

Does anyone know,will the 757 be able to do Newark non stop from Leeds?

ncleflights

8th May 2008, 20:43

New York - Don't want to put a dampner on all the excitement about these New York Services but I am not sure actually how successful they will be. While I hope they are a quick comparison on seat only prices for the December 4 departure with LS and the same departure and return dates from MAN with CO actual show that CO are a lot cheaper.

I know its two different airports but given Manchester and Leeds do have some sharred catchment area this can't be good news for the LS. Given the choice of flying LOCO or full service, cheaper with a legacy cariier well we all know which ones folks are going to choose.

RAPC

8th May 2008, 20:47

Not sure how quickly they will get snapped up at nearly £600 for a round trip to NY when you could go for a few hundred quid cheaper from Manchester over the same period. The difference in price would pay for taxis both ways and still with money to spare.

Great to see the flights launched, but they need to sell it at a realistic price.

lbalad

8th May 2008, 21:08

I agree the flight only price is not cheap,but the inclusive Jet2 holidays price is not unreasonable.

Check out the prices of New York hotels,you could probably get a cheapish hotel near Newark,but in New York its self no chance.

Passed a travel agent in York tonight offering 3 nights in N.Y with Virgin for £679 xmas shopping trip,not much difference.

I am sure there will be a lot of people that will book up,based on the novelty value of being able to fly from LBA to N.Y.

If I had £700 spare in my bank account,I'd be off like a shot!.

Only been to N.Y. once before,on a xmas shopping trip from LBA via AMS with KLM years ago,would love to go again.

4567

8th May 2008, 22:41

Are Jet2 planning on any other longhaul routes from any of there bases maybe SFB (Florida) like GSM?

Do Jet2 have plans to get 767's like GSM to have longer range?

Crewing Gimp

9th May 2008, 08:18

Well Done Jet2 with the New York:ok:

I Guess the ETOPS has been approved, What about the crewing will it be Level 2 or crews downroute?

The Gimp

Mr.Brown

9th May 2008, 10:02

Glad to here their only doing a handful of flights for now to test the water as ETOPS is not cheap and I think with the current set up could prove difficult to maintain.

HiflierEK

9th May 2008, 12:06

Jet2 said this is the first of many specialist routes and are advertising internally for a number of Long Haul crew, one of the requirements is to be prepared to spend long periods away from home so looks like the trips might be good for crew.

lbalad

9th May 2008, 12:26

Like I said in my previous post,I think the New York flights will do well on the novelty value of being able to fly from LBA direct.

I think other limited flights to places like Florida or Toronto or Caribbean for example would do well too!.

757 Speedbrakes

9th May 2008, 13:27

All very well but LBA isn't exactly geared up for Long Haul.

I'm mostly refering that useless excuse for a runway. Unless pax are prepared to have tech stops so aircraft can uplift fuel, say at Shannon, just to go from LBA instead of MAN?

HOODED

9th May 2008, 15:37

That useless runway seems ok for Shaheen to do Islamabad direct, not heard of them doing a fuel stop yet! Whilst Jet2 dont have any A310s I'm sure a 752ER with a few less seats should have no problems.

PaperTiger

9th May 2008, 16:37

UK lowcost carrier Jet2 will launch first trans-atlantic service with service on the Leeds/Bradford - Newark service in November and December 2008.

Service operates on Thursdays from Leeds and Sunday from Newark.So what does the plane do for 2 days in EWR ? :confused:

(Answer: I assume it's a wet lease and does other things for other people in the meantime.)

wawkrk

9th May 2008, 17:18

Regarding New York non-stop.

If my info is correct (approx) LBA to Islamabad is about 400 miles further than New York. Also,the 757 should require less take-off distance of about 400ft over the Shaheen A310.
Primitive estimate I know but even so, why not non-stop?

wawkrk

4567

9th May 2008, 17:53

How many a/c do Jet2 have based in there bases and what types beetween the 737-300's and 757's?

dbertman

9th May 2008, 19:04

21 737-300
8 757-200

757 Speedbrakes

9th May 2008, 19:38

Regarding New York non-stop.

Sorry, I wasn't refering to New York. lbalad mentioned Toronto and Florida and I standby my statement that the runway at LBA is pretty dire - but I'm only a pilot :ugh:

JohnnyRocket

9th May 2008, 20:27

Its a load of BS. Gimmick. far too expensive. Only running it before christmas. I read somewhere that they might do an orlando run as well. Seasonal. Very pricy. Could go premium econ for what they are charging. As alan sugar would say. No good. No good.

dbertman

9th May 2008, 21:38

Of course it is, it is aimed at the same lazy 'Ibiza' type market (those who pay sometimes over twice what they would if they had booked the flight/hotel/transfers separately).

For instance just the Jet2 flight from LBA-Newark (NY) costs £579 return on 13/11 - 16/11. You can get a direct flight from MAN-Newark for £354 on the same dates and that is with bmi. Slap a £20 rail ticket to manchester on top of that and you still save over £200, and you will probably get a far better aircraft and less chance of the flight being pulled at the last minute.

TSR2

9th May 2008, 21:46

Just been looking at flight only prices in November for 3 night stay.

Basic Fare + Tax - £579.98
Baggage Charge - £7.96 Each way
Credit Card / Fuel Supplement - £26.10
Total - £622.00

Optional - Reserve standard seat £3.99 Each way.
Optional - Reserve Extra Legroom seat £50 Each way.

Interestingly, the front cabin section (rows 1-9) are blocked off.

lbalad

9th May 2008, 22:17

I don't think many people are going to be booking the flight only option.

The cheapest hotel on the Jet2 holidays website in New York is the Thirty Thirty.

On Expedia,the cost of the hotel 13/11-16/11 is £636 for two pax,roughly £318 per person.Add this to the cheapest flight above from Man,and there's not much difference in the £699 for the package from LBA.

I guess we will just have to wait and see if these flights prove popular or not.

dbertman

9th May 2008, 22:27

The cheapest hotel on Expedia is actually the Royal Park Hotel for those dates, and at £127.6 makes it only £63 each, add this on to the bmi £354 flight and still it only costs £417. So not quite the 'bargain' at £622 with jet2 from LBA.

