Luton-9
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Not sure of the total number of de-icing rigs available at Luton but I spotted just 3 excluding the FBO’s own equipment. 2 were on the south stands where the aircraft came to the de-icer plus I saw 1 rig floating around the aprons but as Luton is an airport with many aprons I might have missed another one or two.
Not only was there an issue with the length of time it was taking to de-ice each aircraft but there was also an issue with ground crews disappearing just at the wrong time as they seemed thin on the ground to do push backs.
I raised the issue of de-icing years ago with airport management when I could see what was going to happen before the winter frosts came and again after my prediction came true. At that time, and I am talking about maybe 20 years ago when de-icing was done by Reed Aviation, I was told it has nothing to do with the airport so they were not interested. It might be different now due to stand blocking.
Not only was there an issue with the length of time it was taking to de-ice each aircraft but there was also an issue with ground crews disappearing just at the wrong time as they seemed thin on the ground to do push backs.
I raised the issue of de-icing years ago with airport management when I could see what was going to happen before the winter frosts came and again after my prediction came true. At that time, and I am talking about maybe 20 years ago when de-icing was done by Reed Aviation, I was told it has nothing to do with the airport so they were not interested. It might be different now due to stand blocking.
Last edited by LTNman; 28th Dec 2017 at 05:56.
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Are the de-icing rigs the responsibility of the airport or the handling companies? A photo I have seen in a national newspaper shows IDS on the side of one de-icing rig. I would assume this stands for Integrated Deicing Services a Canadian company. Also it seems Stansted seems to be getting in the neck from the UK TV stations this morning unfortunately regarding so-called 'stranded' passengers.
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For a prompt de-icing, you really need a pair of de-icing rigs working a single aircraft. Often the case at those airports where icing is prevalent.
Airport took control of handling equipment a few years ago, with handling agent staff now using a common set of equipment on each stand. Seems to have worked well.
De-icing will be slightly more specialised with the rigs only available for aircraft washing in the Summer months and the training of suitable staff more critical.
I think a minimum of 5 rigs would be necessary for an efficient operation. One being replenished while the other 4 are working.
Airport took control of handling equipment a few years ago, with handling agent staff now using a common set of equipment on each stand. Seems to have worked well.
De-icing will be slightly more specialised with the rigs only available for aircraft washing in the Summer months and the training of suitable staff more critical.
I think a minimum of 5 rigs would be necessary for an efficient operation. One being replenished while the other 4 are working.
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From a ground handerlers perspective
On that morning IDS had 5 De Iceing rigs, 4 of them by contract were alocated to easyJet while the other one was alocated to Wizz. This is what the airlines pay for so this is what they get. If they continue to cut costs from the ground services I’m afraid this will all continue.
The cost cutting even refects the fluid, IDS use Type 1 while the more expensive swissport uses Type 2, Type 1 has a much lower holdover time. Sometimes as low as 10 mins in the snow and with a congested ramp this isn’t good enough for Luton.
With the pushbacks it’s hard to keep crews on aircraft for a long period of time with the hope of pushing back. ATC didn’t communicate with the ground handerlers at all that morning so we had to rely on air crews updating us.
On that morning IDS had 5 De Iceing rigs, 4 of them by contract were alocated to easyJet while the other one was alocated to Wizz. This is what the airlines pay for so this is what they get. If they continue to cut costs from the ground services I’m afraid this will all continue.
The cost cutting even refects the fluid, IDS use Type 1 while the more expensive swissport uses Type 2, Type 1 has a much lower holdover time. Sometimes as low as 10 mins in the snow and with a congested ramp this isn’t good enough for Luton.
With the pushbacks it’s hard to keep crews on aircraft for a long period of time with the hope of pushing back. ATC didn’t communicate with the ground handerlers at all that morning so we had to rely on air crews updating us.
It sounds like some LTN heads need knocking together 
EZY LGW was running deicing conferences through the Summer, which included all the participants who would be involved this Winter i.e. pilots, ATC, Ground Ops & the decing contractor. Even dummy-run deicing days in the balmy late Summer heat were included.
