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Thomas Cook-2

Old 20th Sep 2019, 12:12
  #761 (permalink)  
 
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Plane.Silly, you can’t really use the Monarch repatriation cost and use these as a baseline for Thomas Cook.

The Monarch passengers were all concentrated in Europe were the Thomas Cook passengers are worldwide. I think that the difference in cost will be to get the longhaul passengers back. Dedicated longhaul flights will he a lot more expensive then a return flight to Faro.

Having said that, I think that £600m would be to much. On the other hand to wet lease the Hi Fly A380 won’t be cheap either.
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 12:15
  #762 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by CEJM View Post
Plane.Silly, you canít really use the Monarch repatriation cost and use these as a baseline for Thomas Cook.

The Monarch passengers were all concentrated in Europe were the Thomas Cook passengers are worldwide. I think that the difference in cost will be to get the longhaul passengers back. Dedicated longhaul flights will he a lot more expensive then a return flight to Faro.

Having said that, I think that £600m would be to much. On the other hand to wet lease the Hi Fly A380 wonít be cheap either.
Thats a fair point. at least my suggestion was a good starting block, and relevent to the majority of the TCX programme.
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 12:32
  #763 (permalink)  
 
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Does ATOL only protect the UK operations of the Group? Is is possible to have ATOL protection if the customers are German/Scandinavian?
AFAIK itís illegal to sell package holidays without ATOL, but could Thomas Cook get away with selling packages via their German/Scandinavian operations for ex UK departures? I suppose what Iím asking is if itís possible for parts of the group to survive, or if one part will drag the rest with it?
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 12:47
  #764 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by brian_dromey View Post
Does ATOL only protect the UK operations of the Group? Is is possible to have ATOL protection if the customers are German/Scandinavian?
AFAIK itís illegal to sell package holidays without ATOL, but could Thomas Cook get away with selling packages via their German/Scandinavian operations for ex UK departures? I suppose what Iím asking is if itís possible for parts of the group to survive, or if one part will drag the rest with it?



Sadly i think once the inevitable happens the vortex will drag everything else with it
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 13:01
  #765 (permalink)  
 
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You're not allowed to sell 'packages' without an ATOL to UK consumers. It doesn't matter if the operation is based abroad or not.
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 13:20
  #766 (permalink)  
 
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Rumours this side of the North Sea has it, that Thomas Cook are in the midst of attempting a fire sale to raise the 200M they need. Some say they've put TCNE (Thomas Cook Northern Europe) up for sale which, being the sole consistently profit making arm of TCX, would be somewhat akin to slaying the golden goose.

The troubles TC are facing in the UK are much more severe than in the Nordics, and it does stand to reason that TCNE may be the only long-term viable part of TC. Sure, you can pour all the money you want into the UK, but that doesn't change the fact Brexit is looming, the pound is falling, UK tourists are holding back going abroad, nor that the competition from LCC carriers is by far the toughest in the UK.

Perhaps it's simply a question of the UK consumer having had their say: They prefer utilising booking engines to construct their own flight/hotel combination, they prefer easy and Ryan getting them to warm and sandy places, and they prefer being outside the EU. Thus, putting TCUK on life-support will only delay the inevitable.

TCNE, on the other hand, is a viable and profitable business which is well worth saving.
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 13:21
  #767 (permalink)  
 
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Sadly I was around for the Monarch near collapse in 2016, and their eventual collapse in 2017. As said previously, we all got emails throughout the day saying everything was normal until the wheels lifted off the ground of the last flight and the email came that Monarch was no more.

Unfortunately Iím in the same boat with TCX. Fingers crossed for us all.
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 13:37
  #768 (permalink)  
 
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Good luck 750XL. Quite a few of our ex Monarch colleagues are in the same boat as you. I really hope it works out for everybody at TC. Just hoping that it doesn’t become a Monarch Mk2 with 2019 being what 2017 was for Monarch.
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 13:48
  #769 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by 750XL View Post
Sadly I was around for the Monarch near collapse in 2016, and their eventual collapse in 2017. As said previously, we all got emails throughout the day saying everything was normal until the wheels lifted off the ground of the last flight and the email came that Monarch was no more.

