Manchester Happenings (Merged)

[cbt_bear_MAN]

I see it is reported in nother website that ANZ London Heathrow have said thae Manchester route will be happening but that something has to be signed in Auckland first....? Means very litle to me!

So what start date are we anticipating?

[pwalhx]

As a Cargo agent I have heard nothing and would be very surprised anyway in the current climate if an airline expected to sell space on a flight that doesnt start till next spring, Cargo is an immediate business so few would plan that far in advance.

[This Charming Man]

Sky Europe have announced MAN-SZG 2xweek starting Dec05

brgds
TCM

[initial]

Two other new routes announced today:-

Jet2 to Palma (daily)

Monarch to Menorca (3 times a week)

both start end March 06

[GrahamK]

Bye Bye MAN-IAD...
BMI drop MAN-IAD. Stop St Lucia for 7 weeks (http://www.flybmi.com/trade/en-gb/sectionhome.aspx?p=1904&rid=730)

[semisonic]

ludicrous!!

does anyone know how well man-iad was doing?

bmi deserve to go down. how they can treat customers like this for so long is amazing.

[Caslance]

Now, I wonder which route the B757 will kill off next..... :hmm:

By this time next year at the very latest, all 3 A330s will be based at LHR and it'll be bye-bye long-haul from MAN as far as bmi are concerned.

C'est la vie..... :rolleyes:

[aeulad]

If this DOES happen, I would expect United to pick up the Chicago ORD route, and maybe the Washington IAD also.

Regards

Mike

[Caslance]

Please don't hold your breath waiting, aeulad.

Not while bmi still run the MAN-LHR "shuttle".......now that's an idea of what to do with the B757 once they've killed the MAN long-haul routes with it. ;)

[gayrugbybloke]

Look, let's be pragmatic. BMI have messed us around before, suspending IAD for the winter in 2003/2004, but this time I imagine it has gone for good. We have to accept it and look at other avenues.

The irony is that we have good loyalty at MAN from American caariers, AA, US, DL, CO...so maybe we will see UA join in, too?

[gayrugbybloke]

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/589/Regionalfifths_casestudy4.pdf

Might this happen now???

[bmibaby.com]

:) Keep smiling folks. It only says that the MANIAD route has been "suspended." Whilst in the short-term that does indeed mean there will be no bmi presence on this route, it doesn't mean that bmi will not return to it some time in the future, or that United might not pick it up. It's common knowledge that UA is only really making money on longhaul, and are transferring a lot of their widebody capacity to opening up new longhaul markets. It wouldn't surprise me to see UA managers sniffing around MAN & other UK airports over the next couple of months if rumours are to be believed ...

Not that I believe that bmi's behaviour in MAN is right. They could really do with a fresh sheet & work out what's right & what isn't.

[ManchesterMan]

It was only a matter of time before BMI pulled the plug..
we all saw the writing on the fuselage of the 757.

Lets wait for some American carrier to step in and gain
the benefit or maybe Singapore A/L's from what i'm
reading....

Right......thats over with then....lets all pick ourselves
up and start over....ok!

[gayrugbybloke]

There was good news of course today! ZB to MAH, LS to PMI and NE to SZG! :)

[gayrugbybloke]

Have heard a rumour that Thai may be coming to Manchester soon...anyone heard the same?

[eggc]

Info here...

http://www.flybmi.com/trade/en-gb/sectionhome.aspx?p=1904&rid=730 (http://)

[gayrugbybloke]

Can anyone get that link to work? I can't open it. What does it say?

[ManchesterMan]

Yeah I've heard their in the scrum with
Cathay/AirNewZealand/Qantas/AirChina/Easyjet/
All Nippon(remember that one!)Air India.....

Please forgive me if i've left any out!

I think we should all talk about Mexicana
and Japan airlines cause I saw someone
with a mexican hat on at Manny the other
day and he was talking to a japanese bloke...

blah...blah... blah

[Caslance]

Please forgive me if i've left any out!Northwest...United.....Indian Airlines.....Air Sahara..... :D:D:D

[gayrugbybloke]

Is Belavia carrying on through the winter? ANd what happened to Alitalia's plans for a Rome service?

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

Hi
The Belavia finishes in August after a run of 9 weeks which is all that was planned

G-I-B

[Vuelo]

Does anyone know if Jet2 are going to operate a 757 from MAN this winter? Lso, with no Venice, Amsterdam, Valencia or Pisa, will an aircraft be lost to another location?

[pwalhx]

The only word I have seen on Jet2's 757 is that it is slated to operate the TFS flight which is 3 times a week I believe so highly unlikely to keep 2 aircraft busy.

There have been some rumours one will operate the LBA-AGP flights so guess there is room for more speculation.

On the subject of routes our of Manchester, as I have mentioned before they still mention Manchester - Amsterdam & Edinburgh as still to come for winter. Highly unlikely to do this I would have thought if they were dropping the routes, but still leaving things late too.

Pisa was always planned to end early October so one would guess it was planned as a Summer only route, guess we shall see if thats true if they bring it back next year.

There still seems to be gaps in the schedule will be interesting to see if they do move aircraft or plan more routes.

[Vuelo]

HavrHave unwanted slots for winter 05/06 now been handed back?

Jet2 really risk losing business traffic on EDI and AMS routes this winter if they don;t get the reservations open oon....

[bozzy]

hi everybody,

just wondering were the expansion plans going to be, have they got the room for more gates

[Vuelo]

Expansion plans for who? The airport or the airlines?

[MAN777]

I noticed the other night that one of the new "drive through" stands is now in use, only seems to be Jet 2 on it though, are they dedicated to Jet2 ??

[bozzy]

the airport!!! and were are they going to accomodate the a380 here at man

[juninho12]

Latest I've heard is that Westjet are planning an international expansion to the UK including Manchester. Apparently they are to get 757s for that task. Route would likely be YYZ-MAN.

[Caslance]

Latest I've heard is that Westjet are planning an international expansion to the UK including Manchester. Another one for ManchesterMan's list........ :E

[Goose82]

Can anyone enlighten me into what happened with the Air Atlanta 747 - TF-ABA, this morning.

Was it suppose to take off from runway 24L or did the crew mess up and miss the fact the they had swapped departures onto 06L?

Does this happen often at Manchester?

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

Yes it does happen when there is very little wind and 06L for take off as it is up hill and if the aircraft is very heavy they sometimes opt for a 24L take off or a 06R
as Malasian did the other day

G-I-B

[mikeyuk]

Work has started extending T3 down to the Airport Pub to accomadate the A380 and they are extending T2 down to stand 219.

[cbt_bear_MAN]

So I take it there will have to be some existing buildings demolished at T3 beyond gates 55 and 56? How many extra gates are there to be at Terminal3?

[Scottie Dog]

So does this mean that the airport authority has finally reached an agreement to buy the land occupied by Males Garage - I would be very surprised if that was the case, because they have been trying to do it for years without any success.

Scottie Dog

[bozzy]

i didnt realise they are expanding on terminal 3!! i thought t3 was just for ba,

[mikeyuk]

Scottie dog
The back of Males garage is bieng demolished as we speak.Alpha are moving out of there building and relocating over to West site.The airport own the road from T3 to the airport pub and sometime in the future that road will be no more.
Its quite possibe it will not be an extention of T3 but may become T4.

[bozzy]

how can they build another terminal there? isnt their a big carpark on the other side of the road. cant see them getting rid off that carpark were would they put it?

love to see another terminal go up. that would be cool!

manchester hasnt got alot of land to expand really

[Caslance]

manchester hasnt got alot of land to expand reallyHow do you come to that conclusion? :confused:

[bozzy]

it hasnt really!!! all the space to expand is occupied!

