KLM - Air France (merged)
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Air France and KLM to merge tomorrow according to the Swiss news 10 to 10 a few moments ago .....
Hope that there are not too many out on the street with 28% of the market between them....
Good luck to all
Hope that there are not too many out on the street with 28% of the market between them....
Good luck to all
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Air France board agrees to KLM exchange offer: union (29/09/2003)
PARIS (AFP) The Air France board of directors gave its approval to an exchange offer for shareholders of the Dutch airline KLM, with which it is close to a merger-takeover, a union member of the board told AFP.
"For the moment, the board has approved a letter of intent that will be released by the company," said Yvon Touil of the CGT union.
Asked whether the letter concerned an exchange offer, Touil replied "yes." He declined to give further details.
Air France President Jean-Cyril Spinetta has insisted any decision remain confidential until Tuesday morning.
Air France and KLM are said to be close to the launch of a merger-takeover that would create the biggest airline in the world in terms of sales, ahead of American Airlines.
Francois Cabrera, head of the French airline's chapter of the CFDT trade union, said earlier Monday that Air France would announce the exchange offer for KLM shareholders Tuesday, pending approval by the airline's board.
"Management told us we will only be authorized to give details of the offer, i.e. the rates of exchange, tomorrow, because the board meeting this evening must authorize the president to launch the operation," he told media following a works council meeting in Paris.
To provide fresh Air France shares, the company would carry out a capital increase of "around 15 percent", indicated Emmanuel Jahan of the CFE-CGC union.
CFDT delegate Philippe Decrulle told reporters the operation would extend until April to allow for scrutiny by the European Commission, which cried foul on September 17 when Paris tried to ram through a bail-out of the engineering giant Alstom.
Agence France-Presse
PARIS (AFP) The Air France board of directors gave its approval to an exchange offer for shareholders of the Dutch airline KLM, with which it is close to a merger-takeover, a union member of the board told AFP.
"For the moment, the board has approved a letter of intent that will be released by the company," said Yvon Touil of the CGT union.
Asked whether the letter concerned an exchange offer, Touil replied "yes." He declined to give further details.
Air France President Jean-Cyril Spinetta has insisted any decision remain confidential until Tuesday morning.
Air France and KLM are said to be close to the launch of a merger-takeover that would create the biggest airline in the world in terms of sales, ahead of American Airlines.
Francois Cabrera, head of the French airline's chapter of the CFDT trade union, said earlier Monday that Air France would announce the exchange offer for KLM shareholders Tuesday, pending approval by the airline's board.
"Management told us we will only be authorized to give details of the offer, i.e. the rates of exchange, tomorrow, because the board meeting this evening must authorize the president to launch the operation," he told media following a works council meeting in Paris.
To provide fresh Air France shares, the company would carry out a capital increase of "around 15 percent", indicated Emmanuel Jahan of the CFE-CGC union.
CFDT delegate Philippe Decrulle told reporters the operation would extend until April to allow for scrutiny by the European Commission, which cried foul on September 17 when Paris tried to ram through a bail-out of the engineering giant Alstom.
Agence France-Presse
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KLM taken over by Air France
Tomorrow 0700 CET it will be announced
that Air France takes over KLM
Source: Reuters,CNN
World's olderst airline (1917) will be disbanded
into a new french company based in Paris.
KLM will have 16% of the shares. The Dutch
will retain landing rights out of Amsterdam for
8 years. New company will be one of the
biggest in the world.
Rgds
that Air France takes over KLM
Source: Reuters,CNN
World's olderst airline (1917) will be disbanded
into a new french company based in Paris.
KLM will have 16% of the shares. The Dutch
will retain landing rights out of Amsterdam for
8 years. New company will be one of the
biggest in the world.
Rgds
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UPDATE 1-KLM/Air France deal hits last minute snag
Tue September 30, 2003 01:50 AM ET
(Adds Air France comments, details and background)
By Christopher Borowski and Noah Barkin
AMSTERDAM/PARIS, Sept 30 (Reuters) - An expected deal between Air France AIRF.PA and KLM KLM.AS to create Europe's largest airline appeared to have hit a last-minute snag on Tuesday, with the Dutch carrier saying it still had not decided on a tie-up which the French carrier approved Monday night.