Stampe

9th May 2008, 22:32

For those with an interest in performance for a 752 out of LBA.Here are some approximate figures.Lets assume ....optimum flap, still air, a temperature of 5 degrees C. QNH1013 (standard) and a dry runway with A/c packs off ..... one my companies 757 would be able to take off at

Rwy 14 112503 Kgs climb limited
Rwy 32 109293 Kgs obstacle limited
if the runway were wet and at that temperature engine ant-icing on
Rwy 14 112353 Kgs climb limited
Rwy 32 107954 Kgs obstacle limited

Jet 2 s proposed airframe is showing currently a max RTOW of 113398 Kgs so LBA runway limiting not the aircraft.Typical ZFW for a full load of all adults with not to many bags outbound (short duration shopping trip) might be around a maximum of 82000 kgs
Therefore the worst case will allow a fuel load of about 25954Kgs and the best case about 30503 Kgs.Full tanks on a 752 is about 34270 kgs.My guess is that on the right day subject to the headwinds on the N.Atlantic they may be able to make NY direct.Higher temperatures,low atmospheric pressure or aircraft unserviceabilities might considerably reduce the figures above.Great circle distance EGNM-KJFK 2916nm so lets say 3100 nm ground distance assume a 460kt.TAS and say a 40 kt headwind overall = a flight time of about 7hrs.20 min. Direct most probably possible but very subject to conditions on the day might be better to schedule a tech stop at Shannon and have an easy day out.Hope this helps Stampe:ok:

lbalad

9th May 2008, 22:57

dbertman,

I was trying to illustrate like for like.I know there are cheaper hotels available,but some of the hotels in New York are literally roach motels!

Just looking on expedia,the cheapest packages from LBA with KLM same dates roughly £439 in Newark area.

I hope these flights are a success for Jet2.A lot of people will book without doing the research revealing there are cheaper options out there!.

757 Speedbrakes

9th May 2008, 23:14

Good point. I don't imagine Jet2 want to just sell 'flights only'. They're trying to sell and promote Jet2holidays!!!

I have a feeling it will work but not sure where it leads from here - to more good things I hope and just think of all those staff in New York wondering where LBA is! :D

STAMPE - might be better to schedule a tech stop at Shannon very interesting and thanks for proving my point! :ok:

RAPC

9th May 2008, 23:23

dbertman - bmi don't fly from MAN - EWR. They fly to ORD and then on to EWR via a United flight on a codeshare. It is a very reasonable journey, but not direct as you suggest. I still agree with your point on costs though.

MAN - EWR on Continental would be a fairer comparison though.

tonker

10th May 2008, 08:56

I was told last night there will only be 4 of these trips, so i imagine it's a small but profitable market testing excercise. Nothing wrong with a bit of experimentation as long as it doesn't cost too much(i tell the wife).

skyman771

10th May 2008, 09:36

Papertiger So what does the plane do for 2 days in EWR ?
I presume It is actually THREE nights! as the trips are being marketed with 3 nights accommodation & surely this does not include one night in the hospitality of LS. Which interestingly raises another question that if these trips are being marketed as including 3 nights accommodation what are the precise timings? As I have seen no reference to 'Monday arrivals' back in LBA then presumably they must be early morning departures from EWR reducing actual 'day' time in NYC to two days?

lbalad

10th May 2008, 11:08

If you look at the Jet2holidays webpage,it does say including 3 nights hotel accomodation.

Flight departs LBA Thu 09:00 arrives EWR Thu 12:20.

Flight departs EWR Sun 18:55 arrives LBA Mon 07:05.

lscrew

10th May 2008, 11:51

"Interestingly, the front cabin section (rows 1-9) are blocked off."

I assume these rows are to be used on the Jet2Plus service £100 each way. Extra leg room included.

Ex Cargo Clown

11th May 2008, 03:49

I'm sure the NYC customers will receive the same standard of deplorable customer service as I had as well........

And as for the person who said I hadn't flown an awful lot.....

I've used more ID90s than anyone I know.....

They are in the wrong, and it makes no difference whether they are lo-co or not.

If you buy a 60p tin of tomatoes from Waitrose you expect it to be exactly that.

If you buy the a 30p tin from ASDA or Tesco then you'd also expect it to be tomatoes, just not of the same quality.

You certainly wouldn't expect the cheaper version to poison you..... I'm sure if they did there would be an awful lot of problems.

If anyone wants to PM me about this issue, feel free, I'm sure I'd get more sense out of you than your "call-centre".......

dbertman

11th May 2008, 07:46

You didn't die though, so that's a plus:ok:

AEUENG

11th May 2008, 10:31

ex cargo clown,

Are you still harping on? Jesus man, get a grip! You are gonna have a heart attack before you go on this bloody holiday if you carry on at this rate!

Take your case to the highest court in the land and to the EC if you like but please stop bending our ears about it as you are making them bleed! Go and vent your spleen in Jet Blast if you wish as that forum is dedicated to whingers!

:ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh:

wawkrk

11th May 2008, 10:48

New York
My wife and daughter have booked on the flight departing LBA on the 13th Nov. They tried to upgrade but the front half of the aircraft is showing reserved so no upgrade available.The call centre cannot help. Can anyone throw any light on this.
wawkrk

Mr @ Spotty M

11th May 2008, 11:01

I was told by someone a while back that the aircraft would not be scheduled services by Jet2.com and were being charted by or operated for a third party.
I would guess that the blocked off seats are for the charter and Jet2 is selling the rest by its holiday division and by Jet2.com.

0523 cov man

11th May 2008, 11:26

your tarking crap b757 is a short take off aircraft

SLF@LBA

11th May 2008, 11:31

Note that on the EWR flights the baggage allowance remains at 17kg! Given that many people will be using these flights as a pre-Christmas shopping trip there's likely to be an unpleasant surprise for excess baggage on the return.

The standard baggage allowance of the traditional carriers ex MAN (DL/CO) of 2 x 23kg looks much more attractive.

Channex101

11th May 2008, 12:01

wawkrk, apparently what will happen is once the fine details have been sorted out everyone who has booked on the flight will be sent an email offering an upgrade to Jet2Plus USA. So i would imagine she'll get an email soon offering the upgrade
Hope this helps

4567

11th May 2008, 12:36

Could Jet2 ever open a base at GLA?

daz211

11th May 2008, 13:06

So are there any plans for the STN base ? seem to have taken on
more C/C over the the last few months.

wawkrk

11th May 2008, 13:06

Channex101, many thanks.

757 Speedbrakes

11th May 2008, 14:16

Could Jet2 ever open a base at GLA?

Not while Globespan are there. I belive there is an agreement not to operate from the same base.

0523 cov man

Not sure what your point re LBA was but take a look at Stampe's figures.

Yes the 757 surpasses at take-off's from hot and high aerodromes with short runways with good loads but that doesn't mean it can go at MTOW!

pol1wx

11th May 2008, 16:05

Yes the 757 surpasses at take-off's from hot and high aerodromes with short runways with good loads but that doesn't mean it can go at MTOW!

But with winglets they can. :ok:

airhumberside

11th May 2008, 18:24

Not while Globespan are there. I belive there is an agreement not to operate from the same base.
A - What about EDI?
B - Isnt that anti-competitive?