EZY LGW was running deicing conferences through the Summer, which included all the participants who would be involved this Winter i.e. pilots, ATC, Ground Ops & the decing contractor. Even dummy-run deicing days in the balmy late Summer heat were included.
Last edited by Nightstop; 28th Dec 2017 at 10:54. Reason: Spelling
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De-icing has been hit and miss at LTN for ages....A combination of at least three different companies involved, certain staff who probably haven't dealt with a serious snow/ice event before and poor co-ordination.
The main reason the TUI departure to ACE got away on Dec 10th, was because TUI are the only airline customer using the de-icing rig of Airline Services. So, efficient de-icing was carried out with an eye on the planned runway re-opening time after snow clearance. If this hadn't happened, the crew would have gone out of hours!
The main reason the TUI departure to ACE got away on Dec 10th, was because TUI are the only airline customer using the de-icing rig of Airline Services. So, efficient de-icing was carried out with an eye on the planned runway re-opening time after snow clearance. If this hadn't happened, the crew would have gone out of hours!
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Wizz S18
The seven based Scheduled a/c are now loaded in the booking system as follows. ( w/c 2nd July) for the first wave departures
a/c 1. Kaunas Daily 06.00
a/c 2. Athens Daily 06.00
a/c 3 Larnaca Daily 06.25
a/c 4 Suceava Daily 06.50
a/c 5 Bourgas Daily 07.20
a/c 6. Reykjavik 1,3,5,7 07.10
Prishtina 2,4,6. 07.10
a/c7. Bari 1,3,5,7. 06.30
Tirana. 2,4,6. 06.00
a/c 1. Kaunas Daily 06.00
a/c 2. Athens Daily 06.00
a/c 3 Larnaca Daily 06.25
a/c 4 Suceava Daily 06.50
a/c 5 Bourgas Daily 07.20
a/c 6. Reykjavik 1,3,5,7 07.10
Prishtina 2,4,6. 07.10
a/c7. Bari 1,3,5,7. 06.30
Tirana. 2,4,6. 06.00
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Wizz S18
Im surprised Wizz hasn't decided to use some of their 5.30-6am slots they have used previous summers for those later departures after 7am, when previously night stopping at the airport...
For Wizz a 7.20am departure is pretty late for them, as they get nearly all their fleet in the air at other bases before 6.30am local times, which would be, 5.30am UK time.
Many Wizz flights will be arriving from Eastern Europe into Luton, before the first departure of the 7.20am flight.
For Wizz a 7.20am departure is pretty late for them, as they get nearly all their fleet in the air at other bases before 6.30am local times, which would be, 5.30am UK time.
Many Wizz flights will be arriving from Eastern Europe into Luton, before the first departure of the 7.20am flight.
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gilesdavies
The LTN aircraft seem to be used for 2 daily returns so there is little point in starting extremely early.
Unless I am missing something, there still seem to be a few empty blocks that need to be filled.
There are also a few continued oddities: SOF is 1 daily on Tuesday and 3 daily every other day.
The LTN aircraft seem to be used for 2 daily returns so there is little point in starting extremely early.
Unless I am missing something, there still seem to be a few empty blocks that need to be filled.
There are also a few continued oddities: SOF is 1 daily on Tuesday and 3 daily every other day.
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With the pushbacks it’s hard to keep crews on aircraft for a long period of time with the hope of pushing back. ATC didn’t communicate with the ground handerlers at all that morning so we had to rely on air crews updating us.
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Does anyone know what the TUI fleet mix will be at Luton for S18
now that it’s a 2 aircraft operation?
Also, will both aircraft operate a minimum of 2 flights each day from Luton?
now that it’s a 2 aircraft operation?
Also, will both aircraft operate a minimum of 2 flights each day from Luton?
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Wizz S18
Giles
There will still be 13 arrivals on most days in the first wave before 08.30.
