Flying the Kudu?
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Flying the Kudu?
What are the opinions of using a Kudu for Tourist Ops ( 6 pax). The owner says this is a difficult plane to master. You DON'T just get your conversion and off you go. You need lots of experience, preferably on Harvards. To start taking pax around you should have a few hundred hours on the Kudu under your belt. Can I get some feedback??
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Kudu Lesson 1.
FB,
Nice novel idea as the Kudu seems to fit with the bush. However,
1. Not one Kudu has a C of A, and no C of A, no commercial ops. All were 'civilianised' as what was then called LS1 aircraft. If you want more info on this PM or mail me. I suppose you can start a "Kudu Club", join the club and fly for free.
- oh no! ...let me not go down that road...enough said.
2. The GSO480 engine is a real gas gussler compared to other 'normal' pistons. With the supercharger, boost limiter and carburettor it is an engine that causes big hassles if not treated and handled properly.
3. The Kudu is only a STOL aircraft up to the normal MTOW of 2040kg. At the miltary MTOW of 2275kg (and they were registered on the civil register at this weight) it is not a STOL aircraft. At 2275kg on a 30 degrees plus day you are gonna need a proper runway and quite a bit of it.
4. Plenty taildragger experience (nothing smaller than a C185) is needed before taking on the Kudu. At one stage (due to accidents) the SAAF introduced a policy that no pilot with less than 650 (?) hours total time (of which 150 (?) hours had to be on taildraggers) would be allowed to fly the Kudu. This dramatically reduced the accident rate. Especially at MTOW she can be a beast.
5. Loading has to be done carefully as the Kudu has a very wide C of G range for a single. This is especially true when getting close to the MTOW. Big problem if C of G is too far forward as you run out of elevator authority on landing and on this taildragger that can be very nasty indeed.
6. Then of course, there's the noise levels. It is definately not on the list of quiet aircraft - outside and inside.
There's plenty more to say but all in all, even though the Kudu is a solid but heavy beast and I have fond memories of all the hours I've done on it
, I don't think that any commercial pax operation will be viable.
Cheers vir eers.
Bakela
Nice novel idea as the Kudu seems to fit with the bush. However,
1. Not one Kudu has a C of A, and no C of A, no commercial ops. All were 'civilianised' as what was then called LS1 aircraft. If you want more info on this PM or mail me. I suppose you can start a "Kudu Club", join the club and fly for free.
- oh no! ...let me not go down that road...enough said. 2. The GSO480 engine is a real gas gussler compared to other 'normal' pistons. With the supercharger, boost limiter and carburettor it is an engine that causes big hassles if not treated and handled properly.
3. The Kudu is only a STOL aircraft up to the normal MTOW of 2040kg. At the miltary MTOW of 2275kg (and they were registered on the civil register at this weight) it is not a STOL aircraft. At 2275kg on a 30 degrees plus day you are gonna need a proper runway and quite a bit of it.
4. Plenty taildragger experience (nothing smaller than a C185) is needed before taking on the Kudu. At one stage (due to accidents) the SAAF introduced a policy that no pilot with less than 650 (?) hours total time (of which 150 (?) hours had to be on taildraggers) would be allowed to fly the Kudu. This dramatically reduced the accident rate. Especially at MTOW she can be a beast.
5. Loading has to be done carefully as the Kudu has a very wide C of G range for a single. This is especially true when getting close to the MTOW. Big problem if C of G is too far forward as you run out of elevator authority on landing and on this taildragger that can be very nasty indeed.
6. Then of course, there's the noise levels. It is definately not on the list of quiet aircraft - outside and inside.
There's plenty more to say but all in all, even though the Kudu is a solid but heavy beast and I have fond memories of all the hours I've done on it
, I don't think that any commercial pax operation will be viable. Cheers vir eers.
Bakela
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Thanks Bakela. Great Information. But your right, not for Tourist Pax Ops!!
First came across the plane 3 years ago when we looked at it for use with a Film Production company from USA. Good load carrier and with the sliding door a good camera platfrom. We did not end up actually using it so I had no experience of it.
Thanks again for your input.
First came across the plane 3 years ago when we looked at it for use with a Film Production company from USA. Good load carrier and with the sliding door a good camera platfrom. We did not end up actually using it so I had no experience of it.
Thanks again for your input.
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Ja.It takes a REAL pilot to fly a Kudu.
