what's happening at Azzurra?
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Robin & Avroliner
Its because I think highly of Air Malta (after all we are all pilots for the same company) that I don't want the low cost operation to be operated using KM aircraft and livery. When one looks at a Ryanair aircraft, its automatically associated with the 'low cost no frills' trade. However when one looks at say a 'Singapore Airlines aircraft one immediately thinks of quality service. Air Malta and Finnair are the only airlines in Europe using the same aircraft for both their schedule and charter flights. Are we going to be using the same aircraft also for the low cost service to Stansted? I sincerely hope not.
Il-Milied u s-sena tajba guys. See you around.
Its because I think highly of Air Malta (after all we are all pilots for the same company) that I don't want the low cost operation to be operated using KM aircraft and livery. When one looks at a Ryanair aircraft, its automatically associated with the 'low cost no frills' trade. However when one looks at say a 'Singapore Airlines aircraft one immediately thinks of quality service. Air Malta and Finnair are the only airlines in Europe using the same aircraft for both their schedule and charter flights. Are we going to be using the same aircraft also for the low cost service to Stansted? I sincerely hope not.
Il-Milied u s-sena tajba guys. See you around.
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The two 737 aircraft are back in service. ZS has up to 3 flights per day at the moment. The BGY FCO route is still operational and charter flights to Sharm-el-Sheik are still on.
Yet it seems G7 head, Mr. Palmonella wants to see KM out of ZS. His comments about the Maltese and KM are not appreciated at all. He stated that he will take over KM's part.
Guess it's either G7 or KM. I cannot see any sort of collaboration between the two. KM is a national carrier, and G7 is a bunch of guess what! What do they know about flying after all.
At this stage the best idea is to wait, and if things go G7's way then remove the part of the Maltese cross from ZS logo and withdraw maltese staff back. Pity all the millions (hundreds of them) invested by KM are given for free to such a company with such a bad curriculum.
Time will tell........
Yet it seems G7 head, Mr. Palmonella wants to see KM out of ZS. His comments about the Maltese and KM are not appreciated at all. He stated that he will take over KM's part.
Guess it's either G7 or KM. I cannot see any sort of collaboration between the two. KM is a national carrier, and G7 is a bunch of guess what! What do they know about flying after all.
At this stage the best idea is to wait, and if things go G7's way then remove the part of the Maltese cross from ZS logo and withdraw maltese staff back. Pity all the millions (hundreds of them) invested by KM are given for free to such a company with such a bad curriculum.
Time will tell........
Last edited by Hawk; 2nd Jan 2004 at 22:09.
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Palmonella and 7G have been oficially removed from the list of take-over candidates from Air Littoral which is now for 3 weeks under observation and allowing them time to find another take-over candidate. Palmonella ( he was actually convicted to three years jail in a mafia trial in Rome some years ago ).
Don't mention the name Azzurra in France any longer - Palmonella has done great harm to italian business promotion....
Air Littoral used to bea great regional Airline with good reputation in the south of France and it is french politicians ( who else....) who f...ed up the whole change of ownership scenario.
Don't mention the name Azzurra in France any longer - Palmonella has done great harm to italian business promotion....
Air Littoral used to bea great regional Airline with good reputation in the south of France and it is french politicians ( who else....) who f...ed up the whole change of ownership scenario.
Last edited by Hawk; 2nd Jan 2004 at 22:16.
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Azzurra air seems to be hitten by a lil ray of sun! 
on January I'm flying to Marsalam, Budapest (all B-737 as you know RJ are in Exeter) at the same time, pilots finished courses on A-320 and cabin crew are starting now, the 7th of jan 5 intense days plus a visit on board to be able to fly on that aircraft.
Voices that on the 7th Jan Company should be closedare gone.
Maybe Maltese crew will go away and then...well don't ask me what will happen....our salary has been regulary paid and just for now no dismissals....