757 Speedbrakes

11th May 2008, 18:52

Good Point!!!!! :ugh:

MUFC_fan

11th May 2008, 18:53

They are never going to come out and publically say

"Jet2 and flyGlobespan will never compete on routes and will never launch bases at the same airport with significant competition" and make a contract are they. As you say there maybe a 'Gentlemenly agreement' that they will not.

EDI is a base for LS mainly for the cargo flights but if you notice, the routes they operate from the airport offer very little problems to GSM.

Would be pretty stupid for LS to move into the GLA market with Glasgow being covered domestically by FR, U2 and BE and internationally by FR, U2 and GSM.

Best to stick with what they have and work on their current bases. If they can get stronger with the bases that they have then there is more hope for the airline.

Anyway, will LS be placing an a/c order any time soon? There a/c are getting old and if they want to compete with the high fuel prices then operating older a/c is not really the best way of going about it. At one point they were really easy to run as they were easy to get hold of, lots of qualified staff and also cheap to run. The latter is probably out balancing the other factors meaning it isn't benefitting the airline any more.

Why not get hold of some of the U2 73Gs? Bang some winglets on them and get them flying around Europe - that may reduce the high fares aswell!

Hope it works out for LS in the long run. I cannot seem the company going bus, but maybe one day, if fuel prices carry on the way they are doing, it may return to just cargo flights.

Lets hope this doesn't happen!:=

airhumberside

11th May 2008, 19:05

Would be pretty stupid for LS to move into the GLA market with Glasgow being covered domestically by FR, U2 and BE and internationally by FR, U2 and GSM.
Theres quite a few gaps in the GLA route network. For example no GLA-Italy flights. None to Prague, Nice, Murcia. All staple routes at many UK airports. And some of these routes, like Prague and Nice arent served from PIK either - it's EDI or England

Whether now is the right time to try and fill these gaps is another matter altogether ...

MUFC_fan

11th May 2008, 19:15

Having seen the destinations that you have mentioned is does seem that there are a few gaps but I still believe that they should, if they plan to in the current situation, expand from existing bases first.

JB007

11th May 2008, 19:29

But with winglets they can

757 Speedbrakes Give it up, you're dealing with Spotters mate, they know more then us about everything...:ugh::ok:

Channex101

11th May 2008, 22:50

The Jet2/GSM "gentlemens agreement" wa broken when GSM opened up a base in MAN (Although it didnt last long) hence why the contract for LR operating for GSM in EDI came to an abrupt end

MUFC_fan

11th May 2008, 23:00

Which routes did GSM compete with LS on?:confused:

If we are taking your method we are going back to EDI where both airlines have a base.

GSM had a base with a 767 flying to South Africa and Canada with the flights to North America still going which is completely different to LS's European operations at MAN.

Ex Cargo Clown

12th May 2008, 00:25

Lets hope LS go "bump" sooner than later, the world can do with fewer rubbish carriers around.......

And no I'm not some bitter ex-employee, I'm someone who has been well and truly stitched up by LS, and is well out of pocket due to their intransigence.

So any LS people want to PM me ??? Thought not..

LS= Rubbish

ls_jet2

12th May 2008, 07:25

We can't be bothered wasting our time and effort on you:ugh:. You've obviously made up your mind and nothing we say will make a blind bit of difference. How about you PM me if you feel the need to communicate with someone that you seem to have a great desire in putting on the dole:=:=.

From your initial post you indicate that you were offered seats the day before and the day after, this would then fulfill the requirement to put you on the next available flight would it not?? After all, there aren't any other flights to BUD from MAN:ok:.

tonker

12th May 2008, 08:23

Ex Cargo Clown i can't speak for customer services and how you were dealt with, but i work with hundreds of really decent people all intent on getting you to your destination as comfortably and safely as possible.

You say you want LS gone because of your bad experience and as a fellow complainer i'm with you, but middle management have let you down, not your fellow aviators and cabin crew who you seem intent on destroying the lives of.

I personally loath Ryanair and all it stands for, but don't want or wish redundacy on any of their employees.

757 Speedbrakes

12th May 2008, 11:17

Lets hope LS go "bump" sooner than later, the world can do with fewer rubbish carriers around.......

You going to secure us all with suitable employers that doesn't involve pay cuts or upset to families. I'm sorry you had a bad experience but if you think Jet2 are the only airline to cause somebody aggrevation your a bigger idiot than you already make yourself out to be!

I've been mucked around more times than I care to remember by the 'worlds favorite airline' but I didn't wish damnation on them and their staff because they overbooked seats then lost my bag!

I could rant on and lower myself to your childish level but that would be futile, as I belive everyone else on this thread already holds the same opinion of you.

BYALPHAINDIA

12th May 2008, 11:41

Ex Cargo Clown, I think what you said was very narrow, And a kind of 'Feet First Attitude'

And to say that at this current uncertain period, Is well:mad::ugh:

Just because you had a bad experience, Doesn't mean that you have to wish LS an appointment to an 'early grave'

Maybe you work for a carrier that will never die???:hmm::ugh::=

Is any Airline Perfect????

bobleeds

12th May 2008, 11:48

Get over it.

bluepilot

12th May 2008, 12:10

dont bite, this ex cargo clown is just fishing for a reaction. All the J2 employees on here have said sorry in one form or another, but he keeps harping on. Let him crawl under his rock and die.

mickyman

12th May 2008, 12:14

Ex Cargo Clown

I am very glad that you had a 'bad' experience and I hope you go on to have many more of the same.You read like someone about to machine-gun
everyone in all your posts - your obviously very disturbed and I hope that
you do not inflict your attitude on any family that you might have.

Your posts contain nothing but bile.

Are you Austrian ?

MM

Mr A Tis

12th May 2008, 13:19

I've had some pretty shoddy treatment by Thomsonfly & the skytrax web-site isn't all that favourable to them. I even complained to the CAA AUC, who pretty much agreed with my complaint, but have no teeth to force TOM to do anything (which they didn't). Ive travelled with TOM / Britannia for over 30 years, but their new "MoL" management style means I won't fly with them again-ever.Having said all that, the actual operating crews are pretty well a good bunch, let down by their customer services. I guess it's fairly much the same now accross the Lo Co sector. ( Air Berlin being a clear exception, IMHO)
I have not experienced any problems with Jet2 (yet).
All you can do is vote with your feet in these circumstances, but its rarely the boys & girls on the aircrafts' fault when things go wrong.

Mr @ Spotty M

12th May 2008, 16:17

I think the main problem reference the clowns post is as follows.
The problem with low cost airlines in general and this does not single out Jet2, is that if the new EU travel conditions state next available it does not mean on the same carrier.
The way l see it and l may well be incorrect, is you get put on a flight that gets you to your destination ASAP, it might mean flying by BA or who ever and might also mean a change on the way, for say via T5 at LHR.
The problem at the moment is that over 90% of all airlines seem to ignore the law and try and get away with it and are hoping that the individual gives up and does not take them to court.
This only my opinion but the Consumer Association has over the last few years also pointed out that airlines try and hide their responsibility to the travelling public behind the complex legislation.

