MAN777, I agree with you in certain respects but bulldozing T1 and starting again simply isn't an option. The only way this could be achieved is by constructing a temporary terminal first or by building a completely new terminal on a different site and then demolishing T1 altogether after that and leaving that site empty. Both are extremely costly and whilst I agree that it would be the only real long term solution to certain problems, the money simply isn't there to undertake a project of that size. The demolition of 'B Pier' in itself will cause an incredible amount of disruption. So much so that the airport will probably have to spend 15m on a link between gate 22 in T1 and gate 202 in T2 just so T1 flights can use T2 whilst 'B Pier' is rebuilt. That in itself will cause minor problems when you consider the walking distance between say the current airside food village in T1 and gate 205 in T2. Anything on a larger scale is just a no go.

GavinC... T2 'West Pier' will be extended so that gates 216-219 will be part of the terminal and connected by airbridges. This scheme has already been given the go ahead and will start shortly. This will allow gates 201-205 to be used by T1 carriers without affecting the T2 operation too much.

Gatwick manages with one, and has 20% more movements. I'm sure Manchester will cope.

If you look at artists impressions for T2 in the late 80s you will see a link between these two locations. But it was deleted during the "value-engineering" phase...:(

This link will help during the projects that FlyZB outlines, but will also benefit the flexibility of terminal allocation later, especially where the peaks of terminal useage are not simultaneous.

Suzeman

This extension has been planned for ages will be very surprised when it starts:bored:

I also thought that there were plans to build a terminal in the middle along 235 -247 but might be wrong!!

Rumour has it that B pier will be built in 2 halves.

Fuelboy

Suzeman, indeed that is the idea because the T1 morning peak is usually between 6 and 8 whereas the T2 peak is between 9 and 11 when most of the transatlantics arrive and depart. So of course, it could also work the other way and we'll see T2 aircraft using 'C Pier' on T1 rather than having to go remote. Although the creation of 4 new gates (216-219) in the next 2-3 years will remove the need to use the bussing gate 300 as much. I doubt the airport would spend 15million on a link without it having a use after 'B Pier' has been rebuilt and 'C Pier' remodelled but I know for a fact that this is being carefully researched at the minute. There are doubts over how messy it could get if T1 airlines are boarding off T2 stands and vice versa. It would of course create an easier journey between terminals for transfer passengers but MAG won't want to spend 15m on a new link for that reason alone. Interesting times ahead that's for sure.

Fuel Boy when the T2 extension was being talked about, there were plans to build a remote pier at stands 235 - 247 with an underground subway linking the main terminal building with this satellite terminal. Indeed if you look at a recent A to Z map of Manchester, this subway is marked even though it was never constructed. Recently, this remote pier was talked about again with the idea of low cost carriers using the satellite which would have very basic facilities similar to the satellites at STN. But this idea has yet again been shelved and a big project for T3 as a Low Cost terminal is now work in progress instead.

FlyZB

The proposed T3 works that you mention are they the
plans that had Ringway road 'swallowed' up and concreted
over upto the Airport hotel and back to the railway with
stands for low-cost operators being quick turn-around gates
without a pier? (Getting rid of the 'aeroparks' along Ringway
road - ofcourse).

I seem to remember seeing these plans posted on here a while
ago - or it could have been another site?

MM

....as was the full length taxiway for 23L/05R :ugh:

Things are still very up in the air regarding T3 and several ideas are on the table at the minute. This is the reason why I haven't really gone into any detail regarding T3 as yet. What I can tell you, is once the T1 & T2 security and retail developments have been fully completed by Spring next year, the focus will shift completely onto T3. Mickyman, that particular plan you mention is definately one option although they are favouring building a pier now in a cul-de-sac style design. It will indeed mean that the road and car parks will be constructed upon and under that particular plan, a new checkin hall will be built over the approach road and connect onto the current short stay car park. There are several other ideas being tossed around though, so once I have more detail and providing its not top secret, I shall let you all know. T3 is definately where the 'exciting' development will occur from 2010 onwards. Expect to see huge changes and major expansion of this terminal to cater purely for LCC's and nothing else. You will see minor changes in T3 this Summer. International outbound control is moving to the Mezz, where the new domestic outbound is currently located, to create one big area. The current OBC will be closed and converted into an airside seating area.

FlyZB

Thanks for that.

MM

Redevelopment of T1 ? - Dead easy!
 