Let's stay here and look.....
just one thing....what was that voice about a possibly crash of one of our jets?...technicians are still well trained...maybe a threat?
brgrds
Skunkie
on January I'm flying to Marsalam, Budapest (all B-737 as you know RJ are in Exeter) at the same time, pilots finished courses on A-320 and cabin crew are starting now, the 7th of jan 5 intense days plus a visit on board to be able to fly on that aircraft.
Voices that on the 7th Jan Company should be closedare gone.
Maybe Maltese crew will go away and then...well don't ask me what will happen....our salary has been regulary paid and just for now no dismissals....
Let's stay here and look.....just one thing....what was that voice about a possibly crash of one of our jets?...technicians are still well trained...maybe a threat?
brgrds
Skunkie
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azzurraair
hi guys i worked with azzurraair last summer.
im presently not operating for them<better times for me>.
i have freinds who do work there and they are up in arms as well as the company never tell there crew the truth its all this and that and no answers.
the 2 aircraft are still operating<a320>,one of which is leased on a use by day basis.
they havent enough crew to cover flights hence why flights are recently being canx.
they are now up for training in italy next week,whos paying dont ask havent a clue,staying in hotel for 3 weeks at 45.00 per day allowance,to again there italian license as this is a requirement by italian law for wen and yes a big wen,then go it alone,meant to be feb/march wen km have nothing more to do with them,and so they shouldnt this airline is a disgrace,the ones i feel sorry for are the crew they are diamonds,and have helped this airline out to far...
im presently not operating for them<better times for me>.
i have freinds who do work there and they are up in arms as well as the company never tell there crew the truth its all this and that and no answers.
the 2 aircraft are still operating<a320>,one of which is leased on a use by day basis.
they havent enough crew to cover flights hence why flights are recently being canx.
they are now up for training in italy next week,whos paying dont ask havent a clue,staying in hotel for 3 weeks at 45.00 per day allowance,to again there italian license as this is a requirement by italian law for wen and yes a big wen,then go it alone,meant to be feb/march wen km have nothing more to do with them,and so they shouldnt this airline is a disgrace,the ones i feel sorry for are the crew they are diamonds,and have helped this airline out to far...
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well, it looks like they put 15 mil. in the Company, but really nobody saw them......I mean, as soon as I see cash I believe in it; anyway those money should cover Azzurra up to 15th of February.
Right now they are discussing this and communicating to the pilots & cabin crew associations......tomorrow we will know a bit more.
Anyway I know (should be my flight) that Azzurra operates Adriatica airlines a/c, which are supposed to be in the U.K. blacklist......I opened a 3d to have more infos about that.
Obviously they use their aircraft to go to Sharm-el-Sheikh...with italian pax....all crew and equipment are croatian and only a purser for commercial services should be on board.
This is not exactly a good new for Azzurra's employers....
KM is definitely out of these operations. I wonder where the money are coming from and if it is REAL money or just the usual promise
Skunkie
Right now they are discussing this and communicating to the pilots & cabin crew associations......tomorrow we will know a bit more.
Anyway I know (should be my flight) that Azzurra operates Adriatica airlines a/c, which are supposed to be in the U.K. blacklist......I opened a 3d to have more infos about that.
Obviously they use their aircraft to go to Sharm-el-Sheikh...with italian pax....all crew and equipment are croatian and only a purser for commercial services should be on board.
This is not exactly a good new for Azzurra's employers....
KM is definitely out of these operations. I wonder where the money are coming from and if it is REAL money or just the usual promise
Skunkie
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On 9th jan Azzurra air hosted a "party" where people should be informed of the situation...nothing specific came out ( I wasn't present).
7G promised a first tranche of recapitalization 10 mil Euros ( should be enough up to 15th February).
Maltese 49% got an ultimatum to give 6 mil. Euros, they shuold give, as an ultimatum , the 30th of January.
If they refuse, 7G should cover these money (.....) and maltese will be not cut out, but only reduced their shares in the Company.
This could be (my opinion) a strategy to reduce their shares proportionally and, step by step exit from the Company not in a drastical manner.
Crew are supposed to be sent in Manchester base, with no choice (exept the anzianity list) anyway, just for the moment it is all posticipated to the 15th of january.