TSR2

12th May 2008, 22:37

One of the conditions of any airline booking is that you accept THEIR Terms and Conditions which are easily accessed from the airlines' home page.

According to Jet2's T&C's, EX CARGO CLOWN should have been offered a choice of three options when Jet2 decided not to operate a flight after a booking had been made.

1. Transport to destination 'AT THE EARLIEST OPPORTUNITY ON ONE OF THEIR FLIGHTS'
2. Re-route to destination 'WITHIN A REASONABLE PERIOD OF TIME ON ONE OF THEIR FLIGHTS OR MUTUALLY AGREED MEANS AND CLASS OF TRANSPORTATION'
3. Full refund.

If EX CARGO CLOWN has not been offered ALL THREE options then he/she has valid grounds for complaint, unless the prefice to these options 'Except as otherwise provided by the Warsaw Convention OR the Montreal Convention OR EC Regulations' provides JET2 a legal get-out clause.

14 loop

13th May 2008, 18:40

Delivered to LBA tonight from Norwich.

4567

13th May 2008, 19:45

How much longer can Jet2 get out of there 733's before there going to have to replace them?
Will it be 73G'S and 738's they will replace them with?

MUFC_fan

13th May 2008, 19:54

They should get some of the 73Gs leaving the U2 fleet.

If they were to buy new a/c I would go for a three type fleet (that is if they plan on lasting, which hopefully they will!):

B737-700 (Smaller bases and thinner routes)
B737-900ER (757 replacement for European flights such as MAN/LBA/NCL/BFS bases)
B787-3 (Trans-atlantic flights etc. plus some MAN/LBA flights to AGP/PMI etc.)

Will probably not happen but we will see. The main advantage of the current fleet in the -300QCs which are very lucrative for the airline.

14 loop

13th May 2008, 20:21

In the current climate, I'm sure those 737s will keep going for sometime yet. Heck, if SAS and Spanair can keep those noisy MD83 flying, then Jet2 will have no prob!

Charlie Roy

13th May 2008, 23:15

Some Christmas shopping flights laid on in November from Leeds to New York :cool:

Mr @ Spotty M

14th May 2008, 05:15

Charlie Roy, have a look at post 858 & 859 on the 8th May, sorry mate only a week late in your news.:ok:

Yeadon Dam

14th May 2008, 06:43

Just out of curiosity, how much will it cost to get a second hand B737/700 and how much scrap value can you get for a B737/300?

A320fan

14th May 2008, 11:56

G-LSAJ has been named Jet2New York ..... sounds like they will be using 'AJ for the New York trips then?

757 Speedbrakes

14th May 2008, 13:43

Is she the proper Red and Siver colour or has she been painted quickly white with a few tins of Dulux found in the garden shed like AD?!

ara01jbb

14th May 2008, 16:46

jet2.com has flight times and dates as follows:

Thursday 6th November 2008 – Sunday 9th November 2008
Thursday 13th November 2008 – Sunday 16th November 2008
Thursday 4th December 2008 – Sunday 7th December 2008
Thursday 11th December 2008 – Sunday 14th December 2008
All flights depart from Leeds Bradford at 09:00 arriving into New York at midday and then depart from Newark at 21:00 arriving back in Leeds Bradford at 08:00.

http://www.jet2.com/bargains.aspx

So does the a/c just sit on the ground in EWR over the weekend?

jet2impress

14th May 2008, 19:01

"Does the a/c sit on the ground in EWR all weekend"........ Yes! :zzz:

A320fan

14th May 2008, 19:15

Is she the proper Red and Siver colour or has she been painted quickly white with a few tins of Dulux found in the garden shed like AD?!

She was in the full red & silver livery when she arived at Leeds looking very good indeed.

Just out of curiosity how come the 757's pretty much always stay at the same bases? Its normally G-LSAH/I/G up at Leeds, 'AB at Belfast, 'AC or AA or AD at NCL and 'AA/AE/AD at MAN? are they just more suited performance wise or is it just random?

richardnei

14th May 2008, 21:12

It's party due to the number of seats on each a/c. For example AB has 228Y so on bfs flights they know they can only sell 228. Also the config of each also varies as they've all come from different backgrounds.

757 Speedbrakes

14th May 2008, 21:18

I asked into this last week. Seating and galley arrangements are a factor but it's Engineering odly that is the deciding factor?

LBA can keep AG/AH/AI!!

commit aviation

14th May 2008, 21:58

By and large the ex Chinese aircraft will stay in LBA due seat config.

AJ might be named New York but she is unlikely to head off across the pond - not the lightest airframe in the fleet I understand...... :confused:

JohnnyRocket

14th May 2008, 22:52

Anyone got a photo of the New York jet?

757 Speedbrakes

14th May 2008, 22:57

Looks like the others - from the outside anyway!! :rolleyes:

I Belive AB and AE are earmarked for pond-crossing duties. Most efficeint according to the fuel league table and I belive they could also get Winglets. Both vey nice to fly too. :ok:

Jet2krazey

14th May 2008, 23:50

http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/showthread.php?p=1248807

GoEDI

16th May 2008, 13:39

Winter starting to go on sale.

BFS/EDI/LBA/MAN/NCL-CMF

BLK/LBA/MAN-GVA

LBA-SZG

4567

16th May 2008, 15:43

When NY charter flights begin will Jet2 have ETOPS in place and take an ETOPS route? Just noticed on the flyglobespan forum there ETOPS is back in place and made me wonder about Jet2.

Would a Jet2/Flyglobespan merger ever happen anytime soon?

commit aviation

20th May 2008, 20:41

Canaries flights have gone on sale this evening:
LBA - TFS / LBA - ACE
MAN - TFS / MAN - ACE
NCL - TFS / NCL - ACE
BLK - TFS

Somewhat slimmed down programme.
Nothing from BFS and nothing to LPA (at least not yet!)
Tuesday TFS flights gone too!

:ouch:

take-off

21st May 2008, 15:35

Were the tfs from blk that bad to have cut Tues flights or have they not loaded them on system yet? If just weekly flight will we see the 757 popping in?

757 Speedbrakes

28th May 2008, 09:51

...............:confused:

Think you've had too much of that sherbert!

flybar

28th May 2008, 19:28

Any idea why tonights inbound Ibiza flight to LBA has diverted to DTV?

3redsnawhite

28th May 2008, 19:53

Flybar,

Low cloud and a CAT 1 aircraft. One attempt on 32 then off to DTV.

3RAAW

Illuminated Windsock

28th May 2008, 21:27

See no Tues Tenerife flights from LBA shame because many people like the 10 Day holiday

leedsnorthern

29th May 2008, 18:24

Does anyone know what's happened with the Faro - Leeds flight today? Was also wondering when Summer 2009 will be going on sale - is it usually August time?

