DONCASTER/SHEFFIELD
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: York
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I've heard the 'special' rates deal by the council is now up at Donny and it's starting to cause them some very big headaches.
Honeymoon period well-and-truly over according to my source, and they are genuinely worried about prospects of attracting new interest because the airport is passing on the rates-hike to customers.
Anyone?
Honeymoon period well-and-truly over according to my source, and they are genuinely worried about prospects of attracting new interest because the airport is passing on the rates-hike to customers.
Anyone?
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Swadlincote
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Anyone heard about the new budget carrier planning to launch from DSA.
Starting next sumer, FlyEm with a B738 plans to fly from DSA to Paris, Rome, Spanish mainland and the balearic and canary islands. As well as seasonal routes to Geneva, Prague and Vienna and some destinations in Germany and Italy. Within 12 months it hopes to have 4 738s.
SAM-EMA
Starting next sumer, FlyEm with a B738 plans to fly from DSA to Paris, Rome, Spanish mainland and the balearic and canary islands. As well as seasonal routes to Geneva, Prague and Vienna and some destinations in Germany and Italy. Within 12 months it hopes to have 4 738s.
SAM-EMA
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: , England
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Well they must be planning on having some really low fares to able to fill up the 738 on these ''planned'' routes especially on flights to Paris where Thomsonfly tried and dropped this route due to poor passenger load factors and was even operated by a 735, then again with the right timings i think the route could have done much better with an early morning flgiht throughout the week and and a late evening flight on a sunday. Not only that but bmibaby operate this route double daily from EMA and Jet2 will also be operating the route twice daily next summer from LBA which are both not too far away from DSA. As for a new low fare airline starting up from an airport such as DSA i think using an aircaft the size of the 738 is not going to be in favour for them but then again who knows. Hopefully another airline will base at least one aicraft here sometime soon if if its another charter airline to be able to offer a wider range of destinations other than the usual Spain and Canary flights.
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Leeds
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A 738 is a good choice of aircraft, but as noted the benefits will be reaped by taking it to the end of its range to pastures new for a lo-co. 738 and A320 will be the absolute minimum standard for UK lo-co's soon.
Maybe a 'safe' conventional lo-co destination is still a good idea to start with, but as noted, the timings would need to be right and choice of route should be deemed commercially sound on a regional basis and NOT an airport basis. LBA and EMA must be taken into consideration by DSA, as should HUY if it were to ever attract a lo-co. They cannot plan to operate in isolation.
Lo-co is diversifying and morphing - if these guys start as they mean to go on, then capacity in the evolved model is there for the taking. Slagwagons to the Costa Brava are definitely not the way to go.
Maybe a 'safe' conventional lo-co destination is still a good idea to start with, but as noted, the timings would need to be right and choice of route should be deemed commercially sound on a regional basis and NOT an airport basis. LBA and EMA must be taken into consideration by DSA, as should HUY if it were to ever attract a lo-co. They cannot plan to operate in isolation.
Lo-co is diversifying and morphing - if these guys start as they mean to go on, then capacity in the evolved model is there for the taking. Slagwagons to the Costa Brava are definitely not the way to go.
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Near MME, England, UK
Age: 35
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New UK Start-up ~ FlyEm
Just received my latest edition of Airliner World magazine, and in it there is a small article on new UK-based start-ups, one is the latest development at UK International Airlines, they've been awarded an AOC, the other is PremJet, a proposed London Luton start-up described separately in another thread.
The third is an airline called FlyEm, a new budget airline looking to launch operations at Robin Hood Doncaster Sheffield with a single leased Boeing 737-800. They are hoping to begin services next summer, flying to continental cities and the mediterranean, including Paris, Rome the Spanish Mainland and the Balearic and Canary Islands, with seasonal flights to Geneva, Prague and Vienna as well as destinations in Germany and Italy for Winter 2008. They hope to carry approx 360,000 pax in their first 12 months, as well as producing £40 million of revenue in the same period. Once they've achieved this they will embark on phase two of their plans, which at this point in time only involves the acquisition of four further B737-800s.
Now you're probably thinking oh not another dead-in-the-water LCC start-up, but from what the article says, they certainly seem more organised than previous start-ups, and the thinking behind it all seems accurate enough - the demand for these services certainly does exist from DSA, but the question I'd be asking if I were them is where do we go after that?
Regards.
The third is an airline called FlyEm, a new budget airline looking to launch operations at Robin Hood Doncaster Sheffield with a single leased Boeing 737-800. They are hoping to begin services next summer, flying to continental cities and the mediterranean, including Paris, Rome the Spanish Mainland and the Balearic and Canary Islands, with seasonal flights to Geneva, Prague and Vienna as well as destinations in Germany and Italy for Winter 2008. They hope to carry approx 360,000 pax in their first 12 months, as well as producing £40 million of revenue in the same period. Once they've achieved this they will embark on phase two of their plans, which at this point in time only involves the acquisition of four further B737-800s.
Now you're probably thinking oh not another dead-in-the-water LCC start-up, but from what the article says, they certainly seem more organised than previous start-ups, and the thinking behind it all seems accurate enough - the demand for these services certainly does exist from DSA, but the question I'd be asking if I were them is where do we go after that?
Regards.
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: reality
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So that means over £110 revenue per pax per flight..less start up costs, advertising, fixed costs, AOC, lease costs of a 738 (approx 80k +/-20% per month)...
