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Join Date: Mar 2006
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Do you really think the GB A320/A321s will stay in "British Airways" Pax configuration philosophy ? easyJet is not looking for such a confort in the cabine.
Do you really think people who have never flown other airbus serie than the 319 will be able to transfer directly on the 320/321 without any line training ? be careful with tailstrikes mate
If 2 BFS or AMS are not lucrative enough, you can always find lots of other routes to make money on a kind of 90 min flight time sector.
Competition is already pretty hard on the Canaries destinations...
But we'll see ...
Do you really think people who have never flown other airbus serie than the 319 will be able to transfer directly on the 320/321 without any line training ? be careful with tailstrikes mate
If 2 BFS or AMS are not lucrative enough, you can always find lots of other routes to make money on a kind of 90 min flight time sector.
Competition is already pretty hard on the Canaries destinations...
But we'll see ...
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MUFC, have you been on the cooking sherry again...?
No chance in hell EZY will retain the GB seating long term, so that argument is blown straight out of the water.
So what? We're talking about a lo-co operation which relies mainly on short sectors and multiple rotations.
Absolute rubbish, plus you have to factor in that BFS or AMS passengers are probably week in week out return customers, not your once a year jolly holiday pax. Return year round business counts for alot.
You know, sometimes it's better to stay silent and appear dumb than to open one's mouth and actually prove it
Stoney
1. A320 has same cabin crew as A319 as EZY have 156 seater version.
2. A319 can fly further than both the A320 and A321.
3. An LPL-AGP in August is much more lucrative on an A319 than two BFS, AMS etc. rotations.
Absolute rubbish, plus you have to factor in that BFS or AMS passengers are probably week in week out return customers, not your once a year jolly holiday pax. Return year round business counts for alot.
4. Converting takes not even a a couple of days and if they wished to convert ALL crews from BOEING to AIRBUS then the A320 series really won't bother them much.
You know, sometimes it's better to stay silent and appear dumb than to open one's mouth and actually prove it
Stoney
Join Date: Nov 2006
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How many seats can you legally squeeze into an A320? The most I can ever remember seeing was an 180 which brings it to just short of a 738. MON may have more than 180 in their 320's as they like to squeeze em in.
Don't forget that FR also fly to the Canaries now and has been said in the FR thread the bar makes a killing and there is hardly anything left coming back - which is where a lot of cash is made and will make a bucket & spade trip more lucrative than Mr Smith sitting in row 1 buying nowt on his way to a meeting.
Don't forget that FR also fly to the Canaries now and has been said in the FR thread the bar makes a killing and there is hardly anything left coming back - which is where a lot of cash is made and will make a bucket & spade trip more lucrative than Mr Smith sitting in row 1 buying nowt on his way to a meeting.
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Stoney
1. Can you prove this?
2. I was not adressing the EZY situation, but the range of the aircraft as a whole.
3. On one flight, there is more money to be made on an AGP rotation than a BFS and an AMS from LPL, but I do agree with you about the business loyal PAX.
2. I was not adressing the EZY situation, but the range of the aircraft as a whole.
3. On one flight, there is more money to be made on an AGP rotation than a BFS and an AMS from LPL, but I do agree with you about the business loyal PAX.
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chrism20How many seats can you legally squeeze into an A320? The most I can ever remember seeing was an 180 which brings it to just short of a 738. MON may have more than 180 in their 320's as they like to squeeze em in.
Join Date: Jul 2003
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"MON may have more than 180 in their 320's as they like to squeeze em in."
You may want to check your facts there ChrisM. MON have 174 seats on all their A320 and offer 7/8 rows of extra legroom seats of 35/36 inches seat pitch at the front. Same applies to their A321s with 214 seats onboard and will apply to all their 757s from May.
You may want to check your facts there ChrisM. MON have 174 seats on all their A320 and offer 7/8 rows of extra legroom seats of 35/36 inches seat pitch at the front. Same applies to their A321s with 214 seats onboard and will apply to all their 757s from May.