Step 1.
Build a new terminal between the rail station and the present T1 Multi-storey carpark, to link with the present T2. (Complete with spectators terrace!!??):)

Step2
When this is completed, open it to a grand fanfare, whilst knocking down the old terminal 1, thus creating lots of open area for Apron in front of the new Termial.:ok:

Step3
Knock down Olympic house - situated in a ridiculous place, not only blocking development of T3 but causes no end of turbulnece affecting aircraft over the threshold of 23R when the wind is from the NW at 20+ knots!!!:\

Step4
Build a new "Olympic House" in Leek, roughly half -way between the principle assets of MAG.:D

Step5
Have a Frankfurt style automatic people mover connecting T2 -T1 -T3, it's not rocket science.:D

Then and only then will Manchester Airport have developed to how it should have been - it'll only be about 15 - 20 years too late?:ugh:

Also I reckon it's about time the local councils chipped in with some investment instead of always on the take :D

Thats exactly what i had in mind

Jan08 Traffic Stats
 

Still down as is the norm this financial year and can be expected until probably April. If Recession actually happens then it may be negative for the whole of 2008.

Total (terminal) 1318121 -0.86% :bored:
Total (inc transit) 1346745 -1.88% (mainly the PIA transatlantic reduction) :bored:
Freight 12216 +6.95% :)

As is usual at the moment Scheduled international is up +3.55% and domestic - 8.61% and charter - 4.04% are down

Sq Man-sin
 

As of today at 1430 Galileo CRS is still showing daily through winter season :confused:

Stoneybridge
Under the current allowable dual runway rules, how often would this have been used?

Answer- infrequently and only when 23L/05R is being used for all movements. This only happens during planned maintenance or during an emergency.

You are talking of an extra strip of around 100m parallel to the runway. The cost which includes land acquisition, earthworks and the river tunnel would have been very high and disproportionate to its use. It would have had an even greater environmental impact which could have made winning the public enquiry even more difficult.So it was not built.

IF and it is a big IF, the rules for closely spaced parallel runway ops changes to allow mixed mode on both runways, I guess the Airport would look at it again.

FlyZB

In fact, it was originally proposed to put the underground link in when T2 was built so that it would be there ready for the time that a remote pier was constructed in the grass island and no taxiway disruption would take place. In the end it was considered too expensive to have this investment sitting there unused for possibly many years. This turned out to be the right decision as plans for a T2 extension have chopped and changed over the years and plans for a remote pier/satellite have not materialised.

Adola 69

You forgot step 0 which is to acquire a very large sack of money to allow this to be done.:}

I believe that the shareholders ie local councils did forego their dividends a few years ago, so they could be considered to have invested money in the airport.

Suzeman

does anyone know if VS were using a A340 today to MCO?
i seen it go over just didnt look like the usual 744.

..........

no.

T1 Redevelopment.
 

.

Point taken. However during the past four years, T1 has had shed-loads of money thrown at it to accomplish
1) Two re-vamps of retail development Landside.
2) Two re-vamps of retail development Airside.
3) A new security area being completed as we speak.
4) The removal and re usage of the bus terminus outside T1 arrivals.
5) The re-vamp of the international arrivals area, to include a Tax Free shopping outlet, right in the way of folk struggling with trolleys laden with suitcases to try and reach the arrivals meeting area!! (An outlet that I have yet to see used by any travellers!??)
6) Multi-storey car park completey re-furbished surface area.
7) A complete re-roofing of ALL roof areas ( Which doesn't appear to have worked too well looking at the number of "ACME" Buckets there are when it rains)!:(

Money that could have gone very nicely towards the construction of a new "Sponsored" facility, that wouldn't have needed touching for quite a few years, unless those chaps at the ever helpfull Ministry for "Lets make Air Travel a Pain in the Arse" place anymore requirements on airports to make sure everyone is shrouded in cotton wool. :{

Still I'm sure the accountants have their sums right and I'm talking a bag of S*** e - as usual!!!???:ok:

I'm with you Adola69 on this one.
Plus if they hadn't spent shedloads on EMA, Hurn & Humberside (?) then they would have had more dosh to spend on the core business.

More cobbled together "add ons" means more up & down level changes requiring even more lifts & escalators & walkways. Something that MA seem completely unable to maintain to a satisfactory serviceable level.

I suppose a rooftop swimming pool (ala Singapore) isn't on the cards:)

TK
 

TK now showing as going to 10 a week between July and September.

Also BE adding extra flight to IOM

Viscount

I can only find 9x weekly:

Mon - 321 x1
Tue - 738 x1
Wed - 321 x1 738 x1
Thu - 321 x1
Fri - 738 x1
Sat - 321 x1
Sun - 321 x1 738 x1

Where is the 10th weekly?