Of these only three will arrive before the 07.20 departure, these being
RIX , VNO and CLJ all due at 07.05.
It appears it was the overnight stands that were more important to Wizz.
Slots seem to be more readily available hence no reason to leave before 06.00.
Re the utilisation not sure what the shortest sector is now but Wizz are obviously not worried that they are not getting three rotations per a/c per day
There will still be 13 arrivals on most days in the first wave before 08.30.
Of these only three will arrive before the 07.20 departure, these being
RIX , VNO and CLJ all due at 07.05.
It appears it was the overnight stands that were more important to Wizz.
Slots seem to be more readily available hence no reason to leave before 06.00.
Re the utilisation not sure what the shortest sector is now but Wizz are obviously not worried that they are not getting three rotations per a/c per day
Does anyone know what the TUI fleet mix will be at Luton for S18
now that it’s a 2 aircraft operation?
1 x 757 & 1 x 737-8
Also, will both aircraft operate a minimum of 2 flights each day from Luton?
The 757 won't..."A" check maintenance slots are part of the program......
now that it’s a 2 aircraft operation?
1 x 757 & 1 x 737-8
Also, will both aircraft operate a minimum of 2 flights each day from Luton?
The 757 won't..."A" check maintenance slots are part of the program......
Tuzla
Doesn't seem to have been mentioned on here but Wizzair's summer seasonal route from Luton to Tuzla in Bosnia will not be returning in 2018. Not hugely surprised as fares on LTN-TZL seemed rather cheap
Apart from the small countries which do not have commercial passenger flights (Andorra, Monaco, San Marino and Vatican) Bosnia will be the only country in Europe without direct flights to London
Apart from the small countries which do not have commercial passenger flights (Andorra, Monaco, San Marino and Vatican) Bosnia will be the only country in Europe without direct flights to London
Last edited by davidjohnson6; 30th Dec 2017 at 13:34.
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TUI
All TUI flights for summer 18.(August 18)
AM for morning flight
PM for afternoon/evening flight
N for flight after 9PM
Monday
Gran Canaria - AM
Madeira - AM
Dalaman - PM
Ibiza - PM
Tuesday
Palma - AM
Reus - AM
Kefalonia - PM
Zante - PM
Palma - N
Wednesday
Paphos - AM
Menorca - AM
Rhodes - PM
Thursday
Faro - AM
Malaga - AM
Larnaca - PM
Lanzarote - PM
Friday
Skiathos - AM
Corfu - AM
Tenerife - PM
Naples - PM
Saturday
Menorca - AM
Ibiza - AM
Fuerteventura - PM
Rhodes - PM
Sunday
Malaga - AM
Faro - AM
Lanzarote - PM
Paphos - PM
In addition we also have the following flights not using LTN aircraft:
Tuesday - Tenerife
Friday - Palma
Saturday - Palma
Sunday - Palma
Only gap in the schedule is Wednesday evening after Paphos. This looks like only time for checks.
AM for morning flight
PM for afternoon/evening flight
N for flight after 9PM
Monday
Gran Canaria - AM
Madeira - AM
Dalaman - PM
Ibiza - PM
Tuesday
Palma - AM
Reus - AM
Kefalonia - PM
Zante - PM
Palma - N
Wednesday
Paphos - AM
Menorca - AM
Rhodes - PM
Thursday
Faro - AM
Malaga - AM
Larnaca - PM
Lanzarote - PM
Friday
Skiathos - AM
Corfu - AM
Tenerife - PM
Naples - PM
Saturday
Menorca - AM
Ibiza - AM
Fuerteventura - PM
Rhodes - PM
Sunday
Malaga - AM
Faro - AM
Lanzarote - PM
Paphos - PM
In addition we also have the following flights not using LTN aircraft:
Tuesday - Tenerife
Friday - Palma
Saturday - Palma
Sunday - Palma
Only gap in the schedule is Wednesday evening after Paphos. This looks like only time for checks.