[chiglet]

bozzy et al,
A long time ago before T3 was built, I saw a set of plans fot T3's extension...up to the railway line. MA plc OWN the car parks..surprise,surprise. AFAIK, they also own a lot of land south of the runways. Stand 100 [drive thru] is now in use, and the Staff West [85/86 etc {I think} stands are in use for towed a/c.
watp,iktch

[bozzy]

oh so do you reckon they will start building an extension of t3. but why would they expand t3 when most of the flights out of there are ba short haul. i thought man wants to encourage more long haul routes.

t3 will get alot more busier now that gb are there, and they are expanding alot at manchester. i know they are going to bring a second aircraft in for october, as i am going to cc for them, up here in man

i would love for manchester to have another terminal.

i didnt realise man had that much land

[mikeyuk]

The extension would be to accomadate the A380's at the moment i dont think Manchester has any gate's or stands that will.

[rampman]

manchester has more land than you can shake a stick at they own a lot of land that is leased out to farmers west and south of the airfield.
they will start bulding work on extending T2 around the end of september. and rumorur has it that staff west and the carpark at the end of T2 will be going within 18 months

:ok: rampman

[Caslance]

The extension would be to accomadate the A380's at the moment i dont think Manchester has any gate's or stands that will.Apparently there are two stands - one each on T2 and T3 - that can currently physically accommodate an A380, but passenger access would have to be by the lower deck only. Not ideal, to say the least.

Of course, there's bags of apron space to park an A380 remotely, but the same passenger-loading issues would exist - compounded by the need to bus the passengers out to the aircraft.

[EGCC4284]

Why don't they relocate the cargo centre and put a terminal there. The is already the stands and fuel hydrant line in place. Seems a waste of apron.

[mikeyuk]

Caslance

I didn't think a 380 could fit between C pier and the Apron Safety Unit

[7006 fan]

Three terminals, two runways 15m pax
LGW, Two terminals, one runway, 30m+ pax

Why T4?

:confused:

[eggc]

7006 fan...little out on your numbers...by about 40% !!

MAN has just passed 21M ;-)

Terminals are not all the same size you know, T3 at MAN is a fraction of the size of either of the 2 terminals at LGW - it is really part of T1.

[ManchesterMan]

Sorry - you forgot to add these
factors into your equation:


BAA (with plenty of Humbug!!!)

Bilateral stitch-up

This huge 'chip' on my shoulder!

MM

[Vuelo]

Is there to be a big announcement this week regarding a new long haul service from Manchester..??

[7006 fan]

Oooops,
I stand corrected gentlemen. Please accept my sincerest..
But is does sound flash; three terminals

:O

[ANW]

Mikeyuk you need to get your facts straight, what is being knocked down has nothing whatsoever to do with the Males Garage site.

Scottie, MAplc have not even started talking to Males Garage re. the land, let alone demolishing the back!

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

What are the extension plans for T3
I`ve heard a couple of things but is it just going to be a longer frontage or is it a pier where you can park on either side?

G-I-B

[eggc]

Comon Vuelo spill the beans - your post is designed for someone to ask this question - your dying to tell us !!

ANZ possibly ?

[mikeyuk]

ANW

I was just repeating what one of the Gods that works for MAPLC told me.

[Caslance]

I didn't think a 380 could fit between C pier and the Apron Safety UnitSince C pier was on T1 the last time I checked and in my posting I mentioned stands on T2 and T3, I'm a bit puzzled as to the relevance of this. :confused:

In terms of clearance, the shortest distance between the C pier "satellite" and the Apron Safety Unit on the Western perimeter is roughly 300m - a little more than the full length of C pier itself.

Even with a B777-300 (length 73.9m) parked on stand 31, there would still be ample clearance.

The A380 is big (wingspan 79.6m) but it's not that big....

[Letsparty24/7]

I've heard that the Jet2 check-in area is to move location and that Monarch is to take their place in the Ground Level Departures area. Aparently they are building a new check-in hall above the Ground Level Departures area with work commencing in 29AUG05.

[Vuelo]

Well more check in desks are needed desparately at T1!

I say why don't they move some other airlines lke Monarh or BMI/BMIbaby to T3 and free up some space? It is obvious that T3 is nowhere near operating to capacity. Do BA have some kind of legal claim over T3, in that they will not share it with other operators otside of oneworld?

[Railgun]

T3 in a morning can be heaving, there is no way another carrier that was to want to check in all day could checkin in there. The baggage system in there is not the best either. Also you have the issues of stands as all are occupied in the early morning and the fact that BA helped fund the terminal so why would they want anyone else in there outside of oneworld.

[cbt_bear_MAN]

Is this supposed long haul announcement Thai by any chance?

[eggc]

cbt_bear_MAN...

according to a recent Thai newspaper report, due to sooner than expected long haul fleet growth - the MAN service could operate from 2007 !

so unless fleet is growing quicker than expected it is probably unlikely THAI to announce services this soon.

My money would be on ANZ, who's 777's are due soon...or ( and more likey ! ) the announcement won't happen !!

Call me synical...

[semisonic]

well this thai rumour is certainly true...its just a matter of time..they've been looking at the route for ages.

Anyone know about Air Canada? A route like that to their main hub must be sustainable, and i remember hearing from the station manager a few years back that they were getting amazing loads...just seems to be worthwhile. is it an a/c issue?

[TURIN]

I'm sure I saw an Air Canada 767 on the apron today.:p


Would this new announcement be an extra Emirates by any chance??:rolleyes:

[initial]

Wasnt the 767 their daily Toronto service?

[cbt_bear_MAN]

Do EK have the aircraft available for an early morning MAN arrival from DXB?

Remember when they were planning a DXB - MAN - USA service all those years ago....;)

[Railgun]

BA to LAX daily with a 767. They still hold the slots and will have a surplus of 767'swhen the remaining shorthaul fleet are dusked as they were not still meant to be there.

[cbt_bear_MAN]

Is that a fact or a rumour? Can BA really come back with the LAX sevice?

[gps117]

no chance 767 to lax! all needed for lh expansion at lhr

[Vuelo]

When does GNWH go in for its refit? Want to go to NYC this winter with BA but not on that 76 in its current condition inside!

[ManchesterMan]

RAILMAN

It must have seemed a good idea at the time
But can you stop typing with your a**e.......
cause your coming out with complete bo**ox!!

with thanks

MM

[Railgun]

NWH is not going for its refit till early next year. We will see what happens with LAX.

[pwalhx]

I seem to remember BA fropped the LAX route saying there were too many economy and not enough business passengers, are we to assume they have changed their mind then.

If they are looking at former routes how about HKG then please, and maybe compete with VS on Orlando and the Carribean or am I asking too much of our national carrier here.

Silly me I'd be asking them to take Manchester seriosuly, please forgive me.

[Railgun]

Problems before i am lead to believe were the timings of the flights attracting cheap continental through traffic. Its been mentioned more than once about a possible comeback but we will have to wait and see.

[Vuelo]

Was chatting yesterday to a BA employee at MAN and asked about a possible return of the LAX service, and they just smiled and said, wait and see....! It was a cheeky smile! Wouldn't it be marvellous if MAN LAX were to come back!

Let\'s not forget that times have canged a great deal in the 10 years that BA have not operated MAN LAX.

Passenger numbers from MAN to the USA have dramatically increased, the OeWorld alliance is now a big factor in BA route development and LAX offers great connections with AA and QF. Plus the cargo element....

[ManchesterMan]

Try 'Miracle' instead.

MM

[Vuelo]

Its so much fun hoping though, isnt it!!

Do you think we will see a MAN LAX service in the next 12 months from anyone? UA / BD / N / AA?

[Railgun]

One other thing the Alpha building at the end of T3 shud be been knocked down towards the end of the year. Its lease is up in september and Alpha have been told it will not be been renewed.

[Vuelo]

Obviously in readiness for terminal 3 expansion no doubt. They will need a bigger arrivals hall at T4 to cope! 2 international bag belts won't be anywhere near enough, not the one EU immigration desk!!

