BIRMINGHAM - 5
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Oxfordshire
Posts: 15
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I remember my dad taking me there in 1989, sitting around for around 3 hours to see 4 BAC 1-11's, an Iberia DC-9, Airtours MD-83, TEA 737-300, 2 Britannia 737-200s and a Lufthansa 737-200 or 300 that landed at teatime.
I can remember many good things in the 90's, Birmingham European which became Brymon European, then Maersk Air UK, before its fate as Duo.
Euro 96 saw the Dutch in mass, with the Martinair 747 and MD-11s, Corsair 747 along with a huge host of smaller visitors.
Saturdays saw the Air Toulouse and Air Provene Caravelles from Aix-Les-Baines, what a great sight they were departing!
Can anyone else remember MacAir Jetstream 31 that operated?
I have photos of 2 Aeroflot Tupolev 154's parked around the back by the railway line from 1997 (i think).
Then came along Turkmenistan (still with us thankfully), Tajikstan (Tristar), Uzbekistan (757/767), Kyrgyzstan Airlines (A320/Tu154)
Weekends hosted Balkan and VIA Tu-154s.
Then came the UEFA Cup final at Villa Park which bought another huge amount of charters in from Spain and Italy.
Shame 2012 doesnt have as much variety!
I can remember many good things in the 90's, Birmingham European which became Brymon European, then Maersk Air UK, before its fate as Duo.
Euro 96 saw the Dutch in mass, with the Martinair 747 and MD-11s, Corsair 747 along with a huge host of smaller visitors.
Saturdays saw the Air Toulouse and Air Provene Caravelles from Aix-Les-Baines, what a great sight they were departing!
Can anyone else remember MacAir Jetstream 31 that operated?
I have photos of 2 Aeroflot Tupolev 154's parked around the back by the railway line from 1997 (i think).
Then came along Turkmenistan (still with us thankfully), Tajikstan (Tristar), Uzbekistan (757/767), Kyrgyzstan Airlines (A320/Tu154)
Weekends hosted Balkan and VIA Tu-154s.
Then came the UEFA Cup final at Villa Park which bought another huge amount of charters in from Spain and Italy.
Shame 2012 doesnt have as much variety!
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Eas Anglia
Age: 64
Posts: 812
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The Wardair flights were more to do with ExPats visiting friends and family who emigrated in the 70s. The flights dried up when the market did. Plus these days there isnt that inveitable "waving of the hanky at the airport", there technology is there to see and talk to relatives anywhere in the world via the PC if you so wished.
What is galling however is the number of flights Air Canada operate into Heathrow. With multiple service and direct flights to Toronto, Ottawa , Halifax, Montreal, Edmonton, Vancouver, St Johns etc it is crasy that all that total UK demand is forced into Heathrow.
What is galling however is the number of flights Air Canada operate into Heathrow. With multiple service and direct flights to Toronto, Ottawa , Halifax, Montreal, Edmonton, Vancouver, St Johns etc it is crasy that all that total UK demand is forced into Heathrow.
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Beaumaris
Posts: 204
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BHX Summer 2003
The BHX timetable for summer 2003 has some interesting services:-
Mytravellite
1xDaily Alicante, 1xDaily Beauvais, 1xDaily Geneva + BA/Maersk 1xDaily,
1xDaily Pisa, 1XDaily BCN + BA daily
PIA 2xweekly to Chicago A310 + Daily to ISB/KHI/LHE
Swiss 2xDaily Basle as well as ZRH
BA 1XDaily Bordeaux, Vienna, 4xweekly Venice, Daily Turin, 2xDaily Stockholm, Daily Nice,2xDaily Berlin
Uzebekistan 2xweekly to JFK! 767 and Daily to Tashkent 757/767
Not forgetting CSA Daily to PRG
On a different note does anyone know why One World have abandoned BHX, Star are huge, and even Sky Team respectable, but why have they, One World, just left it to the other two??
Mytravellite
1xDaily Alicante, 1xDaily Beauvais, 1xDaily Geneva + BA/Maersk 1xDaily,
1xDaily Pisa, 1XDaily BCN + BA daily
PIA 2xweekly to Chicago A310 + Daily to ISB/KHI/LHE
Swiss 2xDaily Basle as well as ZRH
BA 1XDaily Bordeaux, Vienna, 4xweekly Venice, Daily Turin, 2xDaily Stockholm, Daily Nice,2xDaily Berlin
Uzebekistan 2xweekly to JFK! 767 and Daily to Tashkent 757/767
Not forgetting CSA Daily to PRG
On a different note does anyone know why One World have abandoned BHX, Star are huge, and even Sky Team respectable, but why have they, One World, just left it to the other two??
