Manchester Happenings (Merged)

[gayrugbybloke]

Does anyone know anything about a possible new twice weekly Royal Jordanian service from Man to AMM?

Also, anyone know if Virgin and US Airways are to move terminals next year from T2 to T1?

[sisyphus1965]

Recap of recent rumours (in no particular order)

Delta or American to Los Angeles

Air China to Beijing

US Airways to Charlotte

Sri Lankan to Colombo

BMI to India

China Airlines to Bangkok and Taipei

Qantas to Sydney

Virgin Express to Brussels

Continental 2x daily to Newark

Cathay to Hong Kong

All Nippon to Tokyo



There are probably more. Which, if any will ever happen, only time will tell.

[HOVIS]

US Airways wil probably be defunct by Feruary so Charlotte is a big if!

All Nippon is a dead duck, the rumour started due to a brief charter op.

[aeulad]

There are so many more long and medium haul markets ex-Manchester, yet to be exploited.

Bangkok, Hong Kong, Sydney, Melbourne, Tokyo, Beijing, Shanghai, Delhi, Mumbai, Male, Colombo, Dhaka, Tehran, Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, Cairo, Nairobi, Mauritius, Johannesburg, Cape Town, Cancun, Los Angeles, San Fransisco, Detroit and Montreal must be at the top of the list!?!

Manchester should have the likes of Thai, Cathay, Qantas, JAL, Air India, Sri Lankan, Biman, Etihad, Gulf Air, Egyptair, Kenya Airways, Air Mauritius, South African and Northwest operating flights. Other airlines have shown that there is much potential in more long haul routes from Manchester. For example, going by CAA fligures for September, one route in particular, San Fransisco, is carrying HALF the monthly equivelent of the US Airways MAN-PHL route, at approx 4000 pax/month. This SURELY shows that there is a market for at leats 3-4 weekly widebody flights, direct from MAN to SFO. What makes matters even stranger is that the MAN-LAX market is larger than the SFO one, and no-one is even flying that one!

Regards

Mike

[Pontious]

Aeulad

Pax travelling to/from the NWUK can access Bangkok, Hong Kong, Sydney, Melbourne, Shanghai, Delhi, Mumbai, Male, Colombo, Dhaka, Tehran, Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, Cairo, Nairobi, Mauritius and Jo'burg via the EK services to Dubai. (Sorry ,Mike! I couldn't resist that!)

Together wth Kuala Lumpu, Manilla, Jakarta, Brisbane, Auckland, Christchurch, Dar-es-Salam, Perth, Hyderabad, Chennai, Cochin and Peshawar...

...and very soon Beijing, Cape Town and a whole host of other destinations targetted by Emirates.( Or that!)

I can remember Qantas serving the airport years ago and as a child remember seeing Northwest(Orient) 747's regularly on Pier B. I'm not too sure if Cathay, Air Mauritius,Air Seychelles, Malaysian, Air India etc operate 'Seasonal services' to MAN but I know they've all 'dabbled' with MAN services at one time or another, as have SAA and Gulf Air but they've never stayed on the route because the PAX figures havent materialised.

As for US East/West Coasts, well that's BA for you, and their attitude of ' If we can't make any money on it then we wont let anyone else have a go.' I remember Laker used to serve LA from MAN and look what BA did to them!

It's ripe for 'Tricky Dickie' to throw a couple of his A343's 'out to pasture'at MAN with a couple of LAX's , SFO's 3 or 4 times per week. Just hope he doesn't give it to Air Atlanta.

:ok

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

Malasian still operate to Manchester 4 times a week passenger plus I think twice a week cargo, Northwest Airlines have only ever operated cargo never passenger

Golf India Bravo

[Pontious]

My apologies G-I.B.

It was probably C.P. Air, TransAmerica and WardAir that I was confusing them with. It was a long time ago (about 25-30 years ago)...aah! Those were the days... Sunday afternoons in summer with my dad... access to the roof of Pier Bravo...the smell of kerosene... getting the two-fingered salute from a pair of Spantax DC-8 pilots!!!

:ok:

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

Ah yes they were good days and I even remember when they parked side on be fore the nose in parking! and flying on an Air Spain DC8-21

Golf India Bravo

[Buster the Bear]

Air Spain, a brilliant blast from the past!

http://whipsnade.co.uk/picturelibrary/jpeg150/br/brown_bear_120_wide.jpg

[Pontious]

G-I.B.

'...Before nose in parking?...Air Spain DC8-21?...'

My god,Man! You should be crown green bowling, fly fishing or enjoying some other equally sedate pursuit at your time of life instead of messing about with computers!!!!

:D ;) :ok:

[Scottie Dog]

The joys of smokey Dan-Air Ambassador starts, Euravia Constellations, KLM 'Flying Dutchman' colourschemes and Mercury Herons etc..........those were THE days!!

Back to my zimmer-frame??

[Tom the Tenor]

You will have us crying into our rosiners even though it is just 9.35 am in the mornin'!

Rosiner: A nice cup of tea with a few generous measures of whiskey added for taste!

There is now even a sentimentality associated with the Palmair/European Boeing 737-200 regularly doing the WW flight to Cork! :{

[gayrugbybloke]

So what's happening with easyJet and Manchester? Is it going to happen this summer?

[dwlpl]

Vuelo is that you...................?

[ManofMan]

Dwlpl,
To quote that meat-loaf bloke, "you took the words right outta my mouth"

:ok:

[chipsbrand]

Scottie Dog, My recollection of the Dan-Air Ambassadors starting was that it was almost impossible to see across the airport while it went on seemingly for ages.

[gayrugbybloke]

Who.what is Vielo? I think you must be confused, dwlpl.

[Manchester Exile]

Vuelo - Give us the heads-up on the new long-haul routes into Ringway that you promised would be announced soon! I need to book a flight back home for next June...I'm holding out in the hope that CX of QF will return to Manchester. I hate transiting through LHR.

[IB4138]

chipsbrand andScotiedog

Yes the Ambassadors were paticularly smokey and their start ups seemed to take longer than the other types you mention. It was great once the new piers were built, as you were above the smoke on the roof!

[gayrugbybloke]

are there to be charter flights to south africa from manchester this winter? also, is the new airline muted on here a few months ago, still going to operate services to pakistan? its all gone very quiet....

[ManofMan]

Not heard anything about new South African service, its a pity that Vuelo dissapeared as looking back through his posts he used to ask about new South African services, he might have been able to answer your questions.

[Curious Pax]

According to the airport timetable for November, Air Scandic are operating to Cape Town and Durban on Tues/Sat and to Islamabad on Weds/Sun with a DC10 from 23rd November. The info includes timings and flight numbers, so presumably slots have been reserved at least. No doubt we'll see the reality come the 23rd....

[gayrugbybloke]

who are the flights to ISB being operated for? A holiday company? PIA?

[rampman]

Air Scandic are not operating to Cape Town Durban and Islamabad they do not have the aircraft the only a/c they will have after the A300 go is one md80 and next year they are lookingat getting a 767 and or 747. they will lease the two finair 757 for the summer

:ok: rampman

[gayrugbybloke]

wonder what will happen to all those poor bugger that booked holidays to South Africa through CT2 travel. They were pushing direct flights from Manchester to Cape Town heavily in the press and on billboards at MAN.

[gayrugbybloke]

I hear that Jet2 are to announce a twice daily MAN - BOH in a few weeks time.

Should be good for bringing the BA and BE fares to SOU down further!

Anyone know anything else planned for MAN next year?

[bagpuss lives]

I think some of you on this thread may have been right.....

Anyway...

MAN - BOH would be very handy indeed, hope it's true :)

[aeulad]

The 1400 Emirates is in as a 772 for next summer, evening stays as the 332.

Regards

Mike

[gayrugbybloke]

Air Berlin to HAM, TXL, PAD and DUS. Maersk to CPH. FlyBe to SOU. American to MIA all start today and tomorrow.

I am not convinced MIA is a good choice for AA. I still say SFO or LAX would have been a better choice.

[ManofMan]

Cathay Pacific to put a second freighter into Manchester on Thursdays only(Starts this Thurs) for the winter schedule, shud be a 747-400F

MoM

[Shed-on-a-Pole]

Ref AA's MAN-MIA ... we are actually approaching the BEST time of the year for visiting Florida. Whilst the British market is geared to a Summer crescendo, Mid-Summer is actually LOW season for North American tourism to Florida (due to hurricane/tropical storm season etc.). Consequently, cheap accommodation deals are offered to the (less well-informed?) UK customers at that time of year. Florida accommodation providers benefit by filling their establishments at a period of low domestic demand; British tourists get to visit the "Magic Kingdom" during the school Summer hols. Good business for mass-market operators.

But the American Airlines MAN-MIA schedule has the opportunity to serve a more discerning market. Affluent Brits on their third or fourth visit to Florida who have learned the best time of year to visit ... and will happily pay the peak accommodation prices to do so. Some of course have bought their own properties. The Winter MAN-MIA flight is ideal for these experienced leisure travellers who actively avoid the Tropical Storm lottery. Plus, MIA can service premium cruise transfer traffic and through-passengers to South American business centres which have been difficult to reach from MAN in the past.