During th party no practical news has been explained.
Maltese crew (5 Maltese Captain at the moment) will go back to Malta.
Let's hope in better period
Right now we (as Cabin Crew, are flying on Saturday and Sunday and not more - no scheduled flights are at the moment available, only ad hoc flights and some charters with B-737/700).
Skunkie
7G promised a first tranche of recapitalization 10 mil Euros ( should be enough up to 15th February).
Maltese 49% got an ultimatum to give 6 mil. Euros, they shuold give, as an ultimatum , the 30th of January.
If they refuse, 7G should cover these money (.....) and maltese will be not cut out, but only reduced their shares in the Company.
This could be (my opinion) a strategy to reduce their shares proportionally and, step by step exit from the Company not in a drastical manner.
Crew are supposed to be sent in Manchester base, with no choice (exept the anzianity list) anyway, just for the moment it is all posticipated to the 15th of january.
During th party no practical news has been explained.
Maltese crew (5 Maltese Captain at the moment) will go back to Malta.
Let's hope in better period
Right now we (as Cabin Crew, are flying on Saturday and Sunday and not more - no scheduled flights are at the moment available, only ad hoc flights and some charters with B-737/700).
Skunkie
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I did hope KM will try some statagy, which it did! G7 10 million euros ultimatum is about 2 weeks prior to ours ..6 million. If G7 delivers... very doubtful.... than good luck to ZS. However maltese crew could and would go, at long last.
Maltese crew in ZS are, as always, filling up the gaps, and doing most of the training according JAR OPS. They are the only holders of a JAR licence, issued by a country which has been operating on very high standards.
If G7 does not deliver than it is them who will loose ZS... Last in first out. KM could and should use this opportunity to expand into foreign bases come May. A320 crews in KM are very well trained, and KM was one of the first carriers to have them.
KM has created this company and I am positive that they will have plans to make it viable. It is KM who has always invested in the company.... 7 years. It is simply not fair that some G7 comes up with loads of promises which to date have never been honoured.
Again, KM is a national carrier and G7 is... em... what is it exacly.... I just do not know, beleive me. All I know is that it has a history of failures. Maltese staff feel that it is their baby. Most Italian staff share our opinion.
Conclusion.... ZS is still on the negotiating table.
Skunkie I hope I clarified the situation, even though I write to the best of my knowledge, and I also could be mistaken.
Robin this is as far as I know for the moment, again to the best of my knowledge.
Best regards to all following this threrad
Hi Robin,
Things in ZS change by the hour. No one actually knows what is up anyone elses sleeve. It is like a chess game. No one declares his next move! Recapitalisation took place just yesterday. As from tomorrow things can change. I am happy KM did not bail out as that meant loosing a 7 year investment overnight. I think they did the correct move.
I am not aware of any site which sheds true transparent light on the story.
Maltese crew in ZS are, as always, filling up the gaps, and doing most of the training according JAR OPS. They are the only holders of a JAR licence, issued by a country which has been operating on very high standards.
If G7 does not deliver than it is them who will loose ZS... Last in first out. KM could and should use this opportunity to expand into foreign bases come May. A320 crews in KM are very well trained, and KM was one of the first carriers to have them.
KM has created this company and I am positive that they will have plans to make it viable. It is KM who has always invested in the company.... 7 years. It is simply not fair that some G7 comes up with loads of promises which to date have never been honoured.
Again, KM is a national carrier and G7 is... em... what is it exacly.... I just do not know, beleive me. All I know is that it has a history of failures. Maltese staff feel that it is their baby. Most Italian staff share our opinion.
Conclusion.... ZS is still on the negotiating table.
Skunkie I hope I clarified the situation, even though I write to the best of my knowledge, and I also could be mistaken.
Robin this is as far as I know for the moment, again to the best of my knowledge.
Best regards to all following this threrad
Hi Robin,
Things in ZS change by the hour. No one actually knows what is up anyone elses sleeve. It is like a chess game. No one declares his next move! Recapitalisation took place just yesterday. As from tomorrow things can change. I am happy KM did not bail out as that meant loosing a 7 year investment overnight. I think they did the correct move.
