Aer Lingus - 4
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Originally Posted by Dr.Kev
I can't help but think that DM has more on his plate than he bargained for.
More than he bargained for?
The man is a walking disaster! What a feckwit!
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I can readily accept that Cork and Dublin EI slots to Heathrow may no longer be cast in stone. All the more reason then that EI should never have quit their flights to Stansted some years ago. Sure, their business model at the time was a lot different with business class seats etc but the model used now in the airline would fit in well with a programme of some flights to Stansted from Cork and Dublin. Stansted is mad keen to get more long haul flights and I guess they have a good start this autumn with American Airlines beginning a 767 service from JFK. Now, if STN could get something like an Emirates flight to Dubai on the go you have it all to points further east in Asia and Australia/NZ etc?
Anyway, must go! Just heard there is a Primetime special on the EI snn decision at 9.30 pm on RTE 1. It is just amazing the amount of national media coverage and indeed sympathy this has caused whilst the Cork Airport debt story was in the main treated as a near joke by most of the Dublin media.
Corcaigh, tabhar aire!
Anyway, must go! Just heard there is a Primetime special on the EI snn decision at 9.30 pm on RTE 1. It is just amazing the amount of national media coverage and indeed sympathy this has caused whilst the Cork Airport debt story was in the main treated as a near joke by most of the Dublin media.
Corcaigh, tabhar aire!
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Originally Posted by Ryano
I agree that slots on ORK LHR or even DUB LHR are no longer cast in stone.
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It's funny how some people are pining for Willie Walsh, as Mannion is Willie-light in comparison !
Another possible reason for them going to Belfast, can't Aer Lingus work it such that they pay their Sterling profits in Ireland ?
Another possible reason for them going to Belfast, can't Aer Lingus work it such that they pay their Sterling profits in Ireland ?
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Originally Posted by Tom the Tenor
It is just amazing the amount of national media coverage and indeed sympathy this has caused whilst the Cork Airport debt story was in the main treated as a near joke by most of the Dublin media.
, it is indeed.
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The Prime Time show is just over. The major hand wringing was from the FG and FF backbanchers, Pat Breen and Niall Collins. Both were standing in an atmostpheric dusk with a backdrop of the Shannon terminal. The Fine Gaeler made mention that a LHR slot could be removed from the Dublin operation and at least he had the cop on not to say anything about taking a way a LHR slot from Cork! I wonder was he under orders from party HQ? Is it Good man, Simon!? It was hardly fair on the new Fianna Fail TD, Niall Collins, to be the only governement deputy at the crease. I think he is looking for time for some calm consideration on the subject which is a fair enough idea.
As an introduction RTE played over a few interviews on the EI privatisation from a few years ago with economists and another from Minister Seamus Brennan making a statement in the Dail about how important regional connections were to Heathrow. The likely turn of events was chillingly predicted by the economic specialists.
A rumor of ORK-BFS-JFK, is it? What next! Boy, that Cork runway is such a pox - it compromises so much possible potential.
As an introduction RTE played over a few interviews on the EI privatisation from a few years ago with economists and another from Minister Seamus Brennan making a statement in the Dail about how important regional connections were to Heathrow. The likely turn of events was chillingly predicted by the economic specialists.
A rumor of ORK-BFS-JFK, is it? What next! Boy, that Cork runway is such a pox - it compromises so much possible potential.
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And how long will that take?
What Cork needs is a transaltantic service that can work from the current runway and the current terminal. How long to get planning permission for the necessary installations for Cat III? As to suggestions for a realigned runway how much longer will that take? And a new airport on a green fled site?
So please can someone answer a question for me?
What is the largest aircraft in terms of Pax, baggage, no cargo, from Cork to New York either JFK or EWR?
Thanks
So please can someone answer a question for me?
What is the largest aircraft in terms of Pax, baggage, no cargo, from Cork to New York either JFK or EWR?
Thanks
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I don't have 757 performance data to hand, but the Continental 757s fly BRS-EWR, so they shouldn't have a problem with ORK, especially now that they are fitted with winglets. Larger than that, possibly a 762 could do it (CO is one of the few still operating these), but not sure about the 763 - and it would probably be too big for ORK anyway.
It would seem to be the right size too. Don't forget that as well as pax from ORK, there would be, around the eastern seaboard, a pretty good sized population of what we might call a "Corkonian diaspora", who would no doubt appreciate very much the possibility of flying back to ORK nonstop.
Mind you, CO 757s are pretty well tasked at the moment with other routes, but carriers like DL, AA and US have been introducing 757s on t/a routes. I just can't see people being willing to fly via BFS.
It would seem to be the right size too. Don't forget that as well as pax from ORK, there would be, around the eastern seaboard, a pretty good sized population of what we might call a "Corkonian diaspora", who would no doubt appreciate very much the possibility of flying back to ORK nonstop.
Mind you, CO 757s are pretty well tasked at the moment with other routes, but carriers like DL, AA and US have been introducing 757s on t/a routes. I just can't see people being willing to fly via BFS.
Last edited by akerosid; 10th Aug 2007 at 03:44. Reason: Additional info
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One great advantage SNN and DUB have is US pre-immigration and customs check. Nothing better than landing in the States and avoiding that long line of interrogation and chaos at immigration! As far as I am aware, Belfast does not have pre-immigration check but correct me if I am wrong. If DUB was not such a dump, it would be a great US connecting airport for EI's European network. As for SNN, if MOL ever does go t/a with a loco airline it would be the ideal airport...flights fed into SNN by FR and onward to the US. The pre-immigration checks would save MOL the cost of repatriating rejected travelers too!!