Jokes aside.I found it a real pleasure to fly.Not forgiving in the sense that if you are not ahead ALL the time it will bite you.
Also built like a tank.I had the unfortunate to have a prang in one as I had an engine failure after take-off.But if I had not been in a Kudu,then definitely would not be here today.
For the person just starting out on tal-draggers--leave it alone.
But for my 10 cents worth,a Kudu is the same as the Huey.People will pay to fly in one.
As far as paying pax and the LS1 category---Well.
If you get one and need a pilot- call me.
Jokes aside.I found it a real pleasure to fly.Not forgiving in the sense that if you are not ahead ALL the time it will bite you.
Also built like a tank.I had the unfortunate to have a prang in one as I had an engine failure after take-off.But if I had not been in a Kudu,then definitely would not be here today.
For the person just starting out on tal-draggers--leave it alone.
But for my 10 cents worth,a Kudu is the same as the Huey.People will pay to fly in one.
As far as paying pax and the LS1 category---Well.
If you get one and need a pilot- call me.
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Me, I was a passenger once in one of those machines back in the days when the SAAF still use to operate them out of Lanseria. On the climb-out to Hoedspruit and passing about 7500' the engine started to splutter and run realy rough. The Captain merely took out his clipboard and started recording the engine parameters. When asked what was going on, he replied "they do it sometimes"!. Realized then that you require b@lls as big as avo's to fly those things!!!!!
Me, I never flew in one again. Went on to fly bang seats. At least there you have one more option!
Me, I never flew in one again. Went on to fly bang seats. At least there you have one more option!
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Are these the same aircraft that are called a Bosbok?, I was looking at buying one recently and it sounds like the same aircraft.
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Hey, thanx capt Undies. after viewing the pics, I am sure the one I was looking at is the nicer looking of the two............. Might have to go and buy it now. 
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Corporal Underpants.
I have links with people in high high places.
There is a law about calling the Kudu a dog.
You see you have to be precise as to what type of dog you call the Kudu.
This is of great debate.
Now before you get on your high horses with a smart ars?d reply,have 3 Heinekins,2 whiskeys and a keg of wine and think your actions thru thoroughly.
Then appologise.
OK appologies accepted.
But yes the Bosbok is a nice machine.
Oh well you now might as well finish off the rest of the whiskey.
Cheers.
I have links with people in high high places.
There is a law about calling the Kudu a dog.
You see you have to be precise as to what type of dog you call the Kudu.
This is of great debate.
Now before you get on your high horses with a smart ars?d reply,have 3 Heinekins,2 whiskeys and a keg of wine and think your actions thru thoroughly.
Then appologise.
OK appologies accepted.
But yes the Bosbok is a nice machine.
Oh well you now might as well finish off the rest of the whiskey.
Cheers.
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What kind????
Goffel, I see you have demoted "Captain Underpants" to "Corporal Undepants" already. Good on ya but I reckon we should give him a court martial for calling the Kudu a dog. The tribe on this side suggested a punishment of temporary demotion to "Lance Corporal G-String" for a period of 30 days
. Unless of course we get a written aplogy on this thread. Cpt. Underpants do I hear you switching on your computer?
The SAAF (41) squadon badge was a Pointer dog, on most occasions modified to represent a well endowed, ready for action, male specimen. Thus, calling it a dog of any lesser size than a Pointer is punishable by Kudu law. At MTOW it was definately a Rottweiler, not quick, but with a moer of a bite if you weren't awake.
Agreed! But it couldn't carry plenty wood for the braais or 300kg's of rump steak for the said braais or 36 cases of Castle (can carry more but bottle store ran out!). 
The Wizard, which one IS the nicer looking of the two"?
REAL ORCA, I might have been your Captain on this flight. Did a couple with vlamgat pax out of Lanseria for Hoedspruit and "they did it sometimes". As for the Avo's - . In fact, I'll give my left avo to fly one again...it's been such a long time
.
FB, we used to remove the door for paradropping and for air to air camera work. Had a limit on IAS with the door open and for door operation. Know of a few guys that 'lost' the door during descent after a paradrop. The air to air camera work I did with it was exquisite. Remember once with the late Herman Potgieter doing a sortie with a couple of SAAF museum aircraft. The Fairchild 24 and Hornet Moth posed no problem.