"There is no deal yet. We are still talking... There are no indications how long it will take," KLM spokesman Bart Koster told Reuters. He declined to say what was holding up the approval by KLM's board.
Air France declined to comment. It had planned to issue a statement at 7.00 a.m. (0500 GMT) after approving a letter of intent to team up with KLM at its Monday meeting, but said it was unclear whether it would do so.
If completed, the KLM/Air France combination would take over from British Airways BAY.L as Europe's largest airline in terms of traffic and the world's third-largest behind American Airlines AMR.N and Delta DAL.N .
It may also pave the wave for further consolidation in the overcrowded sector.
KLM, one of the world's oldest airlines, has made several attempts to hook up with a European partner in the last decade, including two unsuccessful merger attempts with BA.
The French carrier's union officials said that under the plan, Air France and KLM would create a common holding company that would be supervised by an evenly split committee of eight members, with a tie-breaking vote going to Air France's chairman.
Yvon Touil, a representative of the CGT union on Air France's board, said that shareholders would receive a stake in the holding company that would reflect their respective valuations, which suggests an effective takeover of KLM by its larger rival.
Combined, the two airlines have a market capitalisation of 3.6 billion euros ($4.1 billion), with KLM accounting for 16 percent of the total.
They would retain their separate identities, a prerequisite for preserving their international landing rights, and the Dutch government is expected to keep its golden share in KLM for the time being.
Tue September 30, 2003 01:50 AM ET
(Adds Air France comments, details and background)
By Christopher Borowski and Noah Barkin
AMSTERDAM/PARIS, Sept 30 (Reuters) - An expected deal between Air France AIRF.PA and KLM KLM.AS to create Europe's largest airline appeared to have hit a last-minute snag on Tuesday, with the Dutch carrier saying it still had not decided on a tie-up which the French carrier approved Monday night.
"There is no deal yet. We are still talking... There are no indications how long it will take," KLM spokesman Bart Koster told Reuters. He declined to say what was holding up the approval by KLM's board.
Air France declined to comment. It had planned to issue a statement at 7.00 a.m. (0500 GMT) after approving a letter of intent to team up with KLM at its Monday meeting, but said it was unclear whether it would do so.
If completed, the KLM/Air France combination would take over from British Airways BAY.L as Europe's largest airline in terms of traffic and the world's third-largest behind American Airlines AMR.N and Delta DAL.N .
It may also pave the wave for further consolidation in the overcrowded sector.
KLM, one of the world's oldest airlines, has made several attempts to hook up with a European partner in the last decade, including two unsuccessful merger attempts with BA.
The French carrier's union officials said that under the plan, Air France and KLM would create a common holding company that would be supervised by an evenly split committee of eight members, with a tie-breaking vote going to Air France's chairman.
Yvon Touil, a representative of the CGT union on Air France's board, said that shareholders would receive a stake in the holding company that would reflect their respective valuations, which suggests an effective takeover of KLM by its larger rival.
Combined, the two airlines have a market capitalisation of 3.6 billion euros ($4.1 billion), with KLM accounting for 16 percent of the total.
They would retain their separate identities, a prerequisite for preserving their international landing rights, and the Dutch government is expected to keep its golden share in KLM for the time being.
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The deal is done, details will follow at a press conference at 10:00 CET.
Initial reports make is sound like job security is garuanteed for five years (for whatever that is worth). The brand name of KLM will remain for the foreseeable future.
As has been speculated for weeks now, a new holding company will formed which will contain Air France and KLM. The valuations are along the lines that have been mentioned before.
In two weeks time the deal will be signed pending input from all parties involved.
Regards, O.
Initial reports make is sound like job security is garuanteed for five years (for whatever that is worth). The brand name of KLM will remain for the foreseeable future.
As has been speculated for weeks now, a new holding company will formed which will contain Air France and KLM. The valuations are along the lines that have been mentioned before.