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: u.k.
Age: 56
Posts: 238
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
On a different note does anyone know why One World have abandoned BHX, Star are huge, and even Sky Team respectable, but why have they, One World, just left it to the other two??
Actually One world will have a presence from 20th march when Air berlin join but as you can't get on that flight London airways will allow it to continue
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: solihull West Midlands
Posts: 967
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
NAVPI, re Wardair,
not sure thats totally correct I flew with them twice and certainly seemed most were holiday families.Why would people visit ex pats during that period in large numbers but not before or after as you seem to suggest?
What killed Wardair was that Air Canada disposed of them at BHX.They moved in on the hugely successful operation Wardair had at BHX ,putting 747/Tristars and 767s .
With Worldways also offering Tristar flights the market became saturated.
Fewer people had been using Air Canada out of LHR partly due to the huge capacity offered especially by Wardair out of BHX LGW, and MAN, and Air Canada had to stop that.
Ward Air unable to compete pulled out of BHX.With their job done Air Canada also pulled out of BHX a short time later, and passenger numbers recovered for them at LHR.
One of the most ruthless airline strategies seen at BHX, but effective.
not sure thats totally correct I flew with them twice and certainly seemed most were holiday families.Why would people visit ex pats during that period in large numbers but not before or after as you seem to suggest?
What killed Wardair was that Air Canada disposed of them at BHX.They moved in on the hugely successful operation Wardair had at BHX ,putting 747/Tristars and 767s .
With Worldways also offering Tristar flights the market became saturated.
Fewer people had been using Air Canada out of LHR partly due to the huge capacity offered especially by Wardair out of BHX LGW, and MAN, and Air Canada had to stop that.
Ward Air unable to compete pulled out of BHX.With their job done Air Canada also pulled out of BHX a short time later, and passenger numbers recovered for them at LHR.
One of the most ruthless airline strategies seen at BHX, but effective.
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London (Babylon-on-Thames)
Age: 42
Posts: 6,168
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Wardair went upmarket and lost interest in the expat market. They had 14 A310s to fill and were going after the business market. They also dropped PIK as it no longer fitted. Guess what? New policy was a disaster and they were gobbled up by Canadian. UK Canada is pretty seasonal fare, the fact that Air Canada serve multiple routes fron LHR is because London and connectivity support it. Edinburgh with all it's links to Canada struggled to maintain a weekly YYZ on an A310. BHX is unlikely to do any better alas.
One last thing, Air Canada out of GLA and MAN never got the B767 with the new business class. They have four B763s that have tge old seats they fly on seasonal leisure routes to DUB, BCN and elsewhere. LHR has the full new product which BHX would not see.
One last thing, Air Canada out of GLA and MAN never got the B767 with the new business class. They have four B763s that have tge old seats they fly on seasonal leisure routes to DUB, BCN and elsewhere. LHR has the full new product which BHX would not see.
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Lichfield
Posts: 563
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Canada ex BHX
There certainly is a market for flights to Canada ex BHX, In recent years PIA and Air India operated YYZ (AI stopped flying to protect slots ex LHR). Air Transat have maintained their services and I know someone who manages Canadian Affairs ops on the ground at Birmingham and the service is very well supported indeed its very difficult to get a seat at Birmingham during its season of operation and passengers are regularly off-loaded and bussed to Manchester or Gatwick.
AC and BA operate around 4800 seats a day to and from Toronto (AC x 5 and BA x 2) so of course this would has a detrimental effect on Birmingham securing regular scheduled service as there is so much choice just 2 hours away down the M40.
The difference with Birmingham and the other cities talked about is the huge Sikh community in the West Midlands many of whom now have relatives who live in around Toronto and Ontario. They regularly account for at least 40% of the seats sold on Air Transat. I'm sure there is the potential for more services from Birmingham but probably from Air Transat or other charter airline as the scheduled market south of Birmingham is sewn up at LHR.
AC and BA operate around 4800 seats a day to and from Toronto (AC x 5 and BA x 2) so of course this would has a detrimental effect on Birmingham securing regular scheduled service as there is so much choice just 2 hours away down the M40.
The difference with Birmingham and the other cities talked about is the huge Sikh community in the West Midlands many of whom now have relatives who live in around Toronto and Ontario. They regularly account for at least 40% of the seats sold on Air Transat. I'm sure there is the potential for more services from Birmingham but probably from Air Transat or other charter airline as the scheduled market south of Birmingham is sewn up at LHR.
