Airlines, Airports & Routes Topics about airports, routes and airline business.

Stobart Air-2

Old 7th Jul 2020, 15:23
  #581 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Ballymena
Posts: 1,358
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
So if the backers of Bhd provide support to Stobart, what will the other operators and Bhd think?
True Blue is offline  
Old 7th Jul 2020, 15:44
  #582 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Belfast
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by True Blue View Post
So if the backers of Bhd provide support to Stobart, what will the other operators and Bhd think?
BFS fan club cage rattled alert!!!
Probably not much difference to putting up money to start a route
One year left of 3 year deal and established routes for new buyer of airline.
Helps sell the airline and also safety net should EIR not keep the regional contract
Could probably put this in a better way but home brew is ready today for the weekend
Startledgrapefruit is offline  
Old 7th Jul 2020, 16:15
  #583 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Ballymena
Posts: 1,358
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
No Bfs fan club rattled here. I am just curious how some of the members of the Bhd fan club believe that an airline that was saved from bankruptcy very recently, as per the details in post No 581, quoting notes from a crisis meeting 2 weeks ago and that the airline was only saved to prevent the whole group going under, has the funds to start a bunch of new routes at Bhd?
True Blue is offline  
Old 7th Jul 2020, 16:22
  #584 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 70
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Does anyone have any informed indication on the level of investment that would be required for an airline to start new routes and open a base at Belfast City?

Will be interesting to see what new routes Brain Ambrose hinted would be announced within two weeks.
Sharklet7 is offline  
Old 7th Jul 2020, 17:03
  #585 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Northumberland
Posts: 7,125
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
Still got ATR's ex BE? Crew furloughed? Using EI for sales/bookings? If they have excess capacity would the start up costs be much more than continuing to do nothing?
SWBKCB is online now  
Old 7th Jul 2020, 19:15
  #586 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: London
Posts: 229
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by SWBKCB View Post
Still got ATR's ex BE? Crew furloughed? Using EI for sales/bookings? If they have excess capacity would the start up costs be much more than continuing to do nothing?
The ATRs were Stobart metal
Crew Also but would need boring if opening a base in BHD canít see the ex-SEN crew or IOM crew relocate to BHD
and Iím pretty sure EI said they donít want anything with Stobart outside of DUB/Ireland
flyerguy is offline  
Old 7th Jul 2020, 23:32
  #587 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 2,743
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
In defense of Stobart, the facts are that their Aer Lingus Regional business has been successful and noted as the better piece of Stobart Group's portfolio in recent times. Airlines mostly everywhere have been immeasurably impacted by the pandemic and only a few are financially strong enough to weather this storm, and others get bail outs eg Lufthansa. The business will come back, timelines are unclear. So whether Stobart for a recent bailout of not is a mute point.

Airports investing in airlines is not customary, however if the owner of BHD did invest on commercial terms that's another matter.

I don't believe that the above investment scenario is on the cards. The fundamental issue here is about the brand and distribution. The EI contract has very limited time left, and its been publicly stated that EI will pursue all avenues in terms of the right airline for the franchise. What at this juncture is in it for Aer Lingus? Unless BHD has given concessions to EI on operational costs? These would apply to BA, under the IAG procurement umbrella. There is limited strategic value for EI in expanding the EI Regional brand at BHD. They add value feeding passengers into the TA network.

As a consequence Stobart will need to build a new brand for BHD. This doesn't sound promising to me. However, as a counter balance, encouraging to see BHD regaining some lost services via Loganair, Eastern and BA.