Join Date: Aug 2003
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Do you really think people who have never flown other airbus serie than the 319 will be able to transfer directly on the 320/321 without any line training ? be careful with tailstrikes mate
Two sides of A4 which can be read and digested in half an hour will be the only conversion needed for pilots.
As for different engine types - again it is not a problem. The V2500 is an EPR engine (3 spools) whereas the CFM is an N1 engine (two spools) and while there are different limitations, handling techniques and starting sequences it can all be popped onto one side of A4. There might be a 20 question quiz, perhaps? Job done.
There may be some other differences - the GB aircraft are older and may have an earlier model FMS, EFIS screens, Radar and Transponder. I do not know. Once again, it is not a problem.
That said, a more detailed differences course may be decided upon but my point is that it is not necessary. I believe the intention is that ex-GB aircraft will be flown exclusively by ex-GB pilots for the first few months/year until a decision on the longer term use of them is made.
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A lot of the LPL to AGP / ALC/ FAO pax are not once a year bucket and spade punters but regular users travelling to and from holiday homes/ 2nd homes. They use the service just as often as business travellers use some of the other routes. There is a lot of return business on these flights.
As Wingswinger said, the rating held by crews is for the A320 series, covering you from A318 to A321. Minimal training required! Knowing easy there could be some form of training, CD, tech quiz, line flight(s) with a trainer but the cost is not exactly going to be prohibitive!
I think thats what MUFC fan meant, if EZY are happy to go in a big way from Boeing to Airbus then doing a bit of extra training for crews already rated is not going to be an issue!
I can imagine that there would be some routes where the 320/321's would be very welcome on, but then what happens if they go tech / get delayed and you can't fit everyone on the replacment 319. Few factors to feature in the thinking no doubt! Its going to be interesting to see what happens. Do you go whole hog and get more to make it work or just stick with 319's forever!
As Wingswinger said, the rating held by crews is for the A320 series, covering you from A318 to A321. Minimal training required! Knowing easy there could be some form of training, CD, tech quiz, line flight(s) with a trainer but the cost is not exactly going to be prohibitive!
I think thats what MUFC fan meant, if EZY are happy to go in a big way from Boeing to Airbus then doing a bit of extra training for crews already rated is not going to be an issue!
I can imagine that there would be some routes where the 320/321's would be very welcome on, but then what happens if they go tech / get delayed and you can't fit everyone on the replacment 319. Few factors to feature in the thinking no doubt! Its going to be interesting to see what happens. Do you go whole hog and get more to make it work or just stick with 319's forever!
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It's very exciting to have bigger aircraft, A320, A321.... but if it's to see them almost empty (or almost full as you prefer), that's not worth. Europe is not China yet.
It is very good to understand it, but every single flight is different and we learn every day by practice.
I just wonder why pilots at Monarch, GB, etc, dont go straight onto the A321 model
....
But you must be a very good pilot, you don't need any training, just a bit of theory at the most and that's it ! You will never have any of those problems because you understand everything, but just bear in mind you are an exception only
It's excatly like the Dash8 (all versions), The ATR42 and ATR72, the B737-300/400/500/600/700/800/900, the CRJs(all versions), etc...The Type rating is the same on the licence, the systems are mostly exactly the same, but there are some huge differences especially for take off and landing.
As for "the cost is not exactly going to be prohibitive!", ask easyJet to take it from your annual salary and you will see
Do not compare Ryanair with any other airline in Europe. Ryanair is making a lot of money, not thanks to its 0.01 cents tickets but mainly thanks to all the local airports that sponsore ( with millions of cash ) Ryanair for coming.
That's not the same kind of business.
Well spotted
Yes. The baseline model is the 320. All pilots are rated A320/IR covering all variants of the baseline model. The only difference between the 319 and the 320 is the weight. Line-training will not be necessary. The 321 is heavier again and has some minor differences - centre tank fuel pumps, flap speeds, speedbrake deflection angles and the wheels are bigger. Attitude limits on landing are of course different but there is no problem with tail clearance provided a few simple rules are followed. The tail strikes that have occurred have been well analysed and the cause of them is understood.