I am not aware of any site which sheds true transparent light on the story.
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I fully agree with what Avroliner said. Air Malta must have some strategy with regards to Azzurra. If not they would have sold it at the time the Minister for IT and Govenment Affairs announced that KM's shares were to be sold shortly.
I stand to be corrected but I believe that Manchester's operation is being run by Air Malta. The operation is a 100% success and the charterer is willing to sell more seats provided such seats are available.
G7 will shortly be out of the equation. KM has other plans for ZS.
Regards
I stand to be corrected but I believe that Manchester's operation is being run by Air Malta. The operation is a 100% success and the charterer is willing to sell more seats provided such seats are available.
G7 will shortly be out of the equation. KM has other plans for ZS.
Regards
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NetSet
I fully agree with you and Avroliner (as long as it results you are Maltese, you should know what is happening over there).
Remaining an Cabin Crew strategy, all CC flying from Manchester (Bristol is only summer base) are now attending a converse course in Italy, in the case the two EI-DBD, EI-DBC will became Italian
I just pass the test on A-320 (absolutely NOT Jar Ops except some particulars almost regarding cockpit crew).
No exact procedures have been explaind to us, only Airbus general, and we don't know which aircraft and from where will (if) arrive.
The course was 3 days long...I'm always on pc and I find it "quite easy" but is not the same for all Cabine Crew. Then we got test (yesterday morn) based on company SOP, but easier that a lot of things will change!
Tha 4 A320-200 ordered by Air Malta, when our Chairman was still Maltes won't arrive. They are stopped by the same leasing company who took back our Irish B737-700 (nowadays we operate with two German 737-700).
So we don't really know where this A320 will come from, surely second handed, with charateristic totally or partially different from ours.
Great part of Cabin Crew operating in Manchester are from U.K. and their contract is very low....according , anyway to the cost of life in U.K.
If they will start operating in Italy, their salary will be adequated to the cost of life in Italy, so they will gain less then us 8note that we operate as a low cost...737 carries 3 Cabin Crew, the service is not good as Air Malta's but we got duty free (all manual, if you mistake your payment will be lowered) and we got hot meals and so on...only difference all economy class....
Nowadays some pursers from Azzurra went to Toulose and they are abilitated to fly U.K./Maltese a320....everything has been hidden......
When U.K. crews will come to ZS I can't even imagine the mess will be created! If KM quit, the only solution will be closing and reopening with people they want and with salary they want, despite of any seniority list.....otherwise, if no money appears...they will close everything!
I think the only "hope" is that Malta will need a base in Italy in order to enter Europe. And , again , I hope Malta has a kind of strategy.
To know more about pilots, refer to Avroliner!!!!
brgrds
Skunkie
I fully agree with you and Avroliner (as long as it results you are Maltese, you should know what is happening over there).
Remaining an Cabin Crew strategy, all CC flying from Manchester (Bristol is only summer base) are now attending a converse course in Italy, in the case the two EI-DBD, EI-DBC will became Italian
I just pass the test on A-320 (absolutely NOT Jar Ops except some particulars almost regarding cockpit crew).
No exact procedures have been explaind to us, only Airbus general, and we don't know which aircraft and from where will (if) arrive.
The course was 3 days long...I'm always on pc and I find it "quite easy" but is not the same for all Cabine Crew. Then we got test (yesterday morn) based on company SOP, but easier that a lot of things will change!
Tha 4 A320-200 ordered by Air Malta, when our Chairman was still Maltes won't arrive. They are stopped by the same leasing company who took back our Irish B737-700 (nowadays we operate with two German 737-700).
So we don't really know where this A320 will come from, surely second handed, with charateristic totally or partially different from ours.
Great part of Cabin Crew operating in Manchester are from U.K. and their contract is very low....according , anyway to the cost of life in U.K.