Unfortunately I’m in the same boat with TCX. Fingers crossed for us all.
Good ole Swaffers kept stringing us along to the last minute , Bless him .

Good luck.

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Old 20th Sep 2019, 15:26
  #770 (permalink)  
 
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The sad fact is the last line of this letter to the Stock Exchange this morning..... Shareholders' value will be significantly diluted. If I was a shareholder, I'd be opposing that.
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 15:40
  #771 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by JonnyH View Post


Possible. However, the government are the majority shareholder in RBS, who are in turn the majority lender, along with Lloyds for TCX. Clearly Iím not as knowledgeable as some regarding this but surely the government would have significant influence with RBS who seem to be one of the main issues within this saga.
Didnít realise RBS were the lender involved. So yes the Government will want TC shut down this weekend or early next week to drown out the Labour conference.
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 15:45
  #772 (permalink)  
 
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What happens with the Smartlynx aircraft leased to TCX? Could they fly to destinations as planned but under their own call-sign in order to repatriate pax ?
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 15:46
  #773 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by CEJM View Post
Pholling, sorry to pick on you. Nothing personal, I promise!

Even if TC would know at this very minute that they will no be operating on the 1st of October. They will still continue the mantra of business as normal. As mentioned previously, Monarch was sending out optimistic messages until we got the email informing us that the company was placed in administration. Even though 24 hours earlier the price of each flight was increased by £100 to discourage the public from booking flights. When I saw this price increase it was pretty clear that the company was going under, yet we still got the business as normal emails. The company would not have increased the prices if they thought that 5ere was a remote chance we would still be flying 25 hours later.
Not taking it personal at all. I was giving TC more of a benefit of the doubt on when they would 'throw the towel in'. The main reason is that it is illegal to knowingly sell ATOL protected holidays that cannot be honoured. Not saying that there is much means of enforcing this either. That being said, TC are still offering some pretty good deals on ATOL protected holidays. If you are willing to take a punt that the holiday will be cancelled and you will get your money back, or that you might have to be repatriated whilst on holiday they may be worth it. Especially for those in the later Oct, Nov timeframe.
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 15:48
  #774 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by dc9-32 View Post
What happens with the Smartlynx aircraft leased to TCX? Could they fly to destinations as planned but under their own call-sign in order to repatriate pax ?
Are they wet leased? If so, then yes the CAA could contract them to perform repatriation flights. If they are damp leased then there would be a crewing issue.
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 15:50
  #775 (permalink)  
 
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Damp lease I believe. Smartlynx FD and TCX cabin.
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 15:51
  #776 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by pholling View Post
Are they wet leased? If so, then yes the CAA could contract them to perform repatriation flights. If they are damp leased then there would be a crewing issue.
Does anyone know if its Smartlynx flight deck and TCX cabin crew?
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 15:52
  #777 (permalink)  
 
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Hi Guys

i have friends due to return from US in the next few days on TCX, if they go under do the CAA have to rebook their flights for them? they are only on a flight-only deal

thanks
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 15:53
  #778 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by USERNAME_ View Post
As a TCX employee who went through this the last 2 years in a row with Monarch and Primera, I only wish I could share the same blind optimism as DocQ. Really do hope things can be sorted, but unfortunately not holding my breath
Thats genuinely upsetting, are there many others in the same boat? I find it amazing that TCX crews are still walking about with their heads held high and professional as ever. My thoughts are with you and your colleagues, hereís hoping everything works out
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 15:56
  #779 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by diffident View Post

The sad fact is the last line of this letter to the Stock Exchange this morning..... Shareholders' value will be significantly diluted. If I was a shareholder, I'd be opposing that.
Welcome to the wonderful world of insolvency. The sad fact is that as a shareholder you are always at the high end of the risk scale. At least only your equity is exposed. In this case either your agree to the CVA (actually in many cases you have no say) and hope that you get a penny on the pound, or the company goes into administration and likely liquidation, in which case the shareholders will get exactly 0, as the assets are less than the debts. Keep in mind that under insolvency law administrators have to basically ignore shareholders and workers, with a few exceptions their only duty is to creditors.
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Old 20th Sep 2019, 15:58
  #780 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tomahawk98 View Post
Does anyone know if its Smartlynx flight deck and TCX cabin crew?
Yes, Avion are also the same.
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