In short, I do not think MIA was a bad choice vis-a-vis LAX or SFO. The latter two offer good potential also (bring them on!), but that does not make MIA a bad call. Admittedly, there is a significant increase in capacity between MAN and Florida this Winter (Virgin MCO, assorted charters SFB etc), but alot of affluent British travellers have learned the advantages of avoiding the Summer months. This Winter we'll see if those travellers can sustain the extra capacity serving Florida's *real* peak period!

Best Regards, SHED.

[Vuelo]

Thats a point well made, but the stats don't lie, and according to the CAA figures, SFO is one of the most popular USA destinations from MAN.

Are AA expected to revert back to the BOS service next summer or carry on with the MIA as an all-yesr round operation?

[bagpuss lives]

Ahhh remembered your old password Vuelo? :)

[Bagso]

Heard the pax figs this morning on the way in....

nearly 200.....

Looks pretty good to me considering its the second day of operation.

Besides I am sure AA would do a range of additional services but they have to use the BA terminal...and their buddies ramp facilities.

Surely BA who would not be too impressed if they creamed off yet more pax from the Shuttle....!

Word on the street is that AA wanted to continue BOSTON as it was so succesful, but with BAs hand on the tiller pressure was apparently applied to stop it.......at least for the winter !

[gayrugbybloke]

Really? I thought it was just a case of there being no demand for a BOS route in the winter, that's certainly what the AA cabin crew told me when I flew to BOS a few weeks ago from MAN.

I don't think BA hold quite as much 'power' at T2 Manchester as people would like to believe.

The real issue at T3 is the lack of avalable stands for widebodied aircraft. Once plans are put forward for the expansion of T3 next year the issue should resolve itself.

[gayrugbybloke]

Are BA Citiexpress to announce some new routes from MAN for summer 2005? Luxembourg, Leipzig, Salzburg and Lisbon would be nice.....

[Shed-on-a-Pole]

Of course Luxembourg and Lisbon would mean going head-to-head with daily services provided by Luxair and PGA Portugalia respectively.

[gayrugbybloke]

It's posted on an air newsgroup that Dragonair are to start weekly MAN - HKG passenger services in spring 2005. Anyone know any more info on this? Wouldnt this be their first European passenger service?

[Vuelo]

The Chief Executive of Manchester Airport will be participating in a phone-in on BB GMR from 11am tomorrow, you can listen live at www.bbc.co.uk/manchester

You might even like to call him and ask him questions!!

[eggc]

Mr Spooner has just said on GMR that MAN is pushing Air China / China Airlines hard.

He expressed his wish to see CPX return to MAN in the next couple of years, saying " They love Manchester"...yeah right..they have proved that havent they !!

In general Mr Spooner was generally being hassled by the public about a load of nonsense, i.e one old lady was complaining that St Mawgan isnt close enough to Newquay !! Enough said.

Rgds

SC

[Scottie Dog]

Hopefully the response to the caller from Chester will be slightly more helpful with the reference to BA codesharing on AA flights. Just confirmed that he is confident that CX will return after being asked about the switch of CX pax to BA via LHR after the One-World alliance.

Announcement to be made at 1630 this afternoon to encourage Regional Airport passengers........

[eggc]

Big announancement at 1630 today about regional airports....not much more info...watch this space

Re :- BA codeshare someone mention QANTAS aswell....

[Going loco]

An announcement by MAPLC about 'regional airports' - is that what we're saying here?

loco

[eggc]

Not sure, but from what i made of the comments, i think it could be Goverment policy....not 100% tho...anyone else shed any light, as they made it out to be significant.

[Scottie Dog]

Going Loco

Too early to tell.

The cat was let out of the bag by the interviewer who obvously knew about a forthcoming announcement, but John Spooner would not be drawn on the subject.

My recollection of the wording was as per my earlier post that 'An announcement is to be made at 1630 this afternoon to encourage Regional Airport passengers'.

This could be taken anyway. Could it be a reduction in the Passenger Facility Charge levied by goverment on all passengers? Would this stimulate Regional Airport passenger growth?

Or could it be new routes? - bit of an odd time for routes to be announced though, they normally come in the mornings.

Doesn't parliament only debate in the afternoons, so are we back to my first suggestion?

ps - egcc, I see you beat me to it!!

[Vuelo]

EasyJet? Ryanair?

[dwlpl]

Vuelo, your back again!

[Vuelo]

Anyone heard what the news is then?

[Scottie Dog]

It appears an announcement was made at World Travel Market of increased funding for Regional Route Development. Don't ask me what it means, but definately no instant new route announcements (well not this afternoon - yet).

[eggc]

On the broadcast this morning it said more news at 5pm on GMR....just listened and.....NOWT.......MAN website.....NOWT.....

So much for hot news...

Anyone else heard owt'

Rgds

SC

[gayrugbybloke]

I was laughing when I heard that chap say that Cathay 'just love Manchester'! What a load of bollocks! They couldn't give a toss about passengers in the North otherwise they would still be here...dream on Spooner!

And as for this so-called news, well Christ knows why an 'embargo' was put on it! It's hardly exciting stuff.

[dwlpl]

Maybe its the Government bin bagging English regional government.

[Bagso]

I think Mr Spooner was snared on that debate.....and nearly choked at one point !

After a string of pathetic questioniong from the blue rinse brigade at last somebody said something sensible......

After the caller initially and quite rightlly praised Manchester for the strides made in short haul and locost over the last 12 months......came the following exocet ...!

"Does Manchester suffer by not having a viable long haul BA network ...?

The reply was ultra defensive as ever suggesting that BA operate many long haul services via the numerous succesful codeshare agreements that are in place, it was further suggested that these were the way forward...

Quote ...

" these were very much to the benefit of the travelling public in the NWest"


..... but I think Mr Spooner was taken a back somewhat when it was suggested that these agreements could be doubled edged with the caller then referring to the loss of a very succesful Cathay service to HK only 6 months after one of these agreements was introduced... !

ouch ...!

The caller did not want to embarrass him further by mentioning QANTAS, IBERIA....... etc etc

Quite why MAN still has to suck up to BA is beyond me but I am sure there is some rationale to it somewhere.......

Incidentally can anybody explain what happened to Wideroe ?

..started at 5 a week, went daily, then increased in aircraft size and was then withdrawn...with loads then running at 85%

....any takers ?

[This Charming Man]

Bagso , your correct ,average loads were 85% , however it was SAS who ,looking at the overall picture decided that their partner should use the aircraft on domestic routes and Wideroe now feed the Bergen pax via OSL for SAS to fly them to MAN.

brgds
TCM

[Ringwayman]

I really doubt Wideroe ever approached anywhere near 85% loads! If they did, they would have carried just under 4,000 passengers per month whereas all the CAA data I've seen has shown no month exceeding 2,500 passengers which by reckoning equates to slightly over 50% loads.

[gayrugbybloke]

Are we likely to see WW cut back even firther at MAN this coming summer? I can;t see the BCN, BOD and CDG coming back, and the IBZ, MJV and JER routes were not setting any records were they?

[evansthetimp]

Gayrugbybloke, which air newsgroup site were you refering to in the post about Dragonair starting pax services to MAN?

[gayrugbybloke]

alt.travel.uk.air

But don't forget....'Cathay Pacific just love Manchester!' - John Spooner, speaking on the BBC on 8/11/2004.

[bmiboyz]

Our staff in DUB are still talking about the launch of MAN-DUB service to feed the long haul ops at man? Anybody know whats going on?

[gayrugbybloke]

Would the presence of EI, FR and BD on the MAN DUB route not be a bit of overkill? I can't see BD doing that well on this route, especially since there are going to be services from BFS to both the SUA and the Caribbean next year.

Wasn't BD rumoured to be taking on the MAN-BCN/CDG routes from WW?

[bmiboyz]

I was under the impression that the reason the MAN-DUB service was to be started was to be full-service competition against FR who is low cost and EI who are turning lowcost and also to feed the long haul ops at man.

[gayrugbybloke]

i reckon theres more chance of BMI starting services to India from MAN than a DUB.

[loveJet]

er...excuse me? what about the Bournemouth rumour?

TOKYO is a matter of time SURELY!!! Daily B777 would cater for the demand. Its Irrelevant who is rumoured to be doing it though, as long as it gets done.

Jet

[GrahamK]

Daily to NRT? Maybe 3/4 x weekly to start with?

[loveJet]

well to start with yeah I guess so, but I could see twco airlines offering two daily routes eventually.

There is huge demand to Northern UK from Japan both business and leisure. Although obviously not matched by London.

Jet

[gayrugbybloke]

LoveJet......something tells me you klnow something but can;t say.....would I be right?!

[loveJet]

you'd be wrong.

Tokyo from Manchester..with LoveJetairlines.com

fares from £29 one way

Ha!

Jet

[jmc757]

Anyone know whats going on with the Air Scandic South Africa flights? Firstly Air Scandic don't have an aircraft... now when I type howaboutsouthafrica.com (the tour operator these flights were for) it leads me back to CT2 Holidays (the parent company). Have they abandoned alltogether? What about the people that booked with them? Spooky?

[Bagso]

Good news....

Air India rumoured to be coming back to MAN, apparently it's been quoted in the Indian press w.e 17th Nov.

Bad news BWIA now twice a week but via Belfast and PWK
so a 50% reduction in capacity !

PIA rumoured to be moving back to Shannon because of the US immigration laws..... they can use SNN as the US still have an immigration post there, god knows why as nobody uses the place.

Can we not move this to MAN ?

