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South Sudan any1? What to buy before?

African Aviation Regional issues that affect the numerous pilots who work in this area of the world.

South Sudan any1? What to buy before?

Old 5th Feb 2014, 16:34
  #21 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: South Africa
Age: 50
Posts: 105
Juba-licious

In Response to mlindb;

When dealing with malaria in West & Central African countries, I can speak from the following experience.

1. Never trust a UN doctor or their malaria test results.
2. The local doctors may not have the best equipment, but they do know local strain symptoms.
3. The local doctors treat cases everyday and know exactly which antibiotic works for that particular strain. Malaria in Juba is a totally different kettle of fish to Khartoum.
4. Know the symptoms and do not take no for an answer. As Mlindb say's, a strong antibiotic will not kill you but malaria can ! Most times a local doctor will give you a prescription before a UN doctor who is waiting for his mandatory results from his fancy machine.

I am sorry, but the local beer is mandatory. What's the point of going to a foreign country and not try a cold Tusker, Nile Special or White Bull. Yes, stay away from the Primus.....gives you JetA1 guts....

What to take to Juba.....USD for booze and boerewors for the South African expats who will look after you when the hits the fan....and condoms for the Red-Cross girls.

Enjoy.

Last edited by Golf_Seirra; 5th Feb 2014 at 16:52.
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Old 5th Feb 2014, 20:26
  #22 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Charanga y pandereta
Posts: 61
It seems we had different medical experiences, Golf Seirra. But although we may disagree on that one you have all my respect for drinking those local beers :ok:
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Old 7th Feb 2014, 22:52
  #23 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: above planet earth
Posts: 13
South Sudan

Hey Artlite. S. Sudan is not the best place to head to right now, but I am sure you know that. We got pulled out of there due to security situation.
I second the comments on malaria. Make sure you educate yourself, and go to reputable LOCAL doctor. The good one is Kuel Clinic on Airport Road in Juba. Our engineer, myself and several other pilots spend days under the drip there with good results. The first time is the worst and I knew several healthy Westerners who didn't make it. Flying into Juba is interesting at best and scary at worst. One guy is trying to control the ground , tower, and approach. Try to become his friend, or he will make your life miserable. One runway , so everybody has to backtrack, often with another a/c on short final. Watch for potholes, gravel on the apron and jet blast - lots of rocks flying into engines, props and windshields.
There is no radar anywhere. Lots of traffic and many don't have working transponders. TCAS is helpful, but dont relay on it to save you. Always know where everybody else is. Flying in Hubbab is like diving in chocolate milk, but most guys still pretend to be VFR. Many local heroes are lying about their position to get the landing clearance ahead of you.
Try to fly at least above 5000ft . That will keep you safe from AKs. The Toyota pick up mounted .50cals are also very popular and you need to be above 10000ft to feel good about yourself. I have seen ZSU23-4 protecting tanks as well. I am sure they have more modern stuff as well. Several aircraft have been shot at. UN MI8 was shot down by SPLA not too long ago (by mistake). We escape bombing run by two Mig 29s by a few minutes at one of the northern strips .
I am sure you have a good reason to go there. However I would rather not myself. And I have spent 20 years flying in all sorts of “garden spots” in Africa. PM me if you have more questions. Powodzenia.
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Old 8th Feb 2014, 14:58
  #24 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: uk
Posts: 580
Bear in mind that taking medical advice from this or any other forum, and I particularly refer Golf Sierra's above, can be seriously harmful to your health. For all his touted experience it appears that GS is unaware that malaria is caused by a parasite and not a bacteria (as eny skoolboy kno) and that antibiotics are as relevant to malaria as a chainsaw is to a drowning. I don't doubt the local "doctors" may prescribe antibiotics, they may even be real ones as opposed to counterfeit (just possibly) or just aspirin but it's far more likely that UN medicines will be kosher, and of the correct sort for the disease.

GS does have it right on beer though. I suppose that's a start...
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Old 8th Feb 2014, 18:39
  #25 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: US
Age: 35
Posts: 52
takopalayak, you actually know pilots who didn't make it home due to malaria?

Lots of gratitude for all insights and your time, it's highly helpful and worthwhile to me. My 208B training should commence soon. Any specifics on flying during rainy season there? Perhaps I could include a hint or three in my training
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Old 9th Feb 2014, 03:04
  #26 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: 0°9′03″S 37°18′27″E
Age: 50
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Security or insecurity changes faster than the minute hand on your watch. Make sure that you have a reliable source on the ground at each place you intend to land that can give you the current security and weather situation. Also make sure you carry enough fuel to get you to your alternate, in the likely event you can't land. Fuel reserves in S Sudan aren't calculated in minutes, but rather in hours. A fully charged satellite phone, imodium and extra water and fuel are a must. Stand your ground with the nationals, but please don't argue with them. When the rains arrive in a few months, and someone tells you "wet land-able", trust that comment as much as you would trust a prostitute without a condom. Good luck
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Old 9th Feb 2014, 07:31
  #27 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: above planet earth
Posts: 13
S. Sudan