Last edited by Daza; 14th Feb 2012 at 11:53.
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Coventry
Posts: 44
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Lufthansa
Very positive to see that Lufthansa is going from strength to strength at Birmingham. 19% rise in passengers from 2010 to 484,503 passengers being carried on Lufthansa's services in 2011 to Dusseldorf, Frankfurt and Munich.
Highest passenger numbers for Lufthansa in there history from Birmingham to be carried in one year. Numbers set to increase further in 2012 with new services of 12 x weekly to Hamburg and Daily Berlin-Brandenburg service to commence
Highest passenger numbers for Lufthansa in there history from Birmingham to be carried in one year. Numbers set to increase further in 2012 with new services of 12 x weekly to Hamburg and Daily Berlin-Brandenburg service to commence
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: solihull West Midlands
Posts: 967
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Daza,
Canadian Affair should hang their heads in shame,as you say our 1 piddly flight a week to YYZ in the summer is rammed,think load factor was 99% last summer.
Perhaps you can ask their rep why they have put 2 fingers up to a 2nd service out of BHX but are quite happy to ferry Brummies up to MAN where they have increased capacity this summer !
Canadian Affair should hang their heads in shame,as you say our 1 piddly flight a week to YYZ in the summer is rammed,think load factor was 99% last summer.
Perhaps you can ask their rep why they have put 2 fingers up to a 2nd service out of BHX but are quite happy to ferry Brummies up to MAN where they have increased capacity this summer !
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Lichfield
Posts: 563
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BHX TS
Nigel Osbourne wrote
Nigel your post sounded a little sharp! Please don't shoot the messenger! 
Canadian Affairs only charter part of the load the flight is officially a scheduled service operated by Air Transat.
The reason the second service was shelved was due to lack of suitable aircraft TCX 757s in low density seating were used until this agreement came to an end. I believe that last Summer Canadian Affairs attempted to charter alternative aircraft without success.
I also wonder if TS high density 330-300/200s have payload restrictions off Birmingham's runway? I'm sure they could fill another 330 or 310 service a week at least although the 310s are being phased out from Summer 2013.
Canadian Affair should hang their heads in shame,as you say our 1 piddly flight a week to YYZ in the summer is rammed,think load factor was 99% last summer.
Perhaps you can ask their rep why they have put 2 fingers up to a 2nd service out of BHX but are quite happy to ferry Brummies up to MAN where they have increased capacity this summer !
Perhaps you can ask their rep why they have put 2 fingers up to a 2nd service out of BHX but are quite happy to ferry Brummies up to MAN where they have increased capacity this summer !
Canadian Affairs only charter part of the load the flight is officially a scheduled service operated by Air Transat.
The reason the second service was shelved was due to lack of suitable aircraft TCX 757s in low density seating were used until this agreement came to an end. I believe that last Summer Canadian Affairs attempted to charter alternative aircraft without success.
I also wonder if TS high density 330-300/200s have payload restrictions off Birmingham's runway? I'm sure they could fill another 330 or 310 service a week at least although the 310s are being phased out from Summer 2013.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: solihull West Midlands
Posts: 967
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi Daza, certainly not aimed at you... but no remorse re Canadian Affair.
All seats I believe are sold on the 330s.
Last summer their attempt at a second flight was pathetic.In their brochure as a TCX 757 then a MON one.The fact that their were no other long haul flts with such an aircraft anywhere to Canada from the UK meant straight away it wasn't going to operate.
They could quite easily route an A310 via somewhere else if they wanted, but seems BHX is not one of their favoured routes, and they are happy to just keep on increasing MAN which I think was already daily to YYZ !
So for the 3rd year in a row the one flight will be completely full.
They are not alone in the pathetic catergory..BHX still only has 1 flt a week to Orlando with TOM who also refuse to offer increases.We used to get 2 with TOM, MON also operated their.
Both CWL and NCL have more capacity their than BHX for the first time this summer ..Embarrassing
All seats I believe are sold on the 330s.
Last summer their attempt at a second flight was pathetic.In their brochure as a TCX 757 then a MON one.The fact that their were no other long haul flts with such an aircraft anywhere to Canada from the UK meant straight away it wasn't going to operate.
They could quite easily route an A310 via somewhere else if they wanted, but seems BHX is not one of their favoured routes, and they are happy to just keep on increasing MAN which I think was already daily to YYZ !
So for the 3rd year in a row the one flight will be completely full.
They are not alone in the pathetic catergory..BHX still only has 1 flt a week to Orlando with TOM who also refuse to offer increases.We used to get 2 with TOM, MON also operated their.
