DONCASTER SHEFFIELD
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Brighton uk
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Don't be to sure about that when it comes to Flybe look what happened to at Bournemouth
Loads were just beginning to pick up and head in the right direction , yields and prices were certainly no different than the fares at Cardiff and Doncaster that are being charged at the moment so never ever assume when it comes to them ( Ok they did have an agenda with Southampton but Bournemouth paid the price )
Loads were just beginning to pick up and head in the right direction , yields and prices were certainly no different than the fares at Cardiff and Doncaster that are being charged at the moment so never ever assume when it comes to them ( Ok they did have an agenda with Southampton but Bournemouth paid the price )
Join Date: Mar 2015
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I think we can doom monger now! At least until they put the correct figures up...
https://www.caa.co.uk/uploadedFiles/...Statistics.pdf
https://www.caa.co.uk/uploadedFiles/...Statistics.pdf
Join Date: May 2007
Location: LEEDS
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Don't call distance catchment population a "red herring" as it is a scientific figure. Ignore it at your peril. Yes there are all kinds of methods to entice people to use your airport and they are not restricted to link roads and airline deals but you cannot ignore your distance catchment population. DSA's is quite small nestled between MAN, LBA, HUY and EMA. However successful or not DSA will become will have a direct impact on the 4 airports that surround it. For so many routes there simply is not enough passengers to be shared out. Sharing them out is the worst possible thing for the passenger as it leads to unsustainable, unreliable and infrequent service. Inefficient civil aviation strategy. This country needs to reduce the number of airports and make them more accessible and more functional and not have lots and lots fighting after the same passengers while losing money.
Last edited by LEEDS APPROACH; 21st Apr 2016 at 20:26. Reason: typo
Join Date: May 2007
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With skies becoming ever more crowded it would be to everyone's benefit to have fewer more strategically placed airports that can work more efficiently. Put them in the right place and make them more efficient and better connected by road and rail.
Yes we need to thin down what we have and make what we have better.
Join Date: May 2007
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As for it being a new route - nonsense - it's been done by Jet2 and AirSouthwest in recent years. Nobody is learning anything new about this route.
The regional connectivity fund (your tax) would be better off spent on a study to find out why so many airports are losing money. They did it for the railways.
Join Date: Jun 2006
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So you're happy for monarch to leave LBA? They are only there because the airport subsidised them. And jet2 had a lot of support when they started out. I'm sure BA are getting help to be at LBA as are BMI ... It happens everywhere. Even MAN support new carriers.
The only route in yorkshire that is being helped with public funds is LBA-NQY. all the rest is private money and private companies can soend their money as they see fit, there is no need or grounds for regulation, apart from the fact 'leeds approach' wants more aircraft to spot at LBA which isn't exactly a sound commercial driver for making decisions.
LA you need to accept LBA is not the epicentre of the world and that DSA has just as much claim to its market as LBA does to it's own.
Competition is good, the flybe services at DSA are new and it's a huge commitment. It's a well known fact amongst professionals that new airline routes take upto 3 years to reach profitable maturity, so the stats that come out in month one are meaningless, plus as ever, no one knows the yield.
The only route in yorkshire that is being helped with public funds is LBA-NQY. all the rest is private money and private companies can soend their money as they see fit, there is no need or grounds for regulation, apart from the fact 'leeds approach' wants more aircraft to spot at LBA which isn't exactly a sound commercial driver for making decisions.
LA you need to accept LBA is not the epicentre of the world and that DSA has just as much claim to its market as LBA does to it's own.
Competition is good, the flybe services at DSA are new and it's a huge commitment. It's a well known fact amongst professionals that new airline routes take upto 3 years to reach profitable maturity, so the stats that come out in month one are meaningless, plus as ever, no one knows the yield.
Don`t tell me I know Church Fenton
Newquay is one of the fastest growing UK markets as can be seen by the loads being carried out of MAN/BHX. Cornwall is very badly connected by train and if
anything goes wrong on the line cuts them off from the world, driving is a long
drive 7hrs from Leeds or 45 mins by plane and the cost is quite often less
Newquay is one of the fastest growing UK markets as can be seen by the loads being carried out of MAN/BHX. Cornwall is very badly connected by train and if
anything goes wrong on the line cuts them off from the world, driving is a long
drive 7hrs from Leeds or 45 mins by plane and the cost is quite often less
Join Date: May 2007
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So you're happy for monarch to leave LBA? They are only there because the airport subsidised them. And jet2 had a lot of support when they started out. I'm sure BA are getting help to be at LBA as are BMI ... It happens everywhere. Even MAN support new carriers.
The only route in yorkshire that is being helped with public funds is LBA-NQY. all the rest is private money and private companies can soend their money as they see fit, there is no need or grounds for regulation, apart from the fact 'leeds approach' wants more aircraft to spot at LBA which isn't exactly a sound commercial driver for making decisions.
LA you need to accept LBA is not the epicentre of the world and that DSA has just as much claim to its market as LBA does to it's own.