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An A330 can only operate out of Cork if the Take Off Weight is limited to enable the aircraft to take off from the available (shortish) runway. The take off weight is limited by carrying less fuel, less cargo or fewer passengers.
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Shannon's day of concerted action has begun to reverse the EI decision to quit snn-LHR. Once again there was major coverage on the topic on Radio 1's Morning Ireland radio show. None other that Jackie Healy Rea, TD has been roped in to champion snn's cause! To our British readers and others this guy is a Irish MP from the constituency of South Kerry. He is quite a stage Paddy but cute in a sly sort of way. He and his son own a pub and a few businesses and they both portray a colourful near country bumpkin image to their audience and to the media.
It shows how desperate the snn crowd are when they get this guy signed on for their cause when a large amount of the constituency he represents is probablly closer to Cork than snn and this is forgetting conviently his own local Kerry Airport at Farranfore between Killarney and Tralee.
Well, if snn gets back her LHR flights from EI in some fashion another campaign must be started to reinstate the 5th ORK-LHR service for next summer, reinstate Madrid and also to begin a direct flight from Cork to JFK from next year. Why not? If it is good enough for snn it is good enough for Cork to make similar demands.
It shows how desperate the snn crowd are when they get this guy signed on for their cause when a large amount of the constituency he represents is probablly closer to Cork than snn and this is forgetting conviently his own local Kerry Airport at Farranfore between Killarney and Tralee.
Well, if snn gets back her LHR flights from EI in some fashion another campaign must be started to reinstate the 5th ORK-LHR service for next summer, reinstate Madrid and also to begin a direct flight from Cork to JFK from next year. Why not? If it is good enough for snn it is good enough for Cork to make similar demands.
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Originally Posted by vkid
Would Cork people find ORK-BFS-JFK more beneficial or would they just continue to travel to Shannon or Dublin?
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I'm reliably informed that Aerlingus has told Cork that the runway is not in itself an issue in relation to transatlantic so presumably an A330 can operate with some sort of an economic payload. Of course Aerlingus don't have a cargo presence from Cork any longer so presumably it would be a pax only service.
There were also reports of a leased 757 operating on ORK JFK to test the viability of the market.
There were also reports of a leased 757 operating on ORK JFK to test the viability of the market.
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Some very very simplified load factor calculations
Hmmm.
I looked at the numbers and, according to the Irish Indo today, there was about 360,000 carried on the route last year.
Works out at:
30,000pax/month
6,923 pax/week
989 pax/day
and, if there's an average of 6 flights/day (based on current Shannon schedule),
164 pax/flight.
put onto an Airbus 321 (with 212 seats, info sourced from wikipedia) that makes up a load factor of about 77%. For the whole year.
put onto an A320 (174 seats) that makes a load factor of 94% for the whole year.
Try 1 and 1/2 hours, and I feel your pain TTT. That's why I'm on SNN's side.
The fact is people from all over the country fly from DUB, and they should not have to. I beleive there is now enough people to make a market from each airport. Bring in airport competition, and this will set the markets right!
I looked at the numbers and, according to the Irish Indo today, there was about 360,000 carried on the route last year.
Works out at:
30,000pax/month
6,923 pax/week
989 pax/day
and, if there's an average of 6 flights/day (based on current Shannon schedule),
164 pax/flight.
put onto an Airbus 321 (with 212 seats, info sourced from wikipedia) that makes up a load factor of about 77%. For the whole year.
put onto an A320 (174 seats) that makes a load factor of 94% for the whole year.
It's soul destroying having to face into a 2 hour car journey when you have an airport 5 minutes from your house.
The fact is people from all over the country fly from DUB, and they should not have to. I beleive there is now enough people to make a market from each airport. Bring in airport competition, and this will set the markets right!
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Shannon has been operating 4x daily (except Sundays when it's 3x daily) with an A320 in the summer months. But I'd imagine their yields aren't so good, when you consider that if you buy a E100 ticket with Aer Lingus, it leaves them with a lot less profit than a E100 ticket with Ryanair because of the charges.
But I completely agree about the pain of the journey to another airport. In the period when Aer Lingus stopped the evening Amsterdam service from Cork, I had to travel through Dublin. Connecting there was such a nightmare I found it preferable to go down to Heuston and come down by train.
But I completely agree about the pain of the journey to another airport. In the period when Aer Lingus stopped the evening Amsterdam service from Cork, I had to travel through Dublin. Connecting there was such a nightmare I found it preferable to go down to Heuston and come down by train.
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Do the cork Folk really think that flying thru Belfast would be more attarctive than driving to SNN. I think I would rather be stuck on the side of the road in say Limerick than the duty free at Aldergrove if something goes tech. One hour on the ground and almost an hour in the air = 2 hours, the time it takes to drive from Cork city to SNN. Not much gained there.
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TTT - should have included a picture of Jackie HR so people could fully appreciate the kind of guy who gets elected in the west of Ireland. Come to think of it a picture of Wille O'Dea is helpful too...
Capt Kremin - point taken re: Mannion.
As for Shannon - maybe it would help if Aer Arann opened a service to Luton to offer some alternative to Ryanair. But then, the people of the Shannon catchment have never supported Aer Arann so why should POC give them another chance to not fly with his airline.
Capt Kremin - point taken re: Mannion.
As for Shannon - maybe it would help if Aer Arann opened a service to Luton to offer some alternative to Ryanair. But then, the people of the Shannon catchment have never supported Aer Arann so why should POC give them another chance to not fly with his airline.