N707ZS

29th May 2008, 18:35

Leeds Faro departed from Durham Tees Valey as that was where the 757 was diverted to the day before.
Is it cheaper to do a P flight or bus the pax to DTVA?

Wellington Bomber

30th May 2008, 07:04

Is it cheaper to do a P flight or bus the pax to DTVA?

What do you think?

I think the fuel burn for a few coaches is slightly less than a B757

I cannot believe some of the questions on someforums

4567

4th Jun 2008, 15:56

Anybody know how Jet2 is coping with Fuel prices etc at the moment? Have Profit/loss figures been released for last year? Any more share drops?

MUFC_fan

4th Jun 2008, 16:06

LS have hedged their fuel until next summer.

Check the news section on their website.

Mr.Brown

4th Jun 2008, 16:52

LS have hedged their fuel until next summer

What happens in winter 09 then? I think its just prolonging the inevitable!
Anyway with the way this summer is going, they won't even get past September.
It has been a really really bad start to the summer all ready with aircraft reliability not doing good at all.
Its great that they have hedged the fuel and own their own aircraft but have they got the money to keep those buckets in the air?????

Facelookbovvered

4th Jun 2008, 17:52

MOL spouting his usual tripe, asked to name airlines who wont make it, he comes up with Flybe (who are 15% owned by BA, have a good business base = high fares and low running cost turboprops) and Jet2!!

This is from the mouth of MOL who has just taken a 90m Euro writedown on his punt (no pun/punt intended) on Aer Lingus and has managed to find himself unhedged at the time of historic high fuel prices.

Remember if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck!! Blair,Maxwell, MOL next what utter B******t this guy comes up with

MUFC_fan

4th Jun 2008, 18:08

Would surely have to say that the two most stable locos/low fare airlines have to be BE and U2? BE has the backing of one hell of a financial fist who won't want to see their stake diminished and their future regional airline put into jepordy! Also, U2 started to attract a lot of business passengers a couple of years ago and now is prospering in this market even more. U2 have the business backing at the moment in that they are the biggest loco in London and have flights to the major business centres across Europe mostly to the main airports.

Obviously FR are going to be up there as they have huge amounts of £££s in the bank but I don't see them maintaining stability like the two mentioned above over the next couple of years.

Having said that the price of fuel has started to drop abit due to both more fuel becoming available and the drop of oil demand from growing economies so hopefully we will see more drops and see less fears of that stupied figure of $200/barrel mentioned!:eek:

Hey, by the time LS's hedging runs out fuel may have returned to it's once normal price!:ok: What would MOL have to say to that!;)

4567

4th Jun 2008, 18:52

Have LS released there profits or loss for last year?
Is there plans to expand LS long-haul?

Did MOL mention GSM aswell?
Not going to well for them at the moment 13million loss last year However Tom Dalrymyple called this "insignificant" so the Globespan gruop must have money. Though its stated that there well on target to make profit end of 08 with bookings up 10% this year and those money making 763's which are to be leased W08 and suposidly 736's & 733's to be sold off end of the year. Supposidly to be replaced by 7NG's & 738's and 1 more 752 for YHM programe S09. Though they have this court date on July 2nd which could entail an unlimited fine which doesn't help matters. I hope they are flying for a long time to come just better hope there long-haul goes ok this year atleast there using there own 763's and 752.

A320fan

4th Jun 2008, 19:18

Have LS released there profits or loss for last year?

They released last years accounts up to the 31st March 2007, a profit of £18.1 million. They are due to release accounts up to the 31st March 2008 in the coming weeks so it could be a make or break time.

What happens in winter 09 then? I think its just prolonging the inevitable!

Well that is a very very good question, however it may not be prolonging the inevitable! Say Jet2 hedge their fuel ($130/gallon as an example) for winter 2009/summer 2010. In 2009/10 there is no way to predict what will happen to fuel prices but *my* personal oppinion is that it will keep on increasing then Jet2 are sorted. It is a big gamble but not as bigger gamble that Ryanair are on, they are unhedged and MOL seems to think that fuel is going to rapidly decrease in price and if it doesnt then he has said that Ryanair WILL only break even in 2009. Personally I think that the Dart Group (not just Jet2!!) will make a profit this year, next year and for many years to come.

People keep bringing up ohhh "Jet2 is doomed" well that is a complete load of rubbish, Jet2 has changed a lot to accomodate this 'economic downturn rubbish' by cutting capacity at Manchester & Newcastle, where certain routes were not profitable, they have whacked charges for bags, seat selection etc and lowered hold baggage allowance, changed the way commission works for the cabin crew so even if Jet2 make a slim profit on the actual 'flying' they will have added a tidy some on the additional charges that so many airlines keep adding on.

lbalad

4th Jun 2008, 21:55

Anybody any clue as to how this limited series of flights is selling so far?

exrotarybooty

5th Jun 2008, 11:25

From the Jet2 web-site:

Soon after news of the New York service was launched on 8 May, the company was flooded with bookings, the vast majority by women, and if the pattern of 72 per cent female bookings continues, it will be the most popular route out of Yorkshire for women passengers.

Mandy Round, General Manager at Jet2holidays, said: "We knew this would be a popular route for Christmas shoppers, but we didn’t anticipate it would have such a strong female bias."

ERB

Musket90

5th Jun 2008, 16:50

I wonder if their male partners are aware - could be an unexpected very expensive Christmas for some.

danielsirrom

5th Jun 2008, 17:14

In response to the above post...

WOMEN....know your place!

I was told recently, although I'm not sure if it is true or not, that nowadays some women have their own incomes.

dochealth

5th Jun 2008, 18:37

Mr Brown

Got any figures for LS reliability and/or delays?

Any one know average fleet age?

Musket90

5th Jun 2008, 19:07

daniel - I wish mine had.

Mr.Brown

5th Jun 2008, 19:53

Got any figures for LS reliability and/or delays?

If you believe the airline, On time performance is great ( http://www.jet2.com/flightinfo.aspx), but every airline says that. Should we believe their own propaganda? :confused:

Remember the wepons of mass destruction in Iraq:ugh:

I know that they have had a few more problems with aircraft reliability this year, more than expected.

flybar

5th Jun 2008, 21:43

Looks as though they have a 757 gone tech in Murcia

scamptonboy

6th Jun 2008, 05:44

dochealth
Any one know average fleet age?

737's 15 built in 86, 2 in 87 and 4 in 88 Avg fleet age 20.8 years
757's 3 in 87, 3 in 88, 1 in 89, 1 in 90 and 1 in 92 Avg fleet age 19.7 years

Scamps

Facelookbovvered

6th Jun 2008, 08:16

We know ryanair and easyjet have a young fleet, but how does Jet2 average fleet age compare with the likes of Flybe,baby,Globespan, AirBerlin, BA & KLM?