In two weeks time the deal will be signed pending input from all parties involved.
Regards, O.
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I just watched the pressconference. Not good.
KLM will be around for about 3 years and then major
integration will take place.
Garantees by Air France are good for only 8 years!!!
KLM called itself the "junior partner" . They got that
part right!
KLM name may dissapear in the future.After 5 years
the Dutch loose their voting rights in the new company.
KLM will be around for about 3 years and then major
integration will take place.
Garantees by Air France are good for only 8 years!!!
KLM called itself the "junior partner" . They got that
part right!
KLM name may dissapear in the future.After 5 years
the Dutch loose their voting rights in the new company.
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If my experience (not in the airline industry) of takeovers by French firms is any guidance - look out for choppy weather ahead! My favourite French quote: "Of course that looks wonderful in practice, but it could never work in theory".
Good luck to all concerned.
Good luck to all concerned.
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Frogs with clogs
It's difficult to see how the Dutch public would take to Air France replacing KLM out of AMS; despite its financial problems and its association with Northwest, KLM still has a good service reputation and the two airlines have some similarity in their fleets: both are strong GE airlines and have 744s, 777s (KL's on order) and A330s. The major difference is A320s -v- 737s, but KL's 737-8/900 fleet is small and the -3/400s must be due for replacement pretty soon.
An interesting aspect to this will be the extent Basiq Air (operated by Transavia expands) to take over some of KL's short haul flights. While the French govt makes life difficult for low cost carriers, KLM has been badly hit and of course, Easyjet has a pretty big operation there. I wonder if more KL short haul flights will be operated by Transavia/Basiq.
Interesting also to hear reports that AZ now wants in on this marriage . . .
An interesting aspect to this will be the extent Basiq Air (operated by Transavia expands) to take over some of KL's short haul flights. While the French govt makes life difficult for low cost carriers, KLM has been badly hit and of course, Easyjet has a pretty big operation there. I wonder if more KL short haul flights will be operated by Transavia/Basiq.
Interesting also to hear reports that AZ now wants in on this marriage . . .
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Pointer and Pax Vobiscum , I work for AF, and I challenge you to find a better airline to work for. Yes I have worked for other airlines and in other countries, and I can say from experience that it is indeed a fair employer. AND it is making money, unlike many at the moment, AND it hasn't laid off anyone unlike many despite 9/11 and SARS (please spare me the State aids bit, because it didn't receive any since 1994). It is hiring people from other French airlines gone belly up as a priority. Which airline/country could boast the same?
So what do the KLM people should fear? They are loosing money now and would be out of business anyway in a few years if not months, so why AF should be a worse fate than this?
Is teamwork such a hard concept to grasp?
aeroskid
French govt is NOT making life difficult for low cost carriers. It is applying the law (no, you cannot cry outrage at state aids for flag carriers and then extort money to minor airports hiding behing the fig leaf of...what was the excuse already?)
Plus, consider those some of those low frills are based outside France, and if they are based in France they employ people with Irish/UK contracts. Which means that there will be less people paying for retirement pensions in France but still working in France! And that those people get less rights that their French counterparts, and lower requirements! For example, a CC on a UK or EI contract is NOT required to have CSS, which French CC MUST have, which is a professional CC licence delivered by the DGAC (French CAA)which grants more professsionnality than a piece of paper delivered in 3 weeks by any scruffy airline. Call the French stupid if they'd rather have it their it way.
Give me a French job any day!
So what do the KLM people should fear? They are loosing money now and would be out of business anyway in a few years if not months, so why AF should be a worse fate than this?
Is teamwork such a hard concept to grasp?aeroskid
While the French govt makes life difficult for low cost carriers
Plus, consider those some of those low frills are based outside France, and if they are based in France they employ people with Irish/UK contracts. Which means that there will be less people paying for retirement pensions in France but still working in France! And that those people get less rights that their French counterparts, and lower requirements! For example, a CC on a UK or EI contract is NOT required to have CSS, which French CC MUST have, which is a professional CC licence delivered by the DGAC (French CAA)which grants more professsionnality than a piece of paper delivered in 3 weeks by any scruffy airline. Call the French stupid if they'd rather have it their it way.