Air Jamaica now down to one a week..... !

As usual with Manchester one step fwd and two steps back.

They do the difficult bit by getting the airlines in, then seem to totally abandon them with no joined up thinking on strategy to support them.......and make sure they stay !!!

i

[PRobe]

JMC757, Word is South Africa has gone amidst much shenanigans at CT2 following its takeover earlier in the year by people who whilst having deep pockets came from outside travel. 'Money' and 'plugholes' spring to mind, not least because they only just rebranded the South Africa stuff as howabout. Former CEO is apparently tending his garden.

[chiglet]

Bagso,
Given the pax numbers of the PIA transits, would it not be better to free up 4 T2 stands for "in and out" airlines? [If this comes to pass]
watp.iktch

[MAN777]

Pasted from UK immigration site.

Any thoughts ?




You asked if a national of Pakistan needs a visa to pass through the UK in transit.

Yes, you need a Direct Airside Transit (DAT) visa, unless you qualify for exemption because you hold one of the following:

* a valid visa for entry to Canada or the USA and, regardless of the routing you choose, your ticketing includes a visit to Canada or the USA;
* a valid airline ticket for travel via the United Kingdom as part of a journey from Canada or the United States of America to another country or territory, providing that you do not seek to transit the United Kingdom on a date more than six months from the date on which you last entered Canada or the USA with a valid visa;
* a US I - 551 Permanent Residence Card (Green Card) issued on or after 21 April 1998;
* a US Immigrant Visa and Alien Registration - Form 155
* an expired I - 551 Permanent Residence Card and a valid letter authorising its extension from a US Embassy/Consulate;
* a Canadian Permanent Residence Card issued on or after 28 June 2002;
* a valid Category D visa issued by EU/EEA member states;
* a common format EU residence permit issued under Council Regulation (EC) No 1030/2002.


Nationals of certain countries, which includes Pakistan - unless exempt as detailed above - must have a DAT visa to transit through the United Kingdom. The visa does not allow entry to the UK: other than to catch a connecting flight, leaving from the same airport on the same day, where you do not need to pass through immigration control to catch the flight. This is called Direct Airside Transit.

Please read Guidance - Visitors for more information.

To apply for a visa you will need to fill in form VAF3 - DATV.

Any dependants under 16 years old, included on your passport, can be included on the same form, but those older will need to fill in separate forms.

Please make your application to Islamabad.

[gayrugbybloke]

Air Jamaica have reduced services to MAN as the traffic is predominantly holidaymakers, and that side of things has been badly affected by the hurricanes of the summer.

Can;t see Air India ever coming back to MAN - not when there is mega bucks to be made at LHR.

BWIA - well who cares quite frankly?! The pax nos. are so small that it hardly has an effect and is somewhat of a whote elephan - I am told it survives purely because of the freight carried/

AND - apparently it is reported in another forum on here that easyJet are expected to start Manchester services - so that;s great news!!! More loco please and sod the PIA!!

[Bagso]

Re Confirmation Air India
----------------------------------------

http://www.deepikaglobal.com/ENG3_sub.asp?ccode=ENG3&newscode=80947

"Mr Thulasidas, who was also the Chief Secretary of Tripura for the past many years and recently joined the Air India as its Chief, said medium capacity long range and medium capacity ultra-long range sectors would be opened soon and the Corporation had already floated tenders to purchase a large number of aircraft.

Air India had already decided to open new destinations in South Africa, Maurititus, Australia, Beijing, San Francisco, Washington, Houston, Toronto, Manchester, Lagos and Seol by next financial year"

The reason they pulled out originally as I am sure we are all aware is that they wanted Bombay rights, rather Dehli which is what they were given, I assume that they now have Bombay the main commercial centre !

As for the line of thinking on PIA V LoCost that is personal opinion, my view is let have em all !

I concede that they do not bring in much revenue (good point) but with no other long hauls on the horizon it does at least bring in some revenue from parking etc, and most of the time they do actually operate outside the peak hours.

That said I thought they had traffic rights through MAN to carry pax to JFK and Toronto which along with better runway perfomance re 747/777 was a part of the rationale for using MAN.

I know that the marketing dept' also/did use PIA as an example for fuel stop traffic for airlines that could (But do not presently)
have traffic rights through Manchester for onward destinations...

Is that by any cahnce what Air India have proposed here ?

...although I guess that is All now in the melting pot re VISAs etc !

With Toronto, Washington ( and Houston) being mentioned one might suggest that these "could" have been 3/4 a week via Manchester and have come about as a direct result of the succesful PIA example !

There again another poss' might be to connect pax with the BMI services and codeshare.

Time will tell..... lets just hope that this isnt a false dawn and the recent review/ increase of traffic rights between the UK and India did include Manchester and not just London !

[gayrugbybloke]

Once EZY have tasted MAN, they'll probably want to ditch LPL in any case!

Air India sounds more plausible now, and I subscribe to the idea of transits as highly possible.

BD have also announced year round LAs Vegas flights instead iof just a winter service. Though only twice a week between May and October....where else will the A330 fly on the other days I wonder..?

[Curious Pax]

Based on the info MAN777 has posted it looks like the PIA thing is a fuss about nothing - all transit flights go to/from the US/Canada, and so assuming that Pakistan nationals require a visa to enter those countries then they will satisfy the conditions mentioned to transit the UK without additional paperwork. I assume in this that Pakistan, UK, US and Canadian nationals are going to make up the vast majority of pax.

[Vuelo]

Have heard a rumour that AB are so impressed with the success of their MAN services that they are to increase frequencies to Paderborn and introduce new services to Hannover and Munster.

[BombardierCR7]

I understand Jet2 will also add Alicante to their list of destinations from MAN.

[gayrugbybloke]

No! Make it Barcelona!! We only have one airline on this route now and competition and low fares have virtually disappeared! Let's hope EZY choose this as one of their route from MAN.

[GrahamK]

Have easyJet even announced they will start flying from MAN?
Remember, not all rumours come true ;)

[gayrugbybloke]

Of course most rumours are a load of tosh, but let's erally hope this one comes true!!

[Going loco]

Why do you *really* want this one to come true?

EZY already serve the North West perfectly well from LPL and have done for some considerable years. Their arrival there has demonstrated the viability of another airport in the NW other than MAN, and this can only be a good thing for the consumer and the local economy in Merseyside. It's a recipe for success that is being repeated in Leeds and, we hope, in Doncaster / Sheffield.

As I recall it, acres of Chesire countryside weren't dug up just to increase the number of cheap 'n' cheerful flights to Spain, but rather to facilitate the development of inter-contintental business services that would benefit the North as a whole. Is it really in the public interest for MAPLC to be using the increased runway capacity they now have to be overtly targeting the successful operators at LPL and LBA?

Discuss.

If for one, hope for the benefit of a the development of successful regional airports across the North that EZY have no intention whatsoever of moving into MAN.

loco

PS - Bomardier is right. MAN-ALC goes on sale with Jet2 from next Tuesday; a daily service.

[This Charming Man]

GayRugbyBloke

Don't get too giddy , from what i'm told there are no plans to move from EZY from LPL . The flights (IF they do come off) will be 'W' patterns , probably arriving/departing between 1000 - 1400. No bases mentioned .

brgds
TCM

[gayrugbybloke]

i dont care about a base or anything like that - just want cheap flights to spain!!

[GrahamK]

MAN already has that - check flymonarch.com, and soon jet2.com as well as excelairways.com.
Allegedly bmi baby also, but they seem to have very high prices :ugh:

[gayrugbybloke]

I have my eyes on a gorgeous house in Sitges, so I want BCN rather than AGP and ALC...only ZB now fly there, after a choice of three carriers this last summer.

If EZY ran on the route it would at least give some competition to ZB who have gradually downgraded their so called 'crownn' service to no more than a 'baseball cap' free for all!

[cbt_bear_MAN]

I lived in Wilmslow when runway 2 was being built and I was all in favour of it, and I saw i as an opportunity to have more cheap flights to absolutely anywhere in the world. I don't care, and I don;t think anyone else in the NW does either, what services operate from an expanded MAN.

There is no way MAN will ever attract flag carriers like Air China, SAA, Air Canada, Air India, QANTAS, Cathay or Thai because ina nuthell, noone wants to visit Manchster and its environs in a tourism capacity, eespecially when they can visit London.

Get a grip MAplc and suck up to the likes of EZY, FR, WW, AB, BE and all the rest like you have never sucked before and really give Mancs what they want, fish and chips with lager in the mediterranean sunshine!!

Well I do, anyway!!

[ManofMan]

Quote [There is no way MAN will ever attract flag carriers like Air China, SAA, Air Canada, Air India, QANTAS, Cathay or Thai because ina nuthell, noone wants to visit Manchster and its environs in a tourism capacity, eespecially when they can visit London]

Well lets look at this,

Air China - Rumoured to be starting services next year.
Air Canada - Operated out of Manchester for years
Air India - Back next Year
Qantas - Already flying ex Man with there super long range Bae 146's
Cathay - Flown ex Man, could see them back next year via ZRH.
Thai - Again rumoured.

I am aware that it is all rumour and has-been but you said that Manchester could NEVER attract such airlines!!!!

It aint about Manchester not attracting these airlines its all about B.A. and that bloody shuttle thing, the sooner they pull there twin otters off the Scotland flights and operate them to LHR from MAN the sooner we start seing some direct flights instead of having to transit via LHR.