Cheers.

TK
 

Monday from September

Viscount

Mum/Dad going away to Tenerife from MAN next Sunday (17th) .... depart 0945 on the TCX762K (I think) to TFS. Can anyone suggest a reasonable time to arrive at T1? I said no later than 0700 but thought I would ask the experts :} Are Sunday mornings generally busy? Bearing in mind it is half term week (for us up here anyway!) :)

Saturday will be absolute manic at MAN, Sunday will be little better.

You may not know but the Cumbrian half-term is a week earlier so the airport will be dealing with both full inbound traffic and outbound.

Personally, I think the timing is about right. There will be alot of TCX/MYT flights on the Sunday along with FCA/TOM, MON, XL etc. plus normal traffic shipping thousands of people out to the Canaries along with ski resorts, not to mention long haul!

I can't remember whether TCX/MYT operate free check-in desk policies but if this is the case it may be better to get there a little earlier as check-in may take longer - there will be alot of skis!:ok:

Hope this helps!:ok:

P.S. Would put money on it being Boeing 752 G-JMCE!:}

Cheers yes that helps :)

Yes a lot of the country seems to have half term next week, whereas ours is the week after (in Stockton).

Do TCX check in downstairs now with MYT (MYT were down there last time we used them out of MAN anyway!) :confused: If not where do they check in? Also I note car park buses still drop off at train station for T1/2 but not 3 where they drop off at the terminal?! Whats the point in that? :ugh:

MYT is upstairs now. Currently round the back where SAS checkin. TCX are in their usual spot from desk 1 onwards. As of 1st March both TCX and MYT will checkin from desks 1 to 25, I think Swiss and a few others are going back behind MON/ZB checkin. As of 1st April, MYT/TCX will of course be one airline and will use most of the desks along that 1st bank, with just LH right at the end.

mmeteeside, I worked in T1 last Sunday morning and it was very busy at security up until around 6 and then quiet up until half 8 before it got busy again. I suggest you try and get through security between half 7 and 8, that should be the best time. Of course with it being half term, there will be extra charter flights so that could alter things slightly.

RE car park buses, all MAG car park buses (ie - Long Stay, Premier Park, Shuttle Park) pick up/drop off outside every terminal and have been doing for months now. Some private car parking companies may still be using the station but as far as I know, most are using the stops outside all 3 terminals.

As a considerable number of holiday passengers that use Manchester Airport reside in Lancashire, it may be of interest that the majority of schools in the county have a new holiday period for this year only.
Due to Easter falling in March, schools will be closed for Easter on Good Friday and Easter Monday only. A new 'Spring Holiday' period replaces the tradional Easter holiday and schools will close on Friday 4th April until Monday 21st April.
May help to swell the April passenger numbers.

C0
 

The C0 flights have been retimed. Some of the timings are very odd you will need to check on their Website.

Also they will be codesharing on some of the flights with their parent LOT

Viscount

mmeteesside just so you are aware next week the approach roads to t1 and t3 are closed have put the notice below for you.....

T1 & T3 Approach Road Closure

Outwood Lane will be closed from 22:00 on Friday 15 February until the early hours of Monday 3 March.
Outwood Lane is the main road to Terminals 1 and 3 and passes over the ends of the station platforms. To accommodate the extra platform, Network Rail needs to dig across under the road and slide a new supporting bridge into place – the equivalent weight of ten jumbo jets. To do that, the road will be closed and a well signed diversion will be put in place for anyone travelling by car to Terminals 1 or 3 while the roadworks are taking place
Road traffic will continue to be directed off the M56 at junction 5 but Terminal 1 traffic will be diverted via Terminal 2 past the Station and Terminal 3 traffic will be routed up Ringway Road West and onto Ringway Road past Premier Park and the Airport Hotel.
Bob Longworth, Manchester Airport’s Capacity Planning Manager explained: “It is impossible to predict how much longer road users should allow but we don’t expect major disruption. However, the morning and evening peak periods are always busy so we are advising people to leave a little extra time for the trip.
“Because the majority of people who work at the airport park their cars in Staff West only a minority are likely to be affected by the closure of Outwood Lane.”
Once completed, a third rail platform at the Station will mean significant improvements for passengers starting or ending their journey by rail. As well as more capacity for future services, the third platform will also mean greater reliability and punctuality for trains calling at the airport as well as relieving rail congestion around the Piccadilly station area.
Commenting on the work, Gary Openshaw, Network Rail’s Area General Manager said it was vital to meet future demand for travel to the airport: “At the moment there are only two platforms at the airport and with over 300 trains a day calling there, we often have to have a couple of trains in the same platform at any one time.
Rail passengers will be largely unaffected by the work except for the weekend of 16 and 17 February when trains between Manchester Piccadilly and the airport will be replaced by coaches. Passengers should check their travel plans either by calling their train operator, by calling national Rail Enquiries on 08457 48 49 50 or by logging on to www.nationalrail.co.uk
The £15 million project is being jointly funded by Network Rail, Greater Manchester Passenger Transport Executive and The Northern Way, and Manchester Airport is leasing the land needed for the extra platform to Network Rail. Train services are provided by TransPennine Express and Northern.