Give me a French job any day!
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I must be missing something here. Where’s the advantage? This is a 20/80 stake for KLM shareholders (which is incidentally the same swap they turned down from BA), and represents a 40% premium on the share price.
But there’s no new identity, no staff cuts, no significant changes for 3 years. I don’t see how much has changed, except AF shareholders are poorer today than they were yesterday. This is like a Christmas Cracker with no snap, no hat, and no toys.
But there’s no new identity, no staff cuts, no significant changes for 3 years. I don’t see how much has changed, except AF shareholders are poorer today than they were yesterday. This is like a Christmas Cracker with no snap, no hat, and no toys.
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Yeeeeeeeeeeeha
Bloody good thing that merging.
Think of 2 major performing hubs with still major growth potential linked by the bullet train, networks that, for the most part, complete each other, a rather similar fleet and a long experience in the field. I admit this is likely to give stomach burns to a lot of the twitts whose posts I have had the sad privilege to read over the years.
French take-over ??? Technically yes, practically, everyone knows that they are toes not to tread on if you want things to work which is what evrybody wants.
As an AF pilot, I have no desire to see the KLM colours dispear and let me tell you I am rather proud to be merged with such a fine airline. Just like you have Nissan / Renault or Peugeot / Citroen, you'll have AF/ KLM or KLM/AF who gives a hoot ? So forgive me for prefering to work for AF/KLM rather that some crappy outfit that prizes itself in having cabin crew toss the toilet.
I don't think the Dutch as a whole would accept to see the name KLM disapear, nor would the Dutch governement who by the way owns a golden share to precisely prevent that.
So wingers and all we've taken good notice of your wishes for failure, that'll be an even bigger incentive to make this thing work.
As for the others what Pub should we meet at ?
Think of 2 major performing hubs with still major growth potential linked by the bullet train, networks that, for the most part, complete each other, a rather similar fleet and a long experience in the field. I admit this is likely to give stomach burns to a lot of the twitts whose posts I have had the sad privilege to read over the years.
French take-over ??? Technically yes, practically, everyone knows that they are toes not to tread on if you want things to work which is what evrybody wants.
As an AF pilot, I have no desire to see the KLM colours dispear and let me tell you I am rather proud to be merged with such a fine airline. Just like you have Nissan / Renault or Peugeot / Citroen, you'll have AF/ KLM or KLM/AF who gives a hoot ? So forgive me for prefering to work for AF/KLM rather that some crappy outfit that prizes itself in having cabin crew toss the toilet.
I don't think the Dutch as a whole would accept to see the name KLM disapear, nor would the Dutch governement who by the way owns a golden share to precisely prevent that.
So wingers and all we've taken good notice of your wishes for failure, that'll be an even bigger incentive to make this thing work.
As for the others what Pub should we meet at ?
Last edited by wallabie; 30th Sep 2003 at 22:31.
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Wallabie, your enthusiasm is heartening. Something positive on a very sombre day................
Could either you or Ludo confirm or deny the following?
Rumour has it that AF does not pay landing fees in it's home country. And as such, while not receiving state aid, it certainly does get an advantage over for example KLM who do pay landing fees at SPL.
Not that it matters in the grand scheme of things; just curious if it's true or not.
Could either you or Ludo confirm or deny the following?
Rumour has it that AF does not pay landing fees in it's home country. And as such, while not receiving state aid, it certainly does get an advantage over for example KLM who do pay landing fees at SPL.
Not that it matters in the grand scheme of things; just curious if it's true or not.
Sun worshipper
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Hey! Wallabie,my man!
The old Mc D.O.,of course!
I'm laughing my tripes out...
Really,some people haven't yet realised that indeed the world has changed :Air France,which for the last three or four months has been the number one airline in Europe has pulled off the deal BA and some others have wished for!