Rubbish you might say ???, well I have it from the American Airlines rep that they enquired with the airport/B.A. about carrying the Boston on through the winter to be told NO, Miami or Boston, not both and thats just the ones i have heard.

Manchester will see other Long Range direct services, it will just take time.

Someone help me down from this soapbox ???

MoM

[cbt_bear_MAN]

Leave BA alone! I am a gold exec club member and they treat me VERY well at MAN, they should do, I travel to SFO three times a month first class!!

And if they ever put a twin beaver on the LHR route I would be very upset!!

[chiglet]

cht,
Get a grip MAplc and suck up to the likes of EZY, FR, WW, AB, BE and all the rest like you have never sucked before and really give Mancs what they want, fish and chips with lager in the mediterranean sunshine!!

Leave BA alone! I am a gold exec club member and they treat me VERY well at MAN, they should do, I travel to SFO three times a month first class!!

Make your mind up, or go to the "Origin" of the SFO flts :*
A [very] few years ago, a certain "Big Airline" was reputed to say
"Manchester will never support a Daily Trans Atlantic Service"......and then lo and behold, a "shuttle" to Big Airways base started......:{
BTW, cht look at the routes being offered...AB, 3+ WW, 5+ BE, no slots FR not [really] interested. J2, 7+
watp,iktch

[eggc]

...you cannot be happy with stopping off at LHR - direct and a few quid more for me all-day - BAN SHUTTLES !!! (unless they feed our longhaul ;-) )

On the subject of National carriers, Air Canada are to take over from BMI on MAN - YYZ in Spring 2005.

[cbt_bear_MAN]

It;s CBT as in.....(the gay boys will know!) not CHT!!

well i love Ba and i also love to travel to europe for next to nothing - noone quite comes close to BA for service in First and Club World...lets be honest, how would the majoprity of poor northerners afford First and Busiess travel to long haul destinations from MAN? The answer: practically none!

Too busy spending dosh on tickets to see Peter Kay and going to bingo I should iagine!

[gayrugbybloke]

Hay CBT, are you the marketing manager for BA or what??!!

You have come out with some right classics!!

Oh and how can Air Canada be taking over from BMI on the YYZ route in 09/2005 when this route has been axed by BD never to return and AC only ran it as a summer servie in later years??!!

I also rang Air India today in london and the res agent said theyw were hopefully expecting a BOM service fro Manchester 'in late summer 2005' but could not confirm that - so thats good news!

[GrahamK]

AC will be back with the 762 (via Glasgow?) next summer

[gayrugbybloke]

via Glasgow??! So that's BW via PIK/BFS, AC via GLA, TSC via god knows where, RB via LHR, QF via LHR....becoming a bit of a pattern here me thinks.....

[GrahamK]

No wait, my bad. I think it was only in the winter months when it went via GLA. AC842/843 I think (or 840/841)

[eggc]

Gayrugbybloke

ACA ARE returning to MAN next spring / summer.

Maybe more research telephone calls required before damning perfectly good information....DR DOOM !!!

[AUTOGLIDE]

Does anyone else find that when your companies' travel people book you on a flight, you get routed via shuttle to LHR, to get on a flight operated by XXX airline, when XXX operate the flight direct from MAN? Drives me crazy, have to tell them and get it all changed every time. :confused:

[gayrugbybloke]

When are WW to announce their summer programme from MAN? They must be losing business as most of the other loco operators from MAN have already got their summer reservations open.

Is Barcelona coming back next summer with WW??!!

[exrotarybooty]

FIRST LOW COST TO LONDON GATWICK
IS A CAPITAL IDEA
Jet2.com Announces £15 London Route

Manchester’s low cost airline, Jet2.com, which announced nine exciting European destinations in September, has landed another coup – it will launch the city’s first low cost service to London Gatwick, starting on 17th January.

The airline today announced that it will fly to the capital three times a day with fares starting from £15 one way including taxes, cheaper and quicker than a coach or train fare to the capital. Seats go on sale at 2pm today.

Executives at the airline said that the announcement was part of a planned growth strategy aimed at giving the people of the Greater Manchester area access to affordable travel for all. Philip Meeson, boss at Jet2.com, said:

“No airline has yet offered the people of Manchester truly affordable travel to London– we are proud that Jet2.com will be the city’s first.

“We believe that if you add the existing demand for flights to London with the additional passengers our low fares will entice, we will have a very busy service on our hands.

“Gatwick is perfect for London short breaks as it’s just a 30-minute train journey from the airport to London Victoria, and we expect a lot of custom from passengers on shopping and theatre trips.
Our customers can also now fly low cost to Gatwick with Jet2.com and fly on to one of the hundreds of long-haul destinations on offer from there.


“We’re also not underestimating the potential demand for sporting breaks, not least because of the two great football teams in Manchester and those in the surrounding region.

“The first fixtures that will appeal are United’s evening game at Arsenal on February 1st and the City – Chelsea clash four days later. We have evening flights from Gatwick to Manchester meaning fans can make it there and back in a day.

“Outside London, Gatwick is incredibly convenient for the South coast and we’re sure that beautiful Brighton will be hugely popular with Manchester travellers, while Kent and the Garden of England is right on the doorstep, too.

“When we launched, we said our aim was to become the number one airline for leisure travellers in the North – in addition to opening up routes in Europe, today we have announced our first domestic mainland flight and we’re sure London Gatwick will be hugely popular for leisure breaks in the South.”

London Gatwick is Jet2.com’s tenth destination from Manchester. For fares, timetables or bookings on its routes to Budapest, Faro, Geneva, Malaga, Murcia, Nice, Pisa, Valencia and Venice, click on www.jet2.com or call 0871 226 1737.
Timetables

Manchester to London Gatwick
Dep 06.20 – arr 07.25 (Monday to Friday)
Dep 08.10 – arr 09.15 (Saturday & Sunday)
Dep 14.25 – arr 15.35 (Monday to Saturday)
Dep 18.00 – arr 19.00 (Monday to Saturday)
Dep 20.00 – arr 21.00 (Sunday)

London Gatwick to Manchester
Dep 08.20 – arr 09.25 (Monday to Friday)
Dep 09.55 – arr 1100 (Saturday & Sunday)
Dep 16.20 – arr 17.25 (Monday to Saturday)
Dep 20.00 – arr 21.00 ( Monday to Saturday)
Dep 21.30 – arr 22.30 (Sunday)

[FLYboh]

so is this why they secured slots for MAN - BOH? or is this still to be announced?

[ManofMan]

Quote [London Gatwick is Jet2.com’s tenth destination from Manchester. For fares, timetables or bookings on its routes to Budapest, Faro, Geneva, Malaga, Murcia, Nice, Pisa, Valencia and Venice, click on www.jet2.com or call 0871 226 1737.}

Think someone should tell them that this will be there 11th destination, they seem to be missing Alicante from the above press release.

[gayrugbybloke]

It is great news and one in the eye for BA who I bet are fuming as their earlyLGW is quite a money spinner for them!

I am however, rather sceptical about pax using Jet2 to connect on to long hauls from LGW. Locos are notoriously unhelpful if the plane is late, and if you are due to connect on to a long haul or any other flight from LGW, I would give yourself a minimum of 5 hours and just hope that the plane from MAN isnt late!!

Any more routes to be announced do we know?

[Scottie Dog]

Question....

How the heck did Jet2 get peak time slots at both Manchester & Gatwick - both for winter and summer, before the Slot Conference?

Now let's wait until after the Slot Co-ordination meeting this weekend in (I believe Boston) for the rest of next summers news!

[gayrugbybloke]

No!! Let's speculate like mad!!!

[eggc]

lol gaybloke...it's part of the fun

[gayrugbybloke]

I want to throw a new name in to the hat that I am told is one to watch.....Bangladesh Biman.

[Scottie Dog]

Oh No...not Bangladesh again!!!!

Have they not been rumoured for almost more years than I can remember? Well, maybe it will come true?

[loveJet]

Does this mean BOH is still on the cards or not?

Didnt they apply for 3 man-boh slots, and 3 lba-lgw slots with the full intention of only operating MAN-LGW!?

I'm mad!

Jet:*

[eurostar builder]

Isnt there going to be a Manchester - Bournemouth Mail flight in the new year with a jet2 737

[eggc]

Personally - i think the MAN-BOH & LBA - LGW applications were back door into MAN - LGW slots and neither of the original two
applications will materialise or were ever going too !!!

Could be wrong but it smells like it to me....

SC

[GrahamK]

Shockingly a Jet2 a/c was seen at NCL recently

Details at Here (http://ww.airnorth.demon.co.uk)
:E

[gayrugbybloke]

BMI Baby will announce their summer 2005 operations from MAN on 02/12/2004.

Anyone know what we can expect? Return of CDG, BOD or BCN?

[Bagso]

Re Biman !!!!


Olympic finally made it after about 20 years so why not Biman !

keep em coming !

FlyBE

Full both ways on one of two flights today ........Wed 17th NOV

Not bad for a new service and quite encouraging !

Anyone know any other loads Air Baltic, Mearsk ?

[master slug]

Dont forget the Cambrian Viscount's or 1-11's ,Invicta Vanguards.
or the Wardair b727's or what about the RAF Britannia's every wed,thurs fri ,

Those were the days. Proper planes.



So says the slug.........

