The mystery of the 757
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The mystery of the 757
We know that the 737 and 747 are the two machines that made Boeing what they are, or should be today, but the 757 is truely an amazing machine but was it before it's time?
The aircraft is the most efficient in it's class, can use runways much shorter than the Airbus alternative and, for aircraft lovers, it's engines don't sound bad either!
The 739ER is supposed to be the new replacement for the 757 on the short haul sectors but what is the replacement for it on the longer flights? The 787? But surely this carries more passengers than the 757?
Airlines such as DL and CO are increasing becoming aware of how lucrative these aircraft can be on TATL flights to small cities to feed their domestic and North/South American operations flying from airports such as BRS and BFS. Will the 787 replace these in the years to come?
I would probably guess at no, but please correct me if I am wrong. If not - what is going to replace them? Personally I think they should bring the aircraft back, make the winglets as standard and maybe look at new engines with a similar power but more efficient.
Would this work?
Thanks.
The aircraft is the most efficient in it's class, can use runways much shorter than the Airbus alternative and, for aircraft lovers, it's engines don't sound bad either!
The 739ER is supposed to be the new replacement for the 757 on the short haul sectors but what is the replacement for it on the longer flights? The 787? But surely this carries more passengers than the 757?
Airlines such as DL and CO are increasing becoming aware of how lucrative these aircraft can be on TATL flights to small cities to feed their domestic and North/South American operations flying from airports such as BRS and BFS. Will the 787 replace these in the years to come?
I would probably guess at no, but please correct me if I am wrong. If not - what is going to replace them? Personally I think they should bring the aircraft back, make the winglets as standard and maybe look at new engines with a similar power but more efficient.
Would this work?
Thanks.
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The 757 is a fabulous machine...did Belfast - Newark earlier this year, and it was my first 757 flight for quite a while. Brought back to me just how capable it is...and how big a wing it has!
As for the future, it's that big wing that needs to be replicated to have a true 757 replacement. Maybe the 737 replacement will have a specific model with a larger wing (spanwise would be easiest) and the engines to match.
I believe the 757 design was supposed to offer 727 field performance, with a larger payload, from the hot & high fields in the states such as Denver...
As for the future, it's that big wing that needs to be replicated to have a true 757 replacement. Maybe the 737 replacement will have a specific model with a larger wing (spanwise would be easiest) and the engines to match.
I believe the 757 design was supposed to offer 727 field performance, with a larger payload, from the hot & high fields in the states such as Denver...
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G-MONC is being carved up at Lasham, some of the airframes are 25 years old and high on cycles, reduced to baked bean cans is inevitable for them all.
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It's just a great balance of bits, and a great balance of simplicity and toughness. Engineers used to marvel at how everything was screwed together compared to a 737-200 for instance. Much simpler design philosophy and superb build quality.
It's one of those sweet spot aircraft like the A330-200 with Trents. Fly it across the pond and it fits the route like a glove, fly it shorthaul or in UK charter config and it still turns in a great set of numbers if you allow for flexibility.
For a British inspired design it ain't bad! Just a crying shame that our version wasn't built and flown as it would have been essentially the same aircraft but 15 years earlier.
It's one of those sweet spot aircraft like the A330-200 with Trents. Fly it across the pond and it fits the route like a glove, fly it shorthaul or in UK charter config and it still turns in a great set of numbers if you allow for flexibility.
For a British inspired design it ain't bad! Just a crying shame that our version wasn't built and flown as it would have been essentially the same aircraft but 15 years earlier.
Paxing All Over The World
As I understand it, the 75 replacing the 72 also replicated it's high fuel burn? Perhaps this was more amongst the earlier models? Doubtless the machine was well built and so will weigh more than current medium haul twins. So it seems that weight and (possibly) fuel burn, will prevent further instances?
I agree wholeheartedly that it is an utterly beautiful machine and one that falls into the small category of a/c that look so right. I have been known to select particular rotations on a route, so as to get on a 75 in preference to anything else..