And now,the association of the two most efficient hubs on the continent.I guess it would feel rather like a loaded gun pointed right at Mr Edd's temple.
But I remain curious :Is this just the beginning of the realignment of air transport in Europe?What is LH going to do?Is BA going full throttle into a merger with Iberia?
Exciting times,my friends.
Regards
Jetlegs
Air France DOES indeed pay all the fees required by air transport regulations.There is even talk that they are paying more than they should to use CDG and other airports.
Your question poses another problem :where do you live if you haven't heard of EU rules on fair competition?
Regards
The old Mc D.O.,of course!
I'm laughing my tripes out...
Really,some people haven't yet realised that indeed the world has changed :Air France,which for the last three or four months has been the number one airline in Europe has pulled off the deal BA and some others have wished for!
And now,the association of the two most efficient hubs on the continent.I guess it would feel rather like a loaded gun pointed right at Mr Edd's temple.
But I remain curious :Is this just the beginning of the realignment of air transport in Europe?What is LH going to do?Is BA going full throttle into a merger with Iberia?
Exciting times,my friends.
Regards
Jetlegs
Air France DOES indeed pay all the fees required by air transport regulations.There is even talk that they are paying more than they should to use CDG and other airports.
Your question poses another problem :where do you live if you haven't heard of EU rules on fair competition?
Regards
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Ludo,
Although KLM has not made a profit in the last two years, they were not in any danger of bankruptcy in a few months or years, as you suggest. They do have, after all, about €900 million in the bank, and a load factor of 85% going for them. The recent losses were mostly bad circumstances and a massive arbitration decision which went against them. What KLM employees and the Dutch public have to fear is this: Fifty percent of all traffic moving through Schiphol airport are transfer passengers. It just doesn't make sense for an airline to have two hubs located so close together, and when the time comes for Air France - KLM to reduce costs, they will do so by reducing the number of flights at Schiphol and keeping the ones at CDG. That means fewer jobs not only for KLM people, but also for the hundreds of other companies who do business with KLM in and around Schiphol airport.
A question.. Although this won't happen for a few years, eventually they might want to merge our two flight operations departments. Does Air France operate completely in French, i. e. the manuals and everything? At KLM primarily Dutch is spoken, but it would be no problem for us to switch to all English speaking operations.
Although KLM has not made a profit in the last two years, they were not in any danger of bankruptcy in a few months or years, as you suggest. They do have, after all, about €900 million in the bank, and a load factor of 85% going for them. The recent losses were mostly bad circumstances and a massive arbitration decision which went against them. What KLM employees and the Dutch public have to fear is this: Fifty percent of all traffic moving through Schiphol airport are transfer passengers. It just doesn't make sense for an airline to have two hubs located so close together, and when the time comes for Air France - KLM to reduce costs, they will do so by reducing the number of flights at Schiphol and keeping the ones at CDG. That means fewer jobs not only for KLM people, but also for the hundreds of other companies who do business with KLM in and around Schiphol airport.
A question.. Although this won't happen for a few years, eventually they might want to merge our two flight operations departments. Does Air France operate completely in French, i. e. the manuals and everything? At KLM primarily Dutch is spoken, but it would be no problem for us to switch to all English speaking operations.
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Hmm which hub?
For the transfer "experience":
1. AMS
2. CDG
For operations restrictions:
1. CDG
2. AMS
But if the Belgians build the proposed High Speed rail line around Brussels, and all the other High Speed lines are completed as planned, the Schipol Terminal and the CDG Terminal will only be 2 hours apart......
This should have been BA's deal......they desperately need a large transfer hub on the continent. MAD can't provide it, and ZRH has more restrictions than AMS!
1. AMS
2. CDG
For operations restrictions:
1. CDG
2. AMS
But if the Belgians build the proposed High Speed rail line around Brussels, and all the other High Speed lines are completed as planned, the Schipol Terminal and the CDG Terminal will only be 2 hours apart......
This should have been BA's deal......they desperately need a large transfer hub on the continent. MAD can't provide it, and ZRH has more restrictions than AMS!