SV
 

It looks like SV may be going to one a week from summer. Friday only according to OAG however SV website still shows both days

SQ reduction for winter also now showing on their timetable.

Viscount

hi. what time does the viewing park open in the morning please?
thanks for your help.

Take a look at

www.tasmanchester.co.uk

this site has all you need to know about Manchester.

yeah had a look at that but was just wanting to check the info on there was accurate. 8.30 then?

If you get there too early try the mound on the south side, its a great place to watch the early morning departures, runway 2 shut till end of feb though.

That was my original plan to try the southern side, but as you say not much point at the moment. Thanks for your help.

How about the arrivals then, if you drive past the 23R landing lights and turn right onto Styal road, towards Wilmslow, then right onto Moss Lane, you will come to a double bend, park on the dirt lay by and then walk through the metal gates towards the runway, at the perimeter fence there are some new earth mounds, these overlooks the 23R threshold, great for arrivals and departures in the morning light. The AVP is very poor for photography at this time of year, but if you just want to watch its great.

What, two days and no posts? No in-fighting? No, I know more than you posts?

Come on Manchester boys, get to it.

PS. Are Spotty M starting 7 new routes this summer?

Looks like some good developments listed above. I like the idea of arrivals on the top of Pier C, feeding into those corridors over the DF shop.

Linking Pier C and East Pier of T2 is also logical, and will be a lot easier to manage than say Pier B Dom/Int arrivals, or carousel 7. A couple of interlocked doors should do it.

Nice to see there's plenty of healthy scepticism and closed minds above too.

I do wonder why increased passenger numbers is automatically assumed to be an improvement? I wonder why MAPLC can't focus on just level pax numbers and spend the money on customer service instead, rather than ramming more through.

And all that step 1 -5 guff above in #1897. Just how quickly do you think step 2, demolishing T1 and making the apron good, will actually take? I reckon 12-18 months, during which time neither T1 nor its replacement will be usable. So where will all the traffic go during that time? It's not economic to extend T2 or T3 to cope short-term, and if MAPLC do extend them, they'll do the job permanently, won't they? Think it through, man (or woman).

Spotty M being who exactly?

Development
 

Over the last few years if not longer all development has taken place within the Terminals. Clearly some of this was necessary. What is not clear is what if any development is to be started soon airside to the airfield, apron, gates or whatever . There seems to be plenty suggested but nothing concrete .

What is the position on the new Tower

When will work start on an extension to T2 west pier to put gates to stands 215-219. It was suggested above that this has been given the go ahead (post 1888) but later (post 1892) suggests that it could be 2 or 3 years away.

There were suggestions a while back for some new stands for T3 but this now seems to have been shelved in another rethink about what to do with T3 or how to develop T3.

If EZY or FR are to expand at MAN this expansion will need to be catered for somewhere. At the moment there seems to be limited scope for this because of the needs of the LCC's mentioned in previous posts.

I know that at present growth is flat or negative. But if MAN is to grow then something needs to be done soon to cater for this growth or at least to stop the decline because too many PAX are now finding easier if not cheaper to go elsewhere because of facilities on offer not that far away which if not cheaper are now seemingly offering less hassel.

Viscount

I don't understand all these suggestions about demolishing Terminal 1 and starting again.

How in all holy hell would you have envisaged this happening? Demolishing Terminal 1 and starting again on the site would take years.

a) First you'd need a new control tower and airline and airport authority offices, and a relocation of the NATS Manchester Area Control Centre - because the tower block is part of the terminal - if the terminal comes down, the tower has to come down.

b) The T1 multistorey car park sits on top of the terminal - that would have to come down as well, so you'd need another one of those first as well.

c) T1 is attached, at the hip (so to speak), to T3. So you'd end up with a mess in that terminal as well.

MAG is doing the best it can with what it has, and is doing what it can, realistically.