I agree wholeheartedly that it is an utterly beautiful machine and one that falls into the small category of a/c that look so right. I have been known to select particular rotations on a route, so as to get on a 75 in preference to anything else..
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The 757 ticks all the right boxes. Its performance allows it remain the king of the UK charter market. Short, medium and long haul, short field it does the lot better than the rest.
From a pilots point of view it's perfect. Need to Go Around, the Rollers will fire you away from the ground in a second. Land long or short field the brakes will stop you immediately with no overheat problems. Short field T/O? So what, we have the power. The FMC/MCP is way more pilot friendly than the AB MCDU/FCU. Looks, spot on (except -300).
Reliable? You bet, a well looked after 757 is the ops staff's dream.
I believe (hope!!) the 787 will be the true succesor to this fantastic aircraft. Same performance but lower DOC.
From a pilots point of view it's perfect. Need to Go Around, the Rollers will fire you away from the ground in a second. Land long or short field the brakes will stop you immediately with no overheat problems. Short field T/O? So what, we have the power. The FMC/MCP is way more pilot friendly than the AB MCDU/FCU. Looks, spot on (except -300).
Reliable? You bet, a well looked after 757 is the ops staff's dream.
I believe (hope!!) the 787 will be the true succesor to this fantastic aircraft. Same performance but lower DOC.
Last edited by qwertyuiop; 31st Dec 2008 at 19:22.
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757. Trents? Did I miss something? Now then.....757....bit more composite in the fuselage......uprated engines....winglets......just a mo...isnt that a 787?
Boeing were mad not to see it. Sat in the last one to roll off the line, 1,050 I believe.
Boeing keep one as a testbed. it will be a while before they all turn into bean cans.Lots of life as a freighter. Hot, high, 180 minute etops, payload unrestricted, if you can fill it you can take off, almost anywhere at max weight. Ditto landing, beats the 737 hands down
Boeing were mad not to see it. Sat in the last one to roll off the line, 1,050 I believe.
Boeing keep one as a testbed. it will be a while before they all turn into bean cans.Lots of life as a freighter. Hot, high, 180 minute etops, payload unrestricted, if you can fill it you can take off, almost anywhere at max weight. Ditto landing, beats the 737 hands down
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I love the 757. For many years in the late seventies and eighties, I was a very frequent pax on Boeing 737-200's (mainly operated by Britannia Airways in the UK). Then, in 1984, I flew along with the rest of my family to one of the infamous Spanish "Costas" on a BA757 - in the days when it bore the "British" titles with large "757" just ahead of the aft door. The aircraft was registered G-BIKK, and was only two or three days new out the box. I was entirely amazed at how it performed with a very short take off roll, steep climb and quiet to boot.
The overall experience was probably enhanced by the fact that the cabin layout was in traditional "scheduled" configuration, whilst the flight we operated was a charter flight. Therefore, in comparison to the 737, there appeared to be acres of space inside.
I have since flown on 75's of several carriers globally. The aircraft still remains a firm favourite. On my (rarer) visits back to Europe and the need to fly with BA, I am still thrilled when my hops around Europe are performed on a 757, as opposed to one of the Airbus types!
In fact, looking out of my office window right now near to the approach to Dubai Airport, Friday is something of a "757" day, with examples landing in the colours of Finnair, Ethiopian, Vim and - right now as I type this - Baltic Airlines (?), with winglets? Didn't know they had 757's!
Long may it live!
The overall experience was probably enhanced by the fact that the cabin layout was in traditional "scheduled" configuration, whilst the flight we operated was a charter flight. Therefore, in comparison to the 737, there appeared to be acres of space inside.
I have since flown on 75's of several carriers globally. The aircraft still remains a firm favourite. On my (rarer) visits back to Europe and the need to fly with BA, I am still thrilled when my hops around Europe are performed on a 757, as opposed to one of the Airbus types!