[GrahamK]

How well are the QR flights doing now?

[Speedbird777heavy]

Or howabout the loads on RB......

[gayrugbybloke]

RB seem to be doing pretty well, with a large amount of transit traffic using the service.

What announcement is due tomorrow?

[gayrugbybloke]

are we sure it isn't Ryanair who are to announce expansion from Manchester, rather than EZY today?

[ManofMan]

Gaybloke,
Thats a strange statement to make !!!!, care to tell us what you have heard, or are we on the old red herring trail again here.

MoM

[dwlpl]

Its Ryanair announcing an increase in frequencies and four new routes



















from Stansted and Gatwick.

[gayrugbybloke]

the wait for easy goes on then....wonder if it will ever happen......................

[JIMMY-O'B]

the wait for easy goes on then....wonder if it will ever happen......................ANSWER no ;)

[lagerlout]

mr gayrugbybloke why so interested in EZY? MAN has a fine network of low cost options through a variety of operators. Why the need for EZY

[eggc]

DWLPL,

You seem to take geat delight in ridiculing speculation on a regular basis if it has got anything to do with MAN.

I cant wait to see you disappear if any of these romours actually do come off...(with a big IF)

[ManofMan]

eggc,
The reason that DWLPL has a swipe at Manchester so often is plain to see. His local airport is obviously Liverpool who apart from freight and the odd charter survives and has expanded virtually solely as a result of Lo-Cost cariers.

So imagine how annoyed dwlpl and other Liverpool based people must be when in the last 2 years Manchester some 30 miles away from this Lo-Cost hub has seen some 30+ daily Lo-Cost flights announced.

I just wonder if things were the other way round would I be full of so much self pity and try to ridicule anything to do with LPL ????.

I Think not.

[Speedbird777heavy]

Here we go again...................

another `my airports better than your airport!` spat.......

Boring.........

We should all be grateful for a wide choice of airlines and routes from BOTH airports. LPL and MAN operations should complement each other, and so far I think they are both doing a pretty good job. Here`s to the future and expansion at both airports.

[dwlpl]

Where do I ridicule MAN?

[Flying Fokker]

ManofMan
You make it sound like LPL has had no new routes in the last couple of years can i just remind you that Wizzair are due to start in December Aer fungus have already started Air Wales are giving it another go and Flybe with there numerous routes with more in the pipeline and not forgetting Emerald with there IOM route. And many more

[Flightrider]

easyJet have indeed applied for slots at Manchester for Summer 2005:

Amsterdam 3 x daily
Basle 1 x daily
Dortmund 1 x daily
Rimini 1 x daily
Palma 1 x daily
Malaga 1 x daily
Alicante 1 x daily
Newcastle 2 x daily
Belfast Inter 3 x daily
Nice 1 x daily
Bilbao 1 x daily
Madrid 1 x daily

plus easySwiss on 2 x daily Geneva-Manchester.

Looks like quite an invasion.

[eggc]

DWLPL....


WHERE ARE YOU NOW

:-)

[aeulad]

MAN-NCL???? whaaaat??

[cbt_bear_MAN]

Manchester to Newcastle is a pain in the bum by train and can take as long as three hours, so an air service would be a great idea - though lets face it, they'll probably get them and then turn them in to Man - ALC or PMI instead!!

Is this EZY stuff at MAN just a wind up though? Where has news of these slots come from?

[Flying Fokker]

Didnt EZE or AKL try NCL and lasted all of a couple of weeks

[ManofMan]

Its all Hot - Air until EZY says otherwise.

Mom

[cbt_bear_MAN]

well said MOM...lets not forget that plenty of airlines have applied for slots in the past at ringway and not gone ahead with services.....

it might spur my fave airline, BA in to starting a few new routes though!! Get in there early before another Lo Co arrives!

[pwalhx]

Interersting list, still some of the old favourites though. I would like to have seen some more variety like Riga, Tallinn, Warsaw, Bratislava or Ljubljana.

(I know Air Baltic do Riga and LOT Warsaw)

Maybe if this comes off then in the future they may appear.

[ALLMCC]

The BFS is interesting - bye bye baby!!

[cbt_bear_MAN]

would be interested to hear from dwlpl and the other ezy staff at LPL - did they know about this pretty big news?!

[gayrugbybloke]

this anouncement may not mean basing any aircraft at MAN - it could all be done by utilising the aircraft based at EZY's other bases e.g. Dortmund, Amsterdam, Nice etc......

I bet they'll only base about 2 at MAn to begin with....

[MichaelDoyle]

Hi
Im from Liverpool.Love LPL & MAN just as much as eachother.I wont be dissapointed as I know that other airlines in europe will fill in the EZY LPL routes.Possibly a baby switch from MAN?
Thanks
Michael

[willywick]

<b> this anouncement may not mean basing any aircraft at MAN - it could all be done by utilising the aircraft based at EZY's other bases e.g. Dortmund, Amsterdam, Nice etc...... </b>

Easyjet don't have any aircraft based in Amsterdam or Nice...

Continental bases are Dortmund, Paris, Berlin, Geneva. All other bases are in the UK.

Looks as though EZ will have to base a few aircraft and on the base of what we have seen 3-4 aircraft based there looks likely.

[dwlpl]

If it does not happen on Monday, what then?

[eggc]

Six based Jet2

Four based BMIbaby

??? based easy (3 or 4 ??)

Air Berlin about to double their operations at MAN

plus Hapag etc

Surely a dedicated lo-co terminal is on the cards for the cargo area...

otherwise where on earth will all these park ???

[Speedbird777heavy]

So, let battle commence....

Not so much between EZY LPL and EZY MAN, but by all the loco presently at/soon to be based at MAN. How much is there now in the duplication of routes to the likes of AGP, ALC, NCE etc. Surely something will give - can the market really sustain all these flights plus the charters?

[dwlpl]

I doubt very much the 'charter airline' has much of a future anyway.

[PPRuNe Pop]

Please stop the sniping and stay on topic. Information is not always as it seems and can lead to a backlash.

Try being sensible and make proper comments.

We don't want to get heavy and ban the thread. So..................

PPP

[Cyrano]

So EZY has applied for a load of slots at MAN?Doesn't mean much unless they keep them past the slot handback deadline (can someone remind me of the date - end of Jan?). They could be serious, they could just be playing a what-if game, they could be seeing what slots are free to build a smaller network out of MAN, they could be planning to fill a gap if one opens up, they could be psyching out the competition ;) ...

[Flightrider]

There is indeed no proof that these applications are serious until such time as easyJet puts the routes on sale. Remember that they can hold slots up to 31 January without then using them for the summer season if they really felt like it.

According to the schedules filed, the only non-based aircraft operations were the easy swiss Geneva flights. All of the rest were nightstoppers at MAN - looks like four or five aircraft.

Some other applications in case of interest:

Air Polonia 4 x weekly Warsaw 737-400

No sign of any increase by Air Berlin versus the winter schedule

Air India 3 x weekly 777 Delhi-MAN-Toronto

Alitalia MD80s onto MAN-MXP and a new daily MAN-Rome MD80

Bmi applied for Toronto again, which would imply a fourth A330 if
the other Caribbean/Las Vegas services are to continue

FlyBe for MAN-BHD 4 x daily; MAN-SOU up to a 146

2nd daily Continental EWR with a 757

GB Airways routes as already announced

Jet2 routes as already announced

Malev 3 x daily BUD with 737-600

Sky Europe for Warsaw, Krakow 3 x weekly each

estonian 3 x weekly Tallinn 737-500

Lithuanian 3 x weekly Vilnius (very) late night 737 operation

Virgin Express Brussels (again)

No obvious signs of growth from bmibaby

Monarch applied for daily Murcia & Madrid A321 services


Will that do to keep the thread stoked up for a bit?

[willywick]

Flightrider,

Any way you or anybody else in the know could publish the schedule which EZ supposedly wants to fly should they come to Manchester`?

[dwlpl]

What the significance of January 31st?

[eggc]

Flightrider,

Interesting list of applications, disappointing on the long haul front tho' considering the recent rumours.

[Scottie Dog]

dwlpl

You obviously have not ready Flightriders posting properly.

Airlines can apply for and hold slots for the summer schedule as 'provisional' until 31st January. At that time all unwanted slots should be returned to Airport Co-ordination Ltd - the UK co-ordinator for Manchester Airport - for use by other airlines.

You might find the information on the ACL website of interest re the airports that are slot restrained in the UK.

http://www.acl-uk.org/

Cheers

Scottie Dog

Hope this helps to clear up the situation.

[dwlpl]

What happens if they did not 'return' the unwanted ones and then did not use them?

[ManofMan]

They wont be doing, take it from me.

[Scottie Dog]

dwlpl

I think the answer to that is - prove that you intend you use them, or you will forfeit them?

If the slots are held for off peak times when there is no 'waiting-list' then possibly they may be allowed some leeway in the handback date.

Just my understand, not an official response.