​​


EI-BUD is offline  
Old 8th Jul 2020, 07:20
  #588 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Antrim
Posts: 1,553
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Just worth pointing out EIR do routes from SNN and ORK which don't feed into DUB, in fact ORK has several routes to UK cities that have been mentioned as possible from BHD - MAN, BHX, EDI etc.
mart901 is offline  
Old 8th Jul 2020, 07:29
  #589 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 2,743
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by mart901 View Post
Just worth pointing out EIR do routes from SNN and ORK which don't feed into DUB, in fact ORK has several routes to UK cities that have been mentioned as possible from BHD - MAN, BHX, EDI etc.
Of course they do Mart901, but in these instances they don't have the sort of competition that Belfast would have from easyJet etc. They are long established under the EI brand. Whereas 'if' the suggested BHD flights took off under the EIR brand, they may not be long lived in that guise if Stobart were not successful in maintaining the franchise.
EI-BUD is offline  
Old 8th Jul 2020, 07:51
  #590 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Belfast
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by EI-BUD View Post
Of course they do Mart901, but in these instances they don't have the sort of competition that Belfast would have from easyJet etc. They are long established under the EI brand. Whereas 'if' the suggested BHD flights took off under the EIR brand, they may not be long lived in that guise if Stobart were not successful in maintaining the franchise.
Jetmagic flew to Cork for a bit and had good loads. Just the wrong type of aircraft, but unknown name.
So it's possible if Regional do it for a bit then they become Air Arran (not Aer Arran) or FlyUThere name may not matter.
Startledgrapefruit is offline  
Old 8th Jul 2020, 08:37
  #591 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: UK
Age: 74
Posts: 2,582
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Stobart don't have a booking system and I simply cannot seem them establishing one now. Since the Aer Arann days they have operated under either the EI or BE reservations system and EI were not willing for them to use their branding for the SEN European routes, as had been originally hoped, so BE stepped in. The chances of a Stobart route network based at IOM and/or BHD looks very slim to me.
Expressflight is offline  
Old 8th Jul 2020, 09:04
  #592 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Belfast
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
So you could end up with a Manx2 situation but better regulation. That would work !
Startledgrapefruit is offline  
Old 8th Jul 2020, 09:49
  #593 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: London
Posts: 355
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Of course it is entirely logical that Aer lingus would be reluctant to have the brand used in Southend. Whatís in it for Aer lingus. However .... Aer lingus have an established operation at Belfast city already and it would make commercial sense to expand that presence.

I donít think any delay is coming from Aer lingus fo be honest
cumbrianboy is offline  
Old 8th Jul 2020, 11:02
  #594 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Antrim
Posts: 1,553
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by EI-BUD View Post
Of course they do Mart901, but in these instances they don't have the sort of competition that Belfast would have from easyJet etc. They are long established under the EI brand. Whereas 'if' the suggested BHD flights took off under the EIR brand, they may not be long lived in that guise if Stobart were not successful in maintaining the franchise.
The argument about competition is valid especially given the situation we are in now and the effect on demand. However BE were running 7x daily on similar sized aircraft on MAN/BHX up against U2. If you look at what LM are doing with GLA for instance - starting from just 2x daily, less than half the previous frequency with BE and smaller a/c, I seriously doubt these routes are totally unviable which supported high volumes at often higher fares than from BFS.
Also the EI brand is very well established here not only from BFS+BHD but also DUB where swathes of people drive to to catch flights from Northern Ireland.
mart901 is offline  
Old 23rd Jul 2020, 18:27
  #595 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Aalborg
Posts: 131
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Pilot and CC jobs for Belfast are now advertised on their website.
Jamie2009 is offline  
Old 24th Jul 2020, 14:31
  #596 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 194
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
For Winter 2020 the ATR Planes based at airports need to be?

1x CFN, 2x ORK, 1x KIR, 5x DUB, 5x BHD
that is 14 ATR Planes I think will need EI-GPN back so to have 15 ATRs
allan1987 is offline  
Old 24th Jul 2020, 22:38
  #597 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: uk
Posts: 71
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by allan1987 View Post
For Winter 2020 the ATR Planes based at airports need to be?

1x CFN, 2x ORK, 1x KIR, 5x DUB, 5x BHD
that is 14 ATR Planes I think will need EI-GPN back so to have 15 ATRs
Do Stobart still have 2 Embraer E190 in the fleet, are they planning on using them are any of the Aer Lingus routes
rhutch28 is offline  
Old 25th Jul 2020, 09:07
  #598 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Leeds, UK & Cork, Ireland
Posts: 1,074
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by rhutch28 View Post
Do Stobart still have 2 Embraer E190 in the fleet, are they planning on using them are any of the Aer Lingus routes
They are still listed as being in the fleet on the various websites that track these things. AFAIK jets are specifically excluded from the Regional franchise. That might be limited to legacy EI bases like ORK, DUB and SNN. These things are up for negotiation, as the ASL 757s and CityJet ARJS show. I donít imagine the EI pilot union would be too happy with Stobart operating E190s on BHD-LGW, but might tolerate LCY as itís not A320 capable?
brian_dromey is offline  
Old 25th Jul 2020, 10:26
  #599 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 2,743
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by brian_dromey View Post
They are still listed as being in the fleet on the various websites that track these things. AFAIK jets are specifically excluded from the Regional franchise. That might be limited to legacy EI bases like ORK, DUB and SNN. These things are up for negotiation, as the ASL 757s and CityJet ARJS show. I donít imagine the EI pilot union would be too happy with Stobart operating E190s on BHD-LGW, but might tolerate LCY as itís not A320 capable?
Both Stobart Embraers are currently in Farranfore and will be returned to the lessors.
EI-BUD is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2020, 18:39
  #600 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Hither and Thither
Posts: 575
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
New Route Belfast to East Midlands: Leicester Mercury
Red Four is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information

Copyright © 2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.