A320fan

6th Jun 2008, 10:01

I hve only put in airlines with similar fleets.

BA:
BA 737 Fleet Age: 16.1 Years
BA 757 Fleet Age: 13.6 Years

BmiBaby:
WW 737 Fleet Age: 13.3 Years

European Air Charter
EAF 737 Fleet Age: 31.9 Years

Monarch:
MON 757 Fleet Age: 22.9 Years

Globespan:
GSM 737 Classic Age: 9.4 Years
GSM 737 Next Gen Age: 4.2 Years
GSA 757 Age: 12.2 Years

Thomas Cook:
TCX 757 Age: 12 Years

FlyBE:
BE BAe 146 Age: 18.2 Years

First Choice
FCA 757 Age: 10.2 Years

Thomsonfly:
TOM 737 Classic Age: 11.7 Years
TOM 757 Age: 14.3 Years

Lufthansa:
LH 737 Age: 17.4 Years

So yeah Jet2 aircraft are not young, but many airlines have other variants that are way over the 20 mark on such things as 767's.

A320fan

6th Jun 2008, 10:06

Looks as though they have a 757 gone tech in Murcia

Yep, G-LSAB the BFS based 757 is in Murcia, but Jet2 used the LBA based 757 G-LSAI for the passengers going back to Belfast and have cancelled the LBA service. Its showing as est LBA 18.00 today so either crew went out of hours or AB is poorly and will be coming up to LBA today for maintenance at Multiflight?

757 Speedbrakes

6th Jun 2008, 10:34

AB................... not one of the aircraft earmarked for ETOP's :rolleyes:

Still, at least Jet2's engineering is a little better than Globescams ;)

webby1919

6th Jun 2008, 11:23

GSMs average fleet are as follows:

B733s: 9 years
B736s: 9 years
B763s: 10 years
B7NGs: 1 year
B738s: 2 years
B752ER: 12 years

Average overall age: 7

A320fan

6th Jun 2008, 14:55

Thanks for that, as a matter of interest do you know how old are KLM F70&100 fleet

They average at exactly 15 years. Fokker 50's average at 16.5 years.

i was surprised at the baby figure looking at the paint work on some of them, perhaps whites not a good idea?

Yes, having flown many examples of bmibaby 737's you would not think that they are from the mid 90's!!

Of course at the end of the day a 20 year old 737-300 is just as good as a 5 year old 737-300 if its maintained well. Jet2 will not be removing the -300's for a long tiem yet, having signed a deal with CFM for the engines of their 737's and they are currently investing by 'plugging' the eyebrows of them so this is a guess that they will still be around for a while.

wawkrk

6th Jun 2008, 15:11

It seems the New York flights will just be filled with bags.:rolleyes:

Gertcha

6th Jun 2008, 17:08

Hi,
Possibly not the correct forum, but I'll give it a go. I need to get in touch with someone at Jet 2 regarding their website on a professional basis for my company. Can anyone point me in the right direction please? Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks

Jet22

6th Jun 2008, 17:43

Jet2's NYC service is going to be a busy one. I think that the following three outcomes are possible

The service will just be a complete failure(Not Likley)!!!
The service will be a sucess but due to lack of resources(not that there is) they cant continue and infact sell the route/slots to someone like CO who will operate the service 5-6 weekly code-sharing with LS!!!
The service will be a success and the service will be introduced by LS lets say 4 times a week!!!

4567

6th Jun 2008, 19:34

Its selling pretty well with the run up to christmas on a couple of dates but is there a demand for a year round service?

Will the route be flown non-etops?
Do LS plan any other long-haul routes?

Centre cities

6th Jun 2008, 20:32

Or it is meant to be shopping trip series, is not meant to be anything other than that and never will be, sucess or not.

Centre cities

airhumberside

6th Jun 2008, 21:01

The service will be a sucess but due to lack of resources(not that there is) they cant continue and infact sell the route/slots to someone like CO who will operate the service 5-6 weekly code-sharing with LS!!!
There is nothing to sell. There is no route authority and as yet no slots at EWR

And why CO would be interested in codesharing with Jet 2 I have no idea when CO could make a LBA route work themselves. However with current fuel prices and cutbacks CO are not going to be intersted in LBA for a long while I would expect

MUFC_fan

7th Jun 2008, 10:17

And why CO would be interested in codesharing with Jet 2 I have no idea when CO could make a LBA route work themselves. However with current fuel prices and cutbacks CO are not going to be intersted in LBA for a long while I would expect

Exactly. They are not going to be intrested in the route with their own metal because of the crunch. Why not have a code-share? What is there to lose?

I think once we come out of this decline we may see some of the busier EWR routes (MAN, EDI etc.) introduce heavier aircraft which may free up some 757s. They may then look at places like NCL but I believe LS will have LBA sown up by then.

Skipness One Echo

7th Jun 2008, 12:17

Continental don't have the heavier aircraft available or on order to swap as you suggest and going head to head with Jet2 they would wipe the floor with them as they offer connections all over the US from Newark and Jet2 offer squat diddily.

This is all such a plane spotters wet dream ! Going into the biggest market downturn in living memory with oil at historical highs, who really thinks new borderline transatlantic services are the way forward? Not any of the majors that's for sure.

OltonPete

7th Jun 2008, 15:53

Firstly I believe that according to the gospel of "St.anet", 29 CO 757's
cross the pond each day leaving the other 12 on domestic flying or maintenance. In other words plenty for a Leeds service if they wanted to operate it.

It was claimed that the new 739ER's would replace the remaining domestic 757's and new transatlantic routes were to be opened but something called oil changed those plans allegedly ;).

I think this topic has been visited a few times on here and aircraft ownership has always been given as the answer - it is in respect of
the low utilisation of Jet2's aircraft.

I checked acarsd for last Thursday and Leeds had 15 different Jet2
aircraft operating on 32 flights approx. These flights at a squeeze could have operated on 8 or more realistically 9 aircraft (slot permitting), as bmi baby do at BHX with their 8 aircraft (operating 27 flights per day approx).

Obviously the baby aircraft are leased and Jet2 owned and the latter can afford to have their aircraft sitting around for a few hours.

However is there a point when this is not viable? These flights on Thursday would have needed 30 crew and at some point all 15 aircraft would require checks compared to others using half the amount of crew and aircraft.

Does anyone know what crew to aircraft ratio is at Jet2? Will at some point Jet2 go down the route of regular 8 sector days for their aircraft
and 4 sector days every day for crew or is their business model sound enough to withstand this? Jet2 at Leeds seem to have enough short sector flying for 8 sector days on some of their aircraft.