[bozzy]

so there is going to be an expansion on t3. they would need one if ba is to introduce more longhaul flights out of man.

also ba did operate a 747 400 out of man, i remember seeing it loads cant remember what year it was, what did ba do with that and were did it fly to?

also is thai going to introduce a new service to man

[Vuelo]

You are thinking of the BA Islamabad service which flew via and was crewed by Gatwick. It finished in 2001. Can;t see that ever coming back, what with PIA and soon to start Global Spirit.

[pwalhx]

Jet2 are offering 5 times a week to Ibiza from Manchester from May 2006.

[cbt_bear_MAN]

A little bird told me today that someone from Manchester Airport plc is to make some kind of announcement on BBC GMR breakfast show today. Is that true?

[Mouser]

I noticed on T3 arrivals today two GB Airways flights, Malaga due 13.20 & Dubrovnik due 14.10, I thought they only had one based A320? the 2nd due in October.

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

You are quite right but the Malaga flight comes in on a W with a LGW aircraft

G-I-B

[cbt_bear_MAN]

It was something of nothing, all to do with a report from Friends of the Earth! Ah wel.... ;(

[Scottie Dog]

There was discussion on a Manchester Airport Development thread in October 2004 with regards to Alpha Catering moving.

At that time it was noted that a new building was under construction over in the World Freight Terminal area, and that this work was for Alpa. It then mean that all catering commissaries were located in the same area and with better access to the 'airside'.

Removal of the current Alpha - and ancillary - building would give space for limited apron expansion around the Terminal 3 area, but really only to the point of increasing aircraft size on stands 57-59, whilst still allowing an A330 onto stand 55.

I am given to understand that further development plans will be made known when a draft development document is released in the autumn for consultation.

In the meantime does anybody know what the work in that is taking place around stand 22/200. Is it part of the expansion of the T1 Arrivals area?

Scottie Dog

[Vuelo]

I understood the work to be an arrivals area and arrivals channel for flights from the Common Travel Area (NI, Eire, CI, IoM, UK) that use T1. This avoids these passengers departing T1/srriving T3, and other services from the Common Travel Area mixing in with international arrivals at T1. It's is probably a Dept Transport regulation.

[pwalhx]

So what happened to the big announcement promised on Long Haul last week, have I missed it whilst I have been away?

Also wasn't an announcement on BA routes out of Manchester mentioned somewhere (maybe not this thread) for 11th August.

Waiting in eager anticipation for big announcements that never seem to come.

[cbt_bear_MAN]

It was just the usual nonsense I should imagine. I predict no firther long hul expansion for at least 2 years. he UK econom is starting to go into decline and what with terrorism, high £ and escalating fuel prices etc etc it just isnt attractie to Far Eastern operators to fly in to MAN. If it ever was..!

[jongeman]

There was no big announcement last week re long haul routes. I wouldn't believe any of it until I see it (preferably landing).

MAN bosses are saving all these long haul announcements up so that they can amaze us by announcing 5 all at once.....probably in about 2009

The UK economy isn't going into decline! It just hasn't grown as much as was expected - apparently the recent cut in the base rate will help to solve this.

[TURIN]

...it just isnt attractie to Far Eastern operators to fly in to MAN. If it ever was..!

Best have a word with Malaysian, Emirates, Singapore Airlines and PIA then.:rolleyes:

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

I think we will have an Indian and a Pakistan airline start within the next few months
G-I-B

[EGCC]

I think MAN are doing the right thing and getting the expansion underway before they start announcing new long haul routes. The airport is currently operating at over capacity during peak times in the morning. Once T2 Phase 2 construction begins I think MAN will be working hard to fill the extra capacity!

There is still the problem of attracting airlines at 'off peak' times as the airport is almost deserted come 3pm, especially T2, but they are trying to offer incentives to reduce the afternoon lull.

[Daza]

MAN to loose SNN,ARH,ORK,NCE,PSA.FCO,STR and VCE no AR1 s to be based only 1x146-200 and ER4 and DH8s (BHX to loose FCO and VIE)
Daza

Above should read ZRH not ARH!! DOH

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

Sad day for all you guys who are going to have upset again I know it`s not nice,
but this might open doors for an airline/s who can make a go of it The question is are they going to be British ?, I think not!
There is now an opening for BMI Commuter to make a name for themselves at Manchester and have a true network
which can only help with any Transat that they do plan to keep

G-I-B

[Going loco]

What are you talking about GIB? Just look at the competition that has emerged over the last couple of years to most of the places on that list. Jet2/bmi baby + Mr O Leary's expansion over at LPL all combined of course with a 100% increase in fuel! Embraer and RJ operations just do not stand a chance in that sort of environment, regardless of what's painted down the side.

loco

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

There is still a big market for full cost airlines as Lufthansa( A321), Air France(A319, A320) , KLM (B737) and SAS (MD-80) have shown, they have wiped the floor with Citiexpress, the only exception being Iberia which is a Noworld partner.
Flew to Paris with Citiexpress on an EMB145, nice enough aircraft but the guy sat next to me was quite a large person
and by the time we arrived at Paris he had to be peeled out of his seat
Return should have been on a RJ100 downgraded to a EMB145 due a storm at Manchester and re booked with Air France
on an A320 much more room and a lot less
clostraphobic ( hope I`ve spelt that right)
and I`ve got to say Air France pulled out the stops to get us back
If you are travelling on business you want a decent service where you arrive in a fit state to go to a meeting and the flexibility to change a booking at the last moment if plans change

G-I-B

[cbt_bear_MAN]

Where is this information from? Is it official from BA that these routes are to go? To make such a sweeping claim without substantiaited evidence is not a good idea, I would say.

[AirLCY]

G-I-B

You must remember the the majority of the airlines you mention are carryin 70% connecting traffic, if they were only carrying point to point pax like BACX they would also be operating much smaller a/c. All routes dropped are operated by other carriers already.

[cbt_bear_MAN]

Rome is not served by anyone except BA directly from Manchester, the same goes for SHannon.

[cbt_bear_MAN]

Jet2 finally announce MAN AMS/EDI winter scheds.

[initial]

Jet2 have put winter AMS and EDI routes on sale until Jan, flight times different with earlier morning departures from MAN

Were Jet2 simply holding out for better slot times? or were the waiting to see what BACX would do?

Perhap NCE, VCE and PSA will go year round now?

Who is likely to take over the Rome and SNN routes?

Alitallia? (Rome)
Ryanair? (Shannon)
Bmibaby? (three aircraft still to base this autumn)

[cbt_bear_MAN]

Jet2 AMS slots for winter are identical to summer ones!

[ManchesterMan]

Just a reminder for the less 'business' orientated
out there.....

Big aircraft......lots of empty seats......BAD

Small aircraft...lots of full seats..........GOOD

As BA fly 'business' type routes from Manchester
the type of aircraft is fitted to the fat or thin -ness
of the route.

The yield from such flights can obviously vary
quite a lot.Just ask yourself why Ryanair and
Easyjet seem to be doing okay!
BA brought in GB as a 'Leisure' arm for leisure
destinations to try and get some of the market.

BACX has struggled along for too long without the
backing of the public/business sector of the
travelling public.

If routes cannot support themselves then
downgrading or canx occurs.

MM

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

I used to work in Business travel and pax do not like the Embraers and the RJ`s are to slow and don`t fly above the weather
as we found out once when we took off before the AF A320 and he overtook us
missed the storms on the way and arrived about 15 20 mins before us

G-I-B

[cbt_bear_MAN]

Excuses, excues, excuses, excuses....thats all you get from BACX...well fine, let Monarch Sched, Jet2 and HLX step in I say! They dont seem to have the same 'issues' as BACX and they operate 'big' planes!

[AirLCY]

MON load factors are apparently not good on MAD, and Jet2's aren't high enough for a no frills airline either when they're compared to EZY and FR. I dobt very much that MON are making money on a 50% load farctor to MAD especially when nearly all low fares!