The person(s)/company/financial house behind them must have deep pockets.....
...and they expect Doncaster to Vienna to work?
The person(s)/company/financial house behind them must have deep pockets.....
...and they expect Doncaster to Vienna to work?
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: York
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I don't doubt they've done their homework to an extent - it's getting harder and harder to get commercial lenders to part with their cash at the moment, unless your business plan is completely watertight, as I've just found out for myself with a nailed-on housing development with planning permission, but that's a different story.
Back to the plot... I've worked heavily in market research in the past, and it's all too easy to arrive at the answers you wanted to arrive at.
You ask Mrs Boggins at the Frenchgate Centre on a wet and windy afternoon in February where she fancies going on holiday next year, then poke her a list of generic lo-co destinations and ask her to tick 3, and hey presto! Waddya know - she'd love to go to Vienna.
I wish them all the very best, I really do... but 986 passengers a-day in a 189 seat 737-800 for a start-up (i.e. unknown) airline...
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Doncaster
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A search on Companies House shows the registered office to be in Grimsby, a further search on upmystreet.com shows the address belongs to a terraced house in Grimsby, hardly what you would expect for an airline office, even a start up.
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Leeds
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Photon
Don't judge them too much on their address at this stage. Orion Airways was 'born' in the back bedroom of a bungalow in Luton. As soon as it got started the legal address was changed to EMA. It's just a legal nicety.
Don't judge them too much on their address at this stage. Orion Airways was 'born' in the back bedroom of a bungalow in Luton. As soon as it got started the legal address was changed to EMA. It's just a legal nicety.
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Doncaster
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This is a bit of a trying time for DSA at the moment, with TOM pulling back to only offer routes where they do charter holidays. But a lot of the same smaller regional airports like MME and ABZ seem also to be suffering the same problems.
Things go up and down, but I think DSA will ultimately be a success.
Things go up and down, but I think DSA will ultimately be a success.
Last edited by johnnychips; 12th Oct 2007 at 23:05. Reason: spelling
DSA no hope for business ops...
Following from what people have said on another forum, i would like a pro's opinion....
I believe, after the hype, that DSA is nothing more than a bucket and spade airport. The one business flight it has is poorly performing..
Is it ever likely to get the long-haul flights it made a stir over before it became operational?
Personaly i just cant see it, ok maybe GSM... but they arent returning to YHM next year!
I think Emirates is a pipe dream, LBA will get that along with any flight to JFK or EWR... There is just not the demand from the region as it is, you can see that if you look for the figures! The 2mppa using MAN from Yorks/Humber, around 85,000 are going to New York... Only 19% of which are business users. You will need more than that to make it sustainable, if DSA cant attract a flag carrier to any European hub what chance in hell have they got of attracting one to an american or middle eastern hub?
LBA is the most viable out of the three. Largest catchment area by far, already popular business destinations served so can expand on that, major city as opposed to Doncaster/Sheffield... The length of the runway is no issue as the types that would be required can be accomodated (there will be NO 747/A380's from Yorkshire!!) The surface links may not be so good but that realy is not an issue! Airlines wont look at that when they compare the figures and look at the facts! Shaheen, whilst being unreliable so far, have opted for LBA over DSA!!!
DSA is a smaller version of EMA, always will be, it will try and attract as many cargo flights as it can.. It may get some charter long-haul, as EMA does though i dont see it as being so important, they will always be relying on the bottom of the market bucket and spade destinations im afraid to say.
This leaves HUY in the position of expanding as it can, growth will be minimal, the odd scheduled destination may be added. AMS is unlikely to go (HUY is one of KLM's larger regional spokes) but no real appeal to lo-co, now that DSA is running, and charters will come and go as the market dictates.....
I believe, after the hype, that DSA is nothing more than a bucket and spade airport. The one business flight it has is poorly performing..
Is it ever likely to get the long-haul flights it made a stir over before it became operational?
Personaly i just cant see it, ok maybe GSM... but they arent returning to YHM next year!
I think Emirates is a pipe dream, LBA will get that along with any flight to JFK or EWR... There is just not the demand from the region as it is, you can see that if you look for the figures! The 2mppa using MAN from Yorks/Humber, around 85,000 are going to New York... Only 19% of which are business users. You will need more than that to make it sustainable, if DSA cant attract a flag carrier to any European hub what chance in hell have they got of attracting one to an american or middle eastern hub?
LBA is the most viable out of the three. Largest catchment area by far, already popular business destinations served so can expand on that, major city as opposed to Doncaster/Sheffield... The length of the runway is no issue as the types that would be required can be accomodated (there will be NO 747/A380's from Yorkshire!!) The surface links may not be so good but that realy is not an issue! Airlines wont look at that when they compare the figures and look at the facts! Shaheen, whilst being unreliable so far, have opted for LBA over DSA!!!
DSA is a smaller version of EMA, always will be, it will try and attract as many cargo flights as it can.. It may get some charter long-haul, as EMA does though i dont see it as being so important, they will always be relying on the bottom of the market bucket and spade destinations im afraid to say.
This leaves HUY in the position of expanding as it can, growth will be minimal, the odd scheduled destination may be added. AMS is unlikely to go (HUY is one of KLM's larger regional spokes) but no real appeal to lo-co, now that DSA is running, and charters will come and go as the market dictates.....
