HEATHROW
Join Date: Aug 2002
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Techman 5 you are surely aware that due to the space constraints at Heathrow bussing is necessary. Terminal 5 was build in a modular format with the first two parts always intended to open ahead of the final part due in 2010.
I too have been parked at Terminal 5C and bussed but unlike the split ops between T1 and T4 the buses seem to be a Hell of a lot better at being there on time. The delay in the baggage is pretty poor though, I agree.
It's incredibly naive to think that. The government doesn't order airlines to serve Heathrow at the expense of the rest of the country. The market dictates that. What role does the government have in telling people to expand Newcastle Airport? If the airport attracts a lot of business and needs to expand then great but please stop whinging about London getting a half decent airport at last. It is after all 30 years late (!)
As to the Terminal facilities experienced at a typical Ryanair airport, T5 beats them hands down every time.
I too have been parked at Terminal 5C and bussed but unlike the split ops between T1 and T4 the buses seem to be a Hell of a lot better at being there on time. The delay in the baggage is pretty poor though, I agree.
Ryanair, Easyjet and the other profitable airlines have woken up to there being a country outside the M25. When will the government also wake up and move expansion to Birmingham, Manchester and Newcastle?
As to the Terminal facilities experienced at a typical Ryanair airport, T5 beats them hands down every time.
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Sorry doesn't cut it
The response to my experience of T5 appears to be that it was designed to be poor. Well, no wonder that this country is fast disappearing when we design our hyper expensive and much flaunted infrastructure to be rubbish from the outset, and then use this as an excuse.
I think the point that they built a shopping mall and forgot about the planes is valid. Other airports at least appear to put travelling on a level with shopping.
Tony Adams and Phil Scolari will tell you that the excuses don't matter, its the results that count, and that is what I think about T5.
Other countries will be laughing even more at T5 than they have been at our response to 2" of snow (and haven't they). I haven't heard of any far eastern country deliberately designing poor facilities.
Luckily I can get to Europe from my regional airport (via a host of (sometimes) low cost airlines, and for long haul, my first port of call in future will be either Emirates (East) or Continental (West) who both fly from my regional airport to see if I can avoid LHR.
Sorry BA, its nothing against your service, but your management were presumably heavily involved in the T5 project, and they got it wrong.
I think the point that they built a shopping mall and forgot about the planes is valid. Other airports at least appear to put travelling on a level with shopping.
Tony Adams and Phil Scolari will tell you that the excuses don't matter, its the results that count, and that is what I think about T5.
Other countries will be laughing even more at T5 than they have been at our response to 2" of snow (and haven't they). I haven't heard of any far eastern country deliberately designing poor facilities.
Luckily I can get to Europe from my regional airport (via a host of (sometimes) low cost airlines, and for long haul, my first port of call in future will be either Emirates (East) or Continental (West) who both fly from my regional airport to see if I can avoid LHR.
Sorry BA, its nothing against your service, but your management were presumably heavily involved in the T5 project, and they got it wrong.
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T5
Well said MUFC.
I have not personally experienced T5 yet but my daughter and her husband have just returned from a holiday in the far east travelling between MAN and HKG via LHR T5.
Their experience was very positive in both directions and they described T5 as a 'nice experience, far better than HKG and equally as good as Singapore'. On the return journey, due to the late arrival into T5, they had only 55 minutes between touch down and departure of the flight to Manchester. Despite having to clear security,they made it with 10 mins to spare although their baggage obviously did not. Regarding the baggage, they received a text message the following morning stating that it would be delivered to their home at 13.35 that day. Sure enough the doorbell rang at exactly 13.35.
As I see it, the point of a good air terminal is the efficient throughput of passengers in comfort and safety. T5 seems to meet this criteria quite nicely.
I have not personally experienced T5 yet but my daughter and her husband have just returned from a holiday in the far east travelling between MAN and HKG via LHR T5.
Their experience was very positive in both directions and they described T5 as a 'nice experience, far better than HKG and equally as good as Singapore'. On the return journey, due to the late arrival into T5, they had only 55 minutes between touch down and departure of the flight to Manchester. Despite having to clear security,they made it with 10 mins to spare although their baggage obviously did not. Regarding the baggage, they received a text message the following morning stating that it would be delivered to their home at 13.35 that day. Sure enough the doorbell rang at exactly 13.35.
As I see it, the point of a good air terminal is the efficient throughput of passengers in comfort and safety. T5 seems to meet this criteria quite nicely.
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Good to hear postive comments re:T5 and much in line with comments from colleagues, etc who find the experience first class. Canīt wait myself to use it after some grim experiences at some other foreign airports.
Paxing All Over The World
beamender99
In which case that will probably get changed in a couple of years, once experience has come to bear.
The idea of rebuilding Sipson so that folks could stay together and the talk about the rebuilding of London in the 50s, reminds me of the countless families being forcibly moved out to the New Towns and then finding - just how fabulous it was to be in a new house! I have met hundreds of families that moved out from Paddington/Marylebone/Euston/Kings Cross (and other North London points) to Hertfordshire and Middlesex and 99% thought it was fantastic.
Sipson is not not just houses and it's not just money. Everyone has piled in and LHR will never get a fair trail.
Under present regs the A380s do NOT increase passenger numbers. They need extra separation thus negating the apparent benefit of extra seats.
The idea of rebuilding Sipson so that folks could stay together and the talk about the rebuilding of London in the 50s, reminds me of the countless families being forcibly moved out to the New Towns and then finding - just how fabulous it was to be in a new house! I have met hundreds of families that moved out from Paddington/Marylebone/Euston/Kings Cross (and other North London points) to Hertfordshire and Middlesex and 99% thought it was fantastic.