In fact, looking out of my office window right now near to the approach to Dubai Airport, Friday is something of a "757" day, with examples landing in the colours of Finnair, Ethiopian, Vim and - right now as I type this - Baltic Airlines (?), with winglets? Didn't know they had 757's!
Long may it live!
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A truly remarkable aircraft and yes it was ahead of its time in 1983. My memories of this aircraft was of it replacing the Trident 3s on the LHR BFS LHR shuttle run, (infact it was the first BA revenue passenger service)
The glass cockpit was a revelation compared to the other analogue aircraft cockpits of the day and the performance was something to be marveled at. Even though the BA aircraft had the downrated RR211 C compared with Monarch's E4 engines it was still able to depart BFS from the R/W 25 Bravo intersection.
Although i never flew the aircraft i had on occasions to visit the flight deck and talk with the crews and you could just tell they loved to fly it.
One of my alltime favourite aircraft and i still love to watch them.
The glass cockpit was a revelation compared to the other analogue aircraft cockpits of the day and the performance was something to be marveled at. Even though the BA aircraft had the downrated RR211 C compared with Monarch's E4 engines it was still able to depart BFS from the R/W 25 Bravo intersection.
Although i never flew the aircraft i had on occasions to visit the flight deck and talk with the crews and you could just tell they loved to fly it.
One of my alltime favourite aircraft and i still love to watch them.
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....and didja know it had a t tail to begin with? 727 fuselage stuck on a trident wing but swept forward to avoid all the droops/slats and contrivances to get the Trident airborne.
Airlines didnt like the look so conventional tail reverted to, then the fuel crisis that precipitated the demise of the 727 ended and airlines kept their old 72's.
Result? 767/757 hybrid for economies of scale in manufacture.
Trouble was, the flight deck of the 76(wide body) wouldnt fit on the narrow body 75 without a bit of jiggling around, which is why you step down to a 75 fight deck and step up to a 76, and also accounts for the unique and rather beautiful "swan's beak" look to the 75 front end. The 767 is a very conventiional Boeing look.
Now...bit more composite, winglets, uprate the engines, new avionics..wow....what a bird that would be. A narrow body 787 for a fraction of the cost.
Airlines didnt like the look so conventional tail reverted to, then the fuel crisis that precipitated the demise of the 727 ended and airlines kept their old 72's.
Result? 767/757 hybrid for economies of scale in manufacture.
Trouble was, the flight deck of the 76(wide body) wouldnt fit on the narrow body 75 without a bit of jiggling around, which is why you step down to a 75 fight deck and step up to a 76, and also accounts for the unique and rather beautiful "swan's beak" look to the 75 front end. The 767 is a very conventiional Boeing look.
Now...bit more composite, winglets, uprate the engines, new avionics..wow....what a bird that would be. A narrow body 787 for a fraction of the cost.
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Just beats me why Boeing shut the 757 line. Is the fuel performance on 737-900/ERs with the CFM-56s just so much better than the 757 on, say, flights up to 5 hours plus?
Watching the full Arkia 757-300 get off Cork's r/w 35 just north of the intersection on the way to Tel Aviv was some sight to behold. What performance!
Watching the full Arkia 757-300 get off Cork's r/w 35 just north of the intersection on the way to Tel Aviv was some sight to behold. What performance!
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What can be said about the 757...?
A lot - really -
xxx
When it rolled out of Seattle factory, appeared to be (and was) the replacement for 727, with in fact, about the fuselage dimensions and cross-section of the 707 and the 727-200... I saw that airplane continue to be produced well beyond year 2000. Well beyond the production of the 737 new versions.
xxx
One thing, it came initially with the designation "757-200" - letting me believe there would be a shorter/lighter "757-100" one day, as much as I expected the production of a "757-300" in view of its "higher landing gear" permitting the fuselage to be stretched. Boeing had been unable to stretch the 707 as Douglas did on the DC-8 because of its low landing gear.