If they will start operating in Italy, their salary will be adequated to the cost of life in Italy, so they will gain less then us 8note that we operate as a low cost...737 carries 3 Cabin Crew, the service is not good as Air Malta's but we got duty free (all manual, if you mistake your payment will be lowered) and we got hot meals and so on...only difference all economy class....
Nowadays some pursers from Azzurra went to Toulose and they are abilitated to fly U.K./Maltese a320....everything has been hidden......
When U.K. crews will come to ZS I can't even imagine the mess will be created! If KM quit, the only solution will be closing and reopening with people they want and with salary they want, despite of any seniority list.....otherwise, if no money appears...they will close everything!
I think the only "hope" is that Malta will need a base in Italy in order to enter Europe. And , again , I hope Malta has a kind of strategy.
To know more about pilots, refer to Avroliner!!!!
brgrds
Skunkie
Last edited by Skunkie; 12th Jan 2004 at 02:48.
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First of all, I just heard that Capt. Joe Agius (Azzurra Chief Training Pilot) has resigned from Azzurra and is resuming his post with Air Malta. Azzurra's loss.
A plan is desperatly needed. Azzurra has lots of debts and with the 7 RJ's grounded, 2 737s re-possessed, they have a humongous amount of staff sitting around idle doing nothing.......and still getting paid. Besides, there is the little issue of the lease payments on the RJs. Whether Azzurra is paying them or Air Malta is irrelevant, because they still have to be paid (guaranteed) by KM, each month (x7). Can you imagine what this is costing?
With the above as a huge anchor, and the debts accumulated so far, this cash injection will dry up in no time at all.
Something has to be done soon (read now!) and unfortunately this will have to include operating the RJs ......... 1)ready trained crews on payroll, 2)available aircraft idle, also on payroll.
As the RJs cannot be used successfully for charters(except perhaps from some remote airfilelds or perhaps Florence), the only way I can see this going is for Azzurra to open a low cost scheduled operation out of a couple of bases, and operate point to point on stategic routes that are not yet exploited.
Since other low costs have taken over airports like MXP, FCO/CIA, BGY etc, perhaps possible candidates could be Verona, Forli or Venice. Short sectors would be the key, and operation (OF RJs) will be totally internet based. Heavy advertising will be a must, as is the branding on the aircraft. The way I see it..........we are already loosing......this way we can only win!
Regarding G7 (seven group), someone sold (gave) them that stategic 51%, so now they pull the strings. Alitalia screwed Azzurra up, as it did with Minerva, KLM and many others. **** happens. Let's hope that ZS has what it takes to get on it's feet again.....for the long haul.
A plan is desperatly needed. Azzurra has lots of debts and with the 7 RJ's grounded, 2 737s re-possessed, they have a humongous amount of staff sitting around idle doing nothing.......and still getting paid. Besides, there is the little issue of the lease payments on the RJs. Whether Azzurra is paying them or Air Malta is irrelevant, because they still have to be paid (guaranteed) by KM, each month (x7). Can you imagine what this is costing?
With the above as a huge anchor, and the debts accumulated so far, this cash injection will dry up in no time at all.
Something has to be done soon (read now!) and unfortunately this will have to include operating the RJs ......... 1)ready trained crews on payroll, 2)available aircraft idle, also on payroll.
As the RJs cannot be used successfully for charters(except perhaps from some remote airfilelds or perhaps Florence), the only way I can see this going is for Azzurra to open a low cost scheduled operation out of a couple of bases, and operate point to point on stategic routes that are not yet exploited.
Since other low costs have taken over airports like MXP, FCO/CIA, BGY etc, perhaps possible candidates could be Verona, Forli or Venice. Short sectors would be the key, and operation (OF RJs) will be totally internet based. Heavy advertising will be a must, as is the branding on the aircraft. The way I see it..........we are already loosing......this way we can only win!
Regarding G7 (seven group), someone sold (gave) them that stategic 51%, so now they pull the strings. Alitalia screwed Azzurra up, as it did with Minerva, KLM and many others. **** happens. Let's hope that ZS has what it takes to get on it's feet again.....for the long haul.