Then we did the Vampire 
- get altitude, scream into a dive and wait for the Vamp (with full flap, divies out and at VMC!) to pass. A few quick shots and start all over again until enough photos taken. I hear you laugh REAL ORCA 
!!!! Then tables turned - enter the Storch. Storch climbs, Storch dives at VNE and Kudu passes with full flap at VMC!!! Great fun was had by all.
---------------------------------------------
Taildraggers teach you about the 4th dimension
"Captain Underpants" to "Corporal Undepants" already. Good on ya but I reckon we should give him a court martial for calling the Kudu a dog. The tribe on this side suggested a punishment of temporary demotion to "Lance Corporal G-String" for a period of 30 days. Unless of course we get a written aplogy on this thread. Cpt. Underpants do I hear you switching on your computer?
You see you have to be precise as to what type of dog you call the Kudu
But yes the Bosbok is a nice machine
The Wizard, which one IS the nicer looking of the two"?
When asked what was going on, he replied "they do it sometimes"!. Realized then that you require b@lls as big as avo's to fly those things!!!!!
. In fact, I'll give my left avo to fly one again...it's been such a long time .
with the sliding door a good camera platfrom.
Then we did the Vampire - get altitude, scream into a dive and wait for the Vamp (with full flap, divies out and at VMC!) to pass. A few quick shots and start all over again until enough photos taken. I hear you laugh REAL ORCA !!!! Then tables turned - enter the Storch. Storch climbs, Storch dives at VNE and Kudu passes with full flap at VMC!!! Great fun was had by all.---------------------------------------------
Taildraggers teach you about the 4th dimension
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Also known as the CONVERTER, ie converts fuel to noise with no discernible change in altitude or airspeed.
Had a skydiving mate who used to work his way forward and polish the pilot's windscreen in flight before climbing off (he did this from the outside).
Had a skydiving mate who used to work his way forward and polish the pilot's windscreen in flight before climbing off (he did this from the outside).
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To all Kudu drivers I humbly apologise. Moerofasorryman. As a Bossie owner I am a little prejudiced..! The Bossie has a waistline at least and the I don't have to say sorry to five fat okes on a hot day.
36 cases of Castle...gotta try that sometime.
36 cases of Castle...gotta try that sometime.
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Apologies genuinly accepted.
Cpt. Undepants, apologies accepted and court martial called off. Can't get hold of Goffel anyway. Would love to know if you manage to fit 36 cases of Castle into a Bossie. Cannot recall the SAAF managing it and if they did not do it, it cannot be done.
Cardinal Puff,
If anybody does not believe it, this was for real. Had it a couple times (it plays havok with the drag and always necessitated a power increase). It proves that anybody jumping from a serviceable aircraft is totally nuts.
Glad you defined CONVERTER as there's also a law about calling a Kudu a converter. You have to define - CONVERTER of what? For instance, it converted REAL ORCA to bang seats, it converted pilots to wear ear protection under their headsets, it converted every healthy person in the circuit pattern during night flying training into insomniacs, it converted productive hens (chikens that is) from commercial egg bearing animals into zip producing pet birds (apparently the resultant shock after a Kudu passed overhead a chicken farm at low level).
You forgot the massive increase in fuel consumption.
. Can't get hold of Goffel anyway. Would love to know if you manage to fit 36 cases of Castle into a Bossie. Cannot recall the SAAF managing it and if they did not do it, it cannot be done. Cardinal Puff,
polish the pilot's windscreen in flight before climbing off (he did this from the outside).
Also known as the CONVERTER
no discernible change in altitude or airspeed.
.
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BAKELA
Yeah, I was one of the morons in the back trying to pry Slyperd off the windscreen so we could complete the jump before we ended up in a foreign country. Mid winter was the worst as the climb to jump altitude took so long we all froze up solid in the back but nothing as cold as a Puma. I remember putting my foot on the "no step" sign on the wheelwell of a Puma on a linked four exit and taking a chunk of fibreglass with me when the rest of the blokes stepped off and dragged me with them..... now I know why it's been marked as unsuitable for stepping on.
Do you recall some bloke who landed at Zwartkops with the park brake set after dropping some jumpers and flipping the beast on it's back? I heard the rumour after we'd been jumping at Wonderboom but never got it confirmed.
Do you recall some bloke who landed at Zwartkops with the park brake set after dropping some jumpers and flipping the beast on it's back? I heard the rumour after we'd been jumping at Wonderboom but never got it confirmed.
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Yep.