[cbt_bear_MAN]

I see the pax numbers everyday and I can assure yo that ZB Madrid is doing extremely well, regular pax figures in both directions of around 120 on the A320.

[pwalhx]

G-I-B is right, the average business traveller doesn't want to go on a pokey Embraer.

Using the previous examble if you have the choice to fly to paris on an AF A320 or a BA Embraer I'd go for the Airbus everytime.

On the subject of load factors, there have been many posts on various forums about the lack of success of Jet2 at Manchester, however they are adding routes and keeping the so called failing services going, so maybe they dont consider them as failures, yet!

[jongeman]

I don't mind travelling on Embraers; they're deceptively spacious.

Looking at the CAA passenger figures for June, MAN generally handles more pax than BHX to EU cities, sometimes significantly more, yet BA have chosen to base their 146s at BHX and ERJs at MAN.

I don't get it.

[ian_h1]

Dear ian_h1,

Following a review of some of British Airways Citiexpress routes operated from Manchester, we have today announced the cancellation of the following services from the Winter 2005/06 schedule.

As you are an Executive Club member who has travelled from Manchester to one or more of the destinations affected, we want to notify you about these route changes.

With effect from 12 September, flights from Manchester to Zurich and Shannon will be cancelled. In addition, effective October 31st the following flights will be cancelled from Manchester; Cork, Rome, Pisa, Venice, Nice and Stuttgart. All remaining British Airways, British Airways Citiexpress services, and GB Airways services from Manchester will continue to operate. We regret any inconvenience these changes may cause. If you currently hold a booking on one of these services, please contact British Airways for further details, call your service centre or travel agent.

British Airways remains committed to providing services at Manchester, and in addition to the new services provided by our franchise partner, GB Airways, to Tenerife, Malta, Paphos, and Malaga, we are delighted to announce that effective 31st October, GB Airways will introduce three new destinations from Manchester to Gran Canaria, Lanzarote and Marrakech.

Thank you for your continued support. We look forward to welcoming you on board again soon.


Your sincerely,

Sarah Ford
Manager, Executive Club

[7006 fan]

saw in the airline press today that MAN are expanding big time, enlargement of two terminals 12 extra stands 49 desks, to cope with 40m!?! pax pa by 2015, where are all these people coming from!!!

[eggc]

BA Heathrow shuttles :(

[chiglet]

Manchman
BA to Frankfurt Small a/c 20 pax [E145]
LH to Frankfurt Big a/c 154 pax [A321]
Big Aiways is a London based airline and IMMHO is paying "lip service" to the regions....small a/c to EU destinations and big a/c to LHR :mad:
watp,iktch

[ManchesterMan]

chiglet

The reason why Lufthansa and Air France
use bigger aircraft is because a lot of their
passengers journeys end is not Paris or
Frankfurt.

The routes of BA from Manchester to
Europe are point-to-point and not onwards.
(ie:Business orientated)
Therefore if the business community isnt
using BA (at Manchester) but using instead
european airlines its not a surprise the routes
get downgraded.

I look forward to the destinations being
served by new airlines in the future!
It should certainly solve the slot allocation
problems?

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

Most of our clients would do anything to avoid flying BA out of MAN or BHX even travelling via somewhere against direct with BA
Not changed much in 3 years has it



G-I-B

[Railgun]

MAN-LHR-MAD in C is a common one as they hate the product BACX have from MAN. Same with MAN-LHR-JFK in J as NWH is a tip.

[chiglet]

Manchman
So Alitalia are "interlining"? MD80 100+ against E145 30[ish] pax
Amsterdam....Jet2 Hardly "interlining"...BA "pull out"
I think that the question is "Why do pax interline out of MAN on Foreign Carriers ?
Answer, BA do not provide the service that the pax want. BA would rather fly them to LHR and go from there.
Look at the recent history....B737s to "Europe" now, if you are lucky it's a Barbie Jet/146. If you were one of the "unfortunates" to CDG, BRU or AMS [before it stopped] then you could have been on a Dash8. What the heck of of a "business service is that?
watp,iktch

[ManchesterMan]

Chiglet

Yes you have got my point!

BA 'interlines' to LHR

The airline cannot fill its flights from
LHR unless it has shuttles...they are
there to feed the main base!

Surely if your so 'hung-up' about BA
and its use of Manchester you will
welcome the withdrawal?

BA is a private airline and doesnt have
to do anything for loyalties sake.
Perhaps you bought shares in BA and are
now having your say?...or did you sell
for profit!

At the end of the day BA dont have
to fly from Manchester to where-ever
because the shuttle feeds from all
corners.

No-thrills airlines will not fly to many of
these destinations because......?????

(Alitalia are giving up the Birmingham ops)

[chiglet]

ManchesterMan
Read my post!
BA used to have a VERY good business service to "Europe" AMS,CDG FRA BRU.......etc,etc with B737 equipment. They now offer a "degraded" service at a [in real terms] higher cost. The "Passenger" in the NorthWest has two choices.
1. Fly BA, either a "small" a/c or via LHR
2. Fly Another Carrier.
If the Airline cannot fill its a/c without Shuttles, perhaps it should/could Diversify to the Regions.
An example. BA did a LGW-MAN-Islamabad-MAN-LGW. PIA [PK] started in competition.....BA "pulled out"....PIA now have [I think] 28 flights through MAN.
BAW also had a LGW-MAN-MIA-MAN-LGW Service [to fly from MAN was a very hefty premium] Virgin [and Charters now do 30+ per week]
No, I haven't got shares in BA. I work in ATC, and have been at MAN since 1970, so I have seen a few changes.
So, At the end of the day BA dont have
to fly from Manchester to where-ever
because the shuttle feeds from all
corners.
How many Cork pax will transit through LHR? or Zurich pax or oh dear Amsterdam pax.........They go to another Airline.
I could go on, but I'm not too keen on brick walls..
we aim to please, it keeps the cleaners happy

[MarkD]

chiglet

your best bet is "help me GB-Won Kenobi, you're our only hope" :D

I've only gone through MAN once to get anywhere from ORK (ABZ) and even then I came back via LHR. The only thing saving BA's blushes at MAN is that bmi's strategy is even worse than theirs - how the hell can you build LH feeding from a budget carrier FFS?

[Vuelo]

Interestingly, around a third of all pax on GB Airways flights in and out of Manchester are transferring to and from these flights to destinations such as JFK, ION, GLA, EDI, OSL and HEL being the most popular.....

I predict GB Airways will take on VXE, NCE, FCO and PSA.

[ManchesterMan]

Chiglet

I have read your post(s).....see!!

Can you tell me how long BA kept
the two routes your on about?

I guess BA's ploy is to keep rising
the surcharges and make a profit
that way.

They must be doing something right
'cause they just announced an
increase in profits ....or am I wrong?

Pakistan and Virgin are doing well
with there monopoly routes but that
will happen when theres no competition.

You cant 'make' an airline see sense
- only profit counts.

[Railgun]

"I predict GB Airways will take on VXE, NCE, FCO and PSA"

I would not hold out much hope.

[This Charming Man]

Click on the link ... it says it all ......

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/899862/L/

[Vuelo]

I just can;t help smiling to myself when I think how MAplc used to be so subservient to BA and now BA have come along and kneed them in the nuts!

Still, hopefully this will open some slots up for someone else..!

I think the Jet2 photo looks good, I always liked red!

[bozzy]

i think its a shame how manchester has gone nearly all low cost
its going like liverpool, luton instead of easyjet its jet2

[Caslance]

You can't have been to Manchester recently then, bozzy. :rolleyes:

[bozzy]

i always go to the viewing point about every couple of weeks.

yeah that was a stupid comment (what i made) i meant its gettin to a point that all you see is jet2
manchester needs some more big airliners comin in some more jumbos a340s etc i thought manny would be massive in years to come but it seems to be going the low cost carrier way.

[MancRy]

Since GB Airways have commenced MAN op's (and BACX having downsized to 50 seat op's) I have always said that GB should have routes such as.......