[Flightrider]

Plan looks to be five aircraft. Not all slot requests were given the slot times that they actually required, so this list is their requests rather than what they've been given:

A/C 1
ORY 07:45 11:20
RMI 11:55 17:00
ORY 17:25 21:00
PMI 21:35 03:25

A/C 2
NCL 07:00 09:00
MAD 09:25 15:05
NCL 16:00 18:05
ALC 18:30 00:35

A/C 3
BFS 06:25 08:30
BFS 08:55 11:00
BIO 11:45 16:50
AMS 17:30 20:40
BFS 21:05 23:05

A/C 4
AGP 06:00 12:30
ORY 13:15 16:40
NCE 17:10 22:25

A/C 5
AMS 06:35 09:50
BSL 10:20 14:50
DTM 15:20 18:30
BFS 18:55 21:00

Cheers

[dwlpl]

The Monday announcement that was mentioned earlier in this thread may be related to the following thread that I have just created.

Liverpool to be Ryanair New Base : http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=152815

[gayrugbybloke]

In the interests of northwest unity, I think we should all take a step back and have a big group hug.....ahhhhhhhhh that's better! Dwlpl. where is your hand going....??!!

[dwlpl]

.... and still not a good word said in LPL's direction, eh Vuelo;)

[Scottie Dog]

Sounds more like a good idea for a pint at the Tatton Arms to figure this out between ourselves??

[dwlpl]

OK in order, the most profitable first (I do not know if it can be done but profit per passenger) which is the biggest?

[Scottie Dog]

Ouch!!

If I have done my maths correctly, and assuming that current new winter operaties will continue next summer then we have 78 new daily flights. This is based on flights operating at least Monday-Friday. I have taken the afternoon GT flight as departing at the same time (as it seems to vary by only a few minutes, depending on the destination).

That is taking the following airlines as the subjects:

Air Berlin
easyJet
Flybe
GB Airways
Jet2.com
EU Jet

Now 78 movements is a lot of extras for ATC and terminal capacity.

[willywick]

Thanks for the schedules!

What are the easy Swiss schedules btw?

I really hope this expansion does become reality would be great for MAN.

[eggc]

WOW scottydog...very impressive....

but this does raise the question how will this be handled....and i have a feeling more (long haul) new routes to follow very soon...

T4 required

[Scottie Dog]

Yes, and I have only based it on known (leaked) timings. So, BE to BHD and AZ to FCO etc etc not included.

Must have a coffee break for a few minutes.... :cool:

EGCC - ps It's Scottie Dog (not Scotty) - sorry couldn't resist it.:p

[Flying Fokker]

MAN apron have been struggling of late when it comes to parking based aircraft and night stoppers if all goes as rumoured they will really struggle for vacant stands even during the winter as most of the charter airlines are back by about 2000. Summer wont be as bad as Charters will operate round the clock

[gayrugbybloke]

Does BA have the say on which airlines operate from Terminal 3? If not, why couldn;t EZY use it as well as BA?

Also, why do MAplc insist on calling it 'Terminal 3 Biritsh Airways and Domestic' when Terminal 1 is used for Manston, Belfast and Derry and Dublin (and no dount Gatwick with Jet 2 in January)? Surely all these should use T3 and not have this ridiculous situation of departing T1 and arriving T3....very confusing for pasengers and those coming to meet them!

[evansthetimp]

Flightrider,
Your proposed a/c usage by EZY shows a few MAN - ORY rotations, But Paris Orly was not in the list of slots applied for. Is this another route to be added?
Great news for MAN if these all materialise, though I would have thought that a few STN flights would be a money spinner.

[bagpuss lives]

BA has the sole "say" in who uses T3 and who doesn't.

Very good news for Manch today but I can't help but be a little concerned for Liverpool's long term future - RYR or no RYR.

[Rockwell]

Undoubtedly good news for MAN - if the EZY move happens. After all MAN was their original choice, but MAplc would not drop their charges, so EZY set up base at LPL. Now that MAplc has finally logged into the new order of the lo-cos, MAN is witnessing the flood gates opening.

I do wonder, in the EZY case, if there is a bit of footsie with the airline playing off LPL against MAN, similar to an airline playing off Airbus against Boeing, so as to get the best deal.

The main MAN worry must be where the various airlines are going to be parked for their quick turnarounds. New terminals, be they extensions of T2/T3, or new constructions are 3 to 5 years away and most certainly will not be around for Summer 05: MAplc hasn't even begun negotiations with the freeholders of the land necessary for these terminals, let alone reached any planning application stages.

With airline services at Finningley, aka Doncaster (DSA) Robin Hood coming online March 05 with Thomsonfly basing around 5 aircraft at DSA, plus services by HLX, FCA and others, Finningley will impact on MAN and LPL in varying degrees. Liverpool Airport has noted that 60% of their passengers
originate outside the Merseyside area, a very high proportion travel from Yorkshire, I guess a fair number of those will choose to fly from the much expanded route network available at LBA and their soon to be opened local airport at DSA and perhaps even use MAN if the price is right. Interesting
times lie ahead for all!

[PUNM]

I've relied for many years on getting any news relating to my job, company etc from this website, before I hear it last from the guys at the top.

Naturally, I am concerned that this forum hasn't once given any mention to the low cost MEL-MAN-MEL route. Does this mean that meat pies and scooners of VB are off? Surely this is the best place to ask this question.

:ok:

[gayrugbybloke]

Weren't BackpackerXpress looking at MAN - Sharjah - Phuket - Darwin as an alternative to the original plan that was shelved as Qantas got the slots?

[Bagso]

Re Backpackers Express

"Don't get me going aaaggghh"

Thwarted by Qantas with the hand of BA on the tiller !

Although things are a bit tetchy between them these days so you never know.

They will not however operate MAN - LHR to Oz

They have just got rights via HK so will use that for extra services !

BUT they could extend I presume from another European base assuming they still operate, how about Frankfurt ?

Great list but I think its a bit light re long haul....

AA are a cert for Boston X 7

Zoom of course X 4

and you can book Air Canada x 7 now on the website.

[This Charming Man]

I may be sticking my neck out here but a bit more digging around has revealed the following:-

1. Half the flights on the slot list wont happen.
2. There will be no based aircraft ,they will operate from
existing bases both UK and overseas ,therefore LPL will not
lose any aircraft.
3. The get-out clauses at LPL are too expensive to EZY.
4. Dont expect an announcement until the New Year.

(Now watch it change and i'll look a :mad: :) )

best rgds
TCM

[PUNM]

I've done some investigations through the night and found that Backpackers Xpress are still pushing for the routes Melbourne to Manchester through India/ Thailand. However they originally advertised the 744, but now only mention the 747. Could this be anything to do with the departure of a previously parked 742 (ex-BA & poss ex - EAAC) from Kent?

Alot of presumption going on on my part, but I'm sure one of you EAAC chaps out there know where you've sent the 742 from Manston. Come on, spill the beans, where's it gone?

[Vuelo]

You may find that EZY's presence at MAN could seriously affect it's relationship with other carriers such as BA, KLM, Lufthansa, Air France, Aer Lingus, Swiss etc. I bet that when push comes to shove, if there is an overwhelming voice of disatisfaction from the well-established carriers at MAN at the prospect of EZY coming in, MAplc will drop them like a hot brick. It doesn't want to see itself as another STN or LTN.

I think they may realise that Jet2, BMIbaby et al without the presence of EZY is a good balancing act with the other more traditional airlines.

[Foxy2004]

Looked great profit numbers from Man plc this week. How do they do it? Have they got some hot shot consultants in?

[simonwa]

On the list of requested slots, there are 2 x NCL rotations! MAN-NCL with EZY!

[GrahamK]

Where can you see the list of slots applied for?

[gayrugbybloke]

Slots applied for means not that much: eho saw BMI to LAS slots coming or BT to RIX? Or even AA to MIA? This all looks very ambitious by EZY and am not totally convinced it is actually what will happen at MAN!!

[Jet A1]

GB Airways are to start up the MAN base at least a month earlier I am reliably informed ! On the proviso they get hold of an airframe which they expect to arrive in Feb/March !

[gayrugbybloke]

When GB Airways announced new routes to Malaga, Tenerife, Funchal, Paphos and Malta, we were assured they would be increasing their fleet and routes from manchester in due course.

To which destinations are they expected to fly in the future? And how many aircraft are due to be based at MAN?

[Curious Pax]

Happy to be proved wrong, but am I right in thinking that all the LPL EZY seats for next summer went on sale earlier than most - I had the impression that all apart from flights to BFS went on sale straightaway whilst other UK locations came out much more piecemeal?

If that is correct, perhaps EZY have a strategy of getting as many LPL seats sold as early as they can, before announcing MAN flights after Christmas, and getting a rush there too? The predictions of doom for LPL seem premature too, at least for next summer, as I can't imagine EZY would reduce/consolidate flights significantly after having put a full programme on sale.

I think there is room for EZY at both LPL and MAN, and RYR at LPL - seems to work at LTN/STN OK (we can argue catchment areas, but the NW of England as a whole has a huge population). Maybe also economies of scale for EZY if both bases operate the same aircraft - a joint base for crew perhaps? Do they do this for LTN/STN, which are a similar distance apart?

[dwlpl]

The online bookings for Liverpool came out for summer 2005 approx 7 weeks prior to the normal release date. All flights to all destinations were released apart from those flights flown by Belfast based aircraft. They have now been released also.

The number of departures per week is set at 194 with seven based aircraft. This total compares with 202 (at its peak) with eight based aircraft for summer 2004.

I expect the eighth aircraft to come back in summer 2005 with at least one new, to easyJet, destination from Liverpool.

BTW, other routes on the EZY network have also been getting earlier release dates for booking online.