Yes, I lost 2 friends to malaria, but that over 20 years, so don't get to paranoid about it. I also medivaced several expats from the bush . The company flown them to Europe for treatment and they didn’t make it. The most frequent strength of malaria in Sub Saharan Africa in plasmodium falciparum and it kills about 1 million people annually. It has 25% mortality rate, however chance of healthy man dying of it is small, unless you ignore it. Untreated malaria parasite will eventually move to the brain stem and that’s usually fatal.
So my advice is, if you going there only for short period of time, take prophylactics. If you going to spend there several months or more, the prophylactics will probably kill you before malaria will. They have some serious side effects. Also malaria mutates frequently. Therefore drugs from last year often don’t work anymore. Many drugs in Europe and N. America no longer work. The new stuff is not yet approved in the West. Take some drugs back home with you. You may get sick two weeks after being bitten. Find a local doctor recommended by expats. Many African doctors went to school in Europe or US and are good. But of course there are many rip off artists as well. Lots of fake drugs too.
As far as antibiotics for malaria treatment, indeed I have seen that done. The reason is you often get malaria together with typhoid. However you still need malaria treatment.
As far as flying in the rainy season, make sure you have working radar and know how to use it. Storm scope is nice to have as well. The thunderstorms are very violent and every year there are several thunderstorm related crashes. Don’t be a hero. Just wait 20 min and the storm will move away. Carry extra fuel for wx delays. They usually travel at 20-30 knots. Don’t try to go around them on the downwind site. If you do training at FlightSafety, ask them to program some crashes into the sim and see if you can survive the ride. Hint – use the emergency power lever as a last ditch effort. You will cook the engine, but for a minute you will have probably double the power.
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Old 9th Feb 2014, 07:39
  #28 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
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And bring lots of newer U$100 bills with no stamps or any notes on them.
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Old 9th Feb 2014, 11:26
  #29 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Tree
Posts: 222
A lot of good points mentioned.

Water is your most import thing. If you cant carry it have provision to purify it if you have access to it. Fire stick and or matches. Mossie net.If you do come down above all stay with the aircraft. If you are picked up use the matches on the before you depart.

As for charts, my time down there was over 30 years ago and pre GPS. I found the normal aviation maps contained too much detail. Instead I used a Michelin map, strip cut and put in a folder with plastic sheathes. I used to have a line drawn, from departure to destination, magnetic track and marked off in 10 nm steps for every route we flew which was all over the country. That was all I needed for 6 years I did VFR charter down there.

Dollars? Yes correct but make sure you have plenty of small denomination also. As sure as the sun will rise tomorrow you get a $20 invoice, you hand over a 100 and they conveniently wont have any change.
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Old 10th Feb 2014, 08:21
  #30 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Kenya
Posts: 237
At the risk of being horribly cynical... a new operator, a new plane, a new pilot in a war-torn country, with little experience, no local knowledge seeking information off the internet... sounds a likely recipe for yet another sorry statistic.
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Old 10th Feb 2014, 09:28
  #31 (permalink)  
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cheer up, foxcotte, and you just might get a postcard next year

in the end there are 100 caravans flying in sudan

thanks one more time you guys and time to do my homework now
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Old 10th Feb 2014, 16:08
  #32 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: uk
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At the risk of being horribly cynical... a new operator, a new plane, a new pilot in a war-torn country, with little experience, no local knowledge seeking information off the internet... sounds a likely recipe for yet another sorry statistic.
+100

I'm sorry, but the naivety of the OP's posts just makes my hair stand on end. As an introduction to bush flying it is the equivalent of entering the Paris-Dakar a week after taking your driving test and with no off-road experience.

Unless he's a troll. I sincerely hope so, for his sake.
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Old 10th Feb 2014, 19:10
  #33 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: The land of chocolate and cuckoo clocks!
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Snoop

Well, I guess we were all young and gung-ho once
Come on Foxcotte, this one could be the one....
Artlite, part of your training for the rainy season better include the ability to touch down with sufficient power and speed with 20 flap set, be able to feel your aircraft, run your gear down the "runway" for at least 450m, lift off again and view the results.
Ruts filled with water equals several potential nightstops if you can keep it the right way up
Ruts with no water means you could get lucky if it's NOT black cotton soil, if it is see point above
No ruts means you have a chance to get in and out, as I recall 450m was about the minimum you would want with a light load out.
It's been almost 20 years since I "vanned" around there and I'm happy to be corrected but that's a guideline for you....
I shall watch and see
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Old 11th Feb 2014, 07:42
  #34 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: central africa
Age: 60
Posts: 15
100 CARAVANS FLYING IN SUDAN!

Come on Artlite, just who is giving you this twaddle? I really hope you heed the advice as posted by others here, obviously well experienced in flying around Sudan.