xxx
But the 757-100 never came. And while the CFM versions of the 737-200 were to be expected (300-400-500), I was somewhat surprised at Boeing dumping the 757 production and see them drawing plans for the newer current versions of the 737, known as the 700-800-900... After all, Boeing was stretching an airplane from... the 1960s. Quite an older design.
xxx
A nice thing to me was the commonality of 757/767 pilot ratings. Convenient to have airlines with a fleet of both types, and crews who can operate either type of aircraft.
xxx
So that is where Boeing leaves the 757 aircraft. I never flew one, but it is the only "twin" I would have been attracted to be qualified as pilot. I always liked the 757 rides as a passenger, with its "single aisle" compared to the "crowded sensation" of the twin aisle wide body airplanes. And despite my dislike of twin airplanes ETOPS (as I was a 747 pilot with 4 motors), I did not mind crossing a 2,000 NM stretch of ocean, with a nice 757.
xxx
Yes, there will be 757 flying for long, many probably with 220+ Y class passengers when the airlines get tired of having their F class cabin for airline executives or employees on free pass travel. And there will be numerous 757 freighters converted from passenger airplanes, to continue operating them for long.
xxx
Hey Boss (I know you read my lines often) -
You do not need F class to enjoy your free travel with extra legroom. Learn to sip your Courvoisier(s) from an overwing exit seat with extra legroom, and a future Diego Maradona banging on the back of your seat. Thanks for the gold Rolex anyway. Probably was company funds, not from your wallet. As for smoking your stinking cigars, are the guys still letting you puff them, on the flight deck...?
ˇY con respecto, Patrón! - Me gusta ser jubilado...
xxx
Happy contrails
xxx
When it rolled out of Seattle factory, appeared to be (and was) the replacement for 727, with in fact, about the fuselage dimensions and cross-section of the 707 and the 727-200... I saw that airplane continue to be produced well beyond year 2000. Well beyond the production of the 737 new versions.
xxx
One thing, it came initially with the designation "757-200" - letting me believe there would be a shorter/lighter "757-100" one day, as much as I expected the production of a "757-300" in view of its "higher landing gear" permitting the fuselage to be stretched. Boeing had been unable to stretch the 707 as Douglas did on the DC-8 because of its low landing gear.
xxx
But the 757-100 never came. And while the CFM versions of the 737-200 were to be expected (300-400-500), I was somewhat surprised at Boeing dumping the 757 production and see them drawing plans for the newer current versions of the 737, known as the 700-800-900... After all, Boeing was stretching an airplane from... the 1960s. Quite an older design.
xxx
A nice thing to me was the commonality of 757/767 pilot ratings. Convenient to have airlines with a fleet of both types, and crews who can operate either type of aircraft.
xxx
So that is where Boeing leaves the 757 aircraft. I never flew one, but it is the only "twin" I would have been attracted to be qualified as pilot. I always liked the 757 rides as a passenger, with its "single aisle" compared to the "crowded sensation" of the twin aisle wide body airplanes. And despite my dislike of twin airplanes ETOPS (as I was a 747 pilot with 4 motors), I did not mind crossing a 2,000 NM stretch of ocean, with a nice 757.
xxx
Yes, there will be 757 flying for long, many probably with 220+ Y class passengers when the airlines get tired of having their F class cabin for airline executives or employees on free pass travel. And there will be numerous 757 freighters converted from passenger airplanes, to continue operating them for long.
xxx
Hey Boss (I know you read my lines often) -
You do not need F class to enjoy your free travel with extra legroom. Learn to sip your Courvoisier(s) from an overwing exit seat with extra legroom, and a future Diego Maradona banging on the back of your seat. Thanks for the gold Rolex anyway. Probably was company funds, not from your wallet. As for smoking your stinking cigars, are the guys still letting you puff them, on the flight deck...?
ˇY con respecto, Patrón! - Me gusta ser jubilado...
xxx
Happy contrails