[Barber's Pole Bob]

From what I had heard, early bookings and demand are beyond expectations. They have also announced another aircraft and further expansion at LHR. The MAN aircraft was due in May but I understand they are looking to get hold of it ASAP. MAN still will have AT LEAST 3 airframes but just quicker than origianlly planned. As for future routes, expect the usual - Morocco, Tunisia and Canaries etc !

[gayrugbybloke]

So when can we expect an announcement from EZY on the Manchester routes? And when can bookings be made? Everyone at MAN is talking about it so the cat is well and truly out of the bag!

Also, I can't see Air India really being much of a service to the Asian population of the NW of they are only operating transits.......the majority of pax will be flying Delhi - Toronto so there wont be much room for the Manchester Delhi only pax!

[eggc]

Hi Gayrugbybloke,

With RYR announcment due today re LPL, it makes me wonder if this is all lo-co mind games and little will actually happen as regards to EZY at MAN...

Not convinced (yet !!)

Rgds

Steve

[lagerlout]

bit of competition for JET 2 with ryanairs announcement ex LPL today.

let the bloodbath begin. The consumer is the winner here.

[Vuelo]

Ryanair take the biscuit: how on earth can Reus be described as Barcelona?! Its over50 miles away with no links to Barcelona city centre and would be more orrectly called Tarragona, surely?!

I think this announcement spells the end for EZY at LPL. EZY have alwats prided hemselves on using major airports, and passengers from Manchester dont want to fly to Denmark but land in Sweden or fly to Oslo but be in Torp, 70 miles away etc etc.

We look forward to welcoming EZY shortly at MAN!

[ezy733]

(I think this announcement spells the end for EZY at LPL. EZY have alwats prided hemselves on using major airports, and passengers from Manchester dont want to fly to Denmark but land in Sweden or fly to Oslo but be in Torp, 70 miles away etc etc.)

(We look forward to welcoming EZY shortly at MAN!)
Forgive me for laughing but I am certain Jet2 and Baby are the first targets Ezy will not base just run flight's from Man:E :E :E :E :E :E :E
Don't forget Liverpool have the three main players EZY, RYR, and Flybe.( passengers from Manchester dont want to fly to Denmark but land in Sweden or fly to Oslo but be in Torp, 70 miles away etc etc.)
May be But they will still fill RYR aircraft :} :}
Be ready for more shock news from Liverpool at least two more Large happenings I know about may be more:ok: :ok: :ok:

[sisyphus1965]

Am I missing the point here.
Looking at all the recent Loco route announcements in the NW all the airlines involved seem to be tiptoing around each other - trying to create their own niches.

The only real competition seems to be on the safe bets, major Spanish holiday routes, which the charter carriers still carry a huge chunk of.

eg MAN - Alicante September 2001

Schedule 29656 pax
Charter 46288 pax

So where is the real competition?
If I want a weekend break in Prague or Hamburg or Basle or Amsterdam or London, etc.
Where is my Loco choice?

[eggc]

"They will still fill RYR a/c"

Will they now....

I live in Stockport, directly under 24R at MAN, which is 5 mins from the airport itself, and have used LPL many, many times to fly with EZY....great no probs....would do it again, no probs ( even tho flying from MAN is much preferred on EVERY count & is worth paying more for ), but WILL not use RYR, poor destination locations being my foremost reason....therefore EZY, JET2 etc etc keep my business.

Thing is i dont think i am alone....EZY & gang will not suffer in my eyes as an end user...and it's end users that REALLY matter...not another my airport / your airport thread on PPRUNE.

[Vuelo]

I see Las Vegas and Miami are doing extremely well in their early days....might we see Virgin see the potential of a rival LAS service...? Rumours have been heard along these lines.....

Whispers also suggest another Middle Eastern carrier might be gracing the tarmac at MAN soon......

[Scottie Dog]

Whilst not wanting to raise hopes, it is definately worthwhile listening to the webcast, that has been refered to on another thread, of the easyJet 2003/2004 preliminary accounts. It does go on for a while, but it gives a very good insight into the workings of easyJet and their plans for the future.

NO mention of specific airports for expansion are given, but the following points are raised:

1/ 16 new aircraft to be delivered in 2005.
2/ An increased frequency of flights from existing airports.
3/ Joining the dots - ie adding flight between existing airports.
4/ 1 or 2 new new bases are possible in 2005
5/ By increasing aircraft utilisation easyJet expect to have the equivalent of an extra 2.5 aircraft in their fleet.
6/ Easier to apply leverage to new airports for rate. Still able to get benefits from existing airports but harder than new airports.
7/ Threat to withdraw from airports that they do not find attractive.
8/ Answer to specific question re Liverpool base -
a) No real change
b) Aware of pressure from locos basing at Manchester - and keeping an eye on it.
c) Feel that Ryanair are behind easyJet , but that the 2 airlines are complementary to seat other.


Listen and watch and then reach your own decision.

(edited for grammatical and spelling errors)

[TURIN]

Whispers also suggest another Middle Eastern carrier might be gracing the tarmac at MAN soon......

Etihad finally found a station manager have they?:suspect:

[symphonyangel]

Does anyone still monitor the On-time performance at Manchester? see below...


Manchester Scheduled Airlines Jan-Jun 2004

Figures are: Avg Delay (mins), OTP (%), > 1hr late (%), >3 hrs late (%), Total Flights

1 VLM Airlines 4.66 92.35 1.33 0.09 2,262
2 bmi Regional 5.01 91.52 1.57 0.02 4,009
3 Eastern Airways 5.38 92.76 2.07 0.36 2,223
4 SN Brussels Airlines 5.88 92.14 2.07 0.31 967
5 Ryanair 7.47 87.59 2.22 0.36 1,394
6 Scandinavian 7.90 83.94 1.81 0.00 1,494
7 Luxair 8.00 88.89 3.06 0.56 720
8 Lufthansa 8.27 84.15 2.16 0.17 1,205
9 Aer Lingus 8.85 83.56 2.57 0.18 1,673
10 British Airways 9.31 82.12 2.56 0.20 6,142
11 BA CitiExpress 9.48 83.77 3.90 0.32 24,571
12 Monarch Scheduled 9.50 83.83 2.97 0.47 2,765
13 Air France 10.00 81.87 3.48 0.05 2,129
14 Lufthansa City Line 10.04 80.64 3.40 0.15 2,737
15 Swiss Airlines 10.53 77.09 2.54 0.07 1,340
16 bmi British Midland 13.19 74.33 4.52 0.18 3,319
17 KLM (Mainline, et al.) 13.21 76.26 5.29 0.43 2,325
18 Emirates 17.83 70.56 4.81 1.10 727
19 Aurigny 19.15 70.27 7.41 1.10 999
20 bmi baby 26.26 56.97 11.80 1.62 3,830
21 Pakistan International 40.40 51.48 15.68 4.64 1,014

Looks like only PIA is worse than the baby but why is baby's performance so poor

Source: flightontime.info

[Vuelo]

ScottieDog

I am feeling too full of flu to draw a conclusion today...what are you insinuating in your last post?!

[cbt_bear_MAN]

Last week most of us were practically wetting our collective jockstraps at the prospect of EZY coming to Manchester. It's now gone so quiet in here you can here a pin drop.....whats the core?!

[symphonyangel]

Does anyone have a reason as to why bmibaby's average delay at MAN is nearly 30 mins ? - see table above. Is it technical problems or are they trying to deliver faster turnrounds for low cost of 25 mins and can't achieve them at MAN? It could be relevant to Flightrider's earlier posting when he detailed the schedule of ezy at MAN full of 25 min turnrounds.

[symphonyangel]

Sounds like you have also been brought into the loop by Scottie Dog. Is this an announcement that will make BA, bmibaby, Jet2 and Monarch happy ?

[Scottie Dog]

symphonyangel

I think you've been playing 'chinese whispers' for too long and lost the plot.

My - now deleted - post that Vuelo refered to, and I presume you are also talking about, had absolutley nothing to do with easyJet or any proposed summer schedules. :confused:

It was purely a request, for the people addressed, to check their PM's. Hence the apology for using the thread. As you know, some people very seldom check PMs and the beer was getting warm! :cool: :cool:



Now if there is to be an announcement of some kind today please tell me - I want to know as well, and before lunch please!! (Before anyone misconstrues that comment it is due to lack of internet access today!)

Scottie Dog

[generallee]

What's the craic then - is there to be an announcement today? And when did jet2 announce LGW x5 daily!! MAN website says 16 December..... assume this was 16 November. easyJet website news only says 'tune in tonight for Airline programme.....'

[gayrugbybloke]

Can't see anything on the Manchester Airport website.......

Or, is the big announcement more a case that you have bought a new pair of Calvins, cbt??!!

[eggc]

Reading this thread lately, where did any mention of any announcement appear, or have i missed something???

jet2 to LGW is 3 x daily according to jet2.com

easyjet tv tonight as advertised on ezy web news is nothing to do with new routes or announcements - more like publicity and viewing figures !!!

[symphonyangel]

Thanks Scottie Dog, such are the wonders of a rumours website, you are right, a case of 2 + 2 = 5, my apologies.

However why did cbt_bear_MAN write last night there is to be an announcement then withdraw many hours later the post. Seems like many red herrings swim in the sea.