You had better get very good training with your installed WX radar. Learn how to interpret what you see displayed as well as what you see in front of you. Those embedded CB,s tend to hide away and cant be detected in rain.

IMHO fly 2 crew with a very experienced Caravan operator, who can show you the ropes. Sudan is NOT the place to learn the tricks of the trade on your own.

FYI I operate next door in the CAR. Exactly the same weather/dodge controllers/mozzies etc. My pilots fly a minimum of 50hrs 2 crew ops in the rainy season before going it alone. They all remark that they were the better for it!

Good luck and hope you absorb whats being said here.
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Old 11th Feb 2014, 11:47
  #35 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: US
Age: 35
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We will be a crew of two initially and then depending on how it turns out (aircraft insurance etc) we might switch to one-man crew but its still debated so we shall see
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Old 11th Feb 2014, 12:47
  #36 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
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Posts: 123
cheer up, foxcotte, and you just might get a postcard next year

in the end there are 100 caravans flying in sudan

thanks one more time you guys and time to do my homework now


There are not 100 Caravans flying in Sudan.

Here is a brief rundown of foreign C208 operators working in S. Sudan that I am aware of.

From Uganda: Asante (2-3?), KEA (1?), ASL (1-2?)

From CAR: None

From DRC: None

From Kenya: Several of various UN contracts, do not have the names.

From South Africa: Suspect there may be a few ZS Caravans (or similar such as a PAC750 or LET 410s or King Airs) in the neighborhood

From Sudan: Not aware of any but perhaps.

From S. Sudan: Hoping somebody can fill in the blanks on this one.

*Note there will likely be numerous AN-2s, -12s, -24s, -26s, and -32s flying around for dodgy Eastern European/S. Sudanese operators, plus a few LET 410s thrown in for good measure, along with the obligatory MI-8/17s and perhaps an MI-26. The one ton your Caravan can haul is NOTHING compared to what these folks can take, and they can do it significantly cheaper than you.

Artlite - With due respect, be careful. You don't know what you don't know - which makes your operation all the more risky. Heck, your first flight in a C208 will likely be in S. Sudan. That is not the place to be learning a new airplane.

Other contract operators who are operating there have been doing that type of flying for years. They have pilots who know the area, know the local languages, the customs, and how to get things done. They have engineers who know how to get things done on a dusty ramp, plus who have a support network back at their company's home base and can get whatever they need sourced within a reasonable time frame. They have flight operations personnel who know how to deal with the bureaucracy, get the appropriate permits, deal with customs and other issues.

For what its worth, before I first showed up in Africa, I did not spend 2000-3000 Euros on equipment BECAUSE MY COMPANY HAD THE AIRPLANE PROPERLY KITTED OUT. I might've spend 100 Euros or so on the smaller personal things - immodium, anti-malarial pills, etc. If you are flailing around for a satellite phone or GPS or map - it only shows how your operation is NOT prepared to do the job. Do you even know how to use a sat phone? (plus ensure that it has credit).

You give the impression that this is all some new fun-and-games African safari for you. Do you have any idea of what is happening in SOUTH Sudan right now.

Good luck.

Last edited by JTrain; 11th Feb 2014 at 14:31.
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Old 11th Feb 2014, 17:00
  #37 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: uk
Posts: 580
I suppose that if artlite is determined to do this then we might help with some practical advice where possible. It would be helpful to have a brief rundown of your hours/types/location or type of operations he's done to pitch any suggestions at the right level.
It would also be helpful to know the type of operation contemplated in Sudan - is it commercial charter, pax, freight or mixed? UN type or other NGO. Independent operator - missionary etc? Own support network or using someone else's? I realise you can't give names but sketch us a picture to give us an idea.
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Old 12th Feb 2014, 08:32
  #38 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Tree
Posts: 222
Would like to add. Don't knowingly carry military personal from any side, whether they are wounded, walking, in uniform or out. If you do, you immediately become a valid military target. Leave military affairs to the military.

My 2 cents worth.
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Old 12th Feb 2014, 17:25
  #39 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: US
Age: 35
Posts: 52
wageslave, it's still debated whether it's gonna ba Juba or Nairobi - we will know that next month, situation is dynamic. For now it's Juba and 80% of flights with UN cargo (plane will be most likely painted UN) and about 20% with PAX (medical stuff, workers). Operator in Juba has AOC and pple responsible for loading/unloading and fueling. Most flights in 200-300NM range (max 350). A couple times a year we're gonna fly with Poliomyelitis vaccines and that could be landing in radius of up to 50NM from one another field. UN safeguards operations. 90h per month, mostly VFR flights and two-men crew. We take our own mechanic, at least initially. We're all pretty stupid now, but not willing to die either.
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Old 13th Feb 2014, 05:10
  #40 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: South Africa
Posts: 23
What you Need

Buy yourself a cheap Thuria sat phone with a couple of hundred dollars of airtime swell. Often where you will work the internet is no comms.
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