FCO - dash 8 or erj dont have the range
NCE - Apparently is very popular route and difficult to get seats
on BA at present
VCE and possibly PSA.

All these routes fall into the remitt of GB Airways' route network, dont you think?

As a travel agent (until 31st Aug) i find it very difficult to find BCN flights these days considering three airlines did the route this time last year. Instead i send clients from LPL on EZY! Again BCN would fit nicely into the GB Network.

Start at GB on the 12th sept so to have these destinations would be fantastic especially as these would allow for three sector days (due to relatively short flight times) and i think this could equal stopovers! :O

[Mouser]

Were are GB going to get the extra aircraft from, the 2nd arrives in October but is earmarked for extra services and new routes.

[MancRy]

Not saying that they will do that immediately but i think it will be a possibility once new aicraft arrive. But hey, who knows. The last year has seen GB diversifying and operating new routes away from the Iberian peninsular/western med and Innsbruck is a new one for this winter albei from LGW.

[gayrugbybloke]

Look out for some terminal moves for certain airlines this autumn. The moves will apparently involve long hul airlnes moving from T2 to T3 primarily.

[Railgun]

I wonder what exec lounge the airlines will use as the only exec lounge in T3 is a BA lounge for BA/Oneworld card holders/business/first pax? The whole of T3 is 100% ba/oneworld based.

[gayrugbybloke]

I am sure if BA are offered the right price they will open their facilities to anyone who wants to pay! The amount of premium trafic currently using T3 is pretty low currently, and also the BA lounge is pretty big, so could easily be patitioned.

T3 is set to undergo some big changes. Obviously MAplc recognise that expansion can really only feasibly occur at T2 and T3 so I would suggest that T3's days of being a BA bastion are possibly numbered. Watch this space I would say!

[bozzy]

does manplc or ba own t3. did emirates use t3 along time ago.

and dont ya think its a bad idea having checkin desks at the train station, i told somebody you have to check in at the station because they were flyin with aae and they just looked at me like i was an idiot, they had a long walk there and back to the station because they didnt listen to me. they wasnt happy. i cant see that working

[gayrugbybloke]

Well if faced woth severe congestion at T1 or relieveing it somewhat by using some new check in desks at The Stationm, I tend to think it is a good idea. I have heard that Global Spirit will also be using it for check-in, though don;t know if that is confirmed as yet.

[bozzy]

yeah i can understand that but you wouldnt think of goin to a train station to check in

[gayrugbybloke]

You don;t have to think about it at all, you go where the monitors tell yu to go to check in!

[bozzy]

could you imagine gettin to t1 and then having to walk over to the station to check in especially families with kids with loads of luggage it would be a nightmare personally! and then havin to walk back nah i dont think its good and the escalators nine times out of ten are broke in the tube.

[MancRy]

I tell people at work to check in at 'the station' and they also look at me as tho i'm mad. If they are told by the travel agent or if they read the information on the website they would know to get dropped off at the station.

[chiglet]

IF the Taxi drivers/Family fiends are told that their pax are travelling by TravelCity/Air Atlanta then on every approach road to every terminal says "ALL TC/AA CHECK IN AT THE STATION" :confused: It ain't rocket science :ok:
watp,iktch

[gayrugbybloke]

I'm sorry, check in at the station is really not a big deal. Most of the fat chavs using 5A and EUK flights need the exercise anyway! Makes room for all the fast food c*ap they'll be eating when they et to Orlando!

[chiglet]

Don't forget tho'.....Marks and the Coffee Shop are closed at the weekend :{ :confused:
watp,iktch

[Caslance]

M&S is open on Saturdays, while the coffee shop seems to open and close on a random basis totally unrelated to the clock or calendar.

In any case, the T1 garage/supermarket/soft porn emporium is literally a couple of hundred yards away and it's open 24/7.

[gayrugbybloke]

Marks and Spencer is closing shortly - doesnt make any money apparently.

[Caslance]

With the markup that they slap on their prices I'm not surprised.

Try comparing the prices in there with those in other M+S food outlets and you'll see what I mean.

[EGCC]

Yes, £2.40 instead of the usual £2.20 for a sandwich, absolutely outrageous!!! :ok:

[MancRy]

Just read on another forum site that BA are rumoured to be converting it's BACX operation from MAN and BHX to a low cost operation and named BA Red. Anyone heard anything about this. Seems a bit odd to me especially as they, at MAN atleast, becoming a 50 seat operation.

[Vuelo]

Jet2 announce MAN NCE for summer 2006, but no timings...!

[jongeman]

MancRy

Only heard about it through that thread, although this rumour seems to be doing the rounds with BACX staff. At first I thought it was a mad idea, but if you consider how flybe have changed and expanded, maybe it's not.

[Vuelo]

Perhaps they will paint their planes red...that'd be nice!

[Scottie Dog]

Anybody heard anything definate on GlobalSpirit Airlines? I see they are suppose to be starting operations in September using a European 747.

What is the word on the ground?

[Vuelo]

I have heard it has been postponed for a few months.sounds like a BackpackersXpress situation to me! Remember their promises and fancy website? (minus the human remains element!!)

[MancRy]

yeah i thought about Flybe. afterwards so maybe. Also, it wouldnt be a stand alone operation like GO was and should integrate fully into th BA network.

[MichaelDoyle]

Hi
If this new low cost arm of BA comes off are we likely to see a change of equipment to something bigger.eg: Embraer 195,A319,737-700
Thanks
Michael

[TURIN]

Heard that Qatar are going to a daily schedule. Anyone confirm or deny?

[MichaelDoyle]

Hi Turin
It could be a possibility because Qatar are getting some new heavies delivered soon.
I wouldn't rule it out.
Thanks
Michael

[bozzy]

i though qatar has a daily service from man using there a330 to doha?

also i was looking at some oldish pictures of man airport and i didnt realise quantas and gulfair use to fly into man. what happened with them, its a shame and also they had cathay pacific and that went. whats going wrong?

[Vuelo]

Are Etihad starting services from MAN this winter? Have slots been secured?

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

Qantas ( no u ) was asked (told ) to stop by London Airways (BA) as they were taking their pax which had to go via London and I think Gulf Air couldn`t compete with Emirates at the time

G-I-B

[bozzy]

were does ethiad fly to?

do you reckon quantas would ever return to manchester? its a shame gulf air didnt survive its a nice plane. but with emirates and qatar the competition would be to strong to return.

also tui is operating to brazil. what aircraft would they use to travel to brazil. they have only got the 767. would that cope to brazil

[EGCC]

Etihad are on their way with flights to Abu Dhabi, annoucement sometime soon, i've heard a start date is planned for sometime in autumn but don't know the timetable yet.

[diesel36]

tui mytravel t cook first choice there all starting brazil.. mytravel and first choice have done them before.

[Vuelo]

Rumour has it that there are to be some major changes with airlines moving terminals this winter. I have heard that Etihad might be using T3 along with one other long haul airline coming from Terminal 2. I have also heard that EK want to quit T1 and move to T2 or back to T3 as the imae of T1 is now bucket and spade and lo-co ops and that doesnt sit well with EK image as a premier service ourfir. Anyone else heard this?

[bmiboyz]

Mytravel are also operating to Brazil this winter to Recife.

[EGCC]

Emirates are moving to T2. As a result, some dual finger airbridges will be installed for them, like they have over at T1.

[Vuelo]

Will an airline from the Star Alliance, maybe US or SQ be moving to T1 to compensate and concentrate Star ops at T1?

[bozzy]

did emirates originally operate out of t3? has anybody herd any more about the expansion of t3

[agent x]

Many moons ago EK used to go from T2, then they moved to T3, now they're back in T1 and looking to move again!

[Vuelo]

Bet they are worried about Etihad coming, they offer a great in flight product, as good as if not better than EK.