Pete

A320fan

7th Jun 2008, 17:50

I checked acarsd for last Thursday and Leeds had 15 different Jet2 aircraft operating on 32 flights approx.

G-CELG (LBA-VCE-LBA, LBA-GVA-LBA, LBA-LBC-LBA)
G-CELS (LBA-BFS-LBA, LBA-FCO-LBA, LBA-ALC-LBA)
G-CELV (LBA-PMI-LBA, LBA-BCN,LBA)
G-CELC (LBA-AMS-LBA, LBA-PSA-LBA, LBA-CDG-LBA)
G-CELB (LBA-CDG-LBA, LBA-NCE-LBA, LBA-DUS-LBA)
G-CELD (LBA-KRK-LBA, LBA-JER-LBA, LBA-AMS-LBA)
G-CELE (LBA-VLC-LBA, LBA-AGP-LBA)
G-CELU (LBA-IBZ-LBA, LBA-BFS-LBA)

G-CELR operated out ot PRG and G-CELZ came back and then later positioned out to MAN. G-CELR also operated the EDI-LBA-AVN-LBA-EDI. G-CELY is one of the BFS based 737's that does BFS-LBA-BFS at lunchtime.

The 4 757's are:

G-LSAG (LBA-AGP-LBA, LBA-PMI-LBA)
G-LSAH (LBA-FAO-LBA)
G-LSAI (LBA-ALC-LBA, LBA-MJV-LBA)
G-LSAA (LBA-ACE-LBA)

In fairness, Thursday was not a good day to pick as there were several different 737's popping in compared to normal. Also, Jet2 is not at full operational capacity for summer yet, out of the 12 based airframes there are 2 additional weekly ALC's to add, another PMI, which will fill up the 757 schedule, and if like last year the 757's will often do a busy PSA, FCO or KRK, this then frees up a 737 for the weekly Verona Charter.

To me the 737 usage is fairly high, and a lot of routes will be 4 sector days for crew, for example LBA-KRK-LBA, LBA-JER-LBA. Jet2 also often sent a 737 into their part of the multiflight hangar for a spot of maintenance, they often position out say after a BFS to DUB or MAN to operate a charter than it comes back in time for the evening BFS. During summer no 737 will do less than a 6 sector day unless it is in for maintenance. Compare that to TOM 737-300's at DSA for example, they generally only operate a 4 sector day Globesapn at MME, 2 sector and 3 sector days. Also Jet2's 737 are not young! Flexibility is needed in every fleet and pushing those 737's any more will result in more maintenance issues and big delays if one goes tech.

airhumberside

7th Jun 2008, 18:48

Exactly. They are not going to be intrested in the route with their own metal because of the crunch. Why not have a code-share? What is there to lose?
I really cant see CO codesharing with Jet 2. A loyal CO flyer on business travel books a CO codeshare flight operated by Jet 2. The service level will be a lot lower than what they are used too and CO has just p***ed a high yielding traveller. Jet 2 service level are just not what CO's high yielding passengers expect. The two airlines, both good at what they do, just aren't compatiable

OltonPete

7th Jun 2008, 18:49

A320fan

Thank you for your reply and information.

Nothing sinister in choosing Thursday, in fact I checked Friday 6/6/08
and if anything it was worse, 14 aircraft on 28 sectors. However you have to treat acarsd with a bit of caution as not all flights show and at least one was a "W" flight from another base.

Only four 733's are showing six sectors (LB, LD, LG & LV) and one the 757's just two sectors but it seems to work for Jet2 and as long as it works for them there is no problem, I was just curious.

Pete

4567

7th Jun 2008, 19:37

I see Jet2 have launched flights to Sharm el Sheikh from MAN & LBA.

Do Jet2 plan to aquire 767's?
If so what routes would they be used on?
I doubt they would take on GSM with Canada flights though i heard GSM plan when the 787's arrive that they plan to launch SFB from LGW or MAN or Both with LGW via MAN.

Maybe a Jet2/Flyglobespan codeshare agreemnet on some routesfrom MAN anyway!

IB4138

7th Jun 2008, 20:59

Baby's 737s are not a fair comparison, as they are all leased from parent bmi. However they are mostly of less vintage.

Jet2 need to get more realistic with their pricing when they are offering an inferior product. They are just not competing on more than their inferior checked baggage allowance these days.

My wife had to get to BLK from AGP last week, as her mother was unwell. Having checked the Jet2 prices for a AGP-BLK return flight, it was over €200 cheaper to fly to MAN and use the train to Blackpool North, on not just one, but three competing airlines, with better timings, including the trains. Their fares to/from MAN did not stand up either.

14 loop

7th Jun 2008, 21:57

....in the current climate, airlines (Jet2) need to charge the maximum possible without discouraging demand that would otherwise mean leakage to other operators/bases etc....simple. Do that and you'll be fine, however its a big ask!

INKJET

8th Jun 2008, 06:06

They might "start" at around £40.00 each way, but you'll be lucky to get anything to anywhere from anywhere (not just Jet2) for £40.00 these days, by the time you;ve added lugagge fee's, CC fee's checkin fee's and (J2 case) fuel surcharge fee's it wont be £40.00

stocky3

8th Jun 2008, 08:08

Jet2 are expensive on there c/c charges , i just book some flights to tenerife and compard to the likes of monarch they are bl..dy dear. it does brass you off when they add another 6-7 pounds on top of your booking for a charge which may cost them a few pence .i hope they do well, but care not to rip off the passengers with the extra fees

wawkrk

8th Jun 2008, 08:56

I guess they will never go bust then if they are ripping off the passengers so must be making lots money. I think not.

IB4138

8th Jun 2008, 09:31

if you had to pay £200 for a flight to Blackpool

That isn't what I said.

for a AGP-BLK return flight, it was over €200 cheaper to fly to MAN and use the train to Blackpool North,

The actual fare that Jet2 wanted was just short of €400 (£320).

Using different carriers and Trans Pennine Express via MAN, the total fares came to less than €200 (£160).

Jet2 to BLK worked out a whole 100% dearer! :hmm:

A320fan

8th Jun 2008, 10:45

Jet2 do very well on the limited routes they have from BLK. In reality it was highly likely that the flight in question was near full, so Jet2, along with every lo co carrier charge a fortune for the last remaining seats.

Personally i find £36.98 (19th Oct) a bargain for a 2.5-3 hour flight to AGP. That includes the fare, taxes, charges and 1 hold bag.

10 years ago would you have been able to fly from BLK to AGP for example for less than £38 each way? No.