It is very good to understand it, but every single flight is different and we learn every day by practice.I just wonder why pilots at Monarch, GB, etc, dont go straight onto the A321 model
....But you must be a very good pilot, you don't need any training, just a bit of theory at the most and that's it ! You will never have any of those problems because you understand everything, but just bear in mind you are an exception only
As Wingswinger said, the rating held by crews is for the A320 series, covering you from A318 to A321. Minimal training required! Knowing easy there could be some form of training, CD, tech quiz, line flight(s) with a trainer but As Wingswinger said, the rating held by crews is for the A320 series, covering you from A318 to A321. Minimal training required! Knowing easy there could be some form of training, CD, tech quiz, line flight(s) with a trainer but the cost is not exactly going to be prohibitive! !
As for "the cost is not exactly going to be prohibitive!", ask easyJet to take it from your annual salary and you will see
Don't forget that FR also fly to the Canaries now and has been said in the FR thread the bar makes a killing and there is hardly anything left coming back - which is where a lot of cash is made and will make a bucket & spade trip more lucrative than Mr Smith sitting in row 1 buying nowt on his way to a meeting.
That's not the same kind of business.
I can imagine that there would be some routes where the 320/321's would be very welcome on, but then what happens if they go tech / get delayed and you can't fit everyone on the replacment 319. Few factors to feature in the thinking no doubt! Its going to be interesting to see what happens. Do you go whole hog and get more to make it work or just stick with 319's forever!
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Don't be so touchy there Chrism. I quoted you word for word (including the MAY) and merely corrected your erroneous supposition. I suggest a lay down in the nearest corner and wee dram to settle your nerves. 
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The systems on the B737-300 to 900 were pretty much the same but I'm sure classics had round dials and really noisy wipers and NG's fancy screens! 
Yes they handled slightly differently but it wasn't a major trauma to chop and change between the 2, apart from trying to find where the wx radar was and the EFIS control panel! Many people did it very reguarly! I just don't think there will be a huge amount of training involved for all the crews to change bewteen the 319 to 321. Other airlines seem to manage it.
I don't think it would be that expensive to fly a few sectors with a trainer. He has to be paid anyway and its a revenue earning flight. But i have to be honest I know nothing about running an airline and the costs associated with training where perhaps you do.
I am not claiming to be a good pilot and an exception at all. I consider a few sectors line training to be minimal training compared to a whole type rating and line training lasting a few months!!! Ones a lot of training, ones a lot less. Minimal in comparison! I am not a trainer and haven't flown the 321 but I would hope most of us would be able to figure out how not to tailscrape it after a few flights! Maybe I'm in for a big shock in the difference.
I may have misunderstood but I thought airbus designed all their aircraft with commonality in mind. I'm sure they themselves talk about miminal training to change between types. Although they say changing types is going from the A320 series onto A330 / A340 etc.
Anyway, it may all be a mute point as they may all vanish after the summer season anyway!
Yes they handled slightly differently but it wasn't a major trauma to chop and change between the 2, apart from trying to find where the wx radar was and the EFIS control panel! Many people did it very reguarly! I just don't think there will be a huge amount of training involved for all the crews to change bewteen the 319 to 321. Other airlines seem to manage it.I don't think it would be that expensive to fly a few sectors with a trainer. He has to be paid anyway and its a revenue earning flight. But i have to be honest I know nothing about running an airline and the costs associated with training where perhaps you do.
I am not claiming to be a good pilot and an exception at all. I consider a few sectors line training to be minimal training compared to a whole type rating and line training lasting a few months!!! Ones a lot of training, ones a lot less. Minimal in comparison! I am not a trainer and haven't flown the 321 but I would hope most of us would be able to figure out how not to tailscrape it after a few flights! Maybe I'm in for a big shock in the difference.
I may have misunderstood but I thought airbus designed all their aircraft with commonality in mind. I'm sure they themselves talk about miminal training to change between types. Although they say changing types is going from the A320 series onto A330 / A340 etc.