Competition is good, the flybe services at DSA are new and it's a huge commitment. It's a well known fact amongst professionals that new airline routes take upto 3 years to reach profitable maturity, so the stats that come out in month one are meaningless, plus as ever, no one knows the yield.
The only route in yorkshire that is being helped with public funds is LBA-NQY. all the rest is private money and private companies can soend their money as they see fit, there is no need or grounds for regulation, apart from the fact 'leeds approach' wants more aircraft to spot at LBA which isn't exactly a sound commercial driver for making decisions.
LA you need to accept LBA is not the epicentre of the world and that DSA has just as much claim to its market as LBA does to it's own.
Competition is good, the flybe services at DSA are new and it's a huge commitment. It's a well known fact amongst professionals that new airline routes take upto 3 years to reach profitable maturity, so the stats that come out in month one are meaningless, plus as ever, no one knows the yield.
ok my friend. I have made it quite clear that LBA is completely unsuitable just as DSA is - so quite how I want to spot planes there I don't know. I would even suggest closing LBA in favour of DSA if DSA was in the ideal location - but it is not. It never will be. Competition at one well placed, accessible and full functioning airport is brilliant but dividing up a small catchment that already loses millions of passengers North, South and West will only lead to failure within Yorkshire. No other region pours money into the immediate neighbours pockets more than Yorkshire and Humberside. It's a very simple concept. I don't really enjoy arguing with plane spotters about this and the facts speak for themselves. There is a very good reason why EasyJet and Ryanair and Linksair failed at DSA and the BE service to Belfast stopped. Do stop going on about 'markets' too- it is population catchment, catchment wealth and propensity to fly that are important. I predict an intensifying 'bloodbath' for passengers in the next few years.
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Doncaster
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Gents I'd just like to point out that this particular round of debate was started by the Doom Monger in residence on the basis of what he'd 'heard' about one particular flight on one particular Monday morning. Now I can't be sure but I believe that particular route frequency was increased even before the launch date because of 'increased demand'.
Join Date: May 2007
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Increased demand!! - moving 3 flights up the road where we can use some tax payers money. Ooo what shall we do? - "Increased demand" !
Berlin started by Jet2 at LBA (bigger distance catchment population) and where is it now?
Fight to the bottom.
Berlin started by Jet2 at LBA (bigger distance catchment population) and where is it now?
Fight to the bottom.
This may be true in an ideal world, but we don’t live in an ideal world. Our aviation infrastructure has developed in a particular way and we have to live with that and accept that the best we can do is fiddle around the edges of what we’ve already got. We’re way past the point of being able to implement a grand masterplan for air travel; to do so now would require government intervention on an unparalleled scale with huge associated costs. Simply won’t happen.
Join Date: Feb 2002
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Look guys. Leeds Approach has made many arguments in the past for his agenda for closing all airports in Yorkshire and moving to one Yorkshire airport in the right place with the right facilities. That Airport is the former RAF Church Fenton. It is aparently in the best place and has good transport links. LBA has a short runway pointing in the wrong direction and is on a hill and has poor transport links. DSA doesn't have a NE/SW runway either and despite plenty of space and a good length runway is in the wrong place. Doncaster at least is a large city unlike Tadcaster. Leeds/ Bradford clearly don't have the catchment Tadcaster does (plus it's fantastic transport links to the rest of Yorkshire).
As someone who used to work at CF as far as I remember neither runway was longer than either LBA or DSA. It also suffers from Vale of York fog ( another of Leeds Approachs'arguments against LBA in particular) Whilst I agree CF could be expanded and developed who is going to pay?? Will the owners of LBA or DSA, neither of which are local authorities, shut their airports to allow LA's vision? Let's get back to the real world.LBA is struggling along with a little over 3 million pax a year and last I looked DSA was growing nicely. Neither are perfect but short of a billionaire coming in to throw money away on CF and buy out LBA and DSAs owners it is what we have. Get used to it!
As someone who used to work at CF as far as I remember neither runway was longer than either LBA or DSA. It also suffers from Vale of York fog ( another of Leeds Approachs'arguments against LBA in particular) Whilst I agree CF could be expanded and developed who is going to pay?? Will the owners of LBA or DSA, neither of which are local authorities, shut their airports to allow LA's vision? Let's get back to the real world.LBA is struggling along with a little over 3 million pax a year and last I looked DSA was growing nicely. Neither are perfect but short of a billionaire coming in to throw money away on CF and buy out LBA and DSAs owners it is what we have. Get used to it!
Join Date: Jan 2016
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When I worked at EZY as a cabin manager, we did a full summer season at DSA. We all loved the 1,2 or 3 night trips as the flights were so easy to work as they were never full. Biggest pax load I ever took was 119 to Faro in August 2010. Amsterdam was usually mid 40s and Prague 60s . Palma was around 90 pax. We knew DSA was making a hugh loss so we pulled out. FLYBE probably will to, it's Saad Hamnad trying to justify work for the E195 that are for sale but no airline wants to buy, so loadfactor and share price has plummeted .