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things are definately not good at Azzurra...but the 320's do exist and fly and apparently the money to buy out Littoral has been raised and maybe even payed.
I read the 2 companies (azzurra and littoral) want to build a mediterranean regional network together.
we'll see...
I read the 2 companies (azzurra and littoral) want to build a mediterranean regional network together.
we'll see...
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Robin z
yesterday 's news is about using again Avro in Italy, but is really only a rumor.....
Hope some chief read this thread and got some ideas...
i don't know exactly about Capt. Agius resignation, but could be quite true.
He is in Malta since Saturday and maybe they are discussing smtg more.
Here I read betwen the lines, the possibility of using again Avro, as you correctly suggested...but is all a supposition....Malta has got time up to 30th january and hope something will be done....
News from other maling list and sms on mobilephone, refers this...hope they are not "stupid" to leave everything go.
let's wait and hope.................
I will be in Malta on thursday and hope to get some good news1
otherwise, the end of Azzurra will be imminent
Skunkie
yesterday 's news is about using again Avro in Italy, but is really only a rumor.....
Hope some chief read this thread and got some ideas...
i don't know exactly about Capt. Agius resignation, but could be quite true.
He is in Malta since Saturday and maybe they are discussing smtg more.
Here I read betwen the lines, the possibility of using again Avro, as you correctly suggested...but is all a supposition....Malta has got time up to 30th january and hope something will be done....
News from other maling list and sms on mobilephone, refers this...hope they are not "stupid" to leave everything go.
let's wait and hope.................
I will be in Malta on thursday and hope to get some good news1
otherwise, the end of Azzurra will be imminent
Skunkie
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Robin z
Capt Agius has not resigned yet...he went to Malta on Saturday to check situation over there, the rumors about Rj fleet are increasing....hope is a good new for ZS.
As you told in a previous post, maybe they will try smtg as you suggested (forl', LCY, Florence and oters for charters).
Let's wait the ultimatum from Malta...they should insert 6 mil Euros or their quotes will gradually be lowered.
After 30th jan....maybe smtg will move....in the while we are almost all on idle...cpt, cabin crew (1 or 2 fly each month).
Rj pilots got a chance to come back to Italy and fly again with Rj...take it as a rumor ...a llil bit than a rumor....
well In God we trust..
Maybe u flyng from MXP to MLA on thu morning? I will be on KM plane (hope not full) as a pax with ZED ticket....so I will enjoy a week in your marvellous island
no other news from here..people and management are
Anyway...in the 300 cabin crew (supposed to be assumed in KM as a low cost operating cabin crew..) do you think thre is some space for a 13 1/2 years old flying purser?
I mean I don't intend to fly as a purser...just ned a job!
The limit is that I know few Maltese....mostly bad words
Best regards and be strong...here and in KM
cheers
Skunkie
Capt Agius has not resigned yet...he went to Malta on Saturday to check situation over there, the rumors about Rj fleet are increasing....hope is a good new for ZS.
As you told in a previous post, maybe they will try smtg as you suggested (forl', LCY, Florence and oters for charters).
Let's wait the ultimatum from Malta...they should insert 6 mil Euros or their quotes will gradually be lowered.
After 30th jan....maybe smtg will move....in the while we are almost all on idle...cpt, cabin crew (1 or 2 fly each month).
Rj pilots got a chance to come back to Italy and fly again with Rj...take it as a rumor ...a llil bit than a rumor....
well In God we trust..Maybe u flyng from MXP to MLA on thu morning? I will be on KM plane (hope not full) as a pax with ZED ticket....so I will enjoy a week in your marvellous island
no other news from here..people and management are
Anyway...in the 300 cabin crew (supposed to be assumed in KM as a low cost operating cabin crew..) do you think thre is some space for a 13 1/2 years old flying purser?
I mean I don't intend to fly as a purser...just ned a job!
The limit is that I know few Maltese....mostly bad words
Best regards and be strong...here and in KM
cheers
Skunkie
Last edited by Skunkie; 13th Jan 2004 at 19:49.