[MichaelDoyle]

Hi
Yeh must agree with you.I too have heard great things about Etihad and they are the amerging force in the Middle East.
Too things though:
What Aircraft is likely to operate the Etihad flight?
And is it going to be daily?
Thanks
Michael

[Vuelo]

I would be very surprised if they come straight in with a daily service.I would imagine they'll focus on about three times a week, with timings that connect well with onward flights to the sub-continent and Banhgkok, which is where the likely major share of their passengers will want to fly to and from.

[bozzy]

well thats good news, another big carrier coming to manchester. is this definate or just a rumour. i think if they did come they would operate a a330.

[EGCC]

Etihad is pretty much in the bag, its about the only bit of positive route news going round the airport.

[Vuelo]

Interestingly, a Virgin pilot friend of mine has just called me, all excited because he ahs been allowed to move up and base himself at MAN. He flies the B747s out of LGW normally but comes from near Mancheter. He has been allowed to make the move up here because he has been told there is to be more demand for MAN based VS pilots due to expansion. However, he only knows of the MCO and BGI weekly route to startthis winter. Maybe VS are looking at some 747 expansion from MAN at long last?

[bozzy]

well that is good news with ethihad and virgin. lets hope virgin will expand and bring in some more routes over the next couple of years. do they have crew and pilots based in man or is it gatwick crew. and finally they have brought up a decent pane to cover the orlando route instead of that old 747 200. also why did singapore started using the 777 and the 747 400 on the odd days. is the pax figures low on singapore.

[Vampy]

However, he only knows of the MCO and BGI weekly route to startthis winter

Just for those of us not familiar with this coding (speaking as an air traffic controller) where is MCO and BGI? MCO i'm guessing is Miami (KMIA). Where is BGI? Bridgetown, Barbados maybe? (TBPB). Ta. :ok:

[Ringwayman]

MCO i'm guessing is Miami (KMIA). Where is BGI? Bridgetown, Barbados maybe? (TBPB).

MCO = Orlando but you are correct for BGI being Barbados

also why did singapore started using the 777 and the 747 400 on the odd days. is the pax figures low on singapore.

They are now offering significantly more capacity out of MAN using this arrangement than when it was daily 747 one-stop services.

Maybe VS are looking at some 747 expansion from MAN at long last?

Remember at the time of the 744s coming onto the Orlando route in May, they said they would be, though they indicated no timescale - perhaps we can look forward to some Caribbean services and Las Vegas and extra Orlando services for example.

[jongeman]

Re an earlier question re Qantas, Gulf Air and Cathay.

QF left because of BA, as Golf-India Bravo has already said.

When Cathay Pacific joined One World, their services miraculously disappeared too. For One World, read one airport and one carrier.......London Heathrow and London Airways. London, London, London and again, London.

Gulf Air operated to Abu Dhabi, which at the time didn't offer significant connections. They said that they'd return when they finally developed Bahrain as their major hub. This hasn't happened, and possibly GF seem to have missed the boat with Emirates, Qatar and now Etihad developing their networks.

[Leodis]

Jongeman

London, London, London and again London

That is because London is the Capital, Manchester is NOT!! Nor is is close to becoming Englands second city, which is Birmingham.

[Ringwayman]

When Cathay Pacific joined One World, their services miraculously disappeared too.

To be fair to them, they didn't pull the route immediately. It went a few months after they started codesharing LHR-MAN on BA, not codesharing on MAN-HKG (via AMS/FRA/CDG, though I'm sure a 3 weekly non-stop may have become a slightly better product to offer from here given codesharing) and lack of general promotion of the MAN-HKG service.

[MancRy]

Leodis, we all know that London is the capital, but thanks for stating the obvious.
We also know that Birmingham is indeed Englands second city. However, in case you didn't notice, this is an aviation website and to me in this context (and that of media and the financial sector), Manchester is the second city. i.e look at MAN compared to BHX. Need i say more?

The whole BA MAN debate (both here and over at airliners.net) keeps re-appearing and i also have the view that BA (and other UK carriers) have neglected MAN. There is, i believe, much potential at MAN for BA to develop its Long Haul services. What i mean by that is LAX perhaps aswell as other 'popular' destinations and not to some far flung African destination that is operated from LHR!
A common response from those who oppose this view is......

1) "oh BA don't have an obligation to MAN, they are a business"
BA is a business and they haven't an obligation to MAN but they are missing an opportunity. Other long haul carriers have not only found MAN routes sustainable but also very lucrative. Also, contary to many peoples beliefs, Manchester and indeed several Northern Cities have business organisations (financial, manufacturing etc) that can support premium products aswell as there been many, not overly affluent people, that are willing to spend more on their well earned holiday. (yes prosperity really does exist North of Watford Gap)
While some may argue that the dual hub model does not work, Heathrow is, as we know, bursting at the seamswhile MAN could relieve some of that burden. At present BA has a relatively good European network that could feed a small portfolio of long haul routes aswell as those of fellow oneworld partners. In turn this would support european routes. Whilst those in the southeast wouldn't dream of transiting MAN, those connecting from Europe couldnt care less whether they changed at LHR or MAN as long as its easy, the service is good and the price is right. Apparently, GB Airways routes (who i'll be working for from next month-before any of you think i'm anti BA) are full of people connecting onto JFK.
In respect of dual hubs, some say that few other airlines have two or more hubs. But i think that the MAN situation is rarely replicated because whilst IB, for instance, doesn't offer Long haul out of BCN, BCN doesn't have many (if any) long haul ops anyway where as MAN does. Or put it a better way, name me another city that has the likes of EK,SQ,QR,US,DL,PK,AA,MH etc and not have many long hauls by it's National carrier.

This is my own personal view and i can understand why people get frustrated with BA MAN. The fact that shortly, we will lose some routes notably FCO makes it worse. I mean it's terrible that from then on the only route from Northern England to the Italian capital will be an FR from LPL that arrives in Rome and some late hour and all because BA wants to focus on 50 seat ops that can't make it that far. GB...thats your route for the takin!

[ManchesterMan]

Mancry

The reason why Manchester has your stated
long-haul routes IS BECAUSE BA has 'neglected'
Manchester in favour of London.You dont get the
mix of carriers any where else with the obvious
exception of LHR,as you do in Man

I can only assume that the JFK makes so much
money for them that they dare not cut it!

Any increase in BA long-haul from Manchester
would affect other carriers - but I think the dye
has been caste - with GB moving in on leisure
routes and maybe BARed (Crap name) picking up
minor (as in 50 seat) 'business' eurozone routes.

I'm still struggling with the fact that BA is a
'favorite' airline given that everybody seems
to slag them off.
Who the hell flies with them????

BA has always had 2 London bases and in all the
years this has not changed at all.
I for one would rather see more exotic traffic at
Manchester in the future than BA B747's/B777's
thundering down 24 left.

[MancRy]

Yes BA has always placed emphasis on LGW although long hauls from here is now declining.
I am an enthusiast and love seeing various other carriers but i am looking at a it from a business perspective and not from one of nostalgia or anything like that.
If BA were to expand then the routes i'd see them doing would not really overlap much with other carriers and emphasis likely placed on North America. So LAX and SFO etc.
Finally, why not let GB take over some 'business' routes that cannot be flown by BACX or those which would be more profitable under a smaller organisation such as GB. I have stated before that several of BA's routes would be suited to GB as, while true its a mainly leisure airline, its route network centres on southern europe/med....so FCO and NCE (as examples of dropped BACX routes, would be prime for GB)

[Manchester Exile]

Well Leodis, thankyou for clarifying that London is the capital. I believe it is disgraceful that passengers would even consider flying out of a regional airport. In fact, I'm fully in favour of closing down all regional airports and channeling everyone through LHR.

It is quite correct that airlines such as Qantas and Cathay, who were running profitable operations from Manchester, close the routes down in favour of everyone flying from the capital city, on the British national airline.

Let's hope and pray that all other long-haul carriers out of Manchester, Glasgow and Birmingham immediately cease operations. We don't want to detract from our capital city, do we?