Sipson is not not just houses and it's not just money. Everyone has piled in and LHR will never get a fair trail.
Think you'll find that three of the six daily slots for the Heathrow-Milan are coming from bmi. Two are the ones used for Heathrow-Jersey up to the end of March and the other one is a spare due to discontinued routes ex LHR (I think Naples and Palma, but can't tell which one is which). For the other three, I strongly suspect that Lufthansa is about to chop Heathrow/Cologne.
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Palma flights on sale in April, Naples doesn't appear in the booking engine so presume its Naples which has got axed
Surprised BD havent started codesharing on LHR-MXP yet
Surprised BD havent started codesharing on LHR-MXP yet
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Think you'll find that three of the six daily slots for the Heathrow-Milan are coming from bmi. Two are the ones used for Heathrow-Jersey up to the end of March and the other one is a spare due to discontinued routes ex LHR (I think Naples and Palma, but can't tell which one is which). For the other three, I strongly suspect that Lufthansa is about to chop Heathrow/Cologne.
Any hard facts for this? Lufthansa is selling those flights. The only change is that they revert back from a Boeing 737-500 to a Avro RJ85 again with effect summer schedule.
Lufthansa will also need three pair of slots for the TXL-flights that will be shifted from LCY to LHR. So in total they will need 9 pair of slots, 6 for MXP and 3 for TXL.
Last edited by virginblue; 18th Feb 2009 at 14:12.
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I'm curious why you think that LHR / CGN may be axed. It wasn't too long ago that the London / Cologne route was served by 2xEZY ex LGW, 3xBA 319 (even saw a 757 once after irropps) and 3xLH CRJ's, as well as a gaggle of Germanwings flights to Stanstead. Now the route is down to 3xLH 737, 1xEZY, plus the associated Germanwings flights.
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Slot pairs
The BMI discontinuations releases 24.5 slot pairs on the MME route (the .5 is because there are 3 flights upto MME on a Saturday but only 2 coming into LHR) & on LBA 25.5 slot pairs (again 1 less flight southbound on a Sunday), so a total of 50 available for LH to expand in other directions!
Last edited by ChalfontFlyer; 22nd Feb 2009 at 07:28. Reason: grammar
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More fuel for the argument against the third runway
From todays London Daily Telegraph
Business leaders question third runway plan for Heathrow Airport - Telegraph
Some common sense?
Business leaders question third runway plan for Heathrow Airport - Telegraph
Some common sense?
Join Date: Aug 2002
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Watching Theresa Villiers not being pressed on the Tories "policy" on Heathrow on BBC London tonight as she wittered on about trains being the answer to free up much needed capacity.
What percentage of movements per business day ( Mon-Fri ) is UK domestic of the total available movements?
Taking UK mainland domestic flights per day :
Aberdeen = 13
BA 7
BD 6
Edinburgh = 19
BA 11
BD 8
Glasgow = 18
BA 10
BD 8
Newcastle = 6
BA 6
Manchester = 16
BA 9
BD 7
_____________
72 Daily Flights
_____________
So I guess that's *roughly* 144 daily slots at Heathrow that go into the mainland UK domestic. What's the daily total number of slots please?
I want to vote Tory to get that strange man out of Downing Street but I honestly think this policy is dishonest as the mechanism for freeing up splace makes no sense when you look at the small mumber of flights.
I have excluded Belfast as being an part of this policy as the train option is patently not realsitic. I guess we could also add Paris and Brussels as direct Eurostar options.
NOTE
Domestic routes abandoned since Heathrow was opened up to competition again in the 1990s include :
Inverness
Leeds-Bradford
Teesside
Birmingham
East Midlands
Newquay
Plymouth
Isle of Man
Jersey
Guernsey
What percentage of movements per business day ( Mon-Fri ) is UK domestic of the total available movements?
Taking UK mainland domestic flights per day :
Aberdeen = 13
BA 7
BD 6
Edinburgh = 19
BA 11
BD 8
Glasgow = 18
BA 10
BD 8
Newcastle = 6
BA 6
Manchester = 16
BA 9
BD 7
_____________
72 Daily Flights
_____________
So I guess that's *roughly* 144 daily slots at Heathrow that go into the mainland UK domestic. What's the daily total number of slots please?
I want to vote Tory to get that strange man out of Downing Street but I honestly think this policy is dishonest as the mechanism for freeing up splace makes no sense when you look at the small mumber of flights.
I have excluded Belfast as being an part of this policy as the train option is patently not realsitic. I guess we could also add Paris and Brussels as direct Eurostar options.
NOTE
Domestic routes abandoned since Heathrow was opened up to competition again in the 1990s include :
Inverness
Leeds-Bradford
Teesside
Birmingham
East Midlands
Newquay
Plymouth
Isle of Man
Jersey
Guernsey
vkid - details can be found at Let me google that for you
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I believe the percentage is about 10%, about 4yrs growth in normal times.
However I believe a large proportion are transfer pax, so the option of using a train would be very inconvienient.
However I believe a large proportion are transfer pax, so the option of using a train would be very inconvienient.
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Quite a lot of routes have been moved to Heathrow from other airpots to keep the slots. Manchester & Birmingham would have more direct flights if airlines did not need to fly from Heathrow just to keep slots.
The big rise in air travel has been driven by a sharp reduction in ticket prices. The system cannot last as airlines need higher prices to make profits given that we will never have very cheap fuel again.
When BAA monoply ends we could see Gatwick fight for more routes and under cut heathrow.
The big rise in air travel has been driven by a sharp reduction in ticket prices. The system cannot last as airlines need higher prices to make profits given that we will never have very cheap fuel again.
When BAA monoply ends we could see Gatwick fight for more routes and under cut heathrow.