Anyway, it may all be a mute point as they may all vanish after the summer season anyway!
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It is possible to move between the 19 and 20 without a line check. The 21 is a slightly different animal and should require a line check. Not a big deal really but could be time consuming. They should be able to switch between V25 and CFM with a powerpoint course or alike although not that long ago the CAA made meals of that too.
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What about Glasgow and Edinburgh flights? I have family that are due to fly out to Alicante from Glasgow during one of the strikes and I am flying out to Malaga on the 20th of January which is the day after one of the strikes ends but presumably there would be a backlog. Air Malta plans to transfer their flights to Prestwick but I think only a few flights could be transferred there.
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ICING AOA,
Whether or not I am a good pilot is for others to judge, but I am a TRI/TRE with over 6000 hrs on all variants of the 320 series apart from the 318. In my previous company there was no line training given for transition from one 320 variant to another - just a one or two page differences brief and a quick technical quiz. Will that do for you?
It is very good to understand it, but every single flight is different and we learn every day by practice.
I just wonder why pilots at Monarch, GB, etc, dont go straight onto the A321 model ....
But you must be a very good pilot, you don't need any training, just a bit of theory at the most and that's it ! You will never have any of those problems because you understand everything, but just bear in mind you are an exception only
I just wonder why pilots at Monarch, GB, etc, dont go straight onto the A321 model ....
But you must be a very good pilot, you don't need any training, just a bit of theory at the most and that's it ! You will never have any of those problems because you understand everything, but just bear in mind you are an exception only
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Stacks of new routes now on sale!
We are pleased to announce even more new routes for your summer holiday.
From 1 January 2008 cheap flights are on sale to the following new destinations from London Gatwick and Manchester:
New routes from London Gatwick:
Fly to: Fares from:
Ajaccio (Corsica) £39.99
Bastia (Corsica) £49.99
Biarritz £25.99
Crete (Heraklion) £37.99
Corfu £44.99
Cyprus (Paphos) £49.99
Dalaman £44.99
Gibraltar £29.99
Gran Canaria (Las Palmas) £49.99
Hurghada 1 £89.99
Lanzarote (Arrecife) £44.99
Madeira (Funchal) £31.99
Malta £27.99
Montpellier £25.99
Mykonos £44.99
Nantes £23.99
Rhodes £37.99
Sharm El Sheikh £69.99
Tenerife (South) £49.99
Thessaloniki £27.99
New routes from our NEW departure airport Manchester
Fly to: Fares from:
Crete (Heraklion) £44.99
Cyprus (Paphos) £37.99
Malta £34.99
Tenerife (South) £44.99
All these great new routes can be booked to fly between 30 March and 30 September 2008 which means that you now have even more choice for your summer holiday!
www.easyjet.com
We are pleased to announce even more new routes for your summer holiday.
From 1 January 2008 cheap flights are on sale to the following new destinations from London Gatwick and Manchester:
New routes from London Gatwick:
Fly to: Fares from:
Ajaccio (Corsica) £39.99
Bastia (Corsica) £49.99
Biarritz £25.99
Crete (Heraklion) £37.99
Corfu £44.99
Cyprus (Paphos) £49.99
Dalaman £44.99
Gibraltar £29.99
Gran Canaria (Las Palmas) £49.99
Hurghada 1 £89.99
Lanzarote (Arrecife) £44.99
Madeira (Funchal) £31.99
Malta £27.99
Montpellier £25.99
Mykonos £44.99
Nantes £23.99
Rhodes £37.99
Sharm El Sheikh £69.99
Tenerife (South) £49.99
Thessaloniki £27.99
New routes from our NEW departure airport Manchester
Fly to: Fares from:
Crete (Heraklion) £44.99
Cyprus (Paphos) £37.99
Malta £34.99
Tenerife (South) £44.99
All these great new routes can be booked to fly between 30 March and 30 September 2008 which means that you now have even more choice for your summer holiday!
www.easyjet.com