[TURIN]

One of the travel trade mags is, this month reporting that BA will pull the MAN-JFK route very soon.
Whether this is speculation based on airport generated rumour or has more substantial facts behind it I do not know.
Wait and see eh?

[Railgun]

Rumor has it BACX will stop operating it with there crew, possibly manned with ex BRAL crew from BACX who will be mainline shuttle. But also heard it might operate in a W ex LHR with London crew.

[bozzy]

well it doesnt look like ba wants to expand from manchester anymore with the possibility of the jfk route going, bacx cutting routes. ba wants everything back into heathrow even gatwick is suffering with ba. its lucky gb are expanding in man or there wouldnt be no use for t3. but if virgin continues to expand in man then thats good news and ethihad coming.

[This Charming Man]

I have also heard it's in the bag , daily operation with A330's, morning deps,starting in spring 06.

Also heard that there has been more than enough interest to fill the 32 prime time daily slots given up by BA. Some by already established MAN operators but interestingly, by one carrier who is'nt established ! (and before you ask I was'nt told who but it was UNLIKELY to be EZY) :E

[EGCC]

Looks like the change in runway designation is actually going ahead now. Runways 24L/R and 06L/R will become Runways 23L/R and 05L/R.

How much this change (due to the gradual shift of magnetic north) is going to cost the airport is currently being calculated.

[Daza]

Manchester is not even the third city in the UK thats Glasgow and finance media etc Edinburgh is much more of an Important financial centre than Machester as is Leeds. BHX suffers from being too close to London Manchester is just far enough away to desuade most to travel to London by road. Dont forget BHX has lost routes too!

Daza

[MancRy]

Just before I moved to Manchester three years ago, i read or heard a media report saying that in some statistic or other, Manchester (the city) had overtaken Birmingham as the second city. What people also forget is that Manchester is greater (no pun intended) than the city itself. Manchester is made up of 10 districts/councils (as many will know)

Manchester City
Stockport
Tameside
Oldham
Rochdale
Bury
Bolton
Salford
Trafford
Wigan
Not a Manc myself but i believe Manchester has everything. Regardless of whether it is second or third or whatever, after London it probably has the biggest profile

Commonwealth Games
Manchester United
Manchester Airport
Coronation Street (i'll be lynched for that one, but its true, corrie is shown in several other countries)

If it's not second/third city....it should be! lol

[gayrugbybloke]

I really ope FlyBe make good use of those slots!;)

[MichaelDoyle]

Hi
I hope EasyJet or Ryanair takes up the slots.Itll be a nice change and will rattle a few feathers with BA and Jet2
Thanks
Michael

[Vuelo]

They seem pretty happy at Liverpool to me, and we don;t really need more locos, we need more long haul hubsters, like JAL, Thai, Cathay, United and SAA.

[submariner]

I am glad we are now getting back onto the correct subject. I feel it is pointless comparing cities (or indeed Counties), It is beneficial to see most airports expand.

However, just to correct MancRy, By no means of the imagination is Manchester Britains 2nd City.

The Factual information is, according to population:

1. London
2. Birmingham
3. Glasgow
4. Liverpool
5. Sheffield
6. Leeds
7. Bristol
and er,
8. Manchester

Unfortunately, Britains cities do not include their real make up like other countries so it is difficult to make true comparisons, therefore it is best to stick to the facts available.

You can not compare the County of Greater Manchester to other cities, but to other Counties. Try comparing like with like. i.e. West Midlands and Gtr Manchester.

As for a higher profile:

Commonwealth Games - Edinburgh?

Manchester United - But its in Trafford, not Manchester. Try using Manchester City as a comparitor.

Manchester Airport - Fair point, but part of it used to be in Cheshire, and as the rest of the region start to claw back their own Pax, Manplc will expand at a slower rate.

Coronation Street - What, a sad soap opera unknown outside of the U.K. - I have never even watched it.

I'm sure most, if not all other Cities can register a higher worldwide profile than the above.

What you missed (and it is this what has probably couloured your thinking) is that the majority of the Media in the North is based in Manchester and they, being born and bred mancunians, have yet to learn that Manchester is merely the 2nd largest city in the region and is actually based on the periphery of that.

But then again, why don't we all just stick to aviation.

:E

[pwalhx]

In view of everyone being correct, lets be honest when people refer to the population of London they are referring to Greater London not the City of London (which is not that high) so why can we not refer to Greater Manchester in the same way.

[sisyphus1965]

If my memory serves me correct the population of the CITY of London is about 3000!!!!

[bozzy]

unfortunately manchester is expanding, if you like it or not. just look around manchester city centre, and its hard not to miss it with all them cranes with that new skyscraper going up and a couple more in the pipe line. and manchester airport will always be the bigger and busiest airport in the north and i cant really see that changing.ANd nobody can deny that manchester did an excellent job for the commonwealth games. manchester is more recognised globally than weres that place oh yes birmingham and for corrie to be sad, yep thats why they are the number one soap in britain.
lets get back on the topic of planes please.

[agent x]

----------------------------------:zzz: ------------------------------------

[Vuelo]

This whole debate is SO boring. Go off and start your own thread called 'Second Cities', why don't you.

[Thomas_Cook_757-300]

Hi,

A new route for Summer 2006 will be Djerba, Tunisia which will be flown once weekly on a Saturday at 17:20 returning 01:05.

The route will commence on May 6th 2006 and will be flown by MyTravel Airways on behalf of Airtours and Panorama Holidays.

For more information regarding the Island of 100,000 Palm Trees see: MyTravel.com (http://www.MyTravel.com)

Regards
Thomas_Cook_757-300

[ManchesterMan]

VUELO

This whole debate is SO boring. Go off and start your own thread called 'Second Cities', why don't you

Spot on ! - I couldn't agree more!!
Take your chips off somewhere else will you!!

MM

[TURIN]

When you start your new thread on second cities Bozzy, you may want to add a bit of punctuation, capital letters and grammar. It helps the rest of us understand your point of view.:ok:

[MancRy]

My last post (hopefully) on the topic of city size. As someone has pointed out, Trafford is in Manchester The reason why Manchester appears so small in terms of population is that they are based on the Manchester City Council boundaries, which is a relatively small area, and is like the city of London as someone again mentioned.
I live in Manchester and love the city but i am no Manc. I actually come from Barnsley which is just up the road from Sheffield and no way is it larger than Manchester.

Whatever, BHX is also losing out from BA's ignorance towards the regions. MAN is a fantastic airport from my point of view and peoples perceptions are actually greater of it. People come into work and are genuinely shocked that there isn't a direct flight to Rio, Tokyo or wherever they may need to get to such is that perception. I am not sayin MAN could sustain such services necassarily but it goes to show what people think operates out of there. Little do they know that increasingly it's becoming difficult to get to certain EUROPEAN destinations.
My point is though that i have been a travel agent for two years and so feel qualified to comment on demand for certain routes or services and believe BA are making a mistake.

[Vuelo]

Etihad will apparently operate daily, arriving 0645hrs at T1, departing 1000hrs back to Abu Dhabi.

When is it to be officially announced?

[bozzy]

Turin, thankyou for pointing out my mistakes!!!!
I only written one post about the cities battle, so why should i open up a new thread.

Thats great news with ethihad (have i spelt that write) Also i was at Manchester airport yesterday and seen two gb aircraft, i though they only had one up for the moment.

Has Emirates stopped using the A330 and started using the 777. Why is this.

[Railgun]

GB have one based aircraft and one that operates in a W, LGW-AGP-MAN-AGP-LGW. Second one shud be at man for winter ops iirc.

[bozzy]

cheers for the info. I start training with gb as cc in september. so does that mean there will be three gb aircrafts in winter or will the gatwick plane go back to gatwick?