It didn't flip over but it was the shortest three point landing (main wheels and spinner) ever recorded on a Kudu, and on runway 20 (downhill) at Swartkop nogal! The board of inquiry only had to measure the skid marks from touchdown to standstill to get actual landing distance and if my memory is correct it was something like 60 metres! The checklist was actually changed after this mishap as the sequence for BRAKES and PARK BRAKE OFF on the downwind checklist turned out to be the culprit. A ban on engaging the park brake while airborne (so you okes could stand on the wheels) was also slapped on Kudu drivers at the time but I doubt whether anybody ever adhered to it.
The board of inquiry only had to measure the skid marks from touchdown to standstill to get actual landing distance and if my memory is correct it was something like 60 metres! The checklist was actually changed after this mishap as the sequence for BRAKES and PARK BRAKE OFF on the downwind checklist turned out to be the culprit. A ban on engaging the park brake while airborne (so you okes could stand on the wheels) was also slapped on Kudu drivers at the time but I doubt whether anybody ever adhered to it.
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Hah. Never mind the G & T Tourists. I can see a whole new industry waiting to happen here.
EXTREME TOURIST FLYING.
Never mind all the Bungi Jumping and River Rafting when you get to your destination. Get all your thrills just flying to the destination.
Love the thought of sending your co-pilot outside to clean the windscreen while in flight. We could charge the pax $100 for them to try it!!(Video Included)
60m landing with full brakes!! Hmmm. That would suit the Bridge at Vic Falls!!
EXTREME TOURIST FLYING.
Never mind all the Bungi Jumping and River Rafting when you get to your destination. Get all your thrills just flying to the destination.
Love the thought of sending your co-pilot outside to clean the windscreen while in flight. We could charge the pax $100 for them to try it!!(Video Included)
60m landing with full brakes!! Hmmm. That would suit the Bridge at Vic Falls!!
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You all forget one thing....
and that is the fact that most, if not all of the Kudu drivers were tought their taildragger skills on the C185.
Now there is a lovely lady with one helluva kick, especially on landing. A bit smaller, but with a lot bigger heart. A lot nicer to fly than both the Kudu and Bossie, a lot more fun to, especially when sitting next to a jettie trying to get the springsteel undercarraige under control during landing.
Was a real trick to do a bounceless wheeler, even better trick to do a bounceless 3-pointer.
Now there is a lovely lady with one helluva kick, especially on landing. A bit smaller, but with a lot bigger heart. A lot nicer to fly than both the Kudu and Bossie, a lot more fun to, especially when sitting next to a jettie trying to get the springsteel undercarraige under control during landing.
Was a real trick to do a bounceless wheeler, even better trick to do a bounceless 3-pointer.
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Memories.........
I had 3 great years in the seventies flying these beasts!! Off pupes course (short service could only go to LAC) to Kudu's, the first year ignorant, the 2nd scared sh@tless and the third having fun... and of course as young second luit's having the run of Lanseria as your own playground.... daily communte from Swarties to lanseria by Kudu. Good times.
I had 3 great years in the seventies flying these beasts!! Off pupes course (short service could only go to LAC) to Kudu's, the first year ignorant, the 2nd scared sh@tless and the third having fun... and of course as young second luit's having the run of Lanseria as your own playground.... daily communte from Swarties to lanseria by Kudu. Good times.
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Promotion time.
Lt Underpants---for 30 days,then promotion to captain 2nd class.
Bakela,I think I rolled laughing.At least I have some allies(??) in the Kudu.
Mind you I have had some of the guys refusing to jump out of the Kudu until it spluttered,then you could not keep them inside.
Petes Dragon.Yes I totally agree with you on the 185.
Used to spray with one in Tanzania.Really nice craft to fly.
Flying Bean I sent you an email as you asked,not sure if you got it.
But chaps I honestly think that with the Huey extreme,put a Kudu there and you have a match made in heaven.
Lt Underpants---for 30 days,then promotion to captain 2nd class.
Bakela,I think I rolled laughing.At least I have some allies(??) in the Kudu.
Mind you I have had some of the guys refusing to jump out of the Kudu until it spluttered,then you could not keep them inside.
Petes Dragon.Yes I totally agree with you on the 185.
Used to spray with one in Tanzania.Really nice craft to fly.
Flying Bean I sent you an email as you asked,not sure if you got it.
But chaps I honestly think that with the Huey extreme,put a Kudu there and you have a match made in heaven.