[EPRman]

From a well known trade weekly today:

EasyJet: no move to Manchester
EasyJet has denied it plans to switch Liverpool services to Manchester as Ryanair unveiled the Merseyside airport as its latest base.
EasyJet had applied to start 13 routes from Manchester next summer, but a spokeswoman said rumours of a move to Manchester were "complete nonsense."
"We were talking to them and did apply for slots, but we have decided not to operate from Manchester," she said.
"We still have 16 years of our Liverpool contract left."

[eggc]

the truth at last !!!

oh well holidays on jet2 next year....the norths low cost airline ;-)

[gayrugbybloke]

You dont apply for 13 slots for fun......

Give it six months is my thinking...!

[Vuelo]

CBT, were you referring to the supposed Delta announcement they are talking about at work?

[Mouser]

gayrugbybloke,

Perhaps not for fun, but it looks like EZY are walking away for whatever reason, could be the back hander wasn't big enough, perhaps the EZY's price was little higher than Jet 2.

[bagpuss lives]

I admire your blind-eyed optimism I really do :)

[pwalhx]

Out of interest what happened to the big announcement today then?

Anyone seen anything.

[This Charming Man]

Did anyone notice the tone of that statement today ? The higher management of EZY did (after somebody had told them they were in the TTG !) I gather the young lady concerned is not fat and she can't sing and tonight she is nursing some very sore knuckles ! Like I said in my previous post , wait till Jan :ok:

brgds
TCM

[gayrugbybloke]

why what happens in January?

[This Charming Man]

GayMan

I am told to expect the EZY announcement in JAN and not anytime before !

brgds
TCM

[Bagso]

Re Easy V Manchester

..bound to say I agree with ThisCharmingMan...

Why did they not issue a simple No Comment....OR a more appropriate form of words ?

Methinks the PR dept did not clear that release with senior managment first.

Why on earth would you draw attention to the fact that you were daft enough to apply for 13 routes Ex Manchester if it wasnt true AND then deny that you have an interest... even if it was posturing !

..and why suggest that you are "locked in to an airport for another 16 +years", who on earth would make that kind of long term f'cast.......

It just doesn't sit right !

[Mouser]

Isn't Jan 05 a bit late for routes to be released for summer 05, bearing in mind EZY/RYR LPL & JET2 MAN have been on sale for yonks.

[This Charming Man]

I believe it's to do with Runway slots. They definatley want to base 5 a/c but the slots dont fit . They are now working on plan B which is 'W' patterns and between now and Jan they will see if there are any handbacks in order to try and revert to plan A.

Does anybody remember the US sitcom Soap ? :p

[ezy733]

Isn't Jan 05 a bit late for routes to be released for summer 05, bearing in mind EZY/RYR LPL & JET2 MAN have been on sale for yonks.

[QUOTE]Yes but all this is putting the wind up Jet2 and Baby which it is supposed to do. Theres method in their apparent madness:ok:

[gayrugbybloke]

I am bored with EasyJet now!!!!

Other news:

First BMI to Antigua yesterday had 200+ load, that's pretty good for the first day, but I wonder how many business class seats were occupied?!


Las Vegas doing really well too! Average load 86pc, not bad either!

Maybe a new aircraft for us on its way...? With a new Asian route for next uear, too?? Hope so!


Who is going to handle Jet2 from this week? Did Globe get it?

[rampman]

gayrugbybloke

i belive menzies has the handling for the jet2 contract but don't quote me on it

even more handling agents for manchester ????? fantastic:bored: :sad: :E

rampman:ok:

[lexxity]

First BMI to Antigua yesterday had 200+ load, that's pretty good for the first day, but I wonder how many business class seats were occupied?!

Business seats selling like hot cakes on all caribbean routes, especially the barbados, :ok: bd have really landed on their feet with these routes!

[gayrugbybloke]

Bet we'll see Barbados continue year round.....aren;t VS codesharing soon on these Carib routes with BD?

If BD did a LAX route it would do very well I think!

[This Charming Man]

Rumour is that there are more JET2 routes to be announced for Summer05 and they'll need more based a/c to cover the programme !:eek:

brgds
TCM

[lexxity]

nah, vs not codesharing, yet:} , maybe we'll see the launch of a LAX route next year, fingers crossed. The caribbean and Vegas are year round already. More advertising and they would be packed to capacity everyday by those not wanting to go to LHR, but, that's another thread!

[cbt_bear_MAN]

What are the additional Jet2 routes planned? Any chance of Dublin or Brussels?

[Anne.Nonymous]

bmi are not codesharing - just carrying a lot of folks for Virgin Holidays!

Anne :O

[gayrugbybloke]

when do the new Jet2 routes that TCM mentions go on sale?

is it true that Cardiff is one of them?

[cbt_bear_MAN]

I hear that Delta are to start a daily MAN - JFK from 27th March 2005.

[eggc]

The first jet2 has just arrived at MAN, looking good, wearing -

jet2 MANCHESTER in huge letters down the a/c (G-CELI)

another is due soon, and both begin services tomorrow...

Did "LI" get the hose treatment...??

Rgds

eggc

[This Charming Man]

The rumour is that EDI and GLA will be announced soon.:ok:

brgds
TCM

[gayrugbybloke]

I heard today thet Aeroflot are to take the slots vacated by Transaero's lack of services....

Three times a week Manchester to Moscow apparently....

[MichaelDoyle]

Hi
I have heard that United are thinking about applying for SFO-MAN slots and Virgin want to start to Hong Kong and Los Angeles.
I think its great news if DL come back to operate to JFK.Anyone know what equipment it might be?
Thanks
Michael

[semisonic]

Umm..Delta would probably serve JFK with a 767. It actually sounds quite plausible.

What are your sources on the United/Virgin rumour? I'd give the United a 15% prob and the Virgin 10%!!!

[MichaelDoyle]

Hi
My uncle who is a pilot for bmi has been talking to pilots of both airlines whilst in LHR.
I dont think they are true myself but we will have to wait and see.
Thanks
Michael

[Johnny F@rt Pants]

eggc

I was the F/O that brought LI into MAN, we didn't get a hose down, but we did have some publicity photo's done in front of T2. LH followed us in a little later, I was told that this one got a free shower but I'd scarpered off home by then.

I don't think any more routes are planned from MAN for 05, the LGW and ALC were the last two that they said they were keeping under wraps, but we're usually the last to know any of the commercial goings on.

[MAN_Dispatcher]

Gayrugbybloke / Rampman,

The front-of-house/dispatch for Jet2 is done by Manchester Handling, and ramp by Menzies.

Manchester Handling will also be handling Air Scandic, with RHSL doing their ramp.

[Vuelo]

Jet2 have announced three tomes a day Amsterdam services from 10th February.

Air Jamaica have sadly announced they are to abandon their Manchester to Montego Bay abd Kingston service from January.

[MAN777]

Re the Air Jamaica, whats up ? has the honeymoon cheap landing fees come to an end ?

So BWIA will be joining them shortly !!

[Vuelo]

The introduction of mandatory visas for Jamaican national travelling to the UK and subsequent hurricanes I should imagie. Besides, BMI seem to have cornered the Caribbean market nicely now!

I hear another major lo-co announcement is due early Jan for Manchester...winder who that could be?

[This Charming Man]

Nice to see the AMS announcement , can't keep up with them.
At this rate they'll be doing MAD next ;) .

[ManofMan]

I had a dream last night that Jet2 announed a Man-CDG......I wonder......:ok:

If Jet 2 ever announced EDI and GLA that would make Manchester there most served airport.

Imagin that......:ok:

[This Charming Man]

It is reported on another thread that MAPlc will announce a series of new routes this coming Monday .... hmm :confused:

[willywick]

TCM,

Do you happen to have a link to that thread or know routes which could be launched?

[Going loco]

On the basis of what's gone on over the last few months in the NW, plenty more to worry about for the incumbent full service carriers and tour operators at MAN. Scotland, Paris and maybe a Ryanair to Hahn should just about twist the knife into BACX!

loco

[Scottie Dog]

Okay, so let’s look at the Jet2 program - as it has announced - and see what may be going on?

On my calculations, assuming peak summer timetable, there are 7 aircraft based at Manchester. Arrivals between 1930-0005 from PSA/AMS/LGW/AGP/FAO/ALC/MJV. In the mornings there presently appear to be 5 departures between 0620-0835, then the first aircraft (the Gatwick) arrives back at 0955.

The question therefore has to be asked as to what happens to the other 2 aircraft? Presumably they are not going to be sat twiddling their little legs all morning. Rumours, rumours - space for more announcements?

Looking at the lo-co market, it is interesting to see that bmibaby and Jet2 only appear to compete head to head on Malaga, Murcia and Alicante - all destinations that can probably cope (at the charter operators expense) with the challenge.

Roll on Monday and any further news.

[Postit]

watched the flybe from SOU arrive at T1 from the dep lounge last night. it taxied onto stand 2 and the pax were then bussed to T3. Couldn't a door be opened to allow the 80 or so into the terminal? If the unecessary delay continues perhaps flybe will decamp completely to lpl?

[Vuelo]

Look out on Monday for the following:

Royal Jordanian to Amman

Jet2 to Madrid/Barcelona/Rome???

Air India services

Virgin Atlantic happenings

Delta expansion

Other lo-co developments

Ryanair more routes....?

All rumoured I believe......................

[cbt_bear_MAN]

I believe they are to announce Edinburgh, Glasgow, Madrid and Exeter sortly.