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

Bozzy

Re Emirates
They have been using a B777 on the lunchtime flight since June if I remember rightly and will be upgrading to a B777-300 from end of October whilst the evening service is a high density A330
The change to a B777 is a larger number of seats due excellent loads
It will be interesting to see what effect Etihad has on Emirates loads but I`m sure the business is there, so good luck to them both as they along with Qatar have a quality product

G-I-B

[MancRy]

I got a feeling it will continue the AGP with LGW crew and a/c....unfortunately. That would probably have been our shortest day Bozzy. lol

G I B, a 773 would be excellent, love that aircraft.
Slightly off topic, going LHR-MIA on 3rd Septemeber, and really want an aircraft with V:Port IFE. I don\'t suppose anyone has any idea about how many 744\'s are fitted with this?

[bozzy]

Were's agp. i dont understand the abreviations yet?:confused:

who are you flying with to miami.

And with Emirates, i do to love the 777-300, cant wait until they operate that. i dont really rate emirates. i dont think their is anything special about them, the seats are rock solid and very uncomfy. ive heard that qatar is much better.

Has anybody flown with qatar or etihad?

[GOLF-INDIA BRAVO]

Bozzy

Try ths site
http://www.airlinecodes.co.uk/

It lists all the codes for airports and airlines both ICAO and IATA

G-I-B

[bozzy]

Cheers G.I.B, i have just done it, and its malaga. DUHH i feel a bit stupid now.

[MancRy]

Don't feel stupid Bozzy, just sad geeks like me who know da codes. lol. Actually ia v to know them for work. Will be flying to those codes shortly though. :ok:

By the way, flying Virgin to MIA. Really want a V;port a/c.

[bozzy]

whats a v port a/c?:p :p :p :confused:

:{ i dont know anything:{

[MancRy]

Its the new in flight entertainment system on Virgin. You can stop and start films and programmes when you want and the screen is bigger etc. Check some pics of it on airliners.

[pwalhx]

Bozzy

You are the first person I have come across that doesn't rate EK, personally always found their aircraft and service excellent.

[MancRy]

I too have heard some negative comments about EK and one of them was the hard seats. From the pictures i have seen, they do look quite hard.

[bozzy]

i think because of all the hype around emirates, that i was expecting something fantastic. I dont know what just was. I would recommend emirates and think they are an ok airline, but nothing special. The crew are lovely, entertainment good, but the seats were rock hard and very uncomfy, especially for a flight to dubai and i wouldnt like to fly onwards from dubai, it would kill my back and im only 21. i much preferred ba, very comfy seats and excellent service, they surpassed my expectations of them, emirates didnt sorry. But i have heard excellent reports on qatar.

mancRy, i will need to understand all the codes soon, i think my sister will help me, she is a travel agent too. Why dont you phone virgin and ask about the system.


P.s. i do however think dubai airport is fantastic and is probably the best i have been to.

[MancRy]

Does she work for a rival of ours? :( :)
A mate of mine once went to BKK via DXB with EK and he harped on about it all the time afterwards. EK do have alot of hype surrounding them but so do Virgin and i will have to reserve judgement until next weekend.

Bozzy....here we go...a GB crash course for codes. hehe

LPA Las Palmas
ACE Arrecife
TFS Tenerife
MLA Malta
PFO Paphos
AGP Malaga
DBV Dubrovnik (i think)
and christ knows what Marrakesh is.

[bozzy]

:p :p :p :p :p ha ha i better learn them quick!!!:p :p

my sister works for co op travel, shes been there for 8 years i think.

i have pm you on cabin crew.

:ok:

[MancRy]

cheers. Ahh travel must be in the Bozzy familys blood then. :p

[bozzy]

yeah it must be!! all my family can think of is cheap flights with ba.

[chiglet]

The Emirates has been a B773 for a while now...yesterdays' load was nearly 400pax and 21tonnes freight
watp,iktch

[bozzy]

would emirates ever introduce a third daily service from manchester or isnt the demand there

[MancRy]

That is a real possibility Bozzy and think that it's been rumoured before. Besides, if you can fill two services a day, i'm sure that you can have a bloody good stab at a third! :O

[Vuelo]

Shall we just leave you two lovebirds to it?

[Railgun]

Marrakesh is RAK

[MancRy]

Thanks Railgun. Vuelo, your not jealous are you? You know if you want to join in on our conversation that is open to the PUBLIC, please feel free. Neither me or Bozzy bite. :p :p :p

[bozzy]

vuelo, you can join in with the conversation, like what mancRy said we wont bite.:p :O :p

looking at etihad's website and it had no mention of new routes to manchester just New York in 2006. Are you sure they are coming to Manchester?

[jongeman]

It seems pretty certain that Etihad are coming to Manchester, it just hasn't been announced yet. Not officially.

MAN seems to be going through a lull at the moment. I don't think I can remember a time as quiet as this, for a long time.

I'm sure it's got something to do with the cost of oil. Even some established healthy services are struggling to make a profit at the moment (apparently)

[ManchesterMan]

GREAT NEWS !!!!!

There has not been a new post on here
spreading the latest rumours for a whole two
days!

This must be some sort of record for recent
times?

I'm really enjoying the complete lack of juicy
carefree and throw-away willy-nilly snipets of
complete fantasy that often passes for worth
-while infomation.

I hope that by the summer of '06 will be long
enough for me to recover my senses and be
pleasantly surprised when I go to the airport
and discover lots of new destinations served
by lots of new airlines.

I will now do a 90 degree turn on one leg and
walk out of here (with thanks to Monty Python!)

MM

[jongeman]

And wouldn't Los Angeles, Mumbai, Delhi, Hong Kong, Bangkok and Moscow look good on the departure boards?

Would you like a rumour?

Air Koryo MAN-Novosibirsk-Pyongyang, Tues, Thu and Sun from April 22nd!

[This Charming Man]

Hey Manchester Man

I've heard that Mahan Air twice a week is on the cards.

What do your sources say ? ;) :ouch: :E

[jongeman]

Mahan Air would make a lot of sense. There's a massive Iranian community in Manchester and all over the north.

[Lord Toofouright]

Know what you mean jongeman, but I would suggest that they are living in the UK to get away from the present tyranical regime in Iran and therefore wouldn't consider going back?? :(
I think you'll find any service with Mahan Air will be targetting the through route to Pakistan and onward via Tehran.
Buisness must be good in Bradford??

:p

Cheerio old boy,

Lord. 24R

[ManchesterMan]

TCM

Yeah I've heard the rumour around too

3X weekly starting the very first day of
April.

Keep your eyes to the skies!

MM

[runway14141414]

As far as i'm aware Mahan do not fly into Pakistan, most of the PAX from BHX are onwards to Delhi with a few to Bangkok. Maybe they're after the MAN-Delhi market before any of the Indian carriers start.

[Caslance]

Or maybe the Wishful Thinking Fairy has been whispering into people's ears again......:rolleyes:

[eggc]

SWISS are to drop the MAN - Basle run from Oct 30th

[Centre cities]

Mahan air

Have a look on the Mahan air press releease on BHX.co.uk. It is there for all to see.

Centre cities

[Railgun]

So Mahan they have opened a call center in Birmingham? Hardly a tie in for a base in BHX i would not have thought.

[Centre cities]

Yiou missed the second page which mentions services from MAN in December

Centre cities

[Railgun]

Thanks my mistake.

[This Charming Man]

Well , seeing as it's on a press release I can advise the following

Weds
W5 5017 THR - MAN A310 STA 0630
W5 5018 MAN - THR A310 STD 0755

Sat
W5 5017 THR - MAN A310 STA 2000
W5 5018 MAN - THR A310 STD 2130

Start date 10th Dec 05

(Terminal 2 has been allocated).

[Vuelo]

Terminal 2?! It's jam packed as it is of a morning, surely T1 B Pier would be better?

[Caslance]

Well, I feel a right charlie now! :ooh:

Actually, T2 isn't too bad that early on a Wednesday morning... let's hope their timekeeping is up to scratch, eh?

Otherwise it'll be remote stand ops for Mahan.