Jet2 need to get more realistic with their pricing when they are offering an inferior product

Leather Seats? 30" Seat Pitch (bmi baby 29", easyJet 29", Monarch 28", XL 29", Thomsonfly 29") A smart cabin crew uniform (not the fleeces that bmi baby wear)

Its not just Jet2 that put a low starting price, look at the caryr on Ryanair has had. It is simple yet clever marketing, say a customer visits the Jet2.com website and sees Manchester to Alicante, all charges £100 all over the home page. They then go on bmi baby website and see Manchester to Alicante from £19.99 all over their home page. Guess who they are most likely to book with based on price. bmi baby. You cant blame airlines for wanting to take money from their customers, after all they are all here to make a profit ...

757 Speedbrakes

8th Jun 2008, 15:21

The two airlines, both good at what they do, just aren't compatiable

Thankyou!! Just seen this thread having been a way a while! The yanks are having a worse ecconomic time than we are. Who in their right mind would want to fly from America to a s**thole like LBA! :rolleyes: (unless they have a fasination for cold crappy weather, whippets and a curry from Bradford!) :ugh:

If you could go on your hols to the US I'm betting that most would choose, Florida, New York, LA etc etc, not some crappy town in Alabama for example!

Maybe a Jet2/Flyglobespan codeshare agreemnet on some routesfrom MAN anyway!

Not sure how relations are between companies now :confused: but lets please not have the Jet2 / Globescam merger debate again! GSM lost £13M and their engineering is even worse than Jet2's!

The last thing Jet2 needs is large expansion. Just carry on ticking over with the profitable routes, watch spending and try and get as many charters as possible to get though the winter.:D

4567

8th Jun 2008, 16:07

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/transport/article4087988.ece

Its all right Rick Green chief executive of Flyglobespan has answered that question. He said "merging with another airline was unlikely although he would like partnerships with other companies in the travel sector". So as i said before codshare on some routes with jet2.

Though acording to him it would be "difficult to believe a relationship with another carrier would do anything other than just absorb our time". The Globespan Group Plc plan to aquire more hotels in europe etc on that side of the business while re-newing Flyglobespans B733's and 736's with B737-700's & 800's. Also plans to aquire another 752 for long-haul.

Flyglobespan is set for profit this year and are "three quarters hedged" on fuel and 1 738 & 3 763's on lease W08. As for maintenance the whole enginering department was moved to MAN not that long ago after a new head came in from TCX and made big changes and should hopefully pick up.

wawkrk

8th Jun 2008, 16:25

Speedbrakes
New York is for sure a one way route.
LBA a S**thole, for sure,weather,worse than you describe.But, come on, Leeds is not so bad now and they are turning it into a mini Manhattan.
Whippets,not so many as Donny. Curry,fantastic.
Out towards Poole and the Dales its very nice and only minutes from the airport.And what about Old York?
There are about 15 flights per week to Malaga,but how many Spaniards come to Leeds?
Err sorry,but I already scrammed away.:\
wawkrk

BYALPHAINDIA

8th Jun 2008, 17:05

Went upto LBIA this morning, No signs of a 'recession' at Jet 2.:D

Watched them land & T/Off one after the other about 12 went out in 3 hours.

They must be flogging them (seats that is):ugh:

A free Jet2 Airshow.:D

daz211

8th Jun 2008, 19:34

Try STN 32 dep in one hour and thats only the Ryanair Dep's :}.

BABDUCK

8th Jun 2008, 20:08

Who in their right mind would want to fly from America to a s**thole like LBA! (unless they have a fasination for cold crappy weather, whippets and a curry from Bradford!)

Exactly - that is why you can only book LBA - EWR - LBA and not vice versa!!

Odd that I am having to post this - you would have thought employees would have known this was the case!!

BD. xxx

robo283

8th Jun 2008, 20:32

"Try STN 32 dep in one hour and thats only the Ryanair Dep's "

Thanks daz211 but as STN is a London airport one would expect it to be somewhat busier than LBA.

What I can tell you is that LBA was verrrrrry busy this afternoon with LS in particular shipping people in and out, left right and centre. Nice and warm in the departure lounge, and stonkingly hot in that greenhouse of an Arrivals corridor.

Not a whippet to be seen though....

BigT2207

10th Jun 2008, 18:14

Results for the 12 months to 31 March 2008. . . . . . . . . . 24 July 2008
Annual General Meeting . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 21 August 2008
Payment of final dividend . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .. . .September 2008
Results for the six months to 30 September 2008 . . . . . . . 20 November 2008
Payment of interim dividend . . . . . . . . .. . . . . . . . . . . . January 2009
Results for the 12 months to 31 March 2009 . . . . . . . . . . June 2009

bruppy

10th Jun 2008, 22:08

Anyone heard anything about possible interest from the TCX group with regards to a takeover/merger?

BigT2207

10th Jun 2008, 22:23

There are people on here going on about the doom & gloom the finace of Jet2 and how they are going bust this year ect. SO I ahve giving them some dayes for there diary so they can check if there right.

Ie see post after yours about Jet2 takeover

AEUENG

11th Jun 2008, 02:05

BigT,

R u p*ssed or simply illiterate??!!

BLKsheriff

11th Jun 2008, 13:13

The 2007 annual report states that both the aviation and haulage fuel requirements are hedged or protected by contracts. A large chunk of the 06/07 profit disappeared into aircraft purchases...(have they bought any more in the last 12 months?) so in theory the turnover should be up in 07/08 and the you might expect the group profit to be about the same as last year following the february announcement about a poor j2 W08.

So why have the group shares dipped again? By my calculation the current value of the company is only £22.5 million on a share price of 16.5 pence, whic seems odd given the assets and new routes coming out (albeit slowly) for W08.

Something doesn't add up - is all of this driven by economic uncertainty etc etc or is there something else going on??? (and I'm not a jet2 doomsayer, I think they are the best thing to happen to BLK for many years).

Facelookbovvered

11th Jun 2008, 16:31

Airlines and builders are out of favor (see Barrats share price today) and energy companies are in. I think since the trading statement issued earlier this year Jet2 have pulled their reins in by culling routes, upping charges adding surcharges, will it be enough to turn a profit on the Jet2 non road freight side, we will know in a couple of weeks.

BigT2207

11th Jun 2008, 21:44

AEUENG

BigT,

R u p*ssed or simply illiterate??!!

I find your post childish, Offensive and maybe to go as far as bullying.

How do you know I am not dyslexic. I bet 99.9% of post on here have spelling mistakes or bad grammar. At least I can say I can spell ARE and YOU. As for being p*ssed as you put it I have lost someone close to me due to alcohol. So I hope you are proud of yourself.

Also the others on here getting on your High horses just because I posted something about when Jet2 end of year results are going to be announced In a Jet2 Forum. Which if I am right is about Jet2

I know the results are fro last year but that year ended 31st of March which if memory serves was only a couple of months ago. When just before that People were saying Jet2 are doomed the share price is falling.

Also when the results are announce there is a Chairmen's statement about the year ahead in which we know the plans for Jet2 in the next 12 months.

Thank you for reading

BigT