Both CWL and NCL have more capacity their than BHX for the first time this summer ..Embarrassing
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London (Babylon-on-Thames)
Age: 42
Posts: 6,168
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So for the 3rd year in a row the one flight will be completely full.
Last edited by Skipness One Echo; 14th Feb 2012 at 23:43.
Skipness
Afraid I can't help but agree with you - the VFR business between UK and Canada is literally dying.
What's more, if you are Transat, would you rather make a good profit on one flight a week, or be busy fools making less operating two?
Afraid I can't help but agree with you - the VFR business between UK and Canada is literally dying.
What's more, if you are Transat, would you rather make a good profit on one flight a week, or be busy fools making less operating two?
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Solihull
Age: 60
Posts: 3,326
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
flybe/LH/YYZ
Flybe
Just checked the flybe connections timetable which gives aircraft types
and some highlights are.
From 1/3/2012
BE781/84 08.25/08.55 changes to the 195
BE789/92 16.05/16.55 changes to the 195
BE793/96 20.05/20.35 changes to the 195
If you think that was a decent uplift in the number of seats - see below
From Monday 27/03/2012
Incredibly BHX-GLA Monday to Friday is showing as an all jet 195 service
Six daily Monday & Friday and seven Tuesday, Wednesday & Friday,
which appears to me to be the spare 195 being put into service.
Due to this the Monday & Friday midday Jersey is also now showing
as the 195.
The Hanover on Saturday morning and Sunday night is also showing
as the 195.
Milan is showing as a daily 195 but with Q400 flying times.
The 175 on a Sunday does double Dusseldorf.
I can't find what the 175 does on a Saturday.
Anyone from flybe to confirm the above? I did wonder whether the 195 will
actually turn into a 175 subject to delivery on new units?
The three BHX based 195 schedule appears to be: -
1) BHX-CDG-BHX-CDG-BHX-CDG-BHX
2) BHX-GLA-BHX-JER-BHX-GLA-BHX-GLA-BHX
3) BHX-EDI-BHX-MXP-BHX-EDI-BHX
Lufthansa
Dusseldorf actually showing a downgrade from mid April to mid June with the
morning and afternoon service currently showing as the CRJ700 of Cityline, which is 16 less seats per flight so not too bad.
Canada
Is there any evidence of decline in VFR traffic within the Midlands Sikh community in respect of travel to Toronto?
I would have thought it is more a case of not having the right aircraft available for a second flight and committing a second A333 as stated previously would probably just trash yields.
As Daza and Nigel have stated, loads were around 99% in 2011 and as far as
I can remember there was little if any discounting at all. It is frustrating
that a solution could not be found.
Just checked the flybe connections timetable which gives aircraft types
and some highlights are.
From 1/3/2012
BE781/84 08.25/08.55 changes to the 195
BE789/92 16.05/16.55 changes to the 195
BE793/96 20.05/20.35 changes to the 195
If you think that was a decent uplift in the number of seats - see below
From Monday 27/03/2012
Incredibly BHX-GLA Monday to Friday is showing as an all jet 195 service
Six daily Monday & Friday and seven Tuesday, Wednesday & Friday,
which appears to me to be the spare 195 being put into service.
Due to this the Monday & Friday midday Jersey is also now showing
as the 195.
The Hanover on Saturday morning and Sunday night is also showing
as the 195.
Milan is showing as a daily 195 but with Q400 flying times.
The 175 on a Sunday does double Dusseldorf.
I can't find what the 175 does on a Saturday.
Anyone from flybe to confirm the above? I did wonder whether the 195 will
actually turn into a 175 subject to delivery on new units?
The three BHX based 195 schedule appears to be: -
1) BHX-CDG-BHX-CDG-BHX-CDG-BHX
2) BHX-GLA-BHX-JER-BHX-GLA-BHX-GLA-BHX
3) BHX-EDI-BHX-MXP-BHX-EDI-BHX
Lufthansa
Dusseldorf actually showing a downgrade from mid April to mid June with the
morning and afternoon service currently showing as the CRJ700 of Cityline, which is 16 less seats per flight so not too bad.
Canada
Is there any evidence of decline in VFR traffic within the Midlands Sikh community in respect of travel to Toronto?
I would have thought it is more a case of not having the right aircraft available for a second flight and committing a second A333 as stated previously would probably just trash yields.
As Daza and Nigel have stated, loads were around 99% in 2011 and as far as
I can remember there was little if any discounting at all. It is